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Comments
Geoff7
List price is about $90. You can take a look at www.rhodegear.com.
FWIW, I'm trying to sell my carrier. It works great, but my Xterra doesn't have a rear-mounted spare tire so I don't need the carrier any more.
Geoff7
http://www.fourwheeler.com/newtrucks/fwoty/99/4wheel.html
Article:
The grand Vitara has a similar four-wheel drive system to that on last year's Sidekick: a traditional (thank you) lever-operated two-speed part-time transfer case with a dedicated Neutral setting.
Low-range gearing is 1.82:1, and sends power to a Corporate IFS open diff-equipped axle up front and a Corporate rear live axle equipped with a limited-slip.
Kelly
He did mention that there are two after market products on the market to make it LS. One is electric ($$$'s), and the other involves opening up the diff and adding two plates that limit the slip. He says that the latter is less expensive, like a couple of hundred for the parts and the labour.
I had gotten my GV with the window gard accessory, when I brought it back to the dealer complaining of excessive wind noise the mechanic/technician that went on the test drive with me, said it was probably the window gards. So he took them off, and WOW there was a significant (70-80%) reduction in wind noise, there is still a little but I can live with it. I'm going to try "gone2sea"'s idea of keeping the rear windows open a bit.
I'm not familiar with "safety siped" tires can "djwood" or anyone else educate me (and others)
Thanks Much
Hakka Q's
Michelin Arctic Alpin's
Bridgestone Blizzak MZ-02's
Goodyear Ultra Grip Ice
Toyo GP-4's with the Microbit Technology (Walnut shells in the rubber)
Cost wise, they are all pretty close except the Toyo's being cheaper.
My question is (Based on your experience with these tires, and not based on what we read in Consumer Reports or otherwise), what do you think will be best for a location with black ice, snow, and freezing rain as part of the environment????
Ah, dealerships. I wish instead of warranty, I could get $$ back and do all of my own work instead. At least it'd be done correctly.
Kelly B
'99 JLX+, 5 speed
I've heard the Michelin Artic Alpin is just wonderful on ice, giving up some snow traction. Looking at how the tire is heavily siped, I can believe it.
Kelly B
'99 JLX+, 5 speed
am thinking of trying the gv 4 cylinder next weekend. I love the car, the price but am afraid of the engine noise.
Kelly B
'99 JLX+, 5 sp., 20,200 mi
Good luck with the Lemon Law!!
Kelly B
'99 JLX+, 5 sp., 20,300 mi
If it wasn't for the tachometer, I'd never know my GV's engine was on under 3000 rpm!
swest
Some people seem to have cleared it up with new, non-OEM tires, picky tire balance, and an alignment. Personally, I think the trucklet needs a steering damper, but if Suzuki admitted that, they'd be on the hook for what could be a few hundred dollar recall on each vehicle.
Kelly B
'99 JLX+, 5 sp., 20,600 mi, steering shake=yes
Tires, well, I prefer Michelin for passenger car tires, BFGoodrich, if you're looking for an aggressive all-terrain. These are just my personal choices.
Speaking of tires, even with 9 inches of the white stuff this morning, I managed to get out of my rather steep gravel driveway with the nearly shot OEM tires. The GV is like a mechanical goat, pure and simple. Well, it hasn't developed any offensive habits, yet. ;-)
Okay, it did take me a half a dozen tries to actually get all the way to the top, but I had to 'plow' it first.
Kelly B
'99 JLX+, 5 sp., 20,400 mi
Aside from the persistent vibration, I thought the rest of their criticisms were kind of bogus. It certainly would be nice if someone got to the bottom of this issue.
After reading it, I am glad that we got the standard (if what they say about the auto and power is really true).
Our GV experience is very different. It's a pleasure to drive, handles great, is quiet, ours handles very well at highway speeds and always feels stable. We've never felt any lack of power for passing, etc--just the opposite.
I agree about the superb off-road performance. Once you set it in 4L and hit the rough stuff, the machine just begs for more!
I read the review aloud to my wife, and we mostly just looked at each other and wondered how we could have such an overwhelmingly positive view of the machine when these people could hardly get themselves to say the words "grand vitara" without puking?
We laughed when we read Megan McCann's summary at the end. The on-road performance was so bad that she was afraid to take it off road lest it snaps in half..? Come on! Megan is clearly an imcompetent twit.
What they feel is bad, we seem to love. 4 doors, solid construction, extremely reliable..etc. When we camp or go on an extended trip, we pull a little trailer--storage problem solved.
I can honestly say that this is my first and last copy of Automobile I'll ever buy. I'm not saying this because they trashed the car we bought, but because their review was so blantantly weird...
I'm left wondering if a bunch of consumer reports hippies decided to leave and form their own car magazine?!
My 6 year old really did love the issue though, since he could recognize most of the $50,000 plus cars because of all the training Need For Speed III and NFS High Stakes has given him.
Apparently, the Automobile wirters can't seem to review an $18,000 4x4. I guess they are too used to reviewing all the machines that most of us can't afford. I guess I'll take their petty critisicms as a compliment.
JMHO,
swest
Personally, I can't give a magazine which doesn't even do their own performance tests much credibility.
Honestly, their test way biased against the vehicle from word one. I don't know how they can live with themselves. Fortunately, I didn't buy the magazine, I read it at the stand. Initially, I felt guilty, but quickly got over it.
Kelly
For example; CR does a nice job of spelling out what they expect from a vehicle. Too bad what they expect is a soft riding economy car with a cargo space. Their review gets my vote for "most out of touch." At least they are honest about it. You can read that right up front and recognize that CR is looking for a wagon, not a truck.
Oh yeah, back to Automobile. While they don't spell it out like CR, the writers make it fairly obvious what they think these vehicles should be capable of. The criteria are also much more complete than CR's. They provide good examples of the problems and don't just say "it sucked" with no explanation.
What I take issue with is the fact that the writers don't mention more of the things that the GV has going for it (styling, towing, ground clearance, and low gears). Too many negative points and none of the things that people might fall in love with. For a review to be complete, it has to mention everything about the vehicle, not just the good or (as in this case) the bad.
For someone like Gone2sea, who is down-sizing from a Blazer, the onroad manners (one example) of the GV are a step up. While they aren't as good as a CR-V, Forester, or RAV4, the bottom line is they are good enough (for him). The rest of the vehicle's positive traits obviously make up for it. Automobile left too many of those out of the article.
I'm surprised they belittled the reliability despite noting it so many times.
I also felt like they selectively made the decision to not take the machine to the dealer to get the vibration worked out. Then they noted how many complaints the vehicle got on the vibration.
That would be kind of like reviewing a Blazer when the ECU died and they didn't bother to get it fixed. Everyone who tried to drive the thing would make a log entry, so the result is that the thing just sat there for the whole long term review while everyone complained they couldn't drive it off the lot! This is an extreme example, but you get my point. Oh gosh--the brakes don't work right, but we'll just let everyone who test drives it for the next year complain about it, and then we'll tell everyone that all we got were constant complaints! I'm sure that when things happen to other vehicles, they go to the dealer and get them fixed, and this stops the constant stream of complaints...
They did note that the Suzuki salesman said the problem was indemic to these vehicles. I've never talked to a salesman who could even explain exactly how the 4WD system works on the car either. Not very authoritative.
Your statement about the reviewers just wanting a wagon reminded me of a story I saw on the network news last year. It was after the crash test results of various SUVs. They started the segment showing SUVs plowing through mud and the rough stuff. Then they showed both cars (with real bumpers) and SUVs in similar fender benders. Of course the SUVs with their sheet metal bumpers did very poorly. Funny thing is that they never showed the cars trying to go through the same terrain as in the opening segment with the SUVs. This kind of one-sided reporting is what we saw in the Auto review.
Basically, my feeling on reporters these days is that most of them couldn't objectively investigate their way out of a paper bag.
swest
Wolfgang
For me it was Sportage vs. Vitara. In fact, originally I was interested only in 2wd. I eliminated the CRV and RAV 4 on price, and the fact that they are car-based. The Sportage was the emotional favorite going in. I had a soft spot for that car. I like the looks. Once I started researching on the web it became clear that Kia has troubles. In the Sportage forum here at Edmunds it was downright nasty. Of course, the GV had it's share of complaints here too, but they seemed moinor: vibrations, rattles.. that kind of thing. Over at the Kia forum, the niggles were major. SO that made the decision easy.
I drove both the GV and the plain Vitara and decided the 2.0 liter 4 was enough for me. I think it has plenty of pep. The dealer talked me out of 2wd drive because of resale value (I'm in New England).
Anyway, the 4 door Vitara JLX is a fantastic buy if you are looking at small SUV's. The motor is quiet, the ride is free of all the vibration problems I've been reading here about the GV. Off road it is very solid and a pleasure to throw around in the dirt. I looked at Trackers, too, but couldn't get the options I wanted at a price as good as the Vitara JLX. This thing is a sleeper because the GV is getting all the attention. You should really consider this model if you are looking at the GV, and if you really don't need the extra power of the V6 - which only felt a bit more powerful to me when I drove it against the 4 cylinder Vitara.
Geoff7
Howard
99JLX+ GV, 4000 miles
We have two kids, so there were 4 of us in the vehicle. I gotta say that we had a very comfortable trip. The machine handled excellently, got good gas mileage (averaged 23 mpg), was very quiet, and had barely enough room for all our stuff without putting anything on the roof.
We came back from our trip very impressed with the level of comfort we had on the trip. The trip also included some 4 wheeling in the Sitgreaves National forest, and the JLX was a complete blast The rougher the logging road, the more fun we had. Then back on the pavement at 80 mph, and the machine was just as smooth as could be.
7 months after our purchase, we have no regrets and would do it again.
swest
To the guys wondering about the steering wheel vibrations on the GV; it must be a problem with the wheels and tires not balanced properly, or maybe a slight misallignment of the wheels. The truck i tested was free of any rattles or vibrations. Hope this helps any.
*** I noticed that the shifter was a tad rubberry when shifting. Any thoughts on this?
There is a EGroup mailing list for the Suzuki
Grand Vitara owners. You are welcome to subscribe. Only you can do is just send an email to suzukigrandvitara-subscribe@egroups.com with blank subject and message and then you are automatcilly subscribed. You can click www.egroups.com and see for yourself.
Good Luck and enjoy the new mailing list.
John
You can call the GV a lot of things, but cheaply built ain't one of them. I have a unit where the only problem is slight wheel shake that went away when the front tires were rotated to the rear, so it's a problem with one of the wheels or balancing. Pretty darned minor if you ask me, and when I re-rotate, it'll get fixed.
Perhaps one can conclude that the thermal control system isn't a good as it could be, but mine works just fine except the re-circ switch doesn't always stay in the detent--again very minor.
Otherwise, the GV is one heck of a well-built machine that is simply untouchable for the money. Perhaps mukmuk can tell me what competes with GV? The RAV4, CRV, Forester, etc are not competitors since their off road performance pales by comparison--one of the main reasons I got the GV.
My GV has been absolutely reliable, has not a single rattle, and handles better than anything I've ever owned before.
What's the difference between the GV and a 4-runner, explorer, or grand cherokee? About 1 to 1.5 feet of rear space and $10,000.
Now there are a lot of things I will spend $10,000, but 1 foot of cargo space ain't one of them.
I can tell a machine with very high mechanical integrity when I drive it. I'll put the longevity of my GV up against any of these other vehicles.
Time will prove me right. The last off-road trip we went on caused a brand new jeep cherokee to suck water into a piston. The GV didn't even hicup...
There's a selection effect in these groups. When people do have problems, they seek these lists out. When most people are satisfied, they just drive. When was the last time you filled out a comment form for great service. Never for me, I only fill them out when something isn't right. Right now on these lists, I count about 10 people having problems with their GV--how many have been sold, and what's that percentage...?
JMHO,
swest
(read the manual regarding the "free-axle" 4WD system). Putting the vehicle in 4WD runs a small air pump behind the front bumper. This builds and maintains air pressure to push the engagment pods of each axle into their respective gears at the differential cluster. When you take it out of 4WD, a valve opens and releases the air, and a set of springs push the cogs away from the cluster
The dealer was able to reproduce the non-disengagment of the right axle and got Suzuki in the mix. Here's a screamer...
Suzuki told the dealer that they have a known defect in the axle cog release springs in the front differential. They even have a upgraded unit to replace the OEM differential. I don't know whether Suzuki gave a Service Bulletin Number on this or not, but there it is.
If you are experiencing poor acceleration, a strange vibration at moderate speeds, or other front-end 'feelings', jack you car up and check to see both axles are releasing from the cluster. As a reference, engage 4WD and see how both front wheels are locked up. Release 4WD, and both wheels should spin free. If not, see your Suzuki dealer ASAP.
What's the result of a one-sided lockup? Normally, your differential outer assembly is designed to rotate at a speed that is determined by the difference in tire rotation speed during a turn or small tire-size differences. We're talking maybe 1-10 rpm, tops. When one side is locked, the differential still rotates at this 'differential' speed, but in this case the difference is the same as full road speed. The outer cluster was never designed to spins this fast for long duration.
When my dealer pulled the unit apart to determine what the fix might be, as soon as they got inside, a new differential was ordered (and still on back-order), no further questions asked.
Please check this out and post your findings.--walt
walt
This is my first car and I don't know much about cars. Which would you recommend, the Grand or the regular? Also, can you get the grand or the regular with a driver's side armrest?
Thanks.
My 4 door Vitara is not my first car, but it is the first new car I ever bought. I find the 2.0 liter 4 in the plain ol' Vitara peppy enough for me and just fine at highway speeds. Off-road it is great. I liked the GV very much but here in New England they were running $2500-$3000 more. And the gas mileage is a couple MPG below the 4 door Vitara. It's a pleasure to drive, to park and to run around the woods in. Heats up FAST (I've been driving vans for years). I know people with Sidekicks that are well over 100k miles and still going strong. Fine machines.
Geoff7
The good news is that, after 5 years in an automatic, I can still drive a stick!
One small drawback that I haven't seen mentioned: those rear seat head rests have got to go! Maybe it's because I'm a 5' woman, but they block 2/3 of the view in my rear view mirror. I think they are about to find a permanent hiding spot in my basement.
Now, as soon as I save up some more money, I want to buy it some "toys". Are there any good web sites with GV accessories? When I was looking, I found several good Honda accessory sites.
One other question - the roof rack. I hadn't planned on getting one, as I already have a removeable Saris rack. The current rack rails are so wide apart - are there any sort of cross rails available for it? The stuff I haul isn't that wide. I'm hoping the Saris have adapters so I can use them as well... although at 5' they're rather over my head .
Thanks to everyone for all of the great reports. You all really helped me make up my mind (although it was undecided until the very last minute ).
Lee