BMW 5-Series Lease Questions

CarMan@Edmunds · October 2005

Hi papazhenyaaa. BMW's current lease program is scheduled to run through October 31st. It is difficult to say whether its November program on the 2006 530xi will be more or less attractive than its current one. If I had to make an educated guess, I would say that it will probably be about the same. I don't think that it makes much of a difference if you lease this car in October or November, whatever month you choose to do it in though it wouldn't hurt to shop at the end of the month. Dealers often are willing to cut skinnier deals at the end of the month to fit a few more sales in right before the deadline.

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CarMan@Edmunds · October 2005

Hi qingqingdao. BMW is no longer providing any sort of lease support on the 2005 BMW 530i. As a result, if you were to lease one through BMW Financial Services right now, you would have to use its standard lease money factor of .00280. Its 48 month, 12,000 miles per year residual value is currently a terrible 37%. If I was in the market for an '05 5-Series, I definitely would not lease it. The 2006 5-Series' lease program is much much better. If you were to lease a 2006 BMW 530i through BMW FS right now for 42 months (its 42 month money factor is much better than its 48 month factor) with 12,000 miles per, its buy rate lease money factor and residual value should be .00140 and 54%, respectively.

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CarMan@Edmunds · October 2005

Hello bimmerdude. BMW Financial Services' current buy rate lease money factor for a 36 month lease of a 2006 530i is .00140 with the payment of a security deposit and BMW FS $625 acquisition fee. It looks as though the dealer that you are working with is trying to mark-up your car's base money factor to add additional back-end profit to your deal. This practice is perfectly legal, but can usually be avoided by consumers who know what the buy rate is for the car that they want.

It is difficult for me to give you my opinion on the selling price that you were quoted for this car without knowing its full MSRP. This will enable me to see how much of a discount you are being given and it is necessary to calculate its lease payment. Let me know what the full MSRP is (with the destination charge added in) and I will be happy to give you my opinion on your deal and work up a lease payment for you using BMW's actual lease program.

If you choose to lease this car you will have to work with a dealer. BMW FS does not deal directly with the general public.

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CarMan@Edmunds · October 2005

That is a good question, grnfish. I believe that the $0.15 per mile would be subtracted from your car's residual value for the purpose of calculating its lease payment.

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CarMan@Edmunds · October 2005

Here is the information that you are looking for doug_999. If you were to lease a 2006 BMW 550i through BMW Financial Services right now for 36 months with 12,000 miles per year, its buy rate lease money factor and residual value should be .00260 and 59%, respectively. This car's 15,000 miles per and 10,000 miles per residual values would be 57% and 60% for this term. It is difficult to say what this car's lease program will be like in December, but given the fact that its program is not very good right now and that BMW had to provide so much support on the 545i in the past, I would not be surprised if BMW did enhance its lease offers on this car in the coming months.

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99_528i · October 2005

I'm new to this forum, and I'm wondering if anybody can tell me the money factor and residual value for 2006 530i (RWD) on a 36-month 12,000 miles per year term? I just went to a dealer in northern Cal and I was quoted a money factor of 0.00190 and residual of 60%. Not sure if these are valid numbers.

I'm looking at a 530i with nav, sports package and premium package. The dealer didn't really give me any solid numbers, but the monthly payment is $663+tax. Any comments? Thanks so much in advance, as I really want to get my car before month end.

99_528i

kyfdx · October 2005

.0014 and 62% for 3yr/36K...

firstimebmw · October 2005

Hi Kydfx,
I got a quote for 530i, MSRP 54170, price 50995, MF 0.0018. Is this a good deal? MF is bit high, will dealer usually be willing to go lower?
Will you please tell me my monthly payment and other fees expected?

Thanks.

firstimebmw · October 2005

Sorry, it is for 36/12000, lease.

kyfdx · October 2005

The base money factor is .0014, and the residual is 62%

Using the base money factor, the payment is about $602/mo.. + tax..

With the .0018 MF, the payment is $636/mo.. + tax.

At signing, you would have to pay the 1st payment, security deposit, and an acquistion fee of $625.. along with any license/title fees required by your state..

regards,
kyfdx
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bimmerdude · October 2005

Thanks kyfdx!
I remebered you said there should not be a security deposit unless I am getting the base MF = 0.0014, do I still have to pay the security deposit for MF other than base rate?

kyfdx · October 2005

To get the base rate, you have to make a security deposit, unless you are a returning customer... But, if your dealer is marking up the money factor for additional profit, they will also probably require you to make a security deposit... otherwise, it would cut into that additional profit..

regards,
kyfdx
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dasbmw · November 2005

I was able to pluck a car off the boat at the local dealer for $1000 over invoice. I signed the deal in October so I am locked in (or so they say). I got the .0016 with 60% residual on 36 month 15k lease. They said if November numbers are better then we can go with them. What are the November numbers for a 525i, 36 month with 15k/year?

Thanks for the help with determining the best time to buy. I think I got an ok deal. MD charges full sales tax on the vehicle at time of purchase. No getting around that one.

David

needaride1 · November 2005

I'm a newbie to this forum, looking for some assistance. I looking for a deal on a 525. I have 4 months left on my current lease 2003 325i 36month 15k lease. I got ripped off. so now i'm trying to save face. Here's the skinny... I'm way over on miles which I know is probably no big deal. The residual value is around 19,500. I spoke to one sales guy and he told me the money factor was 5.75 and that was the lowest.. what the market like what should I be lookin for... Please Help

dasbmw · November 2005

needaride1,

I am new to the forum too but can help a little bit. Money factors and residuals change every month. Here is an example using last months 525i numbers. I don't know this month's numbers yet. Seperate the old car turn from the new car purchase or lease. Pay what ever you owe on the car or buy it and trade it or sell it. Do not allow the dealer to roll the 325 liability into the new car deal. Make a deal on the new car first. Negotiate the purchase price of the vehicle, maybe $1000 over invoice. Make sure you tell the finance guy that you need to lease the car with the money factor at the buy rate. What this means is if the money factor is .0016 like last month, the dealer might mark it up to .0020 to cover your last car or to make more money. The acquistion fee is $625, some dealer mark that up too. So you negotiate the best deal on the new car, the financing, etc. BTW 5.75 is not a money factor it is the imputed interest rate derived by multiplying the money factor by another number. The MF for last month was .0016 on a 36 month 525 lease. That is about 3.8% not 5.75%. You need to read up on leasing because the lease negotiation is as important as the purchase price.

Now you can deal with your old car. You can buy the car, then sell it or trade it. Or you can pay off the mileage and excess wear and tear. You will have to do the calculations to figure it out.

Good luck. I am sure someone else will add what I missed.

David

needaride1 · November 2005

thanks for the info

needaride1 · November 2005

correct me if I wrong... I need to negotiate a deal on a new purchace or lease price first... then bring my old car into the picture...

needaride1 · November 2005

I sthe money factor used in a purchase as well?

tayl0rd · November 2005

Not outwardly or evenly across the board. The finance guy will stick you with a higher interest rate than you actually qualify for. The dealership will get a kickback from the overage. The bank gets its money for the rate you qualified for and the overage is "cake money" for the dealership.

dasbmw · November 2005

The money factor is for leasing only. It is kind of like an interest rate. I think you multiply the money factor by 2400 (I'd have to look it up to be sure) to get the interest rate. There are on line lease and payment calculators that can help with the payment.

The negotiation process is very personal. I like to get the best deal possible on the purchase, the negotiate for the trade in. Remember that you are returning a leased car. You do not have to trade it. I would only trade in the leased car to the dealer if it was going to save me money. If I owed $1500 in excess mileage and wear and tear, and the dealer was going to pay off the old car then it would work out ok. The point is to figure out what is the cheapest way for you to get out of the old lease. Call BMW finance directly to discuss your options on the turn in.

David

needaride1 · November 2005

thnaks again.. this really helps...

drtravel · November 2005

Noticed that the November deals for the 525 and 530 were identical to the October deals - so looks like no change in MF and residuals.

For 525
MF = 0.00160
15K residual = 60%
12K residual = 62%
10K residual = 63%

For 530
MF = 0.00140
15K residual = 60%
12K residual = 62%
10K residual = 63%

For 550
MF = 0.00260
15K residual = 57%
12K residual = 59%
10K residual = 60%

To get their 525 lease

MSRP = 44,470
Cap Cost = 41,950 (44,470 + 625 security - 2,500 down - 645 discount)
MF = 0.0016 (X 2400 = 3.84% below Greenspan rate!)
Residual = 63% = 28,016
Payment is $499

Happy renting

dasbmw · November 2005

Thanks for the November numbers. I am picking up the car today.

David

needaride1 · November 2005

That's great... so when you go into the dealer do you just ask what the mf is for the month on that car???

dasbmw · November 2005

You can ask and they will tell you what they want to tell you. Dealers will usually mark up the MF from the buy rate. The buy rate is what they get the money for. That is what you want to pay. Come here or go to another board to find the buy rates. Someone just posted November's numbers. Look at the model you are interested in, the miles and it will give you the residual and the MF. Go to a lease calculator program (use google to search) and enter your numbers. It will tell you if you are getting ripped of or paying too much.

David

boyla · November 2005

I am interested in 530i. The dealer says he has 530i w/ premium pkg, cold weather pkg, and steptronic silver gray metallic. MSRP is 51320 and invoice is 47070. I think selling price is 49070 and MF is 0.00193. He claims that I cannot get MF of .00140 since I never owned BMW before. He says MF is 0.00193 w/ security deposit. My understanding was that I could get .00140 MF w/ security deposit even though I have never owned BMW before. His quite is $722 (tax included) w/ 2000 TDO w/ 10k miles/yr. Can you guys help me out? Thank you so much

seloo · November 2005

Don't walk away, Run!

hpowders · November 2005

Run! boyla run! I have a 2005 545 and with tax I am paying $721.
Mine is a $60,000 vehicle with a V8.
Shop around. If you put in the time and have patience, you should be able to find a dealer willing to do the base money factor of .0014.
Good luck!

boyla · November 2005

530I
I want premium pkg, sport pkg, and steptronic, and cold weather pkg w/ metallic paint.
MSRP is $53620
Invoice is $49165
How much do I have to pay for 3 yr/ 15k mile?
Can you guys please help me out? Thank you

dasbmw · November 2005

There are a lot of lease calculators on the net. Do a google search so you can play with the numbers. In your example, 36/15k 530i, MF .0014, residual 60%, $1000 over invoice. Not including taxes or fees your payment would be $615/month. You still need to add in tax, acquisition fee of $625, first month payment $615, security deposit $650. If you pay all this up front your payment if $615. If you roll all this into the payment then it will be higher. It depends on what state you are in. Taxes are big $$$. In MD where I live, you pay sales tax on the entire vehicle and no monthly sales tax. On $50k vehicle, the tax is $2500. Add that to the fees and you get about $4500 out of pocket. If you rolled the $4500 into the lease your payments are about $746. Remember the taxes and fees are not residualized so they are real costs. You do of course get the security deposit back if you don't owe for mileage or damage.

Make sure you get the money factor at the buy rate of .0014 and buy the car for $1000 over invoice. Call the dealers and ask to speak with the sales manager. If the dealer is willing to do the deal, and has a car you will take then you are done. Just check the numbers. You sometimes can't be picky if you are not giving them there "normal profit". I just did this exact deal on a 525i last night. The dealer actually took a car off the boat. I talked to 3 other dealers who either would not do the deal or did not have the car. None of the other 3 dealers would lift a finger to get a for a $1000 over invoice deal. I can't really blame them but my deal was easy.

David

hpowders · November 2005

Paying $2500 over invoice, I get a pre-tax monthly payment of around $673.41 with the base money factor of .0014 and 60% residual.
I would say this is the upper limit of what you should pay.
See if you can find a dealer who can do $1500 over invoice since that would reduce your monthly pre-tax payment to $644.30.

boyla · November 2005

I got quote from other dealer and he says he is willing to do 1300 over invoice. And he also says MF for this month is .0014 w/o security deposit and .00125 w/ security deposit. Is it true or did he make mistake on MF? Thank you.

kyfdx · November 2005

For the '06 530i?

.0014 with security deposit

.00155 without security deposit..

Seems like a simple math mistake on his part....

regards,
kyfdx
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bimmerdude · November 2005

Hi,
I have 2 questions regarding leasing and ordering the car:

1. What should I get from the sales man when I put down the $1000 for ordering a car from BMW? like a detailed about the deal, selling price, MF, fees, etc? Is email enough?

2. Can you cancel the order and get the $1000 back if anything happened? very unlikely, but good to know.

Please advice as soon as possible, I am on the verge of ordering the car. Thanks very much!

boyla · November 2005

I got quote from the dealer.
Premium pkg, sport pkg, and steptronic, and cold weather pkg w/ metallic paint.

MSRP is $53620
Invoice is $49165

MF of .0014 and Residual Value 60%
He went over $1300 invoice
He told me to put down 1907 at the signing
month payment 708 (tax included Southern California 8.25%)

Is this a good deal? Thank you

kyfdx · November 2005

MSRP $53,620
Invoice $49,165
Selling price $50,465
Cap cost $51,090 (Selling price + $625 acq.fee)
Residual 60% (3yr/45K..?)
MF .0014

Payment = $642/mo.+ tax = $695/mo. including 8.25%tax

I'm assuming your $1907 includes 1st payment and security deposit.. plus registration, etc.. if so, this seems reasonable..

That is off by $13/mo.. Not much difference.. about $400 total.. I wouldn't be too worried about that, as you have a very aggressive selling price, and the base rates.. but, I'd still ask why.. Maybe some extraneous fees that you could get taken out..

regards,
kyfdx
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CarMan@Edmunds · November 2005

Here is the new November lease program for the car that you are interested in, 99_528i. If you were to lease a 2006 BMW 530i through BMW Financial Services right now for 36 months with 12,000 miles per year, its buy rate lease money factor and residual value should be .00140 and 62%, respectively.

You never mentioned the selling price or MSRP of the car that you are interested in leasing. These are important numbers for you as a consumer to know for two reasons. First, the selling prices of leased vehicles can be negotiated, just as if you were paying cash for them. Without knowing this car's selling price in relation to its MSRP you don't know how much of a discount you are getting on it. The second reason is that one needs the selling price and MSRP, including the destination charge, of a vehicle to calculate its lease payment. I would be more than happy to give you my opinion on the deal that you were quoted if you let me know what these numbers are.

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CarMan@Edmunds · November 2005

Hello David. It sounds like you were able to negotiate a pretty good deal on the 5-Series that you are interested in. $1,000 over invoice is not too bad for a car that wasn't even in dealer stock. If you were to lease a 2006 BMW 525i through BMW Financial Services in November for 36 months with 15,000 miles per year, its buy rate lease money factor and residual value should be .00160 and 60%, respectively.

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CarMan@Edmunds · November 2005

You don't necessarily have to negotiate the selling price of your new car separately from your trade in, needaride1, but it certainly makes the transaction easier to follow. I always find out exactly what I will have to pay to buy the new car that I want and then ask for a quote on how much the dealer would give me if I was to trade in my old car. If you decide that you want to trade in a vehicle when leasing, it is in your best interest to have the dealer that you are working with cut you a check for your trade rather than using the proceeds from it as a capitalized cost reduction for your lease. I always advise consumers against making any sort of down payment when leasing. I do so for two main reasons. The first is if your vehicle is totaled in an accident or stolen during your lease, your insurance company pays off the bank that you were leasing it through and your down payment essentially disappears. The second main reason is that down payments on leased vehicles do nothing to reduce their lease-end purchase prices. So your lease-end purchase option price for your new 5-Series would be exactly the same, regardless of whether you had put several thousand dollars down, or had made absolutely no down payment at all.

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CarMan@Edmunds · November 2005

Hi boyla. As long as you pay a security deposit equivalent to your car's first month's payment rounded up to the nearest $50 increment, you definitely should qualify for BMW Financial Services' buy rate lease money factor of .00140 on this car. The only reason why this number would be higher is if you were having your car's security deposit waived. BMW FS will do this in exchange for a slight increase in your car's factor. Whether you are a previous BMW Fs lessee or not has absolutely nothing to do with the money factor that you qualify for, other than the fact that BMW may waive its security deposit requirement for returning lessees without an increase in the money factor. It sounds to me as though the dealer that you are working with is marking your car's money factor up to add additional back-end profit to your deal. This practice is perfectly legal and happens all the time, but you should be able to avoid it by insisting that your dealer use the buy rate money factor to calculate your car's payment.

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CarMan@Edmunds · November 2005

Hi bimmerdude. You need to be absolutely positive that you are not going to cancel your deal before you give a dealership a $1,000 deposit on an ordered vehicle. Even if the dealer claims that your deposit is completely refundable if you want to back out of your deal, you may have a hard time getting them to give back your money. I see consumers get stiffed by dealers on deposits that were supposedly refundable all the time. When you give the dealer your deposit, have them give you some sort of receipt for it that states that you can get a full refund of your deposit for any reason. Also, make the deposit with your credit card. That way if you ever get into a dispute with the dealer about getting the money back, you may be able to get your card to reverse the charge.

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jmcmbz · November 2005

Hi, I'm hoping for some helpful info about mileage. I am going to need 19 to 20K miles per year on my lease (everything is so far away here in Cal). Is it best to get the 15K lease and then buy the extra 15K miles after all is negotiated or later in the lease term? My other thought is getting a 2 year lease with 40K miles to stay under warranty but I'm not sure if my payment would be way too high. Does BMW offer a two year lease with the same money factors? I guess the residuals would be different but I would think much higher. Should I buy an extended warranty if I do go the extra 10K miles over on the 3 year lease or just try to get out of the car at 50K miles? Price wise, I am looking at a similar deal in So. Cal as "boyla" in message #140 so that was great information. Thanks!

needaride1 · November 2005

david if you don't mind me asking what Maryland Dealer did you use I in MD and the dealers I've been talking to aren't talking those numbers

needaride1 · November 2005

so if I go the trade in route have them cut a check??? But here's my problem my car has high miles... the best deal I was offered was 15500 for my car which left me about 6k upside down...

boyla · November 2005

I am getting Jet blk/blk w/ sport pkg, premium pkg w/ steptronic.
MSRP: 52870
Selling price: 50140.54
MF: 0.00155
TDO: 1900
Residual Value 60% for 15k
Monthly Payment: 687/month 8.25% tax included
He says car is on the ship to the US and I would be able to get it on Dec. Is this fair deal? I also like to thank you guys for help

jmcmbz · November 2005

Hey kyfdx, It's been hard to find the color and options that I want. Here is a quote for a car that comes close to be delivered first week of December. I think it sounds somewhat high compared to other postings but not too far off from the carsdirect.com price. If my math is right, I should be looking at another approx 2K off the selling price to get to 1K over invoice (which is my goal). I am not sure about the $300 September 2006 "price adjustment" and I'm still unsure of the extra mileage as previously requested.

Here's what they sent me. I'd sincerely appreciate some help. Do you think I could get this for $2800 Out of pocket and $750/month? Thanks!

2006 530i Black Sapphire / Auburn Leather
36 Months 18K/year

Base price $46500
September 2006 Price adjustment $300
Steptronic $1275
Sports Pkg $2300
Premium Pkg $1800
Comfort Access $1000
Heated Front seats $500
F&R Park Distance $700
Navigation System $1800
Destination $695

Total as equipped $56870
Dealer ADD Sirius Radio $850
Total w/ Add-Ons $57720

Selling Price $54995
Money Factor 1.4
Residual Factor 60% -$1350.00 (? for extra miles)

Total Cap Cost $54995
Residual Value $ 32772
Total Depreciation $22223
Monthly Depreciation $617.31
Monthly Rent $122.87

Monthly Payment $740.18
Tax (8.25%) 61.06
Total Payment $801.24

Lic & Reg $426.75
Bank Fee $625.00
Doc Fee $45.00
First Payment $801.24
Sec. Deposit $850

Total Drive Off $2803.27

kyfdx · November 2005

The numbers all work out... Getting the base money factor is good... also, the base acquisition fee..

A few points..

1) You are paying $0.15/mi. for the extra 9000 miles.... As this also reduces the residual, your actual cost is a little less than that.. Are you positive that you will need that many extra miles? If not, you can pick any amount in-between.. (5000 extra for example), and that would lower your payment a little..

2) The Sirius add-on is a non-event as far as MSRP and residual.. they aren't residualizing it.. It is hard to say how much extra that is adding to the selling price, but whatever it is, you are paying for completely.. not just a portion of it, like factory options.. If the selling price is $850 higher because of it, you are paying around $25/mo. just for the Sirius add-on.

3) Getting it down to $750/mo.? That would require a further discount in the selling price of $1700 or so... not very likely.. You might get it down another $25/$30 per month..

regards,
kyfdx
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jmcmbz · November 2005

OK, thanks for the advice, while shopping, I ended up driving a 525i and was more than happy with the power of the new engine AND decided I could be happy with black interior as the auburn was so hard to come by right away. I also thought it drove fantastic even without the sport package. Wasn't sure about those "run-flats" anyway.

SO, Here's what I ended up being offered. Keep in mind it's the pre-Sept price increase which I think is a big bonus and they are picking the car up in Orange County and bringing to LA. The only downsides are that 1) it was hard for me to configure the price for invoice because of this and 2) it has a key instead of a button (big whoop!)

Black Sapphire / Black leather

06 525i $41800
Cold weather $750
Premium Pkg $2000
Auto Trans $1275
Xenon Lights $800
Navigation $1800
Satellite $595
Destination $695

MSRP $49715
Selling price $47000
Adj Residual $29829
Total Term Dep $17171
Monthly Dep $476.97
Mo Lease Chg $122.93

Base Payment $599.90
Monthly Tax 8.25% $49.49
TOTAL PAYMENT $649.39

Drive off= $2480
includes 1st payment $649.39
Cap Reduction $0
Sls tax upfront $55.28
1st year fees (? DMV) $405.75
Security Deposit $700
Other Upfront $670 (Manager says it's $625 Bank Fee and $45 Doc Fee)

36 Months 15K (also decided to just buy the miles later as I may or may not need them all)

Should I go for it? Do these numbers work out? They tell me it's the .0016 MF. Please let me know. What would the payment be if I did not dish out the extra $700 for security deposit? What is the buy rate MF for no deposit?

I do feel very happy about this deal and the car and to boot, it's $150 less per month than the previous car I asked about. PLUS the Sirius radio is built in so I know the price for sure and it comes with one year free service (savings of another $13/month)

Thanks again kyfdx for all the great information. I'm such a BMW and car nerd I read these forums even when I'm not car shopping! If I get the car tomorrow as planned (and hope), I will be heading up to Northern California for a nice road-trip to break it in.

kyfdx · November 2005

California, right?

All of the numbers add up.. You have a healthy discount from MSRP ($2700).. they are using the base money factor (.0016), and the base acquisition fee ($625)... A $45 doc fee is low enough not to quibble about..

1) If you don't make the deposit, the base MF changes to .00175 and the payment goes up about $12-$13/mo.. not a good move.

2) If you want to reduce your upfront payment, you would be better served by having them add the $625 acquisition fee into the cap cost.. which also means you won't be paying sales tax on it, upfront (though you will in the payment).. lowering your initial payment by about $675... This will raise your monthly payment by about $20/mo., but you will still get your $700 security payment back at the end of the lease..

regards,
kyfdx
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jmcmbz · November 2005

Thanks again. Can't wait!

PS: Century West BMW Universal City CA (Los Angeles area)

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