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Porsche Cayman S

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  • carnaughtcarnaught Posts: 1,597
    I will say I have no idea what a CS is, but I suspect it fits in with this group about as well as the other three.

    CS = Cayman S
  • I was sold on the CaymanS re performance,but was not sure if I could use as a daily commuter and looked at other driver's cars.Hope I did not offend the purists. :)
  • habitat1habitat1 Posts: 4,282
    "I was sold on the CaymanS re performance,but was not sure if I could use as a daily commuter and looked at other driver's cars. Hope I did not offend the purists."

    I'm certainly not "pure" enough to be offended and had you phrased your question with that qualifier (use as a daily driver) I would have withheld the Prozac comment. :)

    In the past 14 months, I've put 11,500 miles on my 911S and under 3,000 miles on my Acura TL. And most of the Acura miles were out of feeling guilty seeing it sit there. Thanks to PASM, the 911S on "normal" suspension setting is pretty street friendly. If you have to deal with snow, that will require winter wheels/tires. I think the Cayman would make a great commuter car.
  • amhjmsamhjms Posts: 14
    Interesting comment about signing something saying you won't move your Porsche outside the US. Do recall what the consequences were? You'd have to give back the car I suppose (ha)? I recently moved from Oregon to The Netherlands. I brought my 2000 Boxster with me (about 30 k miles). I figured it was worth more here. Thanks to the exchange rate it could be worth nearly double (i.e. from about $22 k to about $40 k or so, but 30% of that is from exchange rate). At the dealer I can't help but look at prices and due to taxes, etc. you could come close to paying twice. Had I known this I would have bought a brand new 911 in the US, not signed the thing about moving (or signed it "Mickey Mouse"), driven it here for a few years and made money upon selling it. Seems like there is a bit of arbitrage opportunity, although there are various restrictions that would make it hard to do regularly.
  • Any advise on purchase between a new CaymanS vs a low mileage 911? Regarding fun and value. :)
  • kmanskmans Posts: 20
    This has been discussed many times before at the Cayman Club website but in short it really depends on what you want in a car. If you want the best handling car, fastest at the track and one with the best aural sensation go with the Cayman S. If you need miniature back seats and want the status symbol of owning the 911 go that route. Really not a bad choice between either.
  • rmddsrmdds Posts: 10
    Agree totally. I am close to pulling the trigger on the Cayman S. I have test-driven both a CS and a 911 C4S and have spoken about the CS being the best handling and best all-rounder Porsche there is in the mkt, but I get stares from 911 purists! Needless to say in a straight line the 911 range has more hp oomp, but for grip around the bends and overall ride pleasure, the CS is peerless. Hope I am right on this score???
  • I came out of a Boxster S (2003) and was considering both the Cayman S and 911 C2S. I have previously taken performance driving courses and will be going back to take Porsche's advanced level course next spring/summer.

    The Cayman S is an exceptional handling car, It is intuitive - even a relative novice can get one around a track reasonably quickly after a few tries. Also, I liked the light weight - making it feel quicker in transition than it actually is. (Same is true for the Boxster S).

    However, after driving both at a track, the 911 C2S became my choice. It is not as "intuitive" as the Cayman, but once you learn how to drive it, I found it to be quite a bit quicker around the track. The 911 and Cayman are almost neck and neck in the turns, but the 911's power difference is a significant advantage on the straights.

    I don't think you can go wrong with either car. However, I do think the Cayman S interest has peaked. A lot of the initial interest from the press and reviewers was from the camp that has had "issues" with the 911 for decades. They thought the Boxster S was the best handling Porsche ever a couple of years ago. I'm here to claim the 911 is a great handling car - and with the 997 models standard PASM & PSM, Porsche has evolved it tremendously from what it was just 10 years ago, let alone its early days 30+/- years ago.

    P.S. I also recommend you test the C2S rather than the C4S as a better comparison to the Cayman s. The "4" is nearly 200 lbs heavier and has approximately 3-5% less drivetrain efficiency (wheel horsepower) than the "2". The C2S is noticably quicker and IMO, feels more nimble. I've heard it claimed that in actual tests (not Porsche published numbers), the C4S and the base C2 are neck and neck in acceleration, with the C2 being better in handling on dry pavement. The C2S is a notch or two up from both. Maybe it just runs in the family. My brother, a former Porsche racing team member, prefers the RWD 997 GT3 to the AWD Turbo, at least on a track. If you are planning a lot of rain or light snow use, the "4" would make a good choice, but it wasn't mine and I live in New England.
  • I bought a Basalt Metallic Black 2.7 with the 18" wheels, Xenon headlights, all leather, PCM and 'phone, and 6 CD stack.

    Makes me smile every time I am in the car. I think we are on 3400 miles in 8 weeks and its so pleasurable to drive. Regarding the 911 I have no doubt that within a couple of years the Caymen will be the 911 replacement as a racer. It is already awesome around the Nurburgring and adding the LSD and upping the power will see it beating 911's no problem.

    And to think its got 20 year build quality : ) Incidentally the Valmet factory is laying off workers this week so Porsche may be taking a view that it will preserve price and cachet by building less of them.
  • "Regarding the 911 I have no doubt that within a couple of years the Caymen will be the 911 replacement as a racer. It is already awesome around the Nurburgring and adding the LSD and upping the power will see it beating 911's no problem."

    Since we are among friends here who share a passion for Porsche, I won't fault you for your prediction. But I will suggest you don't hold your breath. The 911 is, after all, only 40 years old and has variants that run from $70k to the $200k GT2. No matter how many physics professors have suggested to Porsche that they stop breaking the laws and come up with a mid engine design for their flagship, they have been stubbornly hanging in there with the 911 and making more profit per car than any other manufacturer, period.

    When I was at the plant in September, I asked the very question of whether or not the Cayman was destined to be, in a more powerful form, the 911 racer replacement. Thankfully, my Turbo was already in production, or they would have kicked me out of the waiting line. I'm not defending the rear engine vs. mid engine layout. Personally, if that was the only question, I'd prefer the latter. But purely from a financial perspective, the Cayman is, so far, only a footnote to the 911 in sales and profitability. My dealer sold out his first allocation of Cayman S's 6 months in advance. He's now sitting with an "uncomfortably high" inventory of both base and S models. So I would have to agree with redsoxgirl, the initial infatuation has worn off rather quickly. That doesn't diminish the fact that it is a very nice car, but if the reaction I got in Stuttgart was any indication, the 911 will remain the Porsche flagship (racing and otherwise) until all I can drive is a wheelchair.
  • fedlawmanfedlawman Posts: 3,118
    For the record, the mid-engined Carrera GT is the Porsche flagship.
  • habitat1habitat1 Posts: 4,282
    "For the record, the mid-engined Carrera GT is the Porsche flagship."

    For the record, the Carerra GT was the most expensive road legal Porsche. From Wikipedia:

    Originally, a production run of 1,500 cars was slated. But Porsche announced in August, 2005 that it would not continue production of the Carrera GT throughout 2006. Porsche announced that this discontinuation was due to changing airbag regulations in the US. However, reports of diminishing sales volumes, relatively high dealer inventory levels, and dealer discounts below MSRP were reported by the automotive press as being the true factors driving an early end to the production run.

    So if you are using price as a surrogate for "flagship", it is currently the 911 Turbo. But I think most people would look at the Carerra GT as more of an interesting experiment than a company flagship. You need more than Jay Leno and a few hundred other near billionares to be waving a flagship for it to be seen by the poor masses like us.
  • kmanskmans Posts: 20
    First Item - C2S is faster than Cayman S around the track. Well let's see an engine with 60 more hp and a car that costs $30K more. Surprisingly enough if you ask Hurley Haywood at the Porsche Driving Experience he will tell you that he prefers the Cayman S and that he can turn laps times in the Cayman S on par with the 997 C2S (and faster than the base 997). If you dump $6K into your Cayman S in modifications you can easily outrun the 997 C2S for still $24K LESS in price - source CaymanClub.Net

    Second Item - While the Cayman S did set a sales record for any Porsche sports car at any time ever built in its first month of release demand has dropped from the initial spike but has held steady for the last 6 months. Meanwhile the demand for both the Cayenne and the 997 has fallen off (exception being the recently released turbo and GT3). The Cayman's monthly sales figures are publicly available for your review - source CaymanClub.Net

    Will the Cayman replace the 911 as the factory race car? No - not accordingly to Wolfgang Porsche who said that while the engineers at Porsche recognize that it would be superior race car on the track and would beat the 911, Porsche management will not allow that to happen. He went on to suggest that if the Cayman were raced in an event where they did not compete head to head with the 911 that Porsche would consider backing such an event but he suspected that it would have to be a grass roots effort initially. - source CaymanClub.Net

    As I said in a previous post if you are deciding between a Cayman and a 997, choose the one that best fits your style and preferences but have no preconceived notions that just because you pay more for something that it is in some way a superior car. Deciding between those two is like deciding between two supermodels to take to dinner, is there really a wrong choice?
  • fedlawmanfedlawman Posts: 3,118
    I define a "flagship" as a model that possesses the best that a company has to offer (finest quality parts, latest technology, highest level of performance, highest price/exclusivity, etc.)

    I didn't know the Carerra GT is no longer in production, so I stand corrected. It was the flagship.
  • Selling Price is $51,500
    MSRP is $55,795
    Money Factor is .00310.
    Lease terms 36 MONTHS 12k miles per year
    Intial money out of pocket $3,988
    Monthly Payments is $737

    Is this a good deal?
  • That seems a little steep. If you look on the base Cayman thread, it seems like myself and another chap got better deals. Mine's a 2yr/20K, so its not a straight comparison, but I did get significantly more off of MSRP. I copied my info below from the referenced thread:

    MSRP: $54,350
    Gross Cap: $47,650
    Cap Cost Reduction: $ 2,174
    Residual: $40,0185.70
    License: $359
    Doc Prep: $790 (!)
    Monthly before Tax: $498.82
    Drive-off with 1st month: $4,038
    MF: I belive it works out to about 7.5%
  • Hi bgsntth,

    Thank you the information you provided. What really is Cap Cost Reduction? Do dealers disclose that information?

    And by the way, what dealership did you get you car from?
  • habitat1habitat1 Posts: 4,282
    I've never leased, so am by no means knowledgeable about what is a good or not good deal. However, in today's Wall Street Journal, there is an advertisement by Princeton Porsche for a new base Cayman lease:

    MSRP $50,965
    39 month, 10k miles per year ($.30 per mile over)
    Intitial total out of pocket due $4,639
    Payments: $399/month

    By my simple math, if you amortized 100% of the entire additional cost of your options $4,800 ($123/month) over the lease term and added 2,000 miles a year @$0.30 to the payment ($50/month) and added the difference in intial payment to the lease ($651 = 17/month), it would appear that the equivalent 39 month lease from Princeton on the car you want at 12k miles per year and with a $3998 initial payment would only be about $589 per month.

    $4,000 up front and $737 for a base Caymen seems like an extraordinary amount. I know it's not a fair comparison, but I could sell my fully loaded 2005 911S Cabriolet at 15 months and 11.5k miles for about $10-12k less than I paid for it (new, cash sale). I did get a great discount up front ($10k), but the current discounts on a Cayman S are even greater in percentage terms.
  • Cap Cost reduction is the "money down".
  • rmddsrmdds Posts: 10
    I am close to pulling the trigger on a CS in meteor grey with 19'sports design rims. It's a combo I don't often see on the road. Would anyone have shots of their C/CS in meteor grey? Can you send it to me? The small colour sample in the showroom makes it difficult to visualize the car in the colour.
    Much appreciate it. Thanks!
  • kmanskmans Posts: 20
    Have you looked in the Cayman gallery at:
    http://www.caymanclub.net/gallery/browseimages.php?c=2

    Oh wait I see your question there as well,you might ask it in the forums instead to see if you get a response. Meteor is a new color for 07 so not as many pics yet.
  • kyfdxkyfdx Posts: 29,957
    That is a great link...

    Wow.. would it ever be hard to decide after checking all of those out... :surprise:

    MODERATOR
    Prices Paid, Lease Questions, SUVs

  • Hi:

    Just took my 2006 Cayman-S in for a 15K mile service. I forgot to mention to the service department that my car alarm, once activated, goes off intermitently, several times each day. Typically, I get to work in the morning, activate the car alarm after exiting the vehicle, and within the hour the car alarm goes off. I can see my car from my office window: nothing and no one has touched the car. Is this an easy troubleshoot, or are intermittent alarm issues hit and miss? I don't want to sit and wait for several hours at the Dealer if the prospect of finding the fault is slight.

    Thanks.

    Adam
  • fedlawmanfedlawman Posts: 3,118
    How sensitive is your alarm?

    I ask because, on days when I drive my BMW to work, there is a car in the parking garage that starts chirping like a canary every time I slowly pass by. The alarm doesn't actually go off, but it sure sounds like it's thinking about it! I suspect that the frequency of my Supersprint/Magnaflow exhaust reverberating off the cement walls, floor, and ceiling tickles that car's funnybone.
  • How can I tell "how sensitive"? I can kick a tire, for example, and not set the alarm off. I park on an isolated concrete pad in the morning, and the asphalt road that allows nearby traffic is several feet away. Can the alarm system be tweaked?
  • topspin628topspin628 Posts: 373
    So a couple of days ago I took a 30 minute test drive in the Cayman S. Wow. It's a great car. The handling and sound of the engine were fantastic. I love the looks. My quandary is this: is it a good daily driver for the congested and often cold Northeast? I would use it almost every day and at times I am in the car for upwards of 2-4 hours in a given day (round trip). Much in traffic, so don't scream at me, but I would go for the auto tranny.
    My other possibilities are (different animals but I don't always cross shop the same class)
    BMW 650, 5 series or 3 (twin turbo)
    MB E Class- very different but a great daily driver.
    The Cayman stirs my soul but does the fantastic sound of the engine turn into an annoyance when you are driving for a long stretch? Do you miss a great stereo, ipod attachment, bluetooth for phone etc.?

    I would love any input. I think it's one of the top 10 "lookers" in the auto world.
    Thanks
  • carnaughtcarnaught Posts: 1,597
    I have two things in common with you: I too am in my car for at 2hrs. or so per day and I too lust for a Cayman.

    My daily driver is a 3 series BMW and my lease is up in Aug.

    The way I have rationalized it is that the BMW has been comfortable, fun, safe and even thrifty and is thus ideal for its "workhorse" status. I see the Cayman as being a fun driver on weekends; i.e., for leisure rather than work activities.

    My next lease will probably be another BMW.

    I'm still considering the addition of a Cayman, in addition, though.
  • habitat1habitat1 Posts: 4,282
    Only YOU can answer this question of "tolerability"for yourself. Everybody's risk/reward equation on having a sports car as a daily driver is different.

    But (and I'm speaking quietly, not screaming), if you need to go for an automatic because of traffic, I think the Cayman may not be the right car for you. When we had a Honda S2000 as a third car, I found it delightful but my wife could only tolerate it for short drives due to the engine noise and high strung nature of the car. Our 911S is more "civilized"; the Cayman is probably in-between. But in spite of her lower tolerance level regarding noise, my wife NEVER would have given up a manual transmission in her daily driver SUV by choice. When we traded our Isuzu Trooper for a MDX, she had no choice.

    My point is that driving a stick in traffic may be a good metric. If you can't tolerate that, driving a high strung, relatively noisy sports car 2-4 hours a day might get old real fast.

    If I were faced with your situation, I'd be keeping my semi-retired 1995 Nissan Maxima SE 5-speed with 155k miles for most of the daily commutes (it's book value is about $3,500) and buy a 6-speed Cayman S for the weekends and days when I felt like commuting in (real) sport. Given that the tiptronic costs about $3,400 and diminishes resale, that's a better than even wash in my book. If that didn't work, I'd probably get a 335i - but still in manual mode. I'll be 50 soon and I'm getting too old to learn how to drive an automatic and smile at the same time. ;)

    If I did have to forego my left leg exercise, the E320 Bluetec might be worth considering.
  • topspin628topspin628 Posts: 373
    The 335i looks like a killer on paper. 0-60 times are faster than the current M3. Throw in good gas mileage, lots of creature comforts and tech stuff (bluetooth, killer stereo)and a good value (45-50K loaded)and how can you beat it? But...
    I test drove the sedan and liked but didn't love it yet. I had the last version of the 330i and that was a car I loved.
    This one also had all the right moves but maybe I've changed, since it didn't "rock my world". I may have to try the coupe which will have sport suspension. Now the Cayman is really a special car. It's not nearly as fast (in base), costs more, doesn't have the tech stuff but it's got show stopping looks and slot car handling. You know you're in a special machine. I like the tiptronic; one traffic jam trying to get into the Lincoln tunnel for 45 minutes has cured me of a stick as my everyday ride.
    Anyone out there using the Cayman as an everyday car and putting 15K of city driving on her per year? Chime in please.
  • "Anyone out there using the Cayman as an everyday car and putting 15K of city driving on her per year?"

    I averaged 13,500 miles a year in my Boxster S before trading it for a 911S last fall. It looks like I'll average 12,000 miles +/- in the 911. Less commuting (moved from North Carolina to Boston and live/work downtown) but more long weekend trips. Properly maintained, Porsches are pretty durable, if that's your concern.

    "I like the tiptronic; one traffic jam trying to get into the Lincoln tunnel for 45 minutes has cured me of a stick as my everyday ride."

    One traffic jam "cured" you? I'd re-label that as "poisoned" you. And only one - that's a pretty sad statement of intestinal fortitude. :confuse: ;)

    FWIW, Boston traffic is a lot worse than Charlotte and Raleigh, but it's never once caused me any additional pain or frustration to have a manual transmission. I happen to agree with the suggestion that if you can't endure a manual transmission in traffic, you will probably find a sports car as a daily driver will also wear on you. Obviously, it's your decision, but after driving a Cayman S tiptronic as a loaner whan my car was in for service, I was rather dissapointed. My previous test drives of a 6-speed were extremely positive - to the point I considered it in lieu of the 911S. But the tiptronic seemed to significantly sap the power (down to the level of a base Cayman with manual).
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