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Comments
so the tl type si couldn't pull away from an si on the straights? i never got a chance to watch the video!
Perhaps this should be a message to honda that the tl needs to have sh-awd or be rwd? if i had a type s, i'd be pissed if an si out-anythinged me!
I agree themistocles, the si is wonderful handler.
mabye if honda actually gave the tl rwd, it would have fared better. or at least give it sh-awd with something other than a v-6 to compensate.
http://www.fuelvaporcar.com/html/the_car.html
Thanks!
Suffice to say, through much of the drive, I had a fecal matter eating grin plastered across my face. It's plenty quick, and even on the stock all season tires, handles so well that it's uncanny. I can barely even tell it's FWD.
wow.... that's the most.... original phrase i think i've ever heard. glad you like it though, i can't wait to take mine out into some winding roads and just start playing.
thx
I had the previous Si hatchback in silver. A little too unusual, hard for folks to get in back, performance not so great.
I had a 1989 Si hatchback... one of my favorites. Have also had 2 regular 1998 & 1999 Civics and the first generation Odyssey.
Best thing about any Honda is you can drive the living tar out of it, park it, and it will be ready to go again the next morning, and still get great gas mileage for 100K +.
For the $, Honda cars & motorcycles rock. If I had the extra dough, I'd be driving a BMW 335i...
As someone else on the board said, "BMWs are built to be driven on the autobahn and serviced by highly skilled technicians with special tools. Japanese cars are meant to drive in heavy traffic with minimum maintenance." Good observation. I've had 2 BMW motorcycles and loved them dearly, but they were expensive to maintain.
Thanks to all you Si owners who are posting positive & negative info--helps me make an informed decision.
Have fun & be careful out there.
thx for the replies.
PS. If I do goto the Honda dealership to get oil change, do they have synth and do I just go by their recommendation?
I have a bmw 325 i manual. and am considering a si sedan.
I love the bmr's rear drive. you really can't beat that. the inline 6 purrs like a kitten. the car is very smooth.
However the cars feels heavy. the steering is a little slow unless you yank it and the suspension is on the soft side. Although it does handle even with the soft underpinnings.
I have driven an si sedan. the car was very nice except that it did not idle down between shifts. Iv'e heard there is a fix for this. I will have to go for another re-test drive to see if the factory has addressed this little annoyance. the car feels light and agile compared to the bmer and with lay down seats it has way more storage room for my rc cars and my mt. bike. I wonder how the '08s will drive? (re the idle down issue)
I like the habanero red color and the nav system. HOnda doesn't charge you 400 bucks for pearls or metallics. this I like.
My ~55 year old father drives a Mazdaspeed3, and likes my Civic. My ~52 year old mother drives an 07 Miata (6 speed), and also likes the Civic. They also have an 07 Jeep Commander on lease, and a 4cyl Tacoma, but the Mazdas are their daily drivers except during the winter. I think my father prefers my car to his, as he doesn't really push the Speed3 very much, and the Civic is quite a bit more slick when you aren't trying to get every once of performance out of it.
When my father gets tired of the Speed3 in a year (he's a new car junkie), I might offer him a trade; my Si should be worth more than the Speed3 by then, and he'll have put some more economical all season tires on the car, too. Furthermore, I'll know the car has been meticulously taken care of.
This is my first Honda; my previous car was a 2001 Hyundai Accent that I bought new for $8000, and previous to that was an old beater 86 Chevy pickup. I'm not in to the whole throwing lots of money on swapping new cars constantly thing.
Anyway, the median age means that half of the people that buy the car are older, and half of them are younger, as opposed to an average, which might be a bit higher than the median.
I consider the rev hang problem more than an annoyance. I have an '07 Sedan and the rev hang absolutely kills the driving experience everytime I have to shift. Despite many claiming that it is "fixed" on the '07 Si, it is very much a part of my daily driving experience. If Honda fixes the rev hang for the '08 models, I would hope they apply the fix to the '07s, too.
I may just not be experienced enough yet as a performance driver, but i haven't really noticed the rev hang or how it "kills the driving experience"... I just go out playing and have all kinds of fun. Last night I spent 30 minutes in some back roads, an deverything was going great. I love my little baby...
this car is a nice middlepoint that we need here in the states: the 2.0 k20 pushing 155hp, a sport auto tranny, nicer interior, etc. Something to better compete with the mazda 3 gt.
ofcourse, ours would have the usdm civic face, and not the jdm taillights or headlights.
HONDA: makes this civic for our market. we will love you more!
the wheels are actually what was available as a honda factory performance package for the 7th generation civic...but they were never si wheels, at least not here in the states.
this is a sharp looking car; even if it looked like ours does, but still had the midrange k20 with a leather/sport fabric interior with the sport A/T, id seriously consider a civic again.
This car is rebadged the csx in canada, under the acura nameplate. There is also a csx type-s, which is basically their version of the si sedan.
Example:
I burst onto a 45mph speed limit road in 3rd gear, and then shift right to 5th or 6th to cruise once I get up to speed, when the engine is around 5.5k RPMs
The rev hang makes a bit more work for the clutch there, and a slightly less smooth shift as the engine slows down to match the transmission.
Also, it definitely affects engine braking when you're in situations where you don't have the engine pushing 5k RPMs+ - if the engine is zinging along, you get pretty immediate engine braking, but at slower speeds, it feels more like an automatic when you let off the gas. Hardly a deal breaker.
If you're at 5k+, then you feel the engine braking just fine.
As compared to the "can't shift the damn thing to 5th" or "Yes, I just jerked everyone in the car around in shifting to 2nd gear slowly" Speed3, or the "Couldn't tell how fast I was going because it was too soft and quiet inside" GTI; nothing's perfect!
In the real world, this doesn't exactly make a difference. If I want to use engine braking, I down shift to do so. That letting off the gas while doing 60mph on the highway doesn't decelerate right away isn't much of an issue to me. It clearly bothers some people, and I can see how the throttle could be a deal breaker to some, but it isn't to me. That the throttle isn't absolutely instantaneous is something I notice, but it responds quickly enough.
Just wondering if this is a flywheel issue? It sounds like the flywheel needs to be lighter. Has anyone tried replacing the flywheel with a lighter aftermarket one to see if it helps?
Voids warranty I know but still lots of guys hop them up.
A flywheel is no big deal. It would irritate me but I will see if the 2008's are any better.
I guess it will help to have a good lawyer to remind the dealer since they always try their level best to find a reason to void the warranty. Having the law be true and enforcing it can be costly. I've had enough dealers in the past tell me about voided warranties and then your cars sits unfixed.
If you autox your car then they will say it wore everything out prematurely. They LOVE to do that!
But I will look into it more when i get back. I don't plan on any mods to any car I buy much past tires and different sway bars. Mazda tried to void my warranty on those! I went to a different dealer and they didn't care, so it's probably more the individual car dealer than it is the manufacturer. Problem is the other car dealer called up the dealer I took it to on the phone and told them I must race the car or something.
The problem was actually a faulty sensor and couldn't be related to the sway bars.
Some dealers do try and do this tho. :mad:
Hopefully Mitsu has stopped their policy of voiding warranties in my area. Honda I never modified in any way so no drama there.
Comments on the '08 Mugen model contained here: Mugen Si First Drive Article Review... personally, I'm fairly unimpressed...
A little surfing yields a complete ground effects/wing package for $1244, coilovers for $1098 and Magnaflow exhaust for $498 totalling $2840. A really nice set of 18's could be had for say $2k and installation of everything for maybe $1k so for less than $6k one could easily create their own. If one is selective in wheel choice the entire package probably comes out about $5k and if one can do their own installation about $4k covers it.
this is the thing that is hard to comprehend and yet accept at the same time.
Mugens stuff is pretty much equal to if not BETTER in quality to what honda already puts on their vehicles...and hondaphiles know this. And they KNOW how to tune a car...they have the civic type r pumping out 250hp NATURALLY ASPIRATED! Granted it probably costs a bit, but if there was engine work done instead of the visuals, it would make such a stronger case for the car.
Mugens stuff has ALWAYS been expensive. But in the real world, outside of jdm mania, 30k buys you a lot, hence why i don't think anyone interested in this car is interested in the most bang for you buck, as the regular si already offers that. This is a limited edition model that will hold its value like the r32 has after its already out of production, and will be sought after by enthusiasts.
I love mugens products, but outside of engine/suspension/exhaust/wheels, the stuff (visual sytling) IS overpriced. Its the absolute best you can buy, but it is overpriced. And for the american market, we could have done much better with a type r.
Do the amount of parts put on the mugen equal a 30k tag? yeah they do, mugen really does charge that much for their stuff. But considering how honda is marketing it,(a much sportier, not just cooler looking civic) its not worth it, unless you REALLY want your civic to look like the mugen. Can you imagine what you could do with an si sedan with an extra 7 k? This car is cooler looking, but its only slightly sportier, not 30k sportier.
So i guess the REAL problem is how much mugen charges...not the existance of a limited edition si sedan. It looks great, and those wheels are incredible looking, and i'm sure that the combo of aerodynamic functional body moldings and lightweight wheels does equal a civic with better track performance...but its just to pretty to be beaten!
I do think the car is cool, but if i did have 30k, it would be for an sti or r32.
If i really wanted to go mugen, id invest in some wheels or some engine tuning components. I'd worry about uber expensive (albiet functional) body styling later.
Though I'd probably just get an STI for that money.
Or vacation.
this is the 30k civic i would buy:
1. completely different suspension set up, with more aggressive EVERYTHING.
2. specialy tuned engine pushing at least 220 hp like the jdm type r, or a detuned version of the k23 turbo in the rdx.(make it sh-awd to make it a rally car and its even more justified!)
3. nice, noticably bigger brakes.
4. a small lip kit, that is LIGHTER than the stock components, and lightweight wheels.
you can't tell people that you just drive a sports injected vehicle. its a sports injected civic.