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Lexus ES 350
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Comments
I am noticing quiet a bit of wind noise when I drive above 60 mph (gets really bad when i get to 80)... I didn't notice this on any of the other cars I test drove .. but then again I didn't drive them that fast. Is anyone else noticing this problem? Or is there something wrong with my car? :confuse:
Also,
The Climate settings with NAV... I can't get it to work.. but the Toyota Prius has the same nav system and the climate settings work.. so i find it hard to believe that we need a new chip.... But if we do need an upgrade.. would it be covered under warrantee.. I mean it supposed to work.. its in the manual after all.
Uhhh, where in the U.S. is the speed limit 80?
They were supposed to keep one for test drives but got offered $3000 over MSRP so they sold it. He's hoping they will get more soon but he sounded clueless as to any time frame.
I can only go without having a car so much longer and sharing my wife's She's at work all day so I'm stuck home everyday and now that my health is better I really want to get out more.
So I'm going to go out and look at other cars again. I still want to go drive that Buick Lucerne, but I may end up getting a Camry.
How the heck can Lexus put a car on sale about 6 weeks ago and the dealer has none to sell? I think there must be a problem somewhere which scares me off this car.
I just don't understand the hold up. When Toyota got the new Camry's they got one, then a couple more the next week and then another 7 the next week and now they have a bunch in stock.
I'm venting so here it is:
Lexus, GET ON THE BALL, THIS IS RIDICULOUS!!!
I was told that the Sirius isn't available for a little while (maybe a month...or more). Does anyone have any info on the availability timeframe? I'm also curious about getting a spoiler and the associated costs w/ doing it - purchase/install, etc.? Any help would be appreciated!
I have radar cruise (no PCS) on an '04 Toyota Sienna MiniVan and IMO, it's not very practical. It's really kewel and a neat gadget to play around with and impress your friends, but traveling in typical situations, I rarely use it.
If you are driving in VERY light traffic, it can be useful.
But, in "medium" traffic when a regular cruise is useful, the radar cruise is not all it's cracked up to be.
The problem is during passing. You really have to anticipate the pass when you come up on a vehicle in front of you. If you don't move over to the passing lane soon enough, even if you have it set for the closest distance, you'll find your car slowing down and losing momentum. You may not even be aware of it until you've dropped 5 mph or more. Then, when you do pull over in the passing lane, the engine gets the "go-ahead" and takes off like a bat-outa-hell. Hardly good for gas mileage.
Maybe it's because I'm more familiar with traditional cruise, but it seems a lot easier to just use that under most circumstances than the radar cruise.
Now, maybe having the PCS might be a worthwhile safety feature, but I do not intend to pay the extra $ for the combined package.
Congratulation for the new car, can you tell me how much you get discount for that car and can you tell me what the sticker price for that one ( I have the dealer Ray Catena in NJ discount for me only $1424.00 the sticker price is $37424.00 ) thank you
What state did you buy in?
I looked at going through Costco or AAA, but those deals were at least $2500K more than what I paid on this vehicle. I guess since the car is new those discounts don't work yet - I got a quote on an Acura TL and AAA was able to get me below invoice, but since this car is hot - go dealer direct via the web - it's the only way to shop.
The retail on the vehicle was $40,799 (Premium Plus and Nav). The Sirius (system + install) + 9 Months of Sirius was an extra that I was able to get lucky w/ as I asked one dealer for a discount and he threw it in the deal - the rest of the other dealers couldn't believe it, but they matched it too.
My recommendation is be ready to buy and know what you want. Get your finances in order if you are going to finance and know what you want for your trade. Don't discuss anything other than the price of the car and the features. Then e-mail them w/ a very clear listing of your needs: color, packages, extra features, etc. and give them the lowest price you want to pay. Then just see who comes in w/ the best deals and let each of them know where they stand. You'll know how far you can push when they start telling you they can't go any further.
Some will be high and others will come close to your number - then it's up to you to figure out the best deal. Don't expect to get the guy who's offering you a so-so deal to come down in price by as much as some of the others - they just are playing the game. Go w/ the person who steps up and wants to get the deal done. I was in and out on my one dealer w/in 90 minutes of agreeing on the price.
I am also in Southern California but I am planning on leasing (more write offs for me in my profession.) Could you let me know which dealerships were willing to "step up to the plate". I have requested a few quotes from local dealerships over the internet but would like to know which dealerships, in your experience, are serious about making the deal.
Thanks.
Driven about 70 miles so far....love all the little features. Did not notice wind noise at higher speed though.........will continue to look for that.
More driving impressions in a week or so.
P.S.: The version I am looking at has both of the majot option packages you note plus a few other options and has an MRSP of $40,539. Thanks
Dic you really buy the car and what the MSRP on that car, and where did you buy it.
My MSRP was $40,799 - Premium Plus Package with Additional Options (did not include the Rear Seat Airbags). My price before tax, title, etc. was $36,972.00. The Sirius install and system was thrown in at no additional cost.
I was dealing w/ them at the end of the month and during Memorial Day Weekend. Don't rush it either this all happened over the course of a 5 days.
So any info on when Sirius is coming?
Question: If a problem even relatively minor such as excessive wind noise or an issue with the NAV as has been reported in some posts is noticed or, worse, a transmission-related problem (also reported) occurs which necessitates getting the car to the dealer, will the local dealer handle the problem or must one get the car back to the point of purchase?
I have found significantly lower prices out-of-town but would first like some input concerning the above question before planning on a “long distance” purchase. Thanks.
Because very little info was availble on the web about the 2007 ES, I used Consumer Reports car price services. I started with their bottom line price, per their recommendation, which for the optioned model that you have was around $35,000. I told them what Acura was offering for the top-rated car in its class (per Consumer Reports), the same class as the ES, but their basic response was they didn't need to deal like Acura because their car was in greater demand.
I told them that I knew the invoice price for the base car as well as all options, and that I knew that even at $36,000 they were still making a respectable 5% profit margin. I too was prepared to go to around $37,000, but they wouldn't even counteroffer. After two hours of game playing, I walked away. I have started the internet game today and hope that I am as successful as you. Most responses so far are requiring that I come to the showroom to get any price info.
P.S.: The last time I dealt with this Virginia dealer was 15 years ago, and they wouldn't deal then either. They lost a sale to Mercedes and I reminded them of that fact. The sales manager assured me it wouldn't happen again...but guess what, it seems to be stacking up that way! I'll keep trying, but am prepared to go with the TL if I have to.
Thanks again. Love to hear if others were successful in negotiating a good deal.
To each his own....I drove the TL (auto + stick) and had a deal cut already. This would've been my first Acura/Honda in a long time, after a number of Toyota's/Lexus. Then I drove the ES350. In my opinion, two totally different cars - the former is noisier, smaller, different suspension and not nearly as comfortable. Then I drove the ES350 - in comparison, silent; different suspension, much larger and way more comfortable. IMHO, I would have felt cheated had I purchased the TL. It IS a nice car, but it's not a Lexus. I just can't get past that Honda feel.
Regardless, whatever you get--enjoy it!!
zekeman1
In the meantime... I'll just keep on reading the forums and see if prices continue to drop. CA seems to be getting the best deals... since there are many Lexus dealership. There are about 6-7 dealers within a 100 mile radius.
Rob
Do you have any photos you can post of the Blue Onyx? That is one of the colors I am considering and have not seen it in person yet nor seen actual pictures of it (except altered and enhanced dealer internet pictures.)
Thanks.
MINOR ISSUE: I must admit that I am also having a problem with the voice commands on the NAV. I will probably talk to the dealer on this one very soon. Other than that, everything else is great!
I saw the Moon Shell Mica, too. Definitely pink.
I thought I wanted the cashmere interior, but it kind of clashes with the gray dash. Plus, SGM doesn't come with it. I'm happy with my car; so far, it drives great!
I am in the market to buy a new car and after reading a few review articles/blogs/bulletin boards I am considering the Lexus ES 350. This would be my first foray into the “L-finesse” world. I currently drive a ’95 Acura Integra, which I bought new, and have enjoyed over the years. I always had this idea that my next car would be a Bimmer. But now that my wife and I have a new baby boy and are in the process of adopting a little girl, there is less of a desire for the “ultimate driving machine” and more emphasis placed on comfort and features. With that said I still plan on looking at the 3 series, as well as the Acura TL, MB C 230/280 and maybe the Audi A4. We are looking for a car that will “age well” and remain fun to own for a number of years.
The one off-putting issue with Lexus is their “option packages.” It irks me that they force you to pay for an expensive package when you may not want everything included in the package. The labeling of the packages doesn’t make a lot of sense either. When I use a zip code for the San Diego area they list five different “premium plus package with additional options.” What marketing genius came up with that nomenclature? Also when you “build a Lexus” at lexus.com they list the base MSRP and immediately tack on the cost of a package to that. It doesn’t appear to me that you can get a base car without some kind of package. If that is the case then the real base price is the base MSRP plus the “premium plus package with additional options.” Granted most people looking to buy an entry level luxury car don’t want just the base model but c’mon Lexus. How about a little truth in advertising?
Acura wins hands down for simplicity. You only have 3 choices: color, transmission and navigation system – everything else is standard. BMW has option packages but you can also order “a la carte.” If, for instance, you wanted heated seats but didn’t care about the head lamp washers or split rear fold down seats that come in the cold weather package you can order the heated seats separately. Lexus, on the other hand, crams everything into their option packages. I would love to have an ES 350 with Nav and M/L sound system but I don’t really care about the wood and leather trimmed steering wheel and shift knob, power rear sun shade, full size spare, cargo net, trunk mat, wheel locks and HID head lamps (whew!). To get the Nav and M/L stereo I have to pay for the “ultra luxury package with additional option” for $9,430. Compare that to say, the MB C280: the upgraded stereo can be had for $970 and Nav for $2210.
I’m not knocking the car itself. In fact I’m looking forward to test driving one. Obviously Lexus has been quite successful with their marketing scheme and no amount of grousing by one consumer is going to change their philosophy. With all that said and in light of me being a Lexus newbie, I have a question for the group: is it possible to special order a Lexus with just the options you want or are you stuck with their packages? (if that’s the case I guess I will learn to love my leather wrapped shift knob and wheel locks). Sorry for the lengthy post!
Thanks. :shades:
Currently I have a 2004 Maxima which I'm not entirely happy with, so I'm starting to look around. I've been actually thinking about the Dodge Charger with the 350 HP road track option. A throw back to my youth when I couldn't afford a muscle car, and now a much better car which shares alot of stuff with the Mercedes E series. Lots of fun to drive and scary fast.
But then the ES 350 came out and my practical side is taking over. Never liked the previous ES versions. Too Camry like and plain vanilla. But the new one is definitely a big improvement looks wise. Haven't driven one yet. And I figure the resale and the gas mileage is going to much better than the Charger.
Now, about those pesky "packages." You are right, their nomenclature leaves a great deal to be desired (i.e. "ultra luxury package" sound as if Margaret Dumont should be saying that in a Marx Brothers movie). And yes, some of the bundled features are things that you could easily live without. For the most part, however, I think it's fair to say that there are more people out there who bought lower end packages and then missed the additional features after the purchase than the opposite. Most of us here are gadget freaks to one extent or another. If we weren't we'd be driving Ford 500's. I'm about to take delivery on the UL ("ultra luxury") package early next week (in ruby red/black) and can't wait to play with the myriad features the car has. Ultimately this is a personal decision, however. As to Lexus' motivation in doing it this way (and they have for a while now, with [as you point out] considerable success) I believe it makes manufacturing a great deal easier. Essentially they're only building 2-3 variations of this car. M-B and BMW do allow you to select individual options but the reality is that you are going to be heavily pressured to take what they have coming in. If you really push for a custom ordered car, expect to pay sticker and wait three months for delivery.
Now, on to the cars you're considering:
BMW 3 series - Nice little car. Not in the same league as the ES350. As with all bimmers, very overpriced. It will, however hold it's value nicely. Not as well as the ES, but close. Spartan interior and primitive nav system (I absolutely adore nav systems so this is of critical importance to me). Bells and whistles? Forget it. Just a very nice driving little sports sedan.
Acura TL - Really a quite significant step down from an ES 350. Bland looking and a bit harsh riding. Wonderful engine and great steering, braking and transmission. Good value though it'll depreciate pretty rapidly a year or two out. It's due for a major renovation in the next year or two so that will not help resale value.
Audi A4 - Great little car. Again the nav system is primitive and the ride a bit harsh, but a very nice little car. Quatro is a nice feature to have if you live somewhere that gets a lot of snow. Resale should be pretty good. Great bang for the buck and typical gorgeous Audi interior. Exterior is handsome and refined if not terribly exciting. Many people either love or hate the new grill treatment. You have to see for yourself.
M-B 230/280 - Don't even think this. Awful in pretty much every respect. Small, cramped, underpowered, overpriced, prone to breakdowns, ridiculous control layout and, to add insult to injury, typically Germanic horrible, primitive nav system. Depreciates like a rock falling off a cliff. You'd be better off with a Yugo.
Hope this helps a bit.
Let us know what you decide to do.
Between our two local dealers they have over 50 of these cars on special order.
Something is up, something is wrong with Lexus if there is this kind of wait.
Even the dealer admits they have never had so many special orders, or such a wait for for a new car.
I need to find a car I like. Preferably Aqua Blue or Red with gray or black interior.
The beige is vomit inducing to me, I don't think I could live with it.
Regular moonroof, Premium Plus package, not the Ultra pkg, I can't stand that Panoramic roof . Mark Levinson and Nav are a must.
If anyone knows of a car like this at any dealer across the country,
I'm in Virginia, the closer the better, please let me know.
I need to get a list of dealers and start calling all over.
I've never bought a new car before, I had no idea it would be this much trouble.
A 5 month wait for a car, this is ridiculous what is going on here? WTF?!!!
Is this normal for a new model? I kind of doubt it as the Camry's came flooding in 2 weeks after they went on sale.
The dealers don't even have their fleets yet. How can this be?
Do you think there is a major problem with these cars that has held up production?
I'd buy something else but after checking out all the other brands the ES 350 is the car for me.
Pretty soon I'm going to give up and buy a Camry and then keep it for a year or two and then get into a Lexus.
For all those who think that money solves all your problems this is a reminder as no matter what you have, you may not be able to get what you want when you want to.
But to tell you the truth I'm REALLY pissed at Lexus for announcing this car, yet the dealers have almost none in stock six weeks after they went on sale.
They offer NO explanation for this also, the dealers are clueless.
They offer Aquamarine Blue as a new color and I've not heard of anyone even seeing one yet, much less a PIC of one.
They offer just a few colors and most of the cars seem to have only Ultra Lux pkgs. and I'm not sure if the Mark Levinson's are available.
This is a crappy way to introduce what they call one of the worlds best cars.
Where are they dammit?!!!
So if anyone can help direct me to who might have a car I might like please let me know the dealer so I can give them a call.
Nothing is wrong. Lexus is deliberately promoting scarcity by releasing cars in small numbers. This is intended to make the car seem somewhat unattainable & thus more desirable, which in turn helps dealers get more money for each unit.
Welcome to the wonderful, whacky world of luxury marketing. One of the guiding concepts is that folks won't perceive whatever you're selling, be it a car or perfume, as a luxury item if it's abundant & easy to get.
If there were plenty of cars to go around - if every dealer had a large assortment of ES 350s in all colors & option configurations - you would probably conclude that there was really nothing special about this car. You might even decide to go for a new Camry & bank the difference. Knowing this, the marketing gurus have decided to keep you hungry by rationing product.
I understand that you're recovering from an illness & that you want to treat yourself to a new car, but the tone of your post suggests that you've lost control of the car-buying process. To regain it, you must change your frame of mind. Convince yourself that it doesn't matter if you buy an ES today or a year from today. In a few months, Infiniti will roll out its new G35. That will change the tone of the near-lux market. Many of the folks who have to be the 1st on the block with whatever is newest will rush into Infiniti stores, leaving Lexus dealers lonely & more willing to negotiate. You should be prepared to wait until then. Right now, you are your own worst enemy.
So I drove an IS and found it actually a bit more comfortable in a way on the right side, but now my left leg was jammed!
They had no ES's to sell and very few IS's.
On the way home I passed a Honda dealership so I went in and test drove the 6 cyl Accord again. Immediately I noticed I was more comfortable in the drivers seat. The ride was much firmer, more like the IS's but it wasn't that bad and I think I could get used to it. The power and acceleration of that car is excellent, better than the ES or the IS 250 I thought.
So I'm rethinking things again. They have many Accords in stock. I like the interior and I am comfortable in it. It has excellent power and handling and it's over $15,000 cheaper.
My daughter's had one for about a year now without a single problem, and I drive it and I'm always impressed with how much I like her car, and she's only got the 4 cyl model.
Sure it doesn't have all the really fancy bells and whistles but 95% of the time I don't need navigation or all that other crap. It's still a nice car and it gets you from here to there in a decent style. Status means nothing to me, just a quick, comfortable ride.
So, I don't know, I think I may just buy the Accord this week and put an end to my car buying misery. Honda's hold good value and if something better comes along in a year or two I could just trade it in and still be better off than if I dropped $43K on the ES today.
In fact the 2008 Accord is supposed to be a really nice car with all sorts of bells and whistles. maybe I'll consider it when it comes out.
I've just had it. I want a car and I want it now. It's never been about money or finding a deal with me. I couldn't care less about that. I just wanted to find a car I loved.
I'm also a bit annoyed at Toyota/Lexus over all this game playing and maybe I just wont give them my business this time around.
OK, I'll give the Camry one more test drive just to be sure. It's got a hot 6 cyl engine in it also, and the ride is smoother. But I just wasn't fond of the interior. Too girly for me.
I'll let you guys know what I decide later in the week.
I would just like to get a car NOW!
Damn, so they got all the cars!
They even have IS 350's of which there are not even any to test drive here.
I guess they figure there are more richer people in the Jersey Area then down here in Southern Virginia, and they are probobally right!
I actually grew up about 10 minutes away from that dealership in Jersey.
Maybe it's my fate that they don't have many Lexus's to sell down here, and it's going to lead me back to the Accord.
We'll see what happens this week.