2008 Toyota Matrix/F3R

drfill · March 2006

Toyota F3R Concept World Premier

DETROIT, Jan 9, 2006 -- The Toyota F3R, an exciting new concept vehicle that features unique interior seating, was shown today at the 2006 North American International Auto Show. With younger people hanging out in their cars, they almost become an extension of home. The Toyota design team came up with three very modern looking sets of seats. Each is unique. Up front, the driver's seat reclines and swivels, and the passenger seat reclines to form a comfortable chaise. In the middle, the right and center sections of the 40/20/40 seat fold into the floor and the left-hand seat reclines fully to form, with the third row, an avant-garde sofa.

Could the F3R be the next Toyota Matrix (2007-8)?

Mind you, I'd expect no chaise/sofa lounge seating would pass any safety regulations in the US, and more conventional seating would be implemented, but pivoting 2nd row seats, with a 2+2+2 set-up, could be in the works.

DrFill

toronado455 · September 2006

The F3R concept is wild!

What I would like to see is a Matrix replacement that is more along the lines of the 2006 Toyota Wish. Something that would compete with the Mazda5.

drfill · September 2006

If they build it, they will come!

Is this the xB replacement Scion has hinted at for Spring 2007? :confuse:

http://pressroom.toyota.com/Images?p=2&criteria=%2BF3Rconcept

:shades:

DrFill

toronado455 · September 2006

Is this the xB replacement Scion has hinted at for Spring 2007?

I seriously doubt it. The xB makes the F3R look like a stretch limo. It's clearly in a different class.

drfill · September 2006

Highlander and Matrix need replacements too!

DrFill

toronado455 · September 2006

Highlander and Matrix need replacements too!

Matrix needed a replacement from day one if you ask me.

kdhspyder · September 2006

Highlander soon...
Matrix in 2008 with the Corolla... as 2009 models

toronado455 · September 2006

Matrix in 2008 with the Corolla... as 2009 models

What do you know about '09 Matrix?

nippononly · February 2007

the next Matrix really WILL have the Camry's engine, as had been rumored...

http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070213/FREE/70212007/1528

Here's a link to a good write-up with lots of pics on the current (recently introduced) European Auris, said in the Autoweek article to be the twin of the Blade, now expected to be next year's replacement for Matrix:

http://www.channel4.com/4car/di/toyota/auris/5074/1

It's a very nice-looking vehicle, at least.

Fuel economy is bound to suffer if the new Matrix/Blade uses the Camry's 2.4L engine, just as fuel economy will suffer in the next-gen Highlander, and in the new Tundra (it aint that hot in the new 4-cylinder RAV4 either). Has Toyota suddenly forgotten to make fuel efficiency a design priority?

And then the Matrix name will die after just one generation? Or could they be wrong, and the Blade will be an additional model?

There has been much discussion in the '08 xB thread that it might have been nice to see the Corolla's 1.8L engine as the standard with the 2.4L as an option (the 2.4 is expected to be standard in that model). I wouldn't mind seeing that set-up (1.8 standard, 2.4 optional) for the new Blade as well.

With the way the greenhouse tapers towards the back in the current Matrix, with the consequent impact that already has on rear 3/4 visibility, I can't imagine how bad it will be if the Blade has "thicker C-pillars"...

la4mead · February 2007

This is good news since Toyota has been neglecting the Matrix by whittling down the options list, and seems to have been less than proactive about much needed Matrix design improvements.

The Blade is described as targeting Mazda 3, a worthy goal in my opinion. Compared to the Matrix, the 3 offers higher levels of performance, features, and equipment. Fuel consumption is higher in the 3, however the Camry 2.4 powertrain is capable, with the proper gearing and aerodynamics, of attaining respectable numbers, but not nearly the high numbers the Matrix was capable of with the smaller powerplant. For those looking downmarket or for a more frugal engine, they are offering the Scion xD. I know that's not a the same as what they used to offer, but at least they are offering more hatch/wagon choices than they have been.

I'm looking forward seeing what Toyota includes in the Blade. Will it have a cool moonroof? Auto up/down "one-touch" windows? "Privacy Glass"? An upscale interior? And of course, Toyota's flat-folding seats.

nippononly · February 2007

have an upscale interior in other countries, I am sure Toyota will significantly "dumb it down" for the American flock. For one thing, I imagine it will still have to fit in the line-up at a price point lower than the Camry's, and it can't have a much nicer interior for less money. Ditto feature content, although in this regard the newest vehicles always have the best features lists regardless of price, just because they are newest. I would expect a 1-touch-up driver's window, and was surprised to see that not included on all Camrys with the new car last year. Hondas have all had this feature for a while. I am sure there will be an available moonroof, but I doubt there will be privacy glass unless they have it re-classified as a "truck".

The way the market is going, I will bet it will have some of the options you occasionally see on Mazda3s now: HIDs and navigation. And perhaps a leather option, as this is not a Scion after all. And just as with Corolla, we will probably see standard ABS and maybe 6 standard airbags as well, with optional VSC more easy to find on dealer lots.

If they do mimic the Mazda3 more, it HAS to have 4-wheel discs, which make a world of difference now between the XR and XRS. Dare we hope for an independent rear suspension?

The question really becomes, how much can they cram in there and hold the base price to $18K or so? I really hope they continue to offer a manual transmission, although if they use the one straight out of the tC, geared for speed, fuel economy is going to really stink.

alpha01 · February 2007

....Toyota is readying a new family of 4 cylinder engines... does anyone know when they will get here? Motor Trend came out and said that the new family isn't ready for introduction in the new Highlander, but to expect to see the 4 cylinder Highlander return in the future... possibly displacing 2.5L or 2.8L. If anyone has more info on this engine family, I think we'd all really appreciate reading a bit more about....

~alpha

cklho818 · February 2007

Just a thought. Would Toyota batch the Blade as a Lexus with interior upgrades to compete in the luxury hatchback market? Like the Lexus RX330, it's the same SUV but was batched is actually a Toyota-Harrier in Japan and other Asia countries. :P
Follow this link: http://toyota.jp/harrier/index.html

We currently got the Audi A3 in the market for this segment. Mercedez tried with the C Class Sports coupe back a couple years but not quite successful.

There's also a rumor a 280-hp, hot-hatch version coming next year sporting with a 3.5L V6 w/ 8 spd auto. Could it be a new Lexus entry at ~$25 - $29K :confuse:
Follow this link: http://paultan.org/archives/2006/12/29/2007-toyota-blade-premium-jdm-toyota-auri- s/

porkchop07 · March 2007

Am I the only one who sees this new possibility for the matrix, ( the Auris or the Blade) as just a larger version of a North American Yaris hatchback?

toronado455 · May 2007

When will the new Matrix be coming out? Fall of '07 or not till next year? :confuse:

nippononly · May 2007

February or March of next year. And look for it to be altogether more sporty next time with, I fear, a substantial drop in fuel economy (have you SEEN the dismal FE rating for the new Scion xB? I am thinking something along those lines).

toronado455 · May 2007

February or March of 2008? Edmunds says Fall 2007. But you'd think we would know more about it by now if it were only 4-5 months away from release date. March 2008 sounds more likely. If so, will it still be considered a 2008 model?

I think it will get similar MPG to the new xB if it uses the same (Auris) platform. (Remember that those 2008 EPA ratings are lower now for all vehicles due to the change in method of calculation.)

nippononly · May 2007

I am pretty sure they will introduce it as a 2009 model.

They introduced the 2003 Corolla and Matrix in February 2002, when the first cars began to trickle into dealers. I bet they will do the same thing again next time.

jonpelu · May 2007

I was looking forward to the Matrix replacement since I have owned the first one for almost 5 years now. I bought one right when they became available in 2002. I am not encouraged by what I am seeing so far. I can understand that they want to compete with the hot selling Mazda 3, but I think that they do not need to copy that car. I think there is plenty of room to go their own route with this vehicle and still steal would-be buyers of the 3. I was really hoping I would see a hybrid all wheel drive XR version. I want the sport look but I also want all wheel drive handling and 40 mpg to boot! I am not impressed with the Auris or whatever the Matrix/Blade Euro version is called. It looks too much like the 3. They need a Matrix that is a little bigger than the first one and throw that synergy drive in there.

nippononly · May 2007

Better yet just make the next Matrix the Corolla Verso from Europe, and sell it here with the 2.2 diesel it gets there - it would be a little slow for our roads but not terribly so, and you could have AWD and 40 mpg easy!

http://www.channel4.com/4car/di/toyota/verso/1049/1

AND sell the Blade as well - why not? It's already been developed for other countries, all there would be is the cost of federalizing it.

jonpelu · May 2007

Thanks for that link on the Verso! I do not know how big that car is... like an SX4 or is it equivolent to what the Matrix is now? I would take the diesel over the hybrid anyways since it probably would cost less. If VW's can get around in a 1.8L diesel, I think we could handle a 2.2L. I could not agree with you more... Bring the Verso over and do the Blade as well. I think there is room in the the Scion/Toyota mix for both vehicles.

nippononly · May 2007

The Verso is approximately the same size as the Matrix is now (just slightly larger, in fact).

I would be intrigued if Toyota offered a 6- or 7-seat microvan to go up against the Mazda5, but I bet if they did it would be a Corolla variant, maybe the next Matrix! Call me crazy, but I think that vehicle with AWD and an available 50-state diesel would sell like hotcakes.

alpha01 · May 2007

Dismal rating of the xB? Seriously? 50% power gain with a 15% drop in real MPG seems like a fair trade to me.

~alpha

eldaino · May 2007

the 3 is DEFINTELY the car to copy; imagine a toyota hatch with just as good handling, so so fuel economy and a great sporting nature? Sounds good to me! I liked the xb concept at the beggining of this thread...little did we know it WOULD be the xb, just trimmed down!

nippononly · May 2007

I'm glad it seems that way to you. :-)

alpha01 · May 2007

It'll probably seem that way to the bean-counters, too.

vcarreras · May 2007

Toyota already has one, it's called the WISH!

http://toyota.jp/wish/

The next generation WISH should soon be out in Japan and hopefully we will get it. Rumor has it Honda may bring the Stream here and call it Latitude.

http://paultan.org/archives/2006/06/18/2007-honda-stream-photos/

Both could be powered by the 2.2l diesel which both Toyota and Honda have in Europe..

nippononly · May 2007

Hmm, I'm thinking if 50% more power and 15% LESS fuel economy was achievable, maybe 10% more power and 10% BETTER fuel economy was too. I would have preferred that. ;-)

And what's with the 25% weight gain? Is there ANY automaker out there trying to keep the pork off? :sick:

toronado455 · May 2007

These Stream/Latitude rumors have been floating around for a while now. Honda seems to be satisfied with offering the Fit at the low end and the CR-V and nothing in between unless you want a trunk.

The WISH is awesome and I "wish" Toyota would sell that in the states.

If the Matrix ends up being the Verso, I think that would be cool. It has more Pontiac Vibe-like styling - which I prefer over the Matrix styling. Though from the spy shots, it looks like it will have more Matrix-like styling.

vcarreras · May 2007

I'm frustrated also waiting for Honda and Toyota to bring the Stream or WISH. In the meantime I own what you mention above, a 2007 Honda FIT Sport and a 2007 Honda CR-V EX-L. Have had the FIT since 4/06 and now has 10,600 trouble free miles and a blast to drive. Gives me 32-34 mpg around town and up to 41.7 mpg on the road. The CR-V is just three weeks old.

val61sf · June 2007

Hi there! Since you've had your Matrix for so long, I thought I'd ask you a question. I've been planning to purchase a Matrix for the past year, to replace my Echo. I'm just waiting for the right moment in my budget. Recently, I read several threads dealing with the Matrix and an apparent problem with the alignment? Tires wearing out quick and problems on the road. It sounded like a major problem that wasn't being fixed. Have you had this problem?

ever12 · August 2007

New spy pics of the pontiac vibe are out (and pics of the dual vvti motor inside). It gives some insight to what the new Matrix will look like:

http://forums.genvibe.com/zerothread?id=29557

It looks similar to spy pics found of the Matrix:

nippononly · August 2007

To look at those pics, not much is changing. Looks like it will have the new dual VVT-i 1.8 from the next-gen Corolla? In which case, the power will still be around 140 hp or less, with 130 tq or so. Which is surprisingly low - I thought for sure they would put a larger engine in it for the next time around.

eldaino · August 2007

i think they will, and i don't think the new matrix will be this, it will more than likely be what the blade looks like. (prob with the same name as well.)

mackabee · August 2007

Looks like the current Vibe. Profile view.
Mackabee

bobw3 · September 2007

Just curious...what does the CR-V give you over the Fit...just the fact that it's a little bigger inside?

val61sf · September 2007

I posted this back in June and have not had any replies - thought I'd try again. Hi there! Since you've had your Matrix for so long, I thought I'd ask you a question. I've been planning to purchase a Matrix for the past year, to replace my Echo. I'm just waiting for the right moment in my budget. Recently, I read several threads dealing with the Matrix and an apparent problem with the alignment? Tires wearing out quick and problems on the road. It sounded like a major problem that wasn't being fixed. Have you had this problem?

Kirstie_H · September 2007

Hi - the issue is that you're posting your question in a discussion about an upcoming redesigned Matrix. You'll want to go to the plain old Toyota Matrix discussion to get feedback from current owners.

mackabee · September 2007

All you need to do is correct the alignment.
Mackabee

val61sf · September 2007

From what I read - the alignment couldn't be fixed. And, they shouldn't go out of alignment all the time. To the other person - actually, when I began reading this forum it was addressing the 2008 Matrix which was originally being touted as the year they would have a re-designed version.

ever12 · September 2007

http://i9.tinypic.com/626xy6p.jpg
http://i16.tinypic.com/6c7c6q1.jpg

Seeing how the spied photos of the Vibe closly reflect the body style of the Blade, I wouldn't be surprised if our Matrix will be very similar to the Blade/Auris.

mackabee · September 2007

That particular car must have had front end damage if the alignment can't be corrected.
Mack

nippononly · October 2007

http://www.autoblog.com/2007/10/31/sema-2007-2009-toyota-matrix-unveiled/

in all its "glory". Talk about underwhelming. Too bad the XRS is no longer a true sport model (has less hp than the last XRS despite coming along years later, and only comes with an automatic. Blecch).

And the base model still has wind-down windows? Come on. Will they reduce the sticker price to compensate for this? The automatic in the base model is still a 4-speed. Toyota is becoming the GM of the automatic world. What's next for new Toyotas, pushrod engines?

Looks are nicer, that's about all I can commend them on.

What is the status of the Blade? Someone mentioned that on another board. Will it be the second coming of the '06 Matrix XRS the way the '09 Matrix XRS is not?

Edit: looks like Toyota's own press release leaves the question open of a possible 2.4L/5-speed manual combo. That combination is available with the Corolla sedan. That's something anyway, if it ends up offering a manual with the 2.4L, although it will still be less powerful (and heavier) than the '06 XRS that left us last year...

mackabee · November 2007

Hung up on horsepower eh? The 2.4L has more torque than the 1.8 170 or 180 horsepower that was in the XRS and Celica GT-S ever did. And you should know by now that torque is what matters during dead stop acceleration, horsepower is what keeps you there.
Mack

nippononly · November 2007

Well, with the XRS they have gone from a motor that was too peaky to one that doesn't peak at all. I was kind of hoping for something in between.

nippononly · November 2007

the '09 in person yesterday at the auto show. It was behind the ropes, no getting inside was allowed. It has a nice look, looks smaller somehow, maybe a little sleeker. Not much seems to have changed on the inside, as far as I could tell looking in through the windows. Same hard plastic in the usual places, same stylish look to the dash. The IP looks more Scion-esque than the current model's. At least it will still have a temp gauge on the dash. So many new cars now do not.

2008 Toyota Matrix/F3R

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