Ford Mustang (2005) vs. 2005 Pontiac GTO

benderofbows · May 2005

LOL, I would rather have those questions then "Hey, I have one too, what color is yours?", since almost everyone on the block will own one.

Even though a lot more Mustangs are on the roads than GTOs, the GTOs are still not as noticeable. Whenever I do see a GTO, I have to look really hard; "is that a GTO?" But when you see a Mustang at any distance from any angle, it is instantly recognizeable. I bet many people don't even notice the GTO as being different from a 1998 Grand Prix, but everyone knows the Mustang.

Why argue the greatness of owning a limited-production car if, instead of having limited-production styling, it doesn't do much to stand out from the crowd?

stang22 · May 2005

Most people on the web,car magazines,and overall in society,find the the New Mustang way better than the gto,all in alot of instances the gto isn't even mentioned,because most people don't like it!!! Another article--Mustang wins again!!! Gto-cavalier loses again!!!!,

Mustang '05 wins with its muscle
Ford recently announced that to meet consumer demand for the 2005 Ford Mustang, it will take production to more than 192,000 units in 2005 - an increase of more than 58 percent, or 80,000 units, from the previous year.

Ford will meet consumer demand for the 2005 Mustang.

"The 2005 Ford Mustang, with its legendary heritage and retro look is among the hottest cars in the industry! Its performance on the street and in the showrooms is beating everyone's expectations.
"The 2005 Mustang demand is so strong that most of our production between now and the end of 2005 model year (October 2005) is already committed. In addition to increased, demand fuelled production, the all-new 2005 Ford Mustang GT has been given the well deserved status of best American Muscle Car of the year by internationally reputed car magazine - Car and Driver.
The first truly new Mustang in 26 years, performed exceptionally on its numerous road tests conducted by 15 motoring journalists with over 20 years of experience and demonstrated high value thereby gracefully the winning spot on the list of 10 best cars of the year according to Car and Driver."Mustang's rich performance heritage and distinct styling have made it America's top-selling sports car for 17 years straight and with the all-new 2005 model, we expect this will be the best sales year for the Mustang since 1994. The original pony car keeps getting better and is capturing consumers' hearts once again. Sorry gto,not this time!!!! LOL

sputterguy · May 2005

Yep, small world. Mine was a dark blue fast back. 4-speed, pony interior, and 8-track. Yes, I said 8-track. That was '67, just before I graduated high school. Oh God, I've gone and dated myself again. Ah, those were the days. And those glass packs would probably be drowned out by today's cars. Times change.

Putting in amber foglights sounds rather clever or sensible. Amber is very illuminating. All the street lights around here have been replaced with amber lights which are sulfur vapor I believe. If they look good with your paintjob then it sounds like a win win.

nitromax · May 2005

Even though a lot more Mustangs are on the roads than GTOs, the GTOs are still not as noticeable. Whenever I do see a GTO, I have to look really hard; "is that a GTO?" But when you see a Mustang at any distance from any angle, it is instantly recognizeable. I bet many people don't even notice the GTO as being different from a 1998 Grand Prix, but everyone knows the Mustang.

LOL

"Hey is that a Grand Prix? ....no, I mean a G6?...no, I mean a Grand Am?. ...aww, heck .....is that a new GM car?
:-)

Hey, and it's got a Corvette engine in it....how original....shoehorn the biggest engine you can find into the engine bay and sell it.
Gotta hand it to GM for spending all those late nights in the engineering department.

Sure, the same can attempted to be said about the new Mustang. (no engineering went into it because they copied an old design), but deep down beneath the outer shell is an entirely new beast. (Except I hope they are still using the Fram PH8A oil filter..)

Hat's off to Ford for bringing back an icon and doing such a great job with it.

Ok, having said that...I'm just enjoying the fact that there is even a thread called Mustang vs GTO
....how cool is that!! ......just like the old days

maybe Ford will shoehorn in a 429 Boss and then we can REALLY start to chat!
:-)

442man · May 2005

Actually I believe the Corvette is America's TOP selling sportscar. Arguably the best sports car you can get for $45k or less. The Mustang is NOT a sports car. Has a backseat. It's a sportycar/pony car.

As for the Car and Driver Mustang Vs GTO comparo, the Mustang Only beat the GTO by 1 point, 211 to 210, could have gone either way. Mustang only won because of the got to have factor which gave C&D a lot of negative letters. GTO won most of the performance categories. I believe it was 128 PRO GTO to 2 Pro mustang over that comparo in terms of letters C&D got back. I wouldn't consider C&D to be internationally reputed. They are very biased on advertisers and foreign/Japanese cars.

442man · May 2005

........"Even though a lot more Mustangs are on the roads than GTOs, the GTOs are still not as noticeable. Whenever I do see a GTO, I have to look really hard; "is that a GTO?"......."

Everywhere I go, people stare at my GTO. I have gotten many questions/compliments at traffic lights etc or when I park at store etc. All the car shows/cruise nights I visit I get just as many people checking out my GTO and asking me questions as the 2005 Mustang guys. It stands out better then some think. I get along with the mustang guys quite well. We have mutual respect for each other's cars. They are both great cars.

stang22 · May 2005

You need to re-read my last post,it says the '05 mustang as the top american muscle car.It did not say sports car,like the corvette,that you implied!! Try glasses,they work better!! People in general love the new Mustang GT alot more than the gto!! Sales alone reflect that,much less just about all forums across the web,magazines,editors,mass public opinion,etc.,etc.,!! Shelby Mustang will take care of the vette next year,and gm will lose all the way across the board!!

brushbandit · May 2005

I was at the track tonite with my 04 GTO A4. Their was an 05 GT racing and I have seen a few others run at other trips to the track. I have yet to see one break 14 sec. Most are around 14.40. I see these Magazine claims and internet claims of 13.6. As I said I haven't seen it, maybe every GT I've seen has been purchased by a person who can't drive. My slightly modded GTO ran a 13.58.

442man · May 2005

Depends on the driver/track/weather conditions. The best I have seen on STOCK 2005 Mustangs is the high 13's. 13.8 ish. I have seen stock 2005 GTO's run under 13.2, best I saw in person was 13.186.

442man · May 2005

Shelby Mustang? Anyone that will spend $40k+ for a Mustang, especially one with a solid rear axle needs to have their head examined. Several Current Mustang owners I know have said this as well. Not just me.

Dissappointment in the Shelby GT500 The car was designed for an IRS - there were prototypes of it running around. And all the early Shelby prototypes were running around on one as well (pics exist). It's only at the last moment that it was removed for the cheaper "hundred year old" alternative by the bean counters at Ford.

Regardless, an IRS was planned right from the start for this platform, engineered, and only cancelled (or put off?) at the last moment.

442man · May 2005

The GT500 is going to gain 350 pounds of weight ALL UP FRONT and have it's balance thrown off to 58% front and 42% rear. It will be nearly 3873 pounds with driver or more!

Minimum price of $40k to $45k range, Gas guzzler fee and HUGE dealer markups.

Rather have $25k Stang with V8.

ls1gto · May 2005

as far as sales are concerned there are over 150 2005 mustang gt on order already paid for in this area alone (schweinfurt, germany) with NO gto on order. i have not seen a single gto in germany since they came out in 2004 and i haven't seen any in south western ohio (except mine) while i was home in march. as far as price i picked my gto up for just under 27k. even though it was a 2004 it had the hood/front facia/sport spoiler installed by the dealership to spice it up. it would be nice to see them sell more but if not, mt car will be one of a kind when the stang gt is just one of many different colors. for the price the reason it cost so much is cause its imported from australia. and besides the gto is in a different class than the mustang any ways. the mustang is a "sport car" and the gto is a "muscle car" that is why gm is bringing back the camaro in 2007 giving it design highlights of the 67-69 era. but all in all i would rather have a one of a kind car than compared to what everyone else has.

sputterguy · May 2005

I didn't mean to bad mouth anyone's personal car. I was just pointing out the commonality of the Mustang. Say, you don't live in San Jose do you?

Yes, GM mass produces cars. Afterall, it is the largest automobile company. They tend to be a little more upscale than Ford though. I think though, that GM might be heading in the wrong direction. For instance, in last Sunday's paper, out of two local GM dealers, only one even bothered to advertise. And aside from used cars, it only advertised four models, and they were all Yukons. What on earth can they be thinking? If GM doesn't start getting it right then it could lose out to Toyota which is definitely guning for GM. Ford would have to have a dozen 'homeruns' like the Mustang to catch up to GM. Unfortunately, that may not have to happen if GM keeps stumbling.

sputterguy · May 2005

"Most people on the web, car magazines, and overall in society, find the new Mustang way better than the gto". Well fine, the whole country agrees that you have the better car. Why aren't you enjoying it then? Why are you continually harping about it here? Are you trying to convince me? Or are you trying to convince yourself? Because frankly, I'm not convinced. To Mustang fans you are preaching to the choir, but to GTO fans you are just blowing hot air.

You stepped out of line with this statement from your next post. "Shelby Mustang will take care of the Vette next year". You don't even have the name right. It's Shelby Cobra Mustang. Which sounds like an identity crisis to me. Is it a Shelby, is it a Cobra? Let's see how many icons from the past we can attach to this Mustang to give it some legitimacy. Oh year, and lets add some stripes to make sure people make the connection. My suggestion is to call it the Shelby Cobra Mustang GT500 2+2. You gotta let people know its a fastback. And it looks worse on paper. While the Corvette got even lighter, the Mustang put on more than a few pounds. The weight advantage the vette enjoys with the Mustang is way more than the advantage the Mustang has with the GTO. And that solid rear axle has to hurt performance. Maybe it doesn't with the GT but with the added weight and hp of the GT500 it will. In the old days the Shelbys and the Cobras had it all over the vettes. (Shelby Cobra, I guess with two different design teams there was bound to be problems.) But not this time. Sorry Mustang, this time you lose.

442man · May 2005

Shelby Cobra Mustang or whatever they call it is going to weigh nearly 500+ pounds more then the Z06 Vette.

2006 Z06 Vette will have 505 hp and weighing about 3100 lbs and a near 50/50 weight distribution.

2006 Shelby Cobra will have 450hp and weigh 3600 to 3700 lbs and have 58/42 weight distribution, extra 350lbs added weight in front.

The only advantage is that the Shelby Cobra will cost less then Z06, unless Dealers really mark it up which they probably will. But you get what you pay for.

sputterguy · May 2005

You know what, I'll bet stangman was talking about the LS2 vette. Although I've seen other posts that the GT500 was going after the Z06. With the weight difference the GT500 may not even be as fast as the LS2 vette.

xkss · May 2005

I'm still glad that Ford made a new Mustang and GM brought the Holden Monaro here.

442man · May 2005

I second that, I'm glad GM brought the Monaro here and that there is a Mustang and that there is now a Hemi Charger too. They are all GOOD cars in their own senses. Different strokes for dif. folks. Although with the rise of gas prices, wonder how long they will still keep selling muscle cars like these? Although these cars still get better gas mileage then V8 powered SUV's/trucks.

442man · May 2005

We'll have to wait to see some road tests and comparos with the Vette vs GT500 to know for sure. But on paper, you are right, the Vette has gotten lighter and the Mustang heavier. LS2 Vette is 400hp at 3100 or 3200 lbs. Quite good. GT500 will be 450hp at 3600+ lbs with a supercharger.

Vette is normally aspirated, GT500 relies on a blower. Add a blower to Vette then.

sputterguy · May 2005

Vette don't need no blower, ie., LS7. I just want the LS7 in a GTO. Then the wars really start. Like the man said, let's hope there is gas to run them.

stang22 · May 2005

You'll know what the Shelby is,as when its kicking your gto and vette behinds you'll have plenty of time to see the snake and name on the back of my Shelby!!! Shelby Mustang is going to kick both of your butts!!!!!!!! Shelby wins again!! gto and vette loses!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

442man · May 2005

I second that, I want a LS7 in my GTO too. 505 horse would rock! The LS2 with 400hp I have is no slouch either.

graphicguy · May 2005

Yes, indeed...it's good that both are here.

It's always been my hope that even though I chose the Mustang GT over the GTO, that the GTO would continue to evelove into a competitor. While, like most here, I hold out hope that future GTOs are on GM's roadmap, they have some more pressing issues to resolve.

Good old competition between the Mustang GT and GTO could do nothing more than make both become better cars in the future.

benderofbows · May 2005

I didn't take it that way sputter (no badmouthing of personal car). I like her car OK but I don't love it. Honestly I tried as hard as I could to talk my fiancee into buying one of the 2005s (better engine, transmission, CHASSIS, resale value...! In one ear and out the other...) She was just partial to the styling of her 2001, and the dealer actually had one leftover 2004 left. I do like it better than her 2001 though.

detailz · May 2005

Is there anything different about the 2006 GTO vs. the 2005 model. The 2004 model did not do anything and I could not believe the number of these on the dealership lot. (14). Where do they all go and how do you get these should you want them?

detailz · May 2005

Anyone know how to see the production schedule for the new 2005 Mustangs.......ordered one a couple of months ago and am still waiting to here as to when I might see it

pally · May 2005

Where is the 350 lbs. figure coming from?

The 5.4 is about 50 cubes bigger than the 4.6 . The supercharger with all the extra parts is maybe 70-80 lbs. Maybe.

I'm confused.

If a 4.6 weighs 400 lbs complete, ( I have no idea) , that would be an amazingly light package. If you add 350 lbs to it, that would be basically the same as a cast iron 427 FE big block from the sixties (A real heavyweight) or about the same as my Powerstroke.

This just can't be right.
.
What am I missing?

bamford · May 2005

Even though I am a Ford guy, GM does give some good competition, which is a good thing. I'm all about going after all the japanese, korean, etc. junk, (this is not an attack on those people, just the cars from there Edmunds), down to the 350Z, G35, IS300, and all the other wanna-be's! It's all about American Muscle!

442man · May 2005

From my post 541. A few minor changes and color changes.

http://www.gmfleet.com/us/acquiring...Truck_Guide.pdf

Only 3 minor changes and 2 new colors for 2006 GTO. They are getting rid of Yellow and Midnight Blue and replacing that with Spice Red and Brazen Orange

442man · May 2005

Yes the 2006 Ford Shelby Cobra GT500 will weigh more then 4.6Liter GT. This article says 3600 estimated, regular GT weighs 3375. So that is 225 lbs weight.

2006 FORD SHELBY COBRA GT500
ON SALE: June 2006
BASE PRICE: $39,000 (est.)
POWERTRAIN: 5.4-liter, 450-plus-hp, 450-plus-lb-ft supercharged V8; rwd, six-speed manual
CURB WEIGHT: 3600 lbs (est.)
0 to 60 MPH: 4.5 seconds (est.)
http://www.autoweek.com/news.cms?newsId=102047

stang22 · May 2005

Read the new hot rod mag. it says the new c6 vette will crawl back on trailor after seeing the new shelby mustang's performance!! Not only that,it might be competing with the new z06 vette,as it says in article that the rumors they heard was the new shelby would be 500 hp for under 40,000!!! That makes it best deal in the world and just as fast,if not faster than the zo6,and Shelby would have it no other way{nows here's the cool part},for 30,000 less than the z06!! For that much difference in price it wouldn't take much more added to the new Shelby to totally destroy the z06 vette!!! Mustang WINS AGAIN,AND AGAIN,THIS TIME EVEN BIGGER WITH THE SHELBY!! Read 'em and weep girls!!!!!!!!

stang22 · May 2005

Now,back to the topic as far as the Mustang GT being far superior to the gto(cavalier with cran-am front end),this magazine says it best:Title: Mustang has the GOODIES ,BHP+Style
Comment: I just watched a 2hour show on SPEED TV on this years SEMA.I have to say FORD has stopped sleepin.THe new FORD Mustang GT is perfect i cant wait to see the final sales between the two.To bad the Pontiac GTO is not like the original ,its just a Holden Monaro (AUSSIE),Vauxhall/OPEL Monaro (europe) rebaged with the Pontiac label.Back to the MUSTANG GT, ITS ALLL THAT AND MORE:GAME OVER!!! MUSTANG KEEPS ON WINNING ,EVEN AT THE RACE TRACK TOOK SPOTS 1-2-3 AT GRAND AM RACING,AND AT DAYTONA!!!

442man · May 2005

Stock for stock, the Z06 will be faster and best the Shelby in all performance areas. Z06 is nearly 400 to 500 pounds lighter, with 55 extra hp. 505 vs 450 and has a 50/50 weight distrubution. Shelby is 57/43 at best. Then again the Z06 is a lot more $$ then Shelby, some $20-25k more.

Preliminary 0-60 numbers on Shelby is 4.5 seconds. That is slower then the stock 400hp vette! It isn't much faster then stock GTO. We'll have to wait for a full car review on it with numbers to know for sure.

Can't wait to drive one when it comes out.

442man · May 2005

As for the Mustang GT being superior to the GTO? To each their own. I disagree, but that is my opinion. In C&D the GTO won most of the head to head performance tests, but hey, I guess the Mustang GT is better. The vaunted build quality or lack of on the 2005, go to Mustang Problems forum, seems like trouble in paradise. One of my friends works at Ford Dealer as a Mechanic and said there is a lot more problems/warranty issues on 2005 over 2004. Never buy a first year car. Avoid the problems and wait for demand to drop so you get a better price.

You are right, thankgod this 2004-2005 GTO isn't like the original 1960's/1970's with it's bad handling and poor brakes n comparison to newer cars. The 2005 GTO is the MOST POWERFULL GTO ever made. No GTO ever had stock 400hp from the factory before.

I'm glad we have choices, not everyone wants a Retro Ugly Mustang with a useless backseat and the aereodynmaics of a brick. About a .35 CD. Mustang has a lot more build/quality issues then GTO, go to Mustang Problems forum. Nice looking car on the back of a flatbed.

We all know that GTO beat Mustang in Car and Driver where it counts, peformance, interior etc, C&D gave the Stang the 1 point win, 211 to 210 for Got to have. How lame was that? They got hit with a lot of negative letters over that one, the most in their history.

JD Power said GTO was most appealing Sporty car, NOT the Mustang, Consumer guide picked GTO over Mustang too. Whatever. Thats them, not me.

tayl0rd · May 2005

This article says 3600 estimated, regular GT weighs 3375.

What's your source for the Mustang GT's weight?

442man · May 2005

For 2007 Ford is upgrading interior of Mustang, better quality materials and leather patches etc. Similar to the interior on the 2006 GT500. that should be nice!

442man · May 2005

http://www.maclellan-usa.com/news/story.asp?id=981

That is the source that said 3600 pounds Estimated

ls1gto · May 2005

yes i will have to admit that my gto might slightly look like a grand am (gulp) but i have definitely gotten alot of attention when i was back home. one person even thought it was a new mustang(?) but alot of people dont know about them cause gm is lacking advertisement. i haven't seen an advertisement for a while now and i only hope that for the gto's sake they will advertise the 2006 more. rumor also has it that 2006 will be the last year for the gto. so i guess it will be like the 94-96 impala ss. its all good thou im happy i got a piece of history if that happens. still love that goat to death.

pally · May 2005

Now that makes more sense. Also I'd be shocked if all of the additional 225 lbs. is over the front wheels. I'd bet that 20 - 25% of that additional weight (possibly more), is the result of many beefed up components throughout the vehicle in order to cope with the massive torque developed by that beautiful 5.4.

I truley believe, and have evidence to support, that, Ford has for many years tried it's best in most cases to over build and to err on the side of reliability, not always, but I think Ford's record in this regard over the last 10 - 15 years is much better than G.M.'s or Mopar.

442man · May 2005

Thats the problem, kind of hard to sell a car when you don't bother advertising it much. 2006 will be the last year for this GTO. My GTO gets a lot more attention then some Mustang owners think. Not as much as the GT, but have had people come up to me and ask me about it in parking lots, etc. Looks aren't everything. It's not bad looking at all, azteck. I get along well with the Mustang guys and usualy park near them at the cruise nights-local car shows.

Sometimes dull cars do sell very well... look at the Camry/Accords/civics of the world that are dull looking, and they are among the best selling cars. The F150 truck is best selling vehicle 20+ yrs in a row now and is just avg looking.

stang22 · May 2005

Hate to tell ya jack,read new hotrod magazine!! Shelby numbers will be 500 hp!! 400hp vette will go back up on trailor in fear!! Zo6 your next,and Shelby's got 30,000 dollars to spare to catch up to price of z06, that's alot more mods we might want to do to really trash you!!! When shelby comes out with500hp,0-60 times will be in the high 3's!! Mustanggt kills gto,and now Shelby will win again against vette,just like the old days!!!! you lose again,mustang gt and shelby mustang win again BIGTIME!!!!!!!!!!

:P

kevm14 · May 2005

I'd take a 300c srt-8 even over a GTO

Interesting you mention this. I actually test drove one of the first 04 GTOs in my area in January 04. It was a black 6-speed. I really liked it. But then the 300C came out, and now we have the SRT-8. I have almost completely lost interest in the GTO because the SRT-8 is as fast or faster, handles better, stops better, looks awesome, and is a BIG SEDAN (which is big points for me, personally). However, I have been a GM guy and I expect people will tire of the mustang's relentless presence in the coming years (especially the V6/auto models). I prefer exclusivity (certainly the SRT-8 has that, though the 300 as a general model is going to be as common as Mustangs...), a la Grand National and Impala SS.

Bottom line, I guess, is that if I could afford $33k to spend on a new car, it would be an 06 300C, not an 05 GTO. But I'd take a GTO over a Mustang, for sure.

kevm14 · May 2005

They(GM),probably could have got away with it if they named it something else,but please not a GTO!!

I agree here. I was interested in the GTO not because of the name or the legacy (I don't typically get wrapped up in that crap), but because it was a real high quality car with a killer Gen-III V8 (amazing aftermarket support), IRS, nice interior, etc. Probably should have been Grand Prix Coupe or something. I dunno. The fact that it's 'GTO' automatically solicits a given amount of press/discussion/criticism...

kevm14 · May 2005

I did see video of the Mustang GT run the 13.6, though.

So did I. And something is very wrong with that run. He got a 13.69 @ 97. Anybody who knows anything about the relationship between ET and trap speed would flag that run in an instant. Short of letting off the gas at the end of the track, I'd say something was wrong with the equipment. Anybody have a clue?

kevm14 · May 2005

I wonder how many Harley's have exhaust systems which violate noise ordinances?

OT, but NONE (stock, from the factory anyway). Every single loud, obnoxious Harley you have ever seen, or will ever see, has been "modified" by the oh-so-proud owner to be loud and obnoxious.

kevm14 · May 2005

LOL, I would rather have those questions then "Hey, I have one too, what color is yours?", since almost everyone on the block will own one.

I was thinking the EXACT same thing before I read your post, then you posted it! So I just had to reply...

Claires · May 2005

... before we get any further off-track, the purpose of this topic is to discuss the attributes of the Mustang vs. those of the GTO. Let's stick to that and not veer off into any more comparisons with Corvettes, SRT8s, or other cars.

sputterguy · May 2005

I'm glad of that. Anyway, an interesting thought occured to me. If you could not have found an '04, would your fiancee have gotten an '05 or shopped for something else. Just curious.

sputterguy · May 2005

American muscle and the very survival of American car companies. Yes, Ford also has achieved junk bond status. If everone wanted large suv's and pickups there would be no problem. I think Nissan is even going after the large pickup market.

benderofbows · May 2005

If they (the fiancee and her parents) had not found the 2004 on the local lot, they would have bought one of the 05s. Her 2001 was in her Dad's name, so they got the check from the other guy's insurance. She's a Mustang girl, really wants a 1966. My Fiancee and I drove an 05 and she liked it, and her parents drove one as well; they just liked the 04 better because of styling, and price. They looked at numbers both ways and claimed they'd have paid "significantly" more for the 2005- of course that would have held up in resale, but no one cared for my opinion! I'd have bought one of the 2005s.

The really funny thing is, I was at work when they actually bought- and the 2004 they were looking at had the "shaker 1000" audio system option. I don't know if you have ever seen this system, but it takes up the whole trunk, you can't even get a medium size bag back there. They never opened the trunk until after they bought it (they said they thought all that bass was coming from the rear deck speakers)... So now the fiancee wants to pull all of that stuff out and try to sell it... Sigh... At least she wants to put the money into upgrading the exhaust.

Ford Mustang (2005) vs. 2005 Pontiac GTO

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