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As a finance guy - the accepted paradigm today is that you will have to borrow to buy a house and a car if you're an average American today. Everything else should be bought with available cash. So, I'm not sure that your premise would be correct, just because almost nobody pays cash for cars today, unless they're super-beaters. Credit also plays into this, I know.
My first Lincoln - I paid for in cash. $33,000 or so. That cash depletion haunted me for 6 months and although I had the money, I vowed never again to put that kind of cash out on a depreciating asset. I buy appreciating assets, and lease depreciating assets. That way, I build equity, while paying for depreciation as I go. And that's fiscally sound, don't you think?
So, what that ends up becoming is a bulge in the middle of the curve, where mid range cars are usually bought on time or leased, high end cars are usually leased or paid for in cash, because high end drivers often can pay cash. Low end new cars are usually financed.
None of this has much to do with car selection though - people do tend to drive something that appeals to them, and that tells a story about them more often than not - even if it's economic. ie; you see more Hummers at a real-estate or title company office than you do SAturns.....and it's not because they can necessarily afford them. And they certainly don't pay cash.
I guess I assumed most people finance cars with a budget in mind. It is true that obtaining a loan is much different than being able to afford it.
I know for a fact I could get approved for an auto loan close to twice what my car cost. That wouldn't be a good idea at my income level though.
I suppose that does make me what I drive in a weird way.
I guess I can't tell if you are pulling a leg or pissing on one via forum boards, as one has no facial expression or tone of voice to go by. My leg ain't wet, so I guess ya ain't pissin' on it.
Saturn is going to get the Astra evidently. Those liking a hatchback, may have a pretty exciting looking sporty hatch for a fairly low price in the Saturn line. I am kinda liking that one and the Volvo 30 which is to come out later on down the road. I am only half sold on hatch though. While it is great to carry stuff, the road noise goes up. One of those trade off sorta things, no doubt. My PT at certain speeds can get a droning sound. Really cool for hauling stuff around town though.
-Loren
we were less astute buyers 14 yrs ago, and paid $500 for the so called protection kit , window etchings, stickers, removable key fob to prevent hot wiring...totally un-needed items....a waste of good money...
so now we know... :-)
I have been following your posts on TTAC, and I am struck by the sheer brilliance of your comments.
Very seldom do I come across writing that says to me, "This guy knows how the world runs."
I read stuff on the internet all the time and it's just so rare to see something beyond the regurgitation of the usual stuff from the media, marketing people, and politicians.
And my question to you is, why aren't the news outlets explaining to folks like me "how things really work" the way you seem to do so effortlessly.
Do you think it's just that these reporters have to meet deadlines, don't have real-life experiences in any industries, aren't talking to the right people, just not interested in "how things really work," don't get paid for educating the public?
As much as I like to blame the media for their bias and agenda, in the end they seem to be just doing their job. But that doesn't mean I learn much that is useful from them.
Bottom line: Why is the mainstream media so crappy? Don't they talk to people like you?
You might be interested in Al Gore's latest book though. He is a pretty boring writer, but the book (I forgot the title) deals largely with the mainstream media and how it panders to the lowest common denominator.
To be on topic, let me say that I don't know what Al drives, but it should be an Insight (double meaning there). Whereas, I drive a fine, 12 year old Toyota Tacoma V6, 5-spd. It has 210k miles on it. Still goes like a banshee and gets decent mileage. :shades:
I will make three points to you:
1. I have some doubt that the Honda Insight or anything of its ilk is Al Gore's dominant mode of transportation.
2. I am happy to hear that you have a satisfactory experience with your Toyota Tacoma, but I don't see how that is "on topic."
3. I was aware that pch101 hasn't posted on this forum for a long time, but the TTAC forum doesn't seem to have a "reply" option, and I figured if he still has the same email account, this would be a way for him to receive my questions.
I intended no offense, just having fun. You are new around here, huh?
Insight = greenest of green cars
Gore = greenest of green polititians, who made an "insightful" film about global warming... It kinda wrecks a joke when you have to explain it, but I guess I was too obscure.
As for my comment about what I drive, I am unsure why that is off topic in a forum called, "You are what you drive!?" As a side note, I bought my Toyota pickup when I lived in Tacoma. (It's true) On the dealer license-plate frame it says, "Tacoma Toyota" :P
james
That's pretty good.
When I was a kid, the local Toyota dealer was owned (and named) after the Lunsford family. They used to put a sticker in the back window of the car with the dealership name. Some friends of ours bought a car from them and modified the sticker to read:
FORD TOY
At last report - Al was personally driving a Black Lexus LS430 (among many other family owned vehicles, including a Suburban and other very non-green SUVs) which coincidentally happens to be what I drive. Now, that shames me greatly, because I consider myself to be the Anti-Gore - and to have him choose the same car I drive, given the topic, would make him a brother to me. (Don't get all biblical here please). I do not want to be associated in any way with Gore and his politics - but I do like my car. Rather, I think HE should be more ashamed to be driving what I drive, because I make no living off of panic mentality books or theories on global destruction. He is a hypocrite not to drive a Prius, CNG powered vehicle, or ride a bike wherever he goes. I OTOH, pretend not at all that my car damages the earth in any measurable degree, therefore the car fits me. It does not fit him.
Still think you are what you drive; In my case it says I'm a Bank President. In Gore's case it says he's a liar........ Same car, two statements, both valid.
I'm confused. I drive a Mitsu Eclipse which is a "girls" car. I also drive an old beat-up Ford PU which is "redneck manly". I'd say that maybe I'm a metrosexual but I have dirt under my fingernails and hair in all the wrong places.
Also, I live in the northeast so I can't really be a redneck.
Somebody help me, I'm so confused!!! :confuse:
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
On the note of this thread, I have no idea what my cars make me.
I have noticed that the "sport" model Toyotas tend to be driven by the least sporty people imaginable, including the 100-something year old man I saw yesterday in a Matrix XRS going 10 under the limit oblivious to the traffic around him.
Well it could be worse. At least you're just torn between two extremes. OTOH, I switch up between a '57 DeSoto, '67 Catalina, '68 Dart (okay, that one no longer runs and is hopefully soon outta here), a '76 LeMans, two '79 New Yorkers, an '85 Silverado, and a 2000 Intrepid.
Oldfarmer, maybe you're just bi-polar, while I'm harboring multiple personalities. :P
Suit = Lexus
Shorts = old Suburban, comfy, weekend...
It all speaks quite consistently about my life.
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
One common thread of your varied fleet, andre, is that you show a preference for vehicles that don't owe you much; they're all close to fully depreciated. Mine too. It would be annoying, and somewhat of a hassle, if one of our cars got stolen, or side swiped, say, but it would hardly be a disaster. Could it be that our choices suggest that we're risk averse, when it comes to cars, at least?
As for Al Gore, I beleive he traded his fuel guzzling Lexus for a Mercury Mariner Hybrid. Given his celebrity status, his vehicle choices may have limited meaning, since he may get special deals to support his image, that aren't available to the rest of us.
I think some people are what they drive, while others aren't.
2007 Cadillac DTS Performance - brand new, clean, immaculate.
1988 Buick Park Avenue - very bad paint, a few small dents, but kept clean.
Maybe I'm Jeckyll and Hyde?
Anyway, I'm not sure you are a Jeckyll/Hyde personality - as much as you are a new suit, and an old suit kind of guy. Now, if you had a different KIND of vehicle, rather than justs a new and an old Luxury car, THAT may make you schitzophrenic, like me....
My cars...hmmm
The E55 makes me a failed dot-commer who hasn't made any real money since 2002.
The fintail makes me some kind of [non-permissible content removed] war criminal, trying to remain incognito...in 1964. Maybe some kind of lower level European mafia type too.
Now that I think of it, I can't think of any movie where a fintail plays a role greater than a background scene where it isn't associated with bad guys. Maybe that means I need to be more evil.
I don't remember the movie well enough to say what kind of person the driver may have been, although I suspect that he was fintail's "[non-permissible content removed] war criminal, trying to remain incognito".
james
Hit a heating oil truck at 30mph and it explodes :confuse: ....but you get to see the crumple zones at work anyway.
I guess British physics are the same as Hollywood physics when it comes to car crashes...ANYTHING can explode!
I think there's also a Hollywood law, at least with lower-budget movies, to film the same explosion from three different angles. Dunno if there's a British equivalent of that law.
**Edit: oops, brain lapse. I got mixed up and was had James Bond on the brain when I typed that above, and not "Marathon Man".
The 1968-72 GM A-bodies are my favorite vehicles of all time, especially the convertibles, but I think they're all awesome. My other "fetish" as far as classics go are the "strippo" models from the 60's-70's-Biscayne, Ford Custom 500, base level Novas, Chevelles, Valiants, etc. I just like seeing how basic you could order a car back in the day, and how a la carte the options were-like how you could get a basic Biscayne but still get the hot big-block powertrain.
Back in the 90s my dad had a run of hobby cars, and he had a 68 Fairlane that was an odd mix. It had base hubcaps with no beauty rings, vinyl bench seat, manual steering and brakes, and a 3-on-the-tree...but it had a V8 and a AM radio.
I find the really loaded cars of the period to be interesting too, when you start finding power windows/seats etc on a late 60s middle market car.
I also really like the Buicks from that era. Nice clean, handsome smooth beasts. I don't find the Pontiac or Olds styling quite as attractive though. The Oldsmobiles got a bit fussy in their details some years, like the peaks over the headlights, and Pontiac had that retro thing going on with the narrow, tall grilles and peaked hoods, like they were trying to bring the late 30's kicking and screaming into the 70's.
In contrast though, I didn't really care so much for those "fuselage" '69-73 Mopars. The styles with the hidden headlights, like the Imperial, and the sportier models were kinda cool, but in many cases they just looked fat. I thought the '74 Plymouth Fury and Dodge Monaco were beautiful looking cars, although they were a straight ripoff of a '71-72 Buick!
Three in the front seat, three in the back seat, and two ex-breathers in the trunk. :P
I never really had a chance to drive a big GM car from that era, with the exception of a '75 LeSabre 4-door sedan that was for sale at a local car lot. Believe it or not, at the time I only had ONE car! A 1969 Dodge Dart GT that I had just repainted, and it looked really nice. So I wanted to get a "beater" to help preserve the Dart. Only problem was, they wanted more for this beater LeSabre than I had paid for the Dart!
It didn't seem all that cumbersome back then, but that was also a long time ago.
When I lost the car, I briefly considered the Altima in 2003, which had just changed its styling to its current form. Again, the hot rod and practical sides of me were at war. The compromise came in the form of a red Aerio SX: It had more power, haul things as needed, could be (and still does, except for the color) be distinguished from every other vehicle in a parking lot, and had better room and seating positions than most compacts at the time (my sister has a 2001 Cavalier which, to me, feels like getting into a very low bathtub).
"Is that a truck?" some people would ask.
"Nope." Not much of the local (personal) market had discovered that it was possible to haul stuff at more than 21 mpg overall.
Now, custom usually demands that I immediately swap the car for another brutal assault on my wallet for the next three to five years. I like having money, so I'll hold onto the vehicle until something non-replaceable and/or down-payment expensive breaks, forcing me to consider a new vehicle.
If I were to pick a vehicle today, I think I'd go for the Mazda5. Practical and zoom-zoomy at the same time. Curse my dual nature!
There's not a car made that doesn't compromise some things, nor will there ever be one. That's one reason why many people have more than one vehicle, in addition to need.
Do both cars together make me Schitzo-effective?
Wow...and I don't have a psychiatry degree!!
What my cars used to say about me is different than they would today. Today they say, "paid in full, got the pink." :shades: