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Porsche 911 Lease Questions

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  • Ryan561Ryan561 Member Posts: 3
    I have found a dealer that is offering me 10% off a ordered base 911. I am not sure that the rates and residuals will be when the car comes in, but if I was to get the car today the dealer quoted:

    Here are the preliminary numbers for the 2009 Porsche Carrera. The payments were worked up with $5,000.00 total down. The payment is about $991.00 (including tax and tags) for a 39 month lease. This payment is assuming the credit is excellent and $5,000.00 due at signing.

    what do you guys think?
  • bneidermanbneiderman Member Posts: 1
    Hey guys,

    New to the forums and want to know if I would be getting a good deal. Don't know much about leases and off hand don't know the money factor and residual. However, I have excellent credit. Went to the dealer the other day and they have an 08' Turbo cabriolet with a sticker of $147,000 they said they would take $20,000 off the sticker and a 36 month lease with 15k miles would run around $2100 per month but they thought they could get it to around $2000. This would include taxes and everything. Is this a good deal? Any help would be greatly appreciated.
  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Hi bneiderman. $20,000 is a substantial discount on this car, it's probably right around dealer invoice, but I personally would not be surprised if you could do even better than that. Sales at Porsche dealers has completely fallen off of a cliff. They are desperate for business. Combine this with the fact that the 2009 911 is an all-new, significantly improved car and dealers will be even more desperate to get their leftover models off of their lots. Aim for the moon, shoot for a huge discount and see what happens, you might be surprised.

    As far as leasing goes, it is very important to understand exactly how it works so that you don't get taken advantage of by dealers. You definitely should check out the following informative articles that are available here at Edmunds.com prior to visiting any dealers: 10 Steps to Leasing a New Car and Calculate Your Own Lease Payment.

    Porsche's current buy rate lease money factor and residual value for a 36 month lease of a 2008 911 Turbo Cab with 15,000 miles per year are .00290 and 51%. Make sure that the dealer does not charge you a higher money factor than this.

    Car_man
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  • bwedotnetbwedotnet Member Posts: 48
    Never put any money down on a lease. If the car is wrecked you do not get this money back. I know there is a psychological benefit to having the lower payment but there are no real advantages of putting money down on a lease - just pay the drive off fees.
  • al_93al_93 Member Posts: 2
    Does anyone know the residuals and money factor at the present time? I would assume that it continues to tilt to the buyers favor (especially in the case of leftover "08's). What kind of deals are you guys getting on 08 Carrera's and CS's?
  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Hi Al. Porsche introduced some amazing incentives on the 2009 911 in mid-February. This is the first time that I ever remember it offering cash and special lease money factors on this model. It just goes to show how tough times are right now.

    Having said this, Porsche's February lease program was only scheduled to run through March 2nd. It will likely introduce its new March lease program at some point over the next day or two. Please feel free to check back with me and I will gladly provide you with an update.

    Car_man
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  • madmaxz06madmaxz06 Member Posts: 3
    HI Car_man,
    Thank you for the EXCELLENT info. I'm also interested in a new 911 (2009 or left-over 2008). Can you please tell me what Porsche's March lease/buy programs are (complete with money factors and residuals for a 10,000 mile 36 month lease).
    THANK YOU so very much,
    - Max
  • chanderchander Member Posts: 21
    Any advise between leasing a left over 08 C4S vs a 09 base Carrera , which will make a better choice in the North East?.
    Thanx
  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    You're very welcome, Max. I'm glad that you find it so helpful. Porsche is actually running a special lease program on the 911 right now for the first time ever (at least that I am aware of). Porsche is providing its dealers with a certain number of certificates that enable them to lease 911s through Porsche Finance using a special money factor of .00146. These certificates entitle lessees to dealer cash in addition to this special money factor, anywhere from $1,000 to $3,500.

    The 911's residual values and exact cash allowances vary by trim level. If you let me know exactly what car you are interested in I can tell you what they are.

    Car_man
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  • madmanmoomadmanmoo Member Posts: 2,039
    Porsche is providing its dealers with a certain number of certificates that enable them to lease 911s through Porsche Finance using a special money factor of .00146.

    This is important to note. Porsche is running these on a first come / first serve basis. When the certificates are gone, so are the deals. That means act sooner than later. Each dealer only has a limited amount of certificates as well. There isn't a huge pot that everyone takes from. Each dealer has a set amount and once they are gone, that's it.
  • madmaxz06madmaxz06 Member Posts: 3
    Thanks Car_man,
    I'd love to take you up on the offer of providing residual values and cash allowance details!!! I'm looking either a:
    2009 911 Turbo MSRP = $136,000
    or
    2009 911 Carrera S MSRP = $97,000
    Again, thank you very much for the information, it's EXTREMELY helpful,
    - Max
  • phil0sophyphil0sophy Member Posts: 6
    Hi Car Man, would you also please post the residuals for a 2009 C4 cabriolet and a C2s cabriolet? I'm negotiating with a dealer now and while they are offering quite a bit off MSRP (9,000) they are using a MF of .00170. I'd like to calculate what the deal would look like with a rate of .00146 as discussed above.
    Thanks,
    Shawn
  • glbmwglbmw Member Posts: 4
    I am getting conflicting info from different dealerships on c2 and c2s
    MF is .00146 by Porsche Financial
    the residual 10K 61% 12 k 58% or is it 12 k 56% for both cars.
    ALSO what is the cash back for the dealer? on c2 v. c2s and c4scab?
    One more question... how much discount should I get. They are quoting 7k below MSRP--- on c2 90K msrp and 6K below MSRP on c2 83K.
    Just pricing them out before going in for the final negotiations.
  • phil0sophyphil0sophy Member Posts: 6
    Hi, I pulled the trigger on a C4 cabriolet on Saturday and thought I'd share a few details with you. My MF was slightly above .00146 but the dealer discounted the car nearly $12,000. I strongly urge you to push them for a much more aggressive discount and shop around. After 2 - 3 weeks of shopping around, I had discount offers of $10-11k from all 3 dealers I contacted.
    Good luck,
    Shawn
  • glbmwglbmw Member Posts: 4
    Congrats Shawn
    Would you mind sharing your msrp? I am wondering how close you got to invoice and how much cash back the dealer was getting.
    g
  • glbmwglbmw Member Posts: 4
    Car man
    Any update on residuals and exact cash allowances for c2, c2s and c4, I am looking at 10 k for 36 months for the above 3 trims.
    Thanks
    G
  • bosco42bosco42 Member Posts: 20
    I am looking to obtain a 2009 C2S Tip or C4S Tip.......does anybody have a recommendation for who would be the most aggressive in their pricing in the NY/LI area ? Thanks for your help.
  • bosco42bosco42 Member Posts: 20
    I am looking to lease an 09 C4S with 10K per year and would like to know the residual for calculating the lease price. (and to back into figuring what they are selling it to me for) . The car lists for $110,000 and I am getting a lease figure of $1400 including tax and no money down other than drive offs. Is this a good deal ? Thanks
  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    No problem, Max. Porsche's current buy rate lease money factor for all 2009 911s is .00146, if you can find a dealer that has a certificate to use. Porsche is providing a $3,500 cash incentive on the 2009 911 Turbo and $2,000 on the 2009 911 Carerra S.

    These cars' residual values vary by term and mileage allowance. You never mentioned what either of these variables are, so for now I will assume that you are interested in a 36 month lease with 12,000 miles per year. Let me know if you want something different. Porsche's current residual value for these terms is 51% for the 2009 911 Turbo Coupe and 55% for the 911 Carerra S.

    Car_man
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  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Hi Shawn. Dealers that have certificates available can provide you with a money factor of .00146 on both of these cars. Porsche's current 36 month, 12,000 mile per year residual value for an '09 911 C4 Cabriolet is 53%. The resid for an otherwise identical 36 month lease of an '09 911 C2 Cabriolet is 55%.

    Car_man
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  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Hi glbmw. Dealers that have certificates available can offer the following terms. Porsche's current buy rate lease money factor and residual value for a 36 month lease of a 2009 911 C2 Coupe with 10,000 miles per year are .00146 and 58%, respectively. The numbers for an otherwise identical lease of an '09 911 C2 Coupe S are .00146 and 56%. The numbers for an '09 911 C4 Coupe are .00146 and 56%.

    As far as cash allowances go, there is $1,000 on the '09 911 C2 Coupe, $2,000 on the C2 Coupe S, and $2,250 on the C4 Coupe.

    Car_man
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  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Hi bosco42. Dealers that still have certificates can offer the following terms. Porsche Credit's current buy rate lease money factor and residual value for a 36 month lease of a 2009 911 C4 S Coupe with 10,000 miles per year are .00146 and 54%, respectively. Porsche is providing a cash incentive of $2,250 on this car right now.

    It would be easier for me to tell if you are getting a good deal on this car if you were able to provide me with its selling price. The selling prices of leased vehicles are negotiable, just as if you were paying cash for or financing it. I personally would never lease a car that I didn't know the selling price of. Doing so is sort of like financing one without knowing what the dealer is charging you. Let us know what this car's selling price is and I'm sure that either myself or another knowledgeable community member will tell you what they think.

    Car_man
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  • bosco42bosco42 Member Posts: 20
    For April (and possibly longer) all 2009's are eligible for the Porsche program........no longer restricted by a limited number of certificates
  • bosco42bosco42 Member Posts: 20
    Going with a C2S instead of C4S
    MSRP- $102,460
    Selling Price- $92,150

    So if the money factor is .00146 and the residual is 56% for 10K/yr, then is a lease price of $1292 which includes my taxes (8.625%) a good lease price ?? He claims he is selling it to me at about invoice for calculating the lease.

    Dealer denies there is any "cash incentive" and says he is relying on the "holdback" money.

    Thanks
  • madmanmoomadmanmoo Member Posts: 2,039
    No cashback on a lease. You are getting an aggressive rate which is bought down.
  • bosco42bosco42 Member Posts: 20
    "You are getting an aggressive rate which is bought down."

    What do you mean by this ? Dont quite understand what being bought down means...thanks
  • madmanmoomadmanmoo Member Posts: 2,039
    3.9% is a special rate which is bought down from the real market rate. Instead of using cash back directly, Porsche applies it to your rate.

    For example, there is no such thing as free money (0%), the manufacturer is using incentive cash to buy down the rate to that level.

    Make sense?
  • bosco42bosco42 Member Posts: 20
    So if there is no cash incentive (cash back to dealer) and the dealer is selling it to me at invoice where is he making money ??.....getting it from holdback money ?

    In previous posts here it was stated that there were cash incentives to the dealer...was this an incorrect statement. it is important to know so I know how to negotiate my deal....thanks
  • madmanmoomadmanmoo Member Posts: 2,039
    In previous posts here it was stated that there were cash incentives to the dealer...was this an incorrect statement.

    No, there are cash incentives which only apply to cash purchases. Lease and finance incentives are in the form of a special rate.

    I'm not sure why it matters how they are making their money. If you like the deal and they are willing to sell it to you for that amount, do business. Don't worry about where their profit is coming from.
  • bosco42bosco42 Member Posts: 20
    I am not worried about where their profit is coming from..just trying to understand the system which then allows me to understand how to negotiate better....thanks for all your explanations..I appreciate it your time
  • bosco42bosco42 Member Posts: 20
    Car Man......from the dealers I have spoken with the residual numbers differ from what you have posted.....are you sure yours are accurate ??
  • noahsdadnoahsdad Member Posts: 31
    i have checked with dealers...they seem to accurate. many dealers are trying to pad the .00146 buy rate, so beware
  • bosco42bosco42 Member Posts: 20
    Is there an official online source that quotes the residuals

    I was told by 2 dealers that the residual was 55% on an 09 C2S coupe with 10K per year

    "Hi glbmw. Dealers that have certificates available can offer the following terms. Porsche's current buy rate lease money factor and residual value for a 36 month lease of a 2009 911 C2 Coupe with 10,000 miles per year are .00146 and 58%, respectively. The numbers for an otherwise identical lease of an '09 911 C2 Coupe S are .00146 and 56%. The numbers for an '09 911 C4 Coupe are .00146 and 56%."
  • mghboltmghbolt Member Posts: 1
    Hello Car Man:

    Would greatly apprecieate advice on negotiating a lease on a basic '09 Carrera coupe manual (MSRP range 79,450-82,000). I live in California and the state tax is ~9.25%

    1) It seems that from the forum that the best Money Factor is .00146 on a 3 year lease, does that hold true for 15K miles/year lease as well?

    2) I've heard that this special low rease rate will run through the end of May'09 and it will change for June, either up or down

    3) What is the residual percentage for a 3 year 15 K miles/year lease, and through the same source, I heard the residual percentage may go down for the worse after May, any truth in that

    4) How much off MSRP can I realistically get in this economy, is 15% too much for an '09 Carrera Coupe basic model, or is 10% more realistic, one dealership gave 8% off MSRP without too much haggling

    5) I won't need the car till later in the summer, but do you think its worth putting a deposit by the end of May (capitalize on the low money factor), and have the dealership let me pick up the car end of June which would be the start of the lease. Will a dealership let me do that and have the car sit on their lot for a month before triggerring the lease just with a deposit?

    Greatly appreciate all your advice.

    -MGHBolt
  • mk2001mk2001 Member Posts: 2
    Hi Car man,

    I looking at a 2009 Targa 4s and appreciate your guidance on uterms to expect on this model. I understand you mentioned the current buy rate for leases on 911s is 0.00146. I assume this also applies to the Targa, but appreciate if you could confirm. Could you also advise what the residual percentages are on a 36 and 48 mos. lease for this car based on 10/12K miles? Need also your input on discounts to MSRP and other incentives to reasonably expect on this model. Thanks for all the help.

    Regards,

    MK-
  • vexedvexed Member Posts: 14
    Any new information?
    Specifically, are there any current incentives to dealers for a purchase of a C2 or a C2S?

    Thanks
  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Thanks for the info, bosco42. I had heard that the program was wide open to all current Porsche owners and lessees...but I didn't know that there was no restrictions upon it at all.

    Car_man
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  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Hey bosco42. I'm pretty sure that the residuals that I have posted previously are correct. If you'd like, let me know what car, term, mileage allowance you're interested in again and I'll make some calls to double check.

    Car_man
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  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Ahhhh, I see that you did just that bosco42. To the best of my knowledge, the 56% residual value that I mentioned is correct. I don't see why dealers would quote you anything different since they don't have the ability to alter banks' published residual values.

    Unfortunately, I am not aware of a resource that provides accurate information on banks' current lease programs to the general public.

    Car_man
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  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Hi MGHBolt.

    The mileage allowance that you choose will not have any impact upon your car's money factor.

    Porsche's current lease program is scheduled to run through June 1st. It is difficult to say what its June program will be like at this point.

    Porsche Credit's current 36 month, 15,000 mile per year residual value for a 36 month lease of a 2009 911 C2 Coupe with a manual transmission is 55%.

    I am not personally familiar with what sort of selling prices consumers have been able to negotiate on this car lately, but you might be able to get an idea by stopping by the "Porsche 911 Carrera Prices Paid and Buying Experience" discussion.

    I don't believe that you will be able to lock in Porsche's current lease program by putting a deposit down on the car that you want in May. Usually, the program that is available on the delivery date is the one that has to be used to calculate your monthly payment.

    Car_man
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  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Hey mk2001. Yes, the aforementioned .00146 money factor would apply to all 2009 911s. Porsche's current 36 month, 12,000 mile per year residual value for the 2009 911 Targa C4 S with a manual transmission is 51%. The residual value for an otherwise identical 48 month lease is 45%. If you were to lease with only 10,000 miles per year, this car's residuals would be 1% higher.

    For feedback on this car's pricing, try stopping by the "Porsche 911 Carrera Prices Paid and Buying Experience" discussion.

    Car_man
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  • mk2001mk2001 Member Posts: 2
    Thanks a lot, Car man. Can you confirm what the residual is for the PDK on a 36mos. and 48 mos. (12K miles)? Just want to confirm difference. Also, any guidance on a realistic discount to expect on this model from MSRP? I realize that Targas aren't moving in the current market but appreciate any insight on realistic expectations in light of the standard invoice/margin on this car.
  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    No problem mk2001. The residual values for the aforementioned vehicle are 1% lower on models that are equipped with PDK.

    Unfortunately, I am not personally all that familiar with what the market is like for 911s right now.

    Car_man
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  • blackberryxyzblackberryxyz Member Posts: 8
    My local Porsche dealer in Marin County Ca, just north of the Golden Gate Bridge is advertising a brand new 2009 911 C4 manual coupe, msrp of $86,870.00 for a 36 month lease of $980.57 plus tax and $5,500.00 down.

    Seems like a good deal if you are tempted to acquire a 911.

    Unfortunately for Porsche it seems most people, including probably myself, are concluding that their current car they own now is just fine for a while. In my case it is a BMW 745i, so the 911 deal while very tempting to me, may just fall into the "possibly want", definitely "don't need" category.
    Either the price has to get even better (which it very well may) or I have to get more passionate about buying another 911.
  • investor27investor27 Member Posts: 59
    If that was a 911 C4 S or a 911 C2 S, then it would be a good deal. But not on a standard 911.
  • autojack11autojack11 Member Posts: 39
    What are the residuals on a 2009 Turbo cab? 10, 12 and 15,000 miles? Are any additional incentives being offered now?
  • porschecrazyporschecrazy Member Posts: 6
    First time Porsche buyer here, Interested in getting a 2009 911 coupe. I found this lease deal on http://www.porsche.com/usa/911leaseoffer/ and its seems to be a pretty good one. Its 825$ ( 900$ tax included ). Will it go down further?
  • skimmachiskimmachi Member Posts: 3
    I'm looking at a C2 fairly loaded MSRP $90325. I would like some information on leasing. 12K for 3 years. Any change in money factor or residual since the last posting. Do you think that the market now could handle a 10% or higher off MSRP
    I live in Los Angeles area and you guys know the market here. Thanks.
  • cardiohexcardiohex Member Posts: 9
    Looks like a large cap reduction ~5500 drive off making the lease payment more palatable.
    I just took delivery on a 09 C2. 3500 cap reduction, lease payment 1059 (total) for 36 mo @10k miles a year. MSRP was 88k, sale price 80k. Felt like I got an okay deal... did get exactly what I wanted with options/color. They did a search and found 7 911s close to what I wanted in the southeast.

    09 C2 manual /arctic silver
    black adaptive sport seats (AWESOME option)- heated
    sport chrono, 19" CS wheels
    bluetooth/ipod/bose high end/satellite radio

    Definitely look at how much you are spending over the life of lease (cap+payments)... easy to get excited about 825/mo, but read the fine print.
    Good luck!
  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Hi autojack11. Porsche is providing a special lease money factor of .00146 through its captive finance company on all 2009 models right now. Make sure that the dealer uses that money factor to calculate your car's monthly payment. As far as its residual values go, Porsche Financial Services' resid for a 36 month lease of a 2009 911 Turbo Cab with 15,000 miles per year is 47%. PFS' 12,000 mile per year residual value is 2% higher than its 15k resid and its 10,000 mile per year residual is 3% higher than the 15k.

    Porsche has come dealer cash incentives floating around out there, but none that I am aware of that are available on leases.

    Car_man
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