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Where Is Ford taking the Lincoln Motor Company?

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Comments

  • heyjewelheyjewel Member Posts: 1,046
    That's certainly my view. "Bold moves" was a bowel move IMHO.
  • m1miatam1miata Member Posts: 4,551
    -dittos on comparisons to CTS.

    The CTS is the only car close to being a performance sedan. The bit larger 300 may be another. Most of the domestics, MKS included, as just another FWD car. And the Montego, if ya want a FWD car, would be less expensive and get the job done with a V6. For high performance, you have to look elsewhere. The LS V8, if ya want a Lincoln is not a bad car. Seems like poor resale value compared to the CTS and that is may be an orphan soon. The RWD Mercury Marque, for those wanting a large car, with a decent ride, and durability, is IMHO a better value than a Towncar. Like the looks of the old Towncar -- this new bulb one does little for me. The classic, more rectangular shaped one was the last one which looked rich to me.
  • m1miatam1miata Member Posts: 4,551
    Let me think now about Ford offerings to date...
    I guess IF I was looking for a FWD car the Fusion/Montego is OK
    A used 2004 Mustang is a possible one towards the top of my list.
    And if I wanted a boring looking car, the FiveHundred is very safe and practical.

    See no Bold Moves yet. And the replica Stang is OK. Seems that the replacement parts, if Consumers Guide is correct, will be higher. My guess is that Ford will be looking to shore up profits on parts. Sort of like the exterior of the '69 replica car, the interior is not as good looking or as usable as the the previous model, and over all the styling is more subdued. Since I was around to see the real deal, perhaps this redo is not as exciting to me. Funny how it turns on some older people though. I thought the 1994-2004 were excellent years for new Mustang looks, with hints of the past. I am thinking that if I went replica car, it would be the AC Cobra. Nahhh, just get a modern day Boxster ;)
    -Loren
  • akirbyakirby Member Posts: 8,062
    The LS V8, if ya want a Lincoln is not a bad car. Seems like poor resale value compared to the CTS and that is may be an orphan soon.

    Soon was April. They discontinued the LS earlier this year and almost all of the remaining 2006 models were sold at a $16K discount.
  • rockyleerockylee Member Posts: 14,014
    gregg,

    I'm getting slammed for defending Lincolns current position as they "reach higher". I guess some posters think a brands turn around is suppose to happen over night. It just doesn't work that way. I also am not mad at Lincoln for using FWD biased AWD. It works fine in the Mazdaspeed6 ;)

    If Lincoln can share platforms with other models like the Fusion or Montego, to save the consumer thousands of dollars like Honda does with Acura, I'm all for it. The Honda-Acura concept has yielded consumers premium cars at less cost without sacrificing large amounts of desired levels of performance and comfort. Cadillacs, have gotten way over-priced and the products don't reflect the sticker prices. A loaded out STS V-8 (not a V) with AWD will run ya $66K. The MKS loaded out will be $10-15K cheaper and have just as many "bells and whistles" thus is why I am a strong defender at the direction the brand is going.

    I interpreted the MKS build date obviously differentLY than "heyjewel" and if he doesn't want to talk to me than fine. I feel I don't try to degrade everything he posts and perhaps it's best we don't reply to each others posts to avoid further conflict. :(

    Rocky
  • m1miatam1miata Member Posts: 4,551
    If you want a FWD, then the Mazdaspeed6 is not a bad choice for a performance. Why do they need a Lincoln version of same?

    As for bells and whistle........ Bells belong on church towers, and whistles belong on trains. :P Bells and whistles for clutter and glitch are but ornaments on the Christmas tree. German cars for handling make sense. Current cars, seeking to ad more STUFF, fancy junk, have but added more cost and repair time = headaches. Who needs electrical nightmares, and items never used? Perhaps fewer people using cell phones, navigation, DVD players, drinking, eating, smoking, and having sex in cars would make driving safer for everyone. I threw the last one in to see if everyone was awake. How large is the back seat on the MKS... oh it doesn't matter. Just by the Montego, and a Lincoln nameplate and stick it on the back. :D
    -Loren
  • rockyleerockylee Member Posts: 14,014
    Loren, your way to crazy :P Your a silly goose. :P

    Okay:

    If you want a FWD, then the Mazdaspeed6 is not a bad choice for a performance. Why do they need a Lincoln version of same?

    Mazdaspeed6 is FWD biased AWD. Yes it performs but it lacks the (borrow from Cadillac) "art & science" of Lincoln's new technology, styling, quality, and heritage. The Mercury, and Mazda, are nice cars but they don't portray luxury like Lincoln. The Montego is a slightly nicer slightly more expensive/upscale AWD Ford five-hundred. The MKS, will be much more upscale and more expensive. It shares some of its underpinnings with both but it will have much more technology, better quality, and a revised dash, instrument cluster, upscale engine, thicker glass, carpet, sound deadening materials, etc. I really see no point in knocking car company's that start with a good platform and improve upon it. Sure some of us would of liked it to be built on the new Volvo S80 platform, but then again the MSRP, would of had to shoot up $10-15K to absorb the costs. I personally would just buy the original the new and improved 07' Volvo S80 if I'm going to virtually spend the same kind of money. I also see the MKS, will be more reliable, have a better navigation system, the best audio system on the market, and rumor to get adaptive cruise, lighting, and many other gadgets found and not found, on the Volvo S80.

    As for bells and whistle........ Bells belong on church towers, and whistles belong on trains. Bells and whistles for clutter and glitch are but ornaments on the Christmas tree.

    Loren, while you and others are happy with 50's and 60's technology, you can buy a five-hundred, Montego, or a mazdaspeed/mazda6 ;) I am willing to pay more to get more. A luxury car today isn't no longer just upscale wood trim, better quality leather, with a cushy ride. It should have gadgets, and that is what sells to the majority of people. That is why Acura, has become a icon for technology at a great price. Lincoln appears to say they can do the same thing by offering its customers a competitive premium alternative. I honestly think this new and improved Lincoln, could end up sending buick to the cemetery. :surprise: Cadillac, will have to either drastically improve or be buried next to Buick. :surprise:

    Current cars, seeking to ad more STUFF, fancy junk, have but added more cost and repair time = headaches. Who needs electrical nightmares, and items never used? Perhaps fewer people using cell phones, navigation, DVD players, drinking, eating, smoking, and having sex in cars would make driving safer for everyone. I threw the last one in to see if everyone was awake.

    My generation does do all of the above. We don't want to give up our technology to the few whom are computer or gadget illiterate. ;) Why should we. Why should we have to keep a cooler full of ice to enjoy a soft drink, when a cooled cupholder will solve that simple task ? Why should out backside have to sweat when air-conditioned seats can whisk those beads of sweat away ? Why should we have to listen to the fuzzy radio when XM/Sirius can deliver digital quality ? Why should I have to listen to the decent XM/Sirius, when I can get use the Lincoln certified THX II 600 watt 14 speaker DVD-A surround sound system, why should I have to press the brake pedal to slow down on cruise control when my can car can accomplish that task for me ? Why should we have to settle for not knowing whats around the curve when my headlamps can turn as I steer and give me a heads up ? I guess like the notion goes "why ask why" ? Why not ? or because I can. ;):D The electrical nightmares are your fathers problems with his old cars. For the piece of mind one can negotiate a inexpensive bumper to bumper warranty that will take car of any future problems if they shall arise. The cost/benefit is well worth the luxury IMHO.

    How large is the back seat on the MKS... oh it doesn't matter. Just by the Montego, and a Lincoln nameplate and stick it on the back. :D
    -Loren

    The MKS, will be much more than just a rebadged Montego w/ similar room. :P

    Lincoln: Reach Higher :shades:

    Rocky
  • scootertrashscootertrash Member Posts: 698
    You'd come across as someone old enough to actually have a driver's license if you limit your cartoons to maybe a maximum of 10 per post.
  • rockyleerockylee Member Posts: 14,014
    I won't even bother. ;)

    Rocky
  • rockyleerockylee Member Posts: 14,014
    http://www.autoblog.com/2006/11/07/lincoln-mks-to-get-a-v8-after-all/

    Obviously a few of you have seen this already. It seems to me Lincoln, is great at getting a reaction and then fix what most don't like. I appluad Lincoln, and Ford, for taking marketing to a new level and listen to the consumers for a change. :shades:

    Rocky
  • rockyleerockylee Member Posts: 14,014
    The MKS, will need more than 315 hp. to really compete. I'd turbocharge it to get more power. I feel this was also a Volvo S80 blunder. :sick: Yamaha, perhaps makes a good engine but one would expect more power wouldn't they ?

    Rocky
  • lemkolemko Member Posts: 15,261
    If I want to have sex in a car, I'll just get one of those old Nashes with the front seat backs that fold down to the back seat cushion.
  • rockyleerockylee Member Posts: 14,014
    ROTF !!!! No you didn't. :D :P

    Rocky
  • rockyleerockylee Member Posts: 14,014
    Have you driven a new MKZ/Zephyr ? If so what did you think ?

    Rocky
  • nvbankernvbanker Member Posts: 7,239
    I'd say that's good news. Their advertising can't get much worse.

    I totally agree.
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Member Posts: 19,318
    how much power do you have and how much do you think you need? the most i ever had was 260, in my expedition.
    i have driven a chipped m3 and a built 350 camaro(nitrous disconnected). they were more powerful than i would want on the street.
    2023 Ford Explorer ST, 91 Mustang GT vert
  • rockyleerockylee Member Posts: 14,014
    I would prefer to own a family car that can run consistent 11's in the quarter mile, thus is why I'm seriously considering a 08-09 CTS-V. Sufficient power I suppose is enough to accelerate from 0-60 under 6.5 seconds but in todays world we have choice, and the perfect balance of fuel efficiency and performance. Lexus offers hybrid performance cars, GM offers nearly 30 mpg HWY and 500-600 hp in the upcoming CTS-V. Acura has a 0-60 car in the low to mid 5's and nearly 35 mpg in the TL Type-S. BMW has the 335i that offers 0-60 in 4.8 and nearly 30 mpg. Infiniti mid 5's and nearly 30 mpg. LINCOLN, has a great car but needs to add the hybrid engine to the MKZ to assist performance and yield better fuel economy numbers. The MKS needs a hybrid engine along with a couple of turbo's if they want to sell performance also. Fords biggest weakness has always been their performance in their powertrains and this needs to change. Hopefully the new "hurricaine" engine series yields better performance and efficiency.

    Just my $0.02 for whatever it's worth.

    Rocky
  • akirbyakirby Member Posts: 8,062
    Do yourself a favor - if you want to go that fast go buy a used mustang GT and modify it. And run it at the track. Then buy a fusion for a daily driver. It will be faster and cheaper than getting a CTS-V and trying to modify it.
  • rockyleerockylee Member Posts: 14,014
    Do yourself a favor - if you want to go that fast go buy a used mustang GT and modify it. And run it at the track.

    Thanks for the advice, but I prefer 4 doors. My "track" is the farm and market roads here in the Panhandle of Texas. ;)

    Then buy a fusion for a daily driver.

    They are very ugly and unsafe, so no thanks. ;)

    It will be faster and cheaper than getting a CTS-V and trying to modify it.

    Why would I have to modify a 2008-2009 CTS-V ? It will run 11's in the Quarter Mile out of the factory. I'm not much of a Mustang GT fan which would cost $20 something thousand used and a fusion is $20 something new, so for those 2 prices plus insurance, maintaince, etc, I can have one superior car for less money that can do everything well. ;)

    I appreciate the advice, but would pass on that scenario.

    Rocky
  • m1miatam1miata Member Posts: 4,551
    Well the Fusion is not really unsafe. I do believe it to be a match to the CTS in the crash tests USA. Now the offset Euro testing, may be another matter. As for the look, I kinda like the Schick shaver chrome front. The buttox is a bit high and large, but that is true for all the line, no doubt. The Lincoln is just another Fusion. The Montego scores better in rear collisions for neck injury, so that along with better interior looks makes it the logical choice. As for HP the V6 is adequate. And the CTS 3.6 V6 is MORE than adequate. I did have the pleasure of watching and hearing the wonderful CTS-V track car at Laguna Seca. Maybe GM would sell you one like that :D ... ummm, for a few bucks, no doubt. As for high tech, well it works wonders for computing. High tech is cool. And some advances in car engineering which makes sense are cool as well. Tech, for the sake of geek luv or glitz in a car does little for me. The most fun car to drive which I have ever owned was the little Miata. A bit too little, but for driving excitement it had it. The car had roll-up windows. Could not hear the radio for all the noise in a '96 Miata, but the tail pipe did sing a song.

    Maybe you could buy a Corvette. The C5 era used are getting to be a bargain. Big trunk for the kids, or wife :blush: Don't tell her I said that.
    Bob, the father of the Miata has a saying, which I may not be quoting to exactness here..... " If you can't go fast on 90hp, 900 won't help you". The gentleman has a point. I am thinking a CTS with 255HP, I think it is, is more than enough. Better gas mileage and insurance and has a zero to a speeding ticket which is pretty fast. It is all about balance. Most fun is in cornering, and challenging the yellow signs. A straight line, with white restricted speeds has its limits anyway. The V6 will deliver the best weight balance and will achieve posted limits in a hurry. The CTS, made to be a handling RWD car, should be able to handle anything Lincoln sends its way.
    -Loren
  • akirbyakirby Member Posts: 8,062
    You need to go a google on CTS-V and wheel hop.

    And Cadillac says it does the quarter in 13.1 seconds. You'd need modifications to get it down to 11's and those won't be cheap. And see the above note on "wheel hop".
  • lemkolemko Member Posts: 15,261
    Never drove one. Several things turned me off just looking at it. The hood prop rod just screams "CHEAP!" I also don't like the taillight that strongly resemble the units on my Dad's old 1981 Ford Thunderbird - a true dog of a car.

    What do I like? I like the instrument panel that seems to have been inspired by the classic 1961-64 Continental. I also like the use of the Zephyr nameplate - it was used on the groundbreaking aerodynamic Lincoln Zephyr of 1936. I'd have hoped Lincoln would steer away from the yuppified alphabet soup names. Believe me, I'm not happy with the nameplates Cadillac uses these days. My refer to my car as a Seville and not an STS.
  • nvbankernvbanker Member Posts: 7,239
    I'd have hoped Lincoln would steer away from the yuppified alphabet soup names. Believe me, I'm not happy with the nameplates Cadillac uses these days. My refer to my car as a Seville and not an STS.

    I so agree with that, Lemko. I hate the 3 letter confusing designations. The heritage names, Continental, DeVille, Eldorado, Town Car meant so much more. The conversion to "international symbols" is an irritant. :mad:
  • heyjewelheyjewel Member Posts: 1,046
    I gotta go with you guys on this. I guess I'm repeating myself but t seems pretty STOOOPID to have a "Navigator" and a "Town Car" and then a "Mark LT" and then the letters. Really silly and inconsistent. Made even more so since the "MK" part, which would so nicely say "Mark" instead says "Emm Kay"
    I heard it pronounced that way by the narrator on a "Emm Kay Exx" commercial last night and it really sounded stupid when said aloud. "The new Lincoln Emm Kay Exx". It just aint workin for me.
    My wife (former marketing gal, now back to reality), and I had the same opinion of the commercial - cute but nothing to do with the car. (It showed a babe getting out at the beach and all the dudes watching her disrobe to her bathing suit IIRC.) Typically, showed little of the car, more of the babe. Said nothing about the car except it offered AWD. One could infer it will hold a surfboard cause the babe took one out. Oh I think she took some kids out too, but I was watchin the babe.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,167
    "Emm Kay" makes me think of "Mary Kay", and that's not the best image for a car if it wants to be a real contender.

    With Ford's great management, the future Lincoln looks alive as Abraham Lincoln looks now. Who hired these guys?
  • akirbyakirby Member Posts: 8,062
    You haven't seen anything that the current management has in store for Lincoln. Wait a couple of years. They didn't get this bad overnight and they're not going to fix it overnight, either.
  • rockyleerockylee Member Posts: 14,014
    Loren, about every post you make, is filled with "lines" that make me laugh. :D

    OKAY:

    Well the Fusion is not really unsafe. I do believe it to be a match to the CTS in the crash tests USA.

    Well Volvo didn't help em out on side impact safety since the fusion got a "poor" rating on side impact. :(

    Now the offset Euro testing, may be another matter. As for the look, I kinda like the Schick shaver chrome front. The button is a bit high and large, but that is true for all the line, no doubt. The Lincoln is just another Fusion. The Montego scores better in rear collisions for neck injury, so that along with better interior looks makes it the logical choice.

    The MKZ, is much more than just a rebadged fusion IMHO. way better interior, better engine, better quality inside and out, and lots more gadgets. To me it's like what honda, did with the accord to make a premium upscale car on the same platform called Acura TL. The Montego, I agree is safer and better platform, since it came from Volvo. This is why I'm confident the MKS, will be a very nice car for the extra "change"$$$.

    As for HP the V6 is adequate. And the CTS 3.6 V6 is MORE than adequate. I did have the pleasure of watching and hearing the wonderful CTS-V track car at Laguna Seca. Maybe GM would sell you one like that ... ummm, for a few bucks, no doubt.

    Loren, I don't like the CTS-V only because it performs so well on the track. I also want comfort, a good quality interior/exterior, along with gadgets. The CTS-V, is the most bang for your buck like the Corvette, in its sports car segment. It's like going from a BMW 3 series to a M3. Well that's the way I see it.

    As for high tech, well it works wonders for computing. High tech is cool. And some advances in car engineering which makes sense are cool as well. Tech, for the sake of geek luv or glitz in a car does little for me. The most fun car to drive which I have ever owned was the little Miata. A bit too little, but for driving excitement it had it. The car had roll-up windows. Could not hear the radio for all the noise in a '96 Miata, but the tail pipe did sing a song.

    Well Loren, I think that is a age and generation gap we have. Older folks prefer more often than my generation simple function. Nothing wrong with that. You are more like my father, and his brother, (My Uncle) and like the plain Jane. However my mother, grandmother, grandfather, I would say are the exceptions to the "generation rule" ;)

    Maybe you could buy a Corvette. The C5 era used are getting to be a bargain. Big trunk for the kids, or wife Don't tell her I said that.

    She read your post and chuckled. I told her it was a good idea. I told her I could put some tall blonde, golden tan, California beach bikini wearing girl in the passenger seat. :P

    Bob, the father of the Miata has a saying, which I may not be quoting to exactness here..... " If you can't go fast on 90hp, 900 won't help you". The gentleman has a point. I am thinking a CTS with 255HP, I think it is, is more than enough.

    It's sufficient for most, but for us few the CTS-V, is the only way to go IMHO. ;)

    Better gas mileage and insurance and has a zero to a speeding ticket which is pretty fast. It is all about balance. Most fun is in cornering, and challenging the yellow signs. A straight line, with white restricted speeds has its limits anyway. The V6 will deliver the best weight balance and will achieve posted limits in a hurry. The CTS, made to be a handling RWD car, should be able to handle anything Lincoln sends its way.
    -Loren

    I agree with most of your post but the gas mileage difference isn't all that different. The insurance I agree is a big difference, but their is nothing like taking a high performance car on a empty Panhandle "farm and market" road to the car limits, or at least near them. ;) Cadillac, appears to be countering everything Lincoln throws its way. I suppose that is a good thing but the question is at how much more dough ? So far Lincoln has severely undercutted Cadillac, in price and offers a heck of alot more gadgets. Do a comparo of the CTS vs. MKZ loaded out and tell me which car is a better buy. The MKZ offers bit more power, way better interior, better overall quality, and a six-speed auto. My winner is the MKZ until Caddy releases the 08' CTS, then we will see. ;)

    Rocky
  • rockyleerockylee Member Posts: 14,014
    akirby,

    I'm pretty sure the much more modern 08' CTS-V which I'm referring to will have eliminated those early Y2K problems. With 500-600 hp. on tap it will run 11's in the quarter mile with a new and improved suspension. I could be wrong, but I doubt it. I read on the net somewhere that was what the test mule was running. I've read through perhaps 40 or 50 websites info pertaining to this car. ;)

    Rocky
  • rockyleerockylee Member Posts: 14,014
    LOL...Wow....I guess you really are not much of a fan of the "current" Lincoln, cars. Oh well at least you still have Buick, and Cadillac. ;)

    Rocky
  • rockyleerockylee Member Posts: 14,014
    Fintail, I gotta side with akirby, on this one. I guess the new looks appeal to me. I've noticed one thing for sure and that is older generations than mine prefer almost Dodge Ram like blunt, in your face styling. The GTO, Chevelle, Imperial, weren't exactly beauty's in my eyes and always wondered why older folks liked those pig snouts they called grills. :confuse: I like I said feel it's a generation gap. My generation is more into sleek flowing lines, thus making Acura TL's, CTS's, Camcords, Civics, Grand Prix's, more desirable and attractive. ;)

    Oh well, to each there own I suppose. :P :shades:

    Rocky
  • m1miatam1miata Member Posts: 4,551
    Sorry, but you can not compare the two at all. The CTS and MKZ are in totally different leagues. The Cadillac is not a FWD economy car with some extra nice trim and a larger engine added to it. The CTS is a purpose built car.

    The Montego I did get confused with the Milan. The Milan is the deal, if you want that style and not the Lincoln. The Montego/FiveHundred, if not so plain jane looking, is actually a good car. One of those technically, it is correct, less expensive Volvo cars as a Ford. Not bad - just not too exciting. That said, the Montego is attractive in its own way.

    If you are talking modified cars as a bargain, Cadillac did that with the Cavalier to Cimmeron. already. So Lincoln does the same -- big deal. Must admit it is a Bold, if not silly Move. :confuse:
    -Loren
  • rockyleerockylee Member Posts: 14,014
    Well the AWD does use the Rear Wheels to a point and you'd be surprised just how good of a handler this car will actually be. I guess if they can compare a FWD Acura TL to a CTS, in many car comparo's it's fair game unless you get technical. I guess we both should test drive one for fun, before we get ahead of ourselves. It's not like they are going to hold a gun to our head and tell us we buy it. ;)

    Rocky
  • guyfrguyfr Member Posts: 55
    Bethanybreeze,

    You don't know what you are talking about.

    Volvo reliability has steadily improved like everybody else. My 2 2004 Volvo's are way better than my 1988 was. Thats the one which left me stranded on the side of the road.
  • m1miatam1miata Member Posts: 4,551
    Some people prefer FWD. Those people have many more choices in cars these days. I own and have owned plenty of FWD cars. Too many, and don't care to buy the next one in FWD. The RWD is, IMHO simply superior in say 8 out of 10 scenarios in driving, feel, and durability / simplicity. Transmissions feel better - sound better. Not the heavy front nose syndrome on RWD. Car is better balanced, braking is better too. When punched, the spinning wheels do not throw tire smoke out front. You think the dang car is on fire with FWD. :D When you hit the slightest bump, you feel like the car is crashing into it compared to a RWD car. Once you own a FWD for years, or should I say people that have only driven FWD may not notice a lot of differences until exposed to proper wheel driven cars.

    Rocky, if you have lots of ice, and maybe some snow in your part of Texas, that AWD would be a good thing. I would get a Legacy AWD. That is a company which knows their AWD. Or get an Audi.
    -Loren
  • m1miatam1miata Member Posts: 4,551
    As a whole, the reliability of Volvo, if you believe in CR data, is not all that impressive. Some models look improved, but be picky. There are still some problematic models at Volvo. Considering price and price of parts, this is not a good thing. One or two models in the line may be worth considering.
  • rockyleerockylee Member Posts: 14,014
    Some people prefer FWD. Those people have many more choices in cars these days. I own and have owned plenty of FWD cars. Too many, and don't care to buy the next one in FWD. The RWD is, IMHO simply superior in say 8 out of 10 scenarios in driving, feel, and durability / simplicity. Transmissions feel better - sound better. Not the heavy front nose syndrome on RWD. Car is better balanced, braking is better too. When punched, the spinning wheels do not throw tire smoke out front. You think the dang car is on fire with FWD. When you hit the slightest bump, you feel like the car is crashing into it compared to a RWD car. Once you own a FWD for years, or should I say people that have only driven FWD may not notice a lot of differences until exposed to proper wheel driven cars.

    Can't disagree with you here. :P ;)

    Rocky, if you have lots of ice, and maybe some snow in your part of Texas, that AWD would be a good thing.

    Loren, we get all of the above pal. It sometimes gets worse here than it does in Michigan, because of the wind. The brutual wind and sunshine rapidly melts the snow during the daytime, and by night time you have roads that Michelle Kwan's, blades would easily grip. ;) It doesn't snow much, but when it does it rivals the worst blizzards I seen in Michigan. You can get a couple of feet over a few days-week or so and then the severe melting begins with a warm up. Texans don't have the slightest clue on plowing roads which makes a dangerous matter worse Loren. :surprise:

    I would get a Legacy AWD. That is a company which knows their AWD. Or get an Audi.
    -Loren

    Both make superb AWD systems. So does Acura with it's SH-AWD, which IMHO is the best on the market. I pretty much think all AWD systems are pretty darn good like Volvo/Ford/Mazda's and now Lincolns Haledex? of course created by Volvo. Some like infiniti call theirs "intellegent awd" and the most basic units usually do a 60/40 RWD/FWD plit. Some send the tq. to the wheels that need it most, others send front to rear.

    So yeah AWD is a good option and even on dry pavement with the amount of wind we have blowing debris (sand) here daily, AWD can enhance safety and performance. Audi's Quattro system wasn't banned from racing for the heck of it. So in some cases 4 wheels are better than just 2. Full Grip of AWD vs. 2 slipping/squealing wheels has advantages in certain situations. ;)

    So the bottom line is Lincoln, now has a proven very capable system. :)

    My $0.02

    Rocky
  • scootertrashscootertrash Member Posts: 698
    I sure miss DouglasR.
  • rockyleerockylee Member Posts: 14,014
    Where did he go I wonder. :( I agree I liked reading his posts.

    Rocky

    P.S. I miss rorr, on the boards. :( Luckily I occassionally talk to him via e-mail.
  • rockyleerockylee Member Posts: 14,014
    Lincoln Celebrates New James Bond Movie With Martini Making and Marksmanship Training

    DEARBORN, Mich. — Lincoln is tapping into what it figures is the secret desire of the automotive media to be secret agents for a day, as it celebrates the premiere of Casino Royale later this month.

    http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/News/articleId=117498

    Rocky
  • jae5jae5 Member Posts: 1,206
    With Ford in the financial trouble that it's in, market share erosion, and with putting AM & possibly Jaguar on the block, what are the thoughts of the board if/when the sale(s) go through?

    Do any of you think Ford will take the money, or some of it, and shore up Lincoln's line?

    Or will they only use the monies to help Ford itself, and let the other units, particularly in this case Lincoln, soldier on as is?

    If Lincoln was to be "Oldsmobiled", do any of you think buyers, whether current or potential, would move up to the PAG group, down to Ford / Mercury, or "defect" to the competition?

    Can the rebadges work for Lincoln? Can these products be competitive in the near-luxury and/or luxury markets?
  • m1miatam1miata Member Posts: 4,551
    I would make the Mercury Milan the Fusion, or Ford Milan. The same with all the rest of the Merc line, then dump to name plate. Lincoln would be the premium models of Ford/Mazda, as in Ford Zephyr. Mercury/Lincoln is history. The only true luxury line is the Jaguar. Perhaps they could sell Jag to BMW.

    Personally, I would see a good Ford line up as the Euro Focus sold in USA as the base car, then the Milan. Next up a modern day, with some retro hints Ford Fairlane or Galaxie in RWD. Then keep the Gran Marque as a Ford Marque, and upgrade the interior and exterior. Update the Mustang with a modern interior, with easier to read speedometer, and some chrome or anything to spruce up the dull exterior. Maybe lose the sad face up front somehow. No, don't put the happy face from Chevy or Saturn on it. :D As for crossover Fairlane project - who cares. Boring cars can be produced by anyone. Econo cars can best be made by Korea. Cut the lines down to good solid performers, and start working in more RWD. And no AWD is not the same as RWD. Remember the days when the lower priced Fords had style, like a Falcon or Fairlane 500? Even sporty with a V8. And yes, not a road track racer due to typical handling of that era, but fast enough in a straight line. In today's market, I would like to see one with an inline 6 around 210HP and another one with around 255HP or so as an inline or V6. Possibly make a V8 as a special car SVT, in a couple models. Maybe the Ford Marque, and the Fairlane 500.
    -Loren
  • akirbyakirby Member Posts: 8,062
    Euro Focus is coming but not until 2010. They're bringing in a Mazda based B car to slot under the Focus aimed at the Fit, etc. Ford realizes that it can't compete with the Koreans and (soon) Chinese on price. Expect more features and functionality for a slighly higher (justified hopefully) price at lower volumes and higher profit levels.

    A lot of the Lincoln/Mercury lineup is driven by the need to keep L/M only dealers in business. Don't see that changing.

    Ford will invest in Lincoln eventually - it just wasn't the priority in the past. Think about it - Ford had to develop a brand new mustang and significantly modified F150 followed by a brand new 500/montego/freestyle followed by a brand new Fusion/Milan/Zephyr followed by the Edge/MKX. Now that the car and CUV markets are covered with new products they can focus (no pun intended) on Lincoln and possibly Mercury.

    The problem with Lincoln is there are no suitable RWD sedan platforms readily available as was the case with the CD3 and D3 platforms. I'm sure they're working on it and I think they'll have a smaller Lincoln based on the new Mustang platform. These things take time.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 0
    Especially with Ford. The layers of authority and bureaucracy that demand to sign off on any new plans are allegedly being paired down though. We'll see. It would be great if Ford could at least speed up to Chrysler's pace of bringing concepts to market.
  • akirbyakirby Member Posts: 8,062
    We know the beancounters are no longer making product decisions - that's a start. Mulally and Fields both sound like very impatient managers, so I'd say there's a very good chance that they'll get things streamlined. Only question is how long it will take.
  • heyjewelheyjewel Member Posts: 1,046
    "We know the beancounters are no longer making product decisions "

    Seriously, the review I just saw of the Edge or emmkayexx complained that the thing had no assist handles and that it was a pretty obvious cost cutting measure. Not to mention that the interior materials are below par compared with everyhting else. Not to mention D-L shifter, ... I don't know why we cant strike a reasoned position here, but your quote above makes no sense to me.
  • bumpybumpy Member Posts: 4,425
    Remember the days when the lower priced Fords had style, like a Falcon or Fairlane 500? Even sporty with a V8. And yes, not a road track racer due to typical handling of that era, but fast enough in a straight line. In today's market, I would like to see one with an inline 6 around 210HP and another one with around 255HP or so as an inline or V6. Possibly make a V8 as a special car SVT, in a couple models.

    Have you driven an Australian  Ford lately? Unfortunately, no one in a position of authority at Ford Motor Co. knows how to make a left-hand-drive version of these cars.
  • akirbyakirby Member Posts: 8,062
    C'mon George - Fields has been there less than a year and Mulally only a few weeks. You can't possibly think they could have made any serious changes to the Edge/MKX - it was "in the can" way before they took over, especially Mulally. I'm talking about products that they have a chance to influence.

    I know you're not exactly optimistic but at least give them a chance to deliver on what they're saying.

    I do agree with you on the cost cutting not being wise, but I give them a little credit for making things like the Vista Roof and Navigation available on the Edge. Even that wouldn't have happened a few years ago.
  • m1miatam1miata Member Posts: 4,551
    No, but I did at one time view the V8 racing in Australia on TV. Amazing how we are stuck with FWD cheapo cars, with NASCAR autos having nothing at all to do with what we drive on the streets.
  • nvbankernvbanker Member Posts: 7,239
    Do any of you think Ford will take the money, or some of it, and shore up Lincoln's line?

    IF they sell all of the PAG or maybe all but Volvo, I think they'll have to fix Lincoln, or get out of the luxury car business altogether. Lots of IFs......
  • ehaaseehaase Member Posts: 328
    I think they'll have to fix Lincoln, or get out of the luxury car business altogether.

    I could see Ford get out of the car business altogether in North America and become primarily a truck manufacturer. The only Ford car anyone is passionate about is the Mustang. Does anyone really care about the Mazda and Volvo based sedans that have debuted the past few years? Besides Rockylee, who cares about the MKS?
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