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Buying American Cars What Does It Mean?

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Comments

  • imidazol97imidazol97 Member Posts: 27,132
    >rear lower control arm rubber bushings...

    What year is the DeVille?

    2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,

  • xrunner2xrunner2 Member Posts: 3,062
    That's one reason people are flocking to crossovers - they're the perfect height, you don't step up or down, you just slide in.

    If you have very, very old senior friends or relatives that need your help to get places, such as doctors, hospital tests, or visiting others, the ordinary sedan is the best. These folks are usually short, not very flexible. They can easily back into the front seat of a sedan. And, if they are in a portable wheelchair, the only way to help them into a seat is with a sedan car seat. For these folks, suvs, pickups, some minivans have seats that are way too high.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I had a back injury and my wife's Forester was a Godsend. Perfect height plus heated seats.
  • andre1969andre1969 Member Posts: 25,652
    I think it might depend on the sedan. I remember my grandmother complaining about how hard it was to get in and out of one of her friend's cars. And her friend drives that archetype of old-people cars...a Mercury Grand Marquis!

    She doesn't do too badly, getting in and out of my 2000 Park Ave. And odd as it may sound, my '76 LeMans is actually easy for her to get in and out of. You wouldn't think a low-slung 70's coupe would be senior-citizen friendly, but its seat is pretty high off the floor and the sill is narrow, and close to the edge of the seat, so it's fairly easy to enter/exit.

    For the longest time, it was easiest to just load her into my '85 Silverado, because it was just high enough that she could slide into, rather than down into. But, in the past few years, as she's aged and shrunk, it's gotten to be too much.
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    The dearth of small domestic pickups may be ending sooner than anyone thought.

    "Rising fuel prices have General Motors Co. GM and Chrysler Group LLC taking a second look at peddling smaller pickup trucks—vehicles that the Detroit Three auto makers abandoned in the U.S. amid weak demand.

    GM is planning to revive its Chevy Colorado and GMC Canyon in late 2014, and Chrysler is considering a replacement for its Dakota. Both see the vehicles helping them to hit higher fuel-economy targets and to regain market share from Toyota Motor Corp.'s Tacoma, the current top-selling small hauler."

    Detroit Rethinks Small Trucks (WSJ)
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    Ford builds the best mid sized truck on the Planet. They do not want to risk undercutting their cash cow F150. The T6 diesel would be a killer truck if they built it here and went head to head with the 3rd rate Tacoma. Which by the way is not as good of a truck as the Frontier. Just has a loyal following. I know, as I bought a Tacoma for an ex wife and it was a POC gas hog 4 cylinder stick shift. I also bought one for my son and it cost me a fortune to maintain. Datsun/Nissan builds a much better small/mid sized PU truck.
  • scwmcanscwmcan Member Posts: 399
    Apparently so does Toyota, just not in the US or Canada.
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    I have the feeling the World Market is no longer dominated by the US and Canadian car buyers. The Toyota diesel PUs sold all over the World are great trucks. The Tacoma is a foo foo truck for Americans. They still use drum brakes on the rear. Not great for stopping with a 3 ton trailer in tow. Less power than the competition sold here. And more expensive. Datsun/Nissan has sold a better small truck in the USA since forever. Yet Toyota seems to get the loyalty.
  • uplanderguyuplanderguy Member Posts: 16,054
    My elderly Mom could easily get into and out of my '63 Lark Daytona when I'd drive it over to see her--chairlike seating and nearly flat floors. I think she'd have done well getting in and out of my daughter's PT too. She did have trouble getting out of my old Cavalier coupe and I suspect she'd have had trouble getting up and out of my Cobalt or our Malibu. I used to actually have to pick her up to get her in and out of our vans. She was 5'2" and about 100 lbs.
    2024 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray 2LT; 2019 Chevrolet Equinox LT; 2015 Chevrolet Cruze LS
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I think it might depend on the sedan

    In 2005, in a Subaru thread, we were discussing this, so I broke out a tape measure and actually measured the hip point of several cars:

    NA Miata: 13"
    Legacy 2.5i sedan: 17.5"
    Impreza RS sedan: 20"
    Outback XT: 22"
    Tribeca: 26"

    So you can see there are pronounced differences from a low slung sports car to a high up crossover, exactly double in this case.

    Sedans varied a lot. That Legacy actually had a surprisingly low hip point. The Outback would be far more comfortable to get in and out.

    My friend's Altima is also very low slung.

    My Sienna minivan is higher than my wife's Forester.

    It all depends on the model.
  • busirisbusiris Member Posts: 3,490
    Speaking of sedans...

    I saw what I think was a new Caprice today (it was definitely a Caprice, because I could see the "Caprice" emblem on the side)... It had a temporary tag, which SC issues on a new sale (good up to 45 days after the sale, and this one expires on March 16).

    It was a medium-to-dark metallic gray. Not a bad looking car at all, although the front grill looks a bit small for the front of the car. The car was in the lane next to me, so I couldn't get a look at the interior.

    IMO, the car's design is much "smarter" looking than the Malibu.
  • uplanderguyuplanderguy Member Posts: 16,054
    To my knowledge, those are only sold to police departments, not even rental fleets. I wonder if it was an 'unmarked' car...although it's kind of funny that a car that's only sold to police departments would be an unmarked car! ;)

    The rear I think is a bit plain, like the 'old' ('12 and earlier) Impala, but I like it in profile. I truly wish it weren't built in Australia, and I know people from Australia so it's nothing personal!
    2024 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray 2LT; 2019 Chevrolet Equinox LT; 2015 Chevrolet Cruze LS
  • andre1969andre1969 Member Posts: 25,652
    On the subject of GM cars that the public can't buy, I spotted a black Chevy Captiva yesterday, with temporary tags on it. Dunno if it was a fleet vehicle that was just purchased, or a used car bought by a private party. I just checked Cars.com, and it's showing 15 of them for sale, within a 30 mile radius of my zipcode. All of them 2012 models.

    I just tried to search on "Caprice" and unfortunately, the only thing that came up was a 1996 with 250,000 miles on it, for $2200.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,092
    Some 2012s have aged out of fleets and are on lots already, I have seen privately plated Captivas here. Just like the hoary old Chevy "Classic" - fleet only, but they are on the roads driven by private parties now.
  • uplanderguyuplanderguy Member Posts: 16,054
    edited March 2013
    Driving down to get my daughter for spring break last Friday, I passed a caravan of old guys driving two CTS's and two Captivas, both with "Sold" scrawled on a window of them...probably from an auction. None had a new car window sticker, FWIW. ;)
    2024 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray 2LT; 2019 Chevrolet Equinox LT; 2015 Chevrolet Cruze LS
  • robr2robr2 Member Posts: 8,805
    edited March 2013
    I passed a caravan of old guys driving two CTS's and two Captivas...

    That's going to be my retirement job.

    As for Caprices, the local gendarme has two - one marked and one unmarked.

    Other than we enthusiasts would recognize the Caprice as police only. The other 98% would identify it as a car.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,092
    All ex-rentals, I would wager. I know the CTS has seen a lot of fleet sales too, as it ages and attracts less private buyer attention.

    And yeah, shuttling these cars back and forth would be a cool retirement job. A mere 30-something years away for me :shades:
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    You gonna join sandman? Hopefully we'll see your write-ups as well.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    http://www.autoblog.com/2013/03/12/2013-buick-verano-turbo-vs-2013-acura-ilx-2-4- -comparison-review/

    "The Verano feels like a cheap version of an expensive car, while the ILX feels like an expensive version of a cheap car."

    Interesting read. Both cars made in the USA.
  • andre1969andre1969 Member Posts: 25,652
    And yeah, shuttling these cars back and forth would be a cool retirement job. A mere 30-something years away for me

    It does sound like a fun, but I wonder if, once you're actually doing it for a living, it would feel too much like work, and lose its charm?

    If I ever find myself retired/fired/laid-off/whatever, it might be something to look into.
  • busirisbusiris Member Posts: 3,490
    To my knowledge, those are only sold to police departments, not even rental fleets. I wonder if it was an 'unmarked' car...although it's kind of funny that a car that's only sold to police departments would be an unmarked car.

    If it were a police vehicle, it would not have had the temporary tag on it in SC, so I would think its something else. Could possibly be a rental, because SC does issue temp tags to rental companies. Either way, the style was enough to capture my attention, and the gray color really enhanced its appeal, at least to me.

    I went to the Chevrolet web-site and couldn't even find the Caprice listed in the model lineup. That's a shame, because I think (based only on my very brief observation of the car in motion) that its a design with some sales-appeal.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,092
    Surprised at the result, but maybe not really. Other than some styling issues, the Verano looks nicer, especially inside. ILX really makes me yawn.

    But to echo some in the comments, that segment is going to be shaken up when the CLA and new A3 hit the road here.
  • robr2robr2 Member Posts: 8,805
    edited March 2013
    I saw what I think was a new Caprice today (it was definitely a Caprice, because I could see the "Caprice" emblem on the side).

    Did you see this:

    image

    or this:

    image

    There is no "Caprice" emblem on the side of the Caprice. There is the "Impala" emblem on the rear pillar of the Impala:

    image
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    I passed a caravan of old guys driving two CTS's and two Captivas...

    That's going to be my retirement job.


    It sounds like the back haul drivers for U-Haul and Penske keep real busy returning trucks from Texas and elsewhere to California.
  • busirisbusiris Member Posts: 3,490
    edited March 2013
    The car I was similar to the silver one, in that the front fenders (well, at least the one on the right side) had the "inset" behind the front wheel on the front fender, and it clearly had "Caprice" on that insert. That's how I knew it was a Caprice.

    The front had the Chevy "Bow-tie" in the middle of a relatively small front grill.

    It may be a one-of-a-kind vehicle, but I know what I saw...

    Check out this video...

    http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=DqLNs6776ow&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DDqLNs6776o- - w

    The car I saw was very similar to the first red car shown (about 10 seconds into the clip) in the video ...
  • uplanderguyuplanderguy Member Posts: 16,054
    Our local cops' Caprices are a couple years old, but they only say "Caprice" on the decklid.

    Geez, that silver pic--doesn't that look like a larger Audi in places?
    2024 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray 2LT; 2019 Chevrolet Equinox LT; 2015 Chevrolet Cruze LS
  • berriberri Member Posts: 10,165
    I like those comparison photos. The silver Caprice looks to have a bit of Audi and a bit of more recent Pontiac influence (and a Ford Taurus touch on the front fender), but by and large it seems to me a bit clumsy looking compared to the blue Impala. However, if you like a big V8 rwd, but are on a budget, I suppose the Caprice makes some sense.
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Member Posts: 27,132
    edited March 2013
    >Interesting read.

    ILX & Verano, autoblog

    I read the AutoBlog article because of your comments. I expected a C&D type review based on the concept that everyone is wanting to drive a racecar. Instead, I settled into reading a fair and careful description of the two cars.

    They did peg one thing and that is that the automatic is the better option in the Verano for both its market demographic and its lack of a higher quality manual. I wonder if that "miss" in the manual and shifter is to keep the manual in the ATS more attractive, assuming it's a good quality fit. I was surprised at their honesty of the Civic-like shortcomings on the ILX.

    "Our final vote was tallied, and the decision was unanimous – we all preferred the Buick Verano Turbo over the Acura ILX Premium.

    "Throughout the entire comparison, the ILX simply couldn't shake its Civic roots. It was constantly referred to as "the Honda" during our radio chatter (we never once called the Verano "the Chevrolet"), and we couldn't stop thinking about the still-outstanding Civic Si each time we slid behind the Acura's wheel."

    The real success here is that the Verano is given a fair evaluation by some carguys who are more aggressive driving-oriented than most of us.

    2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,

  • jpp75jpp75 Member Posts: 1,535
    I'd agree, I was less than impressed with the Verano I had for a rental a couple
    of weeks ago but I'm still not wowed by the ILX. I wouldn't drop $30k on either of them.
  • jpp75jpp75 Member Posts: 1,535
    The top vehicle is just awful. It looks like a bad base model 10 year old Volvo S80.
  • tifightertifighter Member Posts: 3,591
    I'd like to drive a Verano turbo, but then I'm one of those weirdos that thinks the Cruze drives okay. So a nicer interior, quieter cabin and 100 extra horsepower doesn't sound like a bad direction to take. TTAC did a very positive video review on this car recently, and TTAC hardly has a rep for being GM lovers.

    As for the ILX, I'm having a hard time figuring out why I'd spend an extra $8k on this over an Civic Si sedan, and I'm a current Acura owner. Leather is nice, and it looks more mature, but the 13 Civics have the improved interior and more sound deadening, not to mention the Si has a front limited slip standard and available navigation that can't even be optioned at ALL on the ILX 2.4. Come to think of it, the Si seems like a pretty fun package for $23K for the sedan. I'd like to drive one of those too. Is mid-30's too old to be seen in one?

    23 Civic Type-R / 22 MDX Type-S / 21 Tesla Y LR / 03 Montero Ltd

  • uplanderguyuplanderguy Member Posts: 16,054
    TTAC did a very positive video review on this car recently, and TTAC hardly has a rep for being GM lovers.

    Interesting. A regular here posts links to TTAC, but I must've missed that particular link of his. ;)
    2024 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray 2LT; 2019 Chevrolet Equinox LT; 2015 Chevrolet Cruze LS
  • scwmcanscwmcan Member Posts: 399
    I am pretty sure I read that test, if it is the one I am thinking of the strange this is that they loved the shifter on their test car and compared it favorably to a Honda shifter ( but it may have been a different review of the car, I know at least one test did, and that would seem to suggest either an improvement in the shift quality happening at some point or that the shift quality is a gamble).
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    It's entirely possible that the press car Autoblog test drove had an abused clutch/shifter.

    I'd lean toward a Regal but those do cost a bunch more.

    ILX seems pointless to me, give me a refreshed Civic Si or an Accord.
  • tifightertifighter Member Posts: 3,591
    edited March 2013
    Direct link to the TTAC Verano Turbo video review.

    And here's a direct link to a CNET Cooley review of the Verano Turbo.

    Neither of these guys are known for pulling punches, and while Cooley is critical per usual, he never singles out the transmission. All that said, I'm guessing the automatic is better suited for this car anyhow given its mission as a quiet cruiser vs a sport sedan. And with the torque numbers it produces, I bet the automatic works very well. It sounds like a nice everyday car, if you are a sedan person.

    As for the ILX, one problem is Honda has too many better alternatives in the Civic Si, TSX (which is going away) and the Accord. In fact, after a recent review of the RLX, I'd say a loaded Accord Touring is a solid alternative to that at over $20k less. The new TL and MDX can't come fast enough for Acura if they want to keep customers coming to the showroom.

    23 Civic Type-R / 22 MDX Type-S / 21 Tesla Y LR / 03 Montero Ltd

  • dave8697dave8697 Member Posts: 1,498
    2001 base model
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    "A compact that feels like you're driving more than you paid for" is about as nice as Cooley ever is to a car.

    He usually likes the $90,000 plus stuff, too.

    Funny to see no-lift shift and rev matching on a quiet tuned car. Maybe the sporty features come from the Astra side of the family.
  • tifightertifighter Member Posts: 3,591
    This car shares a legacy powertrain from the Cobalt SS and HHR SS right? They both had the no lift shift feature as well.

    23 Civic Type-R / 22 MDX Type-S / 21 Tesla Y LR / 03 Montero Ltd

  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Didn't the Solistice also use a version of this engine?

    It's funny, GM just hasn't branded DI+turbo as well as Ford has. You say EcoBoost and everyone knows what it is.
  • greg128greg128 Member Posts: 526
    I interpret these reviewers as almost reluctantly admitting that this is a great car, and better than the competition despite their obvious anti GM bias.
  • roadburnerroadburner Member Posts: 17,312
    Well, that makes me more likely to buy an Abarth!
    :D

    Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport; 2020 C43; 2021 Sahara 4xe 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica Wife's: 2015 X1 xDrive28i Son's: 2009 328i; 2018 330i xDrive

  • tifightertifighter Member Posts: 3,591
    Actually, being familiar with each reviewer's videos, I'd say they are both pretty critical across the board, US, Euro or Asian make. Dykes has both ripped and praised many cars from the same make, and Cooley is, well, Cooley.

    23 Civic Type-R / 22 MDX Type-S / 21 Tesla Y LR / 03 Montero Ltd

  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Cooley pulls no punches, I remember home calling the Outlander's stereo "just awful" and "tubby".

    He likes tech, but well executed high end stuff.
  • tifightertifighter Member Posts: 3,591
    Some of his reviews of Mercedes Navi tech are just brutal.

    23 Civic Type-R / 22 MDX Type-S / 21 Tesla Y LR / 03 Montero Ltd

  • busirisbusiris Member Posts: 3,490
    From the link...

    Hard-working Americans should not have to choose between their free speech and their job," said Rana Elmir, spokeswoman for the ACLU of Michigan. "No employee should fear being fired for speaking out on issues of public concern. Retaliating against workers who publically comment on an array of issues including product quality and management practices is not only bad for business, but sends a chilling message to the rest of the work force. Employees have a right to air their grievances, even if that means a public demonstration or comments to the media."

    Obviously, these folks haven't spent much time in the regular work force.
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    You best have a real strong Union backing you if you plan to express your feelings about the boss. Of course the UAW got those pot heads and boozers their jobs back at Chrysler. I consider poor performance and undisciplined workers a big reason so many jobs are now done in other countries.
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    Not to mention that the UAW didn't support this guy's beef.
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    It seems a lot of the old time UAW people have already forgotten how close they came to being in the poor house. Fiat Chrysler is expanding in the US and trying to put roadblocks is not real bright. I remember people in the Teamsters whining about shift changes. They forget who signs the paychecks.
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