Edmunds dealer partner, Bayway Leasing, is now offering transparent lease deals via these forums. Click here to see the latest vehicles!
Welcome To The Classic Cars Message Board
bonnie_rick
Member Posts: 115
in General
and Welcome to one of our newest Conferences here
at www.edmunds.com Do you own a Classic vehicle,
or are you wondering if what you have is a Classic?
What's a collectible, and what does special
interest vehicle mean?
These and other questions will form the basis for
this Conference. Start your pondering here by
introducing yourself and telling us what your
interest in this Conference is.
I'll let your Host, Mr_Shiftright, get you
started. Oh Joe...
Bonnie Rick
Town Hall Community Manager, edmunds.com
at www.edmunds.com Do you own a Classic vehicle,
or are you wondering if what you have is a Classic?
What's a collectible, and what does special
interest vehicle mean?
These and other questions will form the basis for
this Conference. Start your pondering here by
introducing yourself and telling us what your
interest in this Conference is.
I'll let your Host, Mr_Shiftright, get you
started. Oh Joe...
Bonnie Rick
Town Hall Community Manager, edmunds.com
Tagged:
0
This discussion has been closed.
Comments
Hi, everyone!
I've set aside this topic mostly for introductions. If you'd like to make suggestions
for the Classics Conference or ask for
assistance, I invite you to join me in Topic 3 where I usually hang out.
Talk With Mr. Shiftright in Topic 3
Okay, me first:
Mr Shiftright is really Joe Troise, who lives in
California. Joe comes from an automotive family,
Packard men all, and has been tinkering with cars
since he was a kid. Joe has been employed by
Mercedes Benz North America as a factory
representative, has had his own repair shop years
ago and has done a half-dozen restorations. He has owned lots of different cars, prefers sports car
and sedans and drives like a nut when in the safety of lonely roads or the race track..(strictly driving school amateur).
Presently he wears many hats, as classic car
appraiser, market analyst for a famous unnamed
classic car price guide, author of car books,
calendars and magazine articles (Road & Track,
Autoweek) and cartoonist for Road & Track.
First time I saw your Shiftright tag I thought 'Yeah shr, pal. You know the cartoon. That's great.' Ain't I the cynical old crank?
I guess you're entitled to use the name.
So who's Frank?
PS
My favorite one was where Nigel called somebody about an MG TC from an ad in a 30 yr old R&T. Several gags in one strip.
Frank is Phil Frank, ace cartoonist for the San Francisco Chronicle.
Barring that; I'll contribute my own.
I'm a 42 year old engineer living in central Oklahoma. I currently own 5 cars, the newest of which has 145,000 miles on it. Classics right? Naw, more like old and mostly worn out. I buy cars when they:
a) Have more than 100k miles on them
b) Are in moderately good condition
c) Considering the asking price, I think I can get enough more miles out of them to make them worth owning.
I'm kind of constantly on the lookout for older undervalued cars: cars that have lost their appeal to their owner, but still have lots of reliable miles left in them. I bought my Volvo 240GL with 126000 miles on it for $750 because it looked like heck (had right rear quarterpanel damage), squealed like crazy (A/C compressor locked up), and power windows didn't work (on same circuit as A/C). I currently have 185000 miles on it and the core engine and tranny are still strong.
I was hoping to find a conference where folks discussed the reliability issues of 10+ years old high-end (luxury?) cars. I looked in the sedan/luxury topic, but those folks value dollars the way I value pennys.
Am I in the right place?
Hi, and welcome. Sure, this is the right place.
Why not start a new topic here on that very subject? I'd be glad to offer my opinions as I'm sure other would who come here regularly. Sometimes you can get a short bio on people by clicking on their names as they appear in their posts. Bios will appear only if the user has chosen to write and display one, of course.
best wishes from Mr. Shiftright, Your host
The best chrome? Undoubtedly the British back then and maybe still...you can still see rotting hulks of Bentleys and Jaguars and even MGs with still good chrome attached....they used a triple-plate process.
What do you think of MGA's? How about a nice Twin Cam? I think they're in the $20K range. Very pretty.
How would you compare it to a contemporaneous Jag, I guess an XK120/140?
I think the Jag 120 especially is a historically significant car, powerful, great fun to drive and absolutely beautiful to look at. It's almost the perfect classic postwar British sports car. I'd love to own one, in spite of their shortcomings (brakes need some attention, and overheating...all curable...). The Jag 140, also a nice car, looks clunkier in the bumper area. I had a 1955 roadster and a 56 coupe so I know them well.
I would appreciate any help in appraising the real value of this car. Thanks.
Basically these W114 coupes should be evaluated just as decent used cars, as they are of no real interest to collectors. I would think $3,800 to $5,000 would buy a very nice one. Parts availability is good, but fuel mileage is rather poor, even for the 6 cylinder cars. The cars are solidly built, fairly common, perform adequately and reliably in most areas, but do not have good AC systems.
This could be a practical and enjoyable car, but don't pay too much for one or put too much into restoration, because the value in the marketplace is not that high and not likely to increase to any great extent. If you really like these cars, shopping for a CE model (fuel-injected would be a somewhat better purchase).
pay $5,000 so considering the condition and mileage and your advice, I don't think that I have overpaid. I will keep in mind your comments about the car not becoming a "classic" any time soon if any hefty repair bills start creeping in. Other than the A/C, anything else I should be sure to have checked when I bring it into the mechanic for a general tuneup other than objects that can be easily seen by the naked eye that either tend to fail or would improve performance? Also, anything that can be done to improve the A/C situation? (I feel that it's worth putting another $500-$600 into it to bring it up to very good condition just for my own satisfaction. Other than detailing, where would my $$ best be spent to improve the auto (besides required things like brakes, tires, etc.)?
Thanks again for your valuable input.
Sorry I've been on vacation, so couldn't respond sooner.
Congrats on your purchase...sounds like a very fair price for a nice car..the low mileage should mean a long life.
I'd say the A/C on all 70s era Mercedes Benzes is hopeless, and the 1980s not all that great either. You'll never get the A/C to perform well in extremely hot conditions unless you retrofit to an American system (it's something we do best).
Perhaps you're best investment would be to guard against the potential failures caused by, of all things, the low mileage....seals, gaskets belts and hoses dried out (perhaps) from lack of use. Have all the rubber and synthetic rubber parts checked thoroughly. Also flushing out all the fluids (cooling, brakes, trans, differential, oil) would be well worth the trouble, again because of the lack of use.
good luck with the car...perhaps someday it will enjoy some collector status, like the earlier Mercedes coupes from the late 50s and early 60s (the old round-fender types) do. Time is on your side, although I do think appreciation will be slow...but some cars don't appreciate at all, so there's something!
best wishes,
Your host
I currently own a 75 Chev El Camino that I have had since 1976. I was wondering if there is a old El Camino discussion thread around that you know of?
regards,
John
No, sorry,I don't know of any discussions going on right now at the Edmunds Town Hall...maybe some of our visitors have a suggestion?
is worth. The car is in running condition, runs rough.has new carb and new tires, however it needs a lot of body work and interior work. I would like to buy it for a restoration job, but the owner has asked me to make an offer. anyone who has an idea of what I should pay I would appreciate a reply. Thank you.
How's the softtop? That's around $1,200-1,500 right there for a replacment. Is there a detachable hardtop with the car? That's worth $1,500 alone.
THE DETACHABLE HARDTOP IS FINE, BUT I DON'T KNOW HOW THE SOFTTOP IS. ARE PARTS AVAILABLE FOR THIS CAR/ DO I HAVE TO GET THEM FROM MERCEDES ?
THANKS
DAVID
<<A HREF="http://www">www. hemmings.com>
ALSO CONSIDERING A 1980 TR7 WITH 42000 ORIGINAL MILES FAIRLY GOOD RUNNING CONDITION. HAS SOME RUST BUT NOTHING THAT BAD. WANTS 1950.00
IS THIS WITHIN REASON?
Thee TR7s are going off very cheap...you shouldn't have to pay more than $2,500-$3,000 for a nice clean one, if you're really set on having one.
Your Host
YOUR THOUGHTS ON A 1968 TR4A. CAR RUNS SMOOTH AND SHIFTS SMOOTH. VERY LITTLE RUST ON THE CAR BUT THE INTERIOR IS SHOT . NO DENTS NO HITS. NEEDS EXHAUST HARDTOP IS GOOD BUT NEEDS A SOFTTOP.HE IS ASKING 3500.00 BUT THAT IS NEGOTIABLE. GOOD TIRES,AND FRAME IS FINE. IS 2500. TO 28OO. TO MUCH TO PAY AND IS THE CAR WORH RESTORING.
THANKS
From your description, the car sounds seriously overpriced, and when you say "rust" I hope that means only on the surface, and not actual rot. If there are rust holes in the body, frankly I wouldn't even bother with the car, I'd part it out. But if there's no serious rust, then perhaps an offer of $1,500-2,000 at most, presuming there are no serious mechanical defects...but if it's got a worn out engine and trans and is just a leaky old bucket, it's not so rare or valuable a car that you can't start with a better one at a better price.
I wasn't really looking for an old collectible to restore, but I found a white '61 Mercedes 190SL 4 speed for about $7000 that is VERY original. It's a two owner (bought it in '66) with a claimed 78K miles. At least one paint job and some minor body work is evident, as well as current rust. Driver's floor pan is rusted bad. Didn't get to drive it or hear it run as the starter doesn't work, but it will be replaced in the next week or so. Doors, hood, trunk, and body panels fit very well. Lights, wipers and horn work. Interior is in typical rough shape for an almost 40 year old car. Top is not in bad shape, but does not fit well on frame work. When lifting and pushing the car, the suspension does not creek and the shocks bring the car to rest quickly. There is lots of grease and oil grime in the engine bay and under both the front and rear ends. There is an original owners manual package.
1. Is it worth it?
2. Does anyone know about what kind of money it would take to restore it?
3. Does anyone know any European restoration specialists? I found Sports Leicht Restorations, Inc. and Silverstar Inc. on the internet.
4. I documented some body and engine numbers. Where can I go to see what they mean and if they match?
5. What questions should I bring to the owner?
Sincerely,
Perplexed in Ohio
Bilsteins are great shocks, but probably overkill for a car like that...I wouldn't necessary go bottom of the barrel on shocks, but you might try something in the middle range, like KYB or Sachs/Boge...Koni makes a great shock,too, but I think they are no cheaper than Bilstein.
I've never heard of anything like a 'timing relay' on a 1969 car...you must have gotten the name wrong, since the timing on your car is not electronic to the best of my knowledge...so I can't help you with that one.
Looking for a site or plce where I could find a value for my 1928 Chevy Coupe Cab
The 230SL is certainly a collectible car, but I see two problems that have perhaps interfered with the value of your car.
One thing is that the 280SL is pulling away in terms of buyer preference, since it has nicer appointments than the 230 and a larger engine. So the "big" money is going to the 280SLs, which is super show condition are now breaking $30,000.
A second issue is that your car is a European model, which causes hesitation among buyers who worry about rust issues and part problems for a Euro car.
Given all that, nice-looking 230SLs are selling around $16K-18K right now, but you'll have to figure somewhat less for a European car.
Dear TWG---if you could describe your Chevy Cab in more detail, regarding condition and originality (see link below to find out the Classes of Condition), then I might be able to give you an approximate value.
Topic on How to Determine the Condition of your Classic is this one ====>
>
Host
Thanks for responding so fast-
My '28 is all original, I would say probally a number 3 with approx. 56000 miles on it.
Runs great and needs no work to go to a show.
Any more info you need?
Ooops, maybe the VIN number will help you in determining the value of my '28 Chevy?
This is the vin # 12AB48516.
Iforgot to give it to you in my last note
Thanks again
TWG
These are rare cars (few built, few surviving, hard to restore compared to a Model A because of finding parts). However, there is not a strong demand, say compared again to a Model A, but certainly it will appeal to buyers who are Chevrolet lovers.
I would think anywhere from $8,000 to $12,500, around there for a solid, clean, good-looking, good-running #3 car. There's a lot that varies the price of these old-timers...originality, color scheme, how it runs, etc....these things are important to the type of buyer you will attract, I think.
I always try to advise people selling 1920s popular cars to never let a serious cash buyer walk away if he/she is somewhat close to your asking price. The 20s cars are not as popular as they once were, due to the obvious changing of the guard--the people who collect old cars. Nowadays, as the older generation passes on, the newer spenders are looking to cars from their own memory, so the 50s and 60s and even early 70s muscle cars are hot right now.
Great parade car, however, or a wonderful "ice-cream" car to take the kids for a ride in style on Sundays.
Thanks again for the info
My '28 Chevy is a Cabriolet Coupe- All original, with 56,000 miles on it.
I was looking at a 1929 Buick- 4 door Sedan-
6 cylinder in nice shape (#3). I was just wondering, if the Buick was worth more than the Chevy or vice versa. the Buick has a 6 cyl and wooden spoke wheels, all original also, inside and out--versis the '28 Chevy Cabriolet Coupe with full dish steel wheels.
The Chevy really does make a great "ice cream car".
TWG
Anyway, good luck with your plans!
You might ask the mechanic what he hopes to gain by fixing the timing delay...to my mind, delaying the timing, an emissions function, will also retard the spark or delay its advance, thereby resulting in poorer performance. But if he thinks it's screwing something up, then by all means, have it fixed....if a vacuum device leaks, you will get a rough idle usually.
Thanks again for the info.
Have a good day-
'till next time.
TWG
Thank you for your help.
The "european" label is as much a psychological problem as a material one. If the car is revealed to be European, and old Mercedes buyers being the fussy people they are, this usually hurts the value of the car. I'm not saying it makes a lot of sense in the case of your particular car (it's more relevent to 80s cars imported into the US), but nonetheless, this prejudice exists and if a buyer goes sour on you, this is probably why.
This prejudice probably stems from the fact that many old German cars were patched up rustbuckets sent to the US during the "classic car gold rush" in the late 1980s.
In fact, most cars of all types made in the 1960s are rust prone, since the technology of corrosion prevention wasn't very good then.
I'm planning on buying a '96 Olds 98 Elite with 16,000 miles on it. The car is really clean, am-fm cassette,cd player, leather seats, full cloth top( like a convertible, air, cruise, compass. Can you tell me what a fair market price would be? from a private party. Seems to drive well.
thank you.
TWG1160@AOL.COM
This is a used car question, not related to the Classics Conference, but since you're here and I'm here, I'll give it a try...dealers seem to be asking in the $16,000 range (high blue book) and wholesale is around $13K, so I'd guess somewhere in between there is where the action is, and where most of these cars will sell for in real money. Offer $13.5 - $14K if you're comfortable with that. This is not such a hot car that you have to grab at it, although the miles are good.
Thanks again for the info