Edmunds dealer partner, Bayway Leasing, is now offering transparent lease deals via these forums. Click here to see the latest vehicles!

Mainstream Large Sedans Comparison

15253555758134

Comments

  • batistabatista Member Posts: 159
    The 3.5 makes 263 hp at 6,250 rpm and 249 lb-ft of torque at 4,500 rpm, which is an additional 42 hp and 44 lb-ft of torque. It delivers those increased numbers smoothly, but accompanied by a far too noticeable and decidedly drone-y, flat and unrefined sound.

    Here is the link:

    http://en.autos.sympatico.msn.ca/guides_and_advice/article.aspx?cp-documentid=51- 15239&dub-gallery-photo-number=&dub-gallery-page-number=2
  • dzier217dzier217 Member Posts: 4
    I just test drove the Azera, Avalon, Camry, Altima, Maxima, Fusion, Taurus, Lucerne and Imapala the past week or so. I am not a fan of Nissan's style, but the Altima's interior is much improved. The Impala assembly quality, especially fit and finish in the interior, was not good on the SS I drove, and the car had squeeks and rattles. SHockingly, the Camry had the same problem, but notquite as bad. I was shocked to see the misaligned panels. I am astounded at how much cheap plastic is in all of these cars, but the impala seemed to be the worst at that too. They all get some minus points for cheap plastics on various pieces or consol, dash pieces, etc. I guess you just don't touch.

    I was suprised by the Azaera and Taurus because, although I was not expecting much, they were a suprise because of how good they were. I drove the Taurus AWD after the Avalon, and was most suprised that the Avalon was not the slam dunk I thought it was going to be. I was stunned at how quiet the Taurus was,and how the engine noise is virtually absent, and is well hushed at speed. I was also suprised the assembly quality and fit and finish was good in the Taurus and Azera, and the other products from Toyota no longer outclass others as they have in the past. The Azera looked and felt like a toyota product, and Ford's interior assembly look similar to VW (on the austere side).

    I was also pleasantly suprised at the visibility and seating positions in the Taurus. I will admit the Taurus looks are more stark with the grill, but also a little more sedate - or boring - than the others since it is so boxy. I guess that is the ford edge style.

    The Buick Lucerne stood out as a V8, but the visibility in the car is not great. The car interior is small compared to the exterior dimenesions, especially when compared to Taurus and Avalon. I am not sure how that happens.

    I have not yet made up my mind, but everyone has an opinion. I have not had a ford or American car since the 1970's (car at 16 was a pinto), but this new Taurus refinement got my attention.
  • mikewellsesqmikewellsesq Member Posts: 29
    Ford has made a lot of progress on quality from everything that I have heard. I think your comments on the Taurus are on the mark, it does seem to me to echo the VW style of design, a bit stark but clean. Many have commented on the generous dimensions of the interior.

    May I suggest that you also test drive the 2007 Kia Amanti? I know no one has really talked about it in this thread for a while, but I have owned one for a month and am extremely impressed and pleased with the car. I think you will find the quality of the interior very Toyota/Lexus-like, and it is quite spacious, especially the back seat area and trunk. Kia has taken care to make the inside of the car very quiet and squeak-free. Fit and finish is of very fine quality. I like its exterior looks, they grow on you, but some may find the design "unique"! The handling and engine power are very good, much better than the first generation of the Amanti. It uses the same 3.8 engine as the Azera. I had tried out the Azera, but found the ride on the Amanti more to my liking. I felt that the Azera rode a bit "twitchy" - but this is purely a subjective opinion. I find the Amanti a pleasure to drive, and my wife loves the car. You are wise to try out as many of these cars as you can before making a decision.
  • ronsmith38ronsmith38 Member Posts: 228
  • scottlscottl Member Posts: 109
    So, the 2008 Taurus mileage is better than the Azera....

    And, the Taurus is less expensive than the Azera.

    Another plus is the availability of AWD, which has also been completely re-engineered from the old 500, although I never read anyone complaining about the 500's AWD system which was Haldex. The new AWD is lifted from the Edge.

    The Taurus gets the highest score on all of the NHTSA crash ratings. The Azera does not.

    I really don't know what more Ford can do, spec-wise. If the reliability of the car is halfway decent, and it still doesn't sell, maybe Ford is in bigger trouble than I thought.
  • tjc78tjc78 Member Posts: 15,856
    "maybe Ford is in bigger trouble than I thought"

    The Taurus will not "save" Ford. Midsize sedans are where the volume is and although Ford is doing well with the Fusion/Milan it isn't up to the competition and until it is Ford will continue to lag behind in sedan sales.

    BTW, the Taurus I saw on a lot a few weeks ago was 34K. Granted it was fully loaded, but, that # is easily Avalon/Lucerne territory. Take away the AWD and Nav and you are right at Azera pricing.

    2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Ram 1500 Bighorn, Built to Serve

  • 101649101649 Member Posts: 192
    Ford is on the ropes...Focus isn't even up to the Mazda 3 standard. V-6 Fusion is very weak..Who wants to spend a min of $48k (base) for a hopped up Mustang?? Taurus nameplate won't attract enough needed attention to make the sedan a real hit...Lincoln MKZ is in search of an identity. Town Car is a dinosaur..Ford SUV's and trucks are all but "give-aways."
  • robbiegrobbieg Member Posts: 346
    FYI - According to a Hyundai salesman, a lot of Azera buyers are former Cadillac owners.
  • 101649101649 Member Posts: 192
    Might be true, but consider your source....Quite a few Huyndai salespersons aren't even up to speed on their own products..Also, it depends upon what "a lot" means...Auto Week used to post either weekly or monthly the total sales of all the major manufacturers....I haven't seen an issue in some time, so it would be interesting to see the rankings....given, they don't break it down per model.....I'm sure that someone reading this has access to the individual makes and models sold monthly or can pervide a link....
  • allmet33allmet33 Member Posts: 3,557
    Yeah...the SS is great (depending on what you're looking for), but the argument we had earlier pertaining to that is that you had to get a V-8 to contend with the power output of the foreign V-6's...same applies to the 300/Charger twins and the Buick Lucerne. Without the upgrade to V-8, the V-6 models fall a bit short in power.
  • allmet33allmet33 Member Posts: 3,557
    Now go test drive an Azera and tell us what you think. ;)
  • allmet33allmet33 Member Posts: 3,557
    Not sure how you figure the Taurus is less expensive than the Azera. If you go and price a fully loaded Taurus and a fully loaded Azera...I can almost guarantee you that the Azera will come in less than the Taurus.

    Right now, the biggest advantage that the Taurus offers is AWD, a larger trunk and a very cavernous cabin.

    However, even if you use Edmunds as a guide, the starting MSRP price for the Taurus starts out higher than the Azera...that's without options.

    Nice try though. ;)
  • martin22martin22 Member Posts: 53
    Actually, it's not so much outright power I'm interested in - it's low end 'grunt',i.e. gobs of low end torque, that I like.

    In England, I owned a couple of Jaguars (XK120 and 3.4 MkII), each with the magnificent XK engine. That was another engine with great low end torque even though it was a straight 6 and only about 200hp.

    I'm not one to go screaming around, red lining the tacho - I leave that to the youngsters. I like 'long legged' cars like the SS that can cruise at 70 mph at less than 2000 rpm. As a bonus, the SS brings to the table a much more controlled ride than its lesser brethren - probably as a result of a thicker anti-roll bar and maybe several other factors. I rented a 3.9 LT once and it wallowed a lot - the SS does not do that.
  • dborthdborth Member Posts: 474
    "Quite a few Huyndai salespersons aren't even up to speed on their own products."

    So true. Most of these guys can't remember what they had for dinner last night. What lights their fire is conning the buyer to return the factory questionaire for them to fill out in order to get their "spiff".

    Bad news for a foreign factory contemplating an upgraded sedan over Azera.
  • scottlscottl Member Posts: 109
    What are you talking about? Right here on Edmunds, the 2008 Taurus starts at 23245. The 2007 Azera starts at 24,235. With the weakness in the dollar, you can bet the 2008 prices will be higher for the Azera (The Sonata is the only '08 Hyundai listed, and it is $500 higher). A 'fully loaded' Taurus is AWD. Compare FWD to FWD.
  • scbobscbob Member Posts: 167
    Sept 2007 Motor Trend 2008 car reviews: Taurus-3 stars; Azera-3.5 stars. MT gives little consideration to reliability in its reviews, but Consumer Reports does. April 2007 Car Review issue: 500-better than average; Azera-much better than average.
    As for costs, it is hard to say. I have things on my Azera as standard that were options on Lexus. Owner satisfaction on the 500 was average, compared to much above average on the Azera.
    Personally I don't care for the grill on the Taurus (reminds me of my razor). Also, the bright work around the fog lights looks like an attempt to cover a hole. Reminds of what they did in the 60's and 70's to "refresh cars by tacking parts on. But that's me.
    Compare everything and decide what is right for you. :):)
  • smithedsmithed Member Posts: 444
    Gosh, my HEMI has plenty of low end grunt. :shades:
    And will cruise at 70 MPH at less than 2000 RPM, running on 4 of the 8 cylinders.

    "Grunt" takes displacement. That's what gets things movin'
    :)
  • alexstorealexstore Member Posts: 264
    and what's the name of that option that is optional on lexus?
    Is this a superior 3.5 engine producing 272-300 HP or heated and cooled seats or a reliable vehicle , which has no need of long warranty to prove its reliability?
  • cobrazeracobrazera Member Posts: 352
    Azera Limited with Ultimate, and Taurus Limited FWD with Stability Control, homelink, moonroof, etc. ( to bring the equipment on par ) both list for a few bucks under $30K. Taurus has adjustable pedals and rear sonar, but doesn't have power tilt ( and woodgrain ) steering wheel tied to seat memory - I'd call it a wash... similar power and economy, too.
    The Hyundai warranty trumps the Ford, but who knows about long term reliability.
    It's nice to have a choice, isn't it?
  • captain2captain2 Member Posts: 3,971
    The Hyundai warranty trumps the Ford, but who knows about long term reliability
    The warranty difference should not be construed to make any implications about reliability (or quality). The Hyundai warranty after all is only on powertrain components and within the 7 year/100k term should largely be inconsequential for any car in this group. Bottom line, I think, is that Hyundai HAS to offer that warranty to sell their cars and Ford doesn't simply because it can't afford to. Wouldn't surprise me however to see Ford 'bite the bullet' however now that Chrysler has upped the ante along with GM already on the bandwagon.
    OTH the Azera has been showing a very good record over the short term despite an all new engine/tranny. A truly 'clean sheet' new design and an impressive effort. Remember though that the Sonata started out life with a whole bunch of 'initial quality' awards and favorable reliability stats, but in time has been showing its 'roots'. Think that it is still a little earlier to declare the Azera a 'triumph' from a reliability persepctive.
    The Ford 3.5 doesn't seem to be the truly 'new' engine it was purported to be (surprise, surprise), so therefore, be less likely to experience too many teething problems and most of the other components have been 'tested' already in the 500.
    Only a guess, of course, and although I would likely favor the Azera personally because of a smoother and quieter powertrain, I would bet a marginal long term reliability edge to the Ford - if you don't include those AWD models.
  • tjc78tjc78 Member Posts: 15,856
    I think it is a tough call between the Azera and the Taurus. Both cars offer a lot and are reasonably priced. If I was buying now it may come down to which one I get a better deal on. For some the warranty would sell the Azera and for others the availability of AWD would sell the Taurus. Ford's next step to making the Taurus a super solid competitor is taking the 3.5 to the next level and reducing the NVH. Sounds like the 3.5 was another "rush job" by Ford.

    2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Ram 1500 Bighorn, Built to Serve

  • celica8celica8 Member Posts: 42
    We have a Lucerne CXS with the chrome package and it gets a ton of compliments. Also the v-8 makes highway cruising a dream. Big trunk, too. Not a single problem with it since we got it more than a year ago.
  • captain2captain2 Member Posts: 3,971
    Sounds like the 3.5 was another "rush job" by Ford.
    agreed, and an interesting statement given that the 3.5 was originally supposed to be in the Five Hundred - 3 years ago! However, had that happened I would bet that the Five Hundred would have sold much better (much like the Chrysler 300) and we wouldn't be talking about the 'Taurus' today. I guess we'll see if the marketing mavens are right about the name change and whether the extra HP needed to make it competitive in this class works.
    Having recently driven an Edge, the 3.5 still seems a notch or two below what most of the competition is offering.
  • allmet33allmet33 Member Posts: 3,557
    Starting price, you're going with STARTING price??? Look at what you get for that price and see if it's really a comparison. The best barometer is the price on fully loaded top of the line models. As I pointed out earlier...the Azera comes in less than the Taurus. I'm also sure if you go with the starting price on base models...comparably equipped...the Azera will still come in less than the Taurus.

    I'm pretty sure if the Taurus didn't have AWD, it MIGHT be less than the Azera, but...that could be the factor that takes it higher. I did say that AWD was one advantage that Taurus has over the Azera, along with bigger trunk space and a cavernous cabin. Downsides...bland styling (they tried hard though) and an almost clinical interior (not inviting at all). The new Taurus IS leaps and bounds better than any other Taurus that has been on the streets in the past. It actually looks like a car a family should be in.
  • allmet33allmet33 Member Posts: 3,557
    Yeah...you had to get a V-8 to get something that's "long legged". However...I guarantee you that the Azera is quite long on leg as well. I'm not one for redlining the tach either.

    The SS has a more controlled ride because it's a "sport" version. The LT is just a cruiser version so it's going to be softer. That being the case, you should have driven a Maxima or an Avalon Touring model...both of those have stiffer suspensions than most of the other entries.

    Don't know about anything being lesser brethren to the Impala though...that's funny!
  • allmet33allmet33 Member Posts: 3,557
    A long warranty doesn't prove reliability, it proves a company's willingness to stand behind their product.
  • tjc78tjc78 Member Posts: 15,856
    Lucerne is a great car but as I and others have said the 3800 V-6 is antiquated and the V8 while nice isn't worth the fuel economy penalty compared to the almost equal power of the 3.5 V6 in the Avalon. I was saying in one of the other forums the other day I still cannot understand why GM won't put the 3.6 6 speed in that car. I just can't believe the Lacrosse gets a superior powertrain than the "flagship" Buick. Make the 3.6 standard then offer the VVT 292 HP version of the Northstar V-8 as an option for those who have to have a V-8.

    2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Ram 1500 Bighorn, Built to Serve

  • tjc78tjc78 Member Posts: 15,856
    "I guess we'll see if the marketing mavens are right about the name change and whether the extra HP needed to make it competitive in this class works"

    Something tells me that it won't. The Taurus name is "tainted" now with the stigma of "fleet" car. And not to mention that many dealers are having a fire sale on '06 Taurus program cars. Why wouldn't they just have marketed "the restyled 500 now with 260HP 3.5 V6" Nah, that would have made too much sense.

    2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Ram 1500 Bighorn, Built to Serve

  • alexstorealexstore Member Posts: 264
    If hyundai stood behind their warranty, it would have been fully transferable. Most people, who buy new cars keep them for few years and not 10 yrs.
  • discgolfer99discgolfer99 Member Posts: 42
    "A long warranty doesn't prove reliability, it proves a company's willingness to stand behind their product. "

    Totally agree. And for me, Powertrain warranty is pretty much meaningless. The REAL factor is the Bumper-To-Bumper warranty. Now THAT!, is standing behind your product...

    But I have to admit, even the bumper to bumper warranty was probably 4th or 5th reason on my list when I bought, lower than Styling, Options, Price, Performance, etc.

    Still loving my Charger SXT. NO ISSUES whatsoever in two years now...
  • captain2captain2 Member Posts: 3,971
    Yep, bumper to bumper much more likely to be used - and to be fair Hyundai does go a bit further on that end as well. As far as allmet's statement goes - if I might alter it just a bit ;) - 'a long warranty doesn't necessarily even IMPLY reliability and if it proves anything, it 'proves' that the company (and/or the car buyer) thinks that it MUST offer it to compete effectively'.
    To me - long warranties, if anything, are a 'red flag' of sorts - probably because I haven't owned a car in the last 15 years that ever required any kind of warranty service within 100k, total mileage of those 2 Chevys, 1 Ford, 4 Nissans, and 1 Toyota over a million miles.Therefore really don't care (Knock on wood) about a lousy 100k warranty - that kind of thing should be expected these days given any semblance of proper upkeep - don't you think?
  • captain2captain2 Member Posts: 3,971
    If Hyundai (or GM/Chrysler) were to really do this, suggest that there would be a really positive impact on resale values and equally as obviously 'true cost to own'. That lack of tranferabililty is what limits the mfrg's exposure, given that most folks are trading off cars every 3 to 4 years - in effect, making the warranty 50 or 60k, not 100.
    Nobody ever accused the Koreans of being dummies!
  • bobber1bobber1 Member Posts: 217
    And nobody ever accused the Japanese of being dummies and they avoid 100,000 mile warranties just like our domestics.

    The Koreans know that they have had reliability issues in the past and that the reason they're offering these long warrantee to buy back business.

    I agree with the guy who's never had to do warrantee work on all of his cars foreign and domestic. I never have either and I've owned all GM and Honda.

    I'd like to see the Hyundai cheer leaders to report back at 100,000 or 150,000 miles to see what they think of them at that point.
  • tjc78tjc78 Member Posts: 15,856
    "And nobody ever accused the Japanese of being dummies and they avoid 100,000 mile warranties just like our domestics"

    GM is offering 100K and Chrysler is offering unlimited mileage on certain models. Why? Because, no matter whether the warranty is worth anything or not its a good marketing ploy to help sell cars.

    2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Ram 1500 Bighorn, Built to Serve

  • bobber1bobber1 Member Posts: 217
    Actually in GM's case they almost never has power train problems so very low risk warrantee for them. I think it's the only 100,000 mile warrantee they offer? Chrysler on the other hand ranks at the bottom of domestics for reliability, so they're going the Korean route buying customers.
  • allmet33allmet33 Member Posts: 3,557
    Fully transferrable doesn't mean they stand behind it, it just means they are standing behind the orginal owner. Look at Dodge/Chrysler's new lifetime warranty...only good to the orginal owner!

    Actually...a longer warranty would seemingly make someone want to hold on to a car for a longer period of time, however...someone like me...I ran through 100k miles in 4 years, so...
  • allmet33allmet33 Member Posts: 3,557
    You're right about most cars not really needing the warranty, however...it is nice to know that should something go wrong in that time/mileage constraint...it doesn't come out of your own pocket. I can tell you this...should any of those cars that don't offer the longer powertrain warranty have something that goes wrong outside of their shorter warranty periods...the cost to repair is much higher.

    I had a 96 Camry (4 cyl/ auto)and when the tranny went, AAMCO wanted $2300 to repair it...eventually, I found a shop to do it for $1800,but just imagine if it was one of the newer trannies!!!
  • allmet33allmet33 Member Posts: 3,557
    Yeah? Just let one of those japanese trannies go out on you after the warranty period and tell me if you're happy about paying out the nose to get it fixed. :P
  • colloquorcolloquor Member Posts: 482
    Re. GM's power train problems, or lack thereof . . . tell that to those who suffer piston slap in GM engines.

    I would certainly agree on GM's transmissions however, as Rolls-Royce formerly used Turbo-Hydramatics.
  • bobber1bobber1 Member Posts: 217
    Sorry, I meant GM's transmissions are relatively trouble free. I think they have decent engines too, but they've certainly had more issues with those.
  • prigglypriggly Member Posts: 642
    Greetings, Martin! Now, you are obviously a man who knows a fine car when he sees one!

    I also own an Impala SS and consider it the best car bar none among the vehicles being compared on this thread. I have had exactly no - zero - problems with it during my just over one year of ownership save for the power steering assembly recall that was addressed under warranty and I must say I never did have any problems with mine.

    The car is the very best combination of power, styling, very competent handling, quality, quietness, value, excellent stereo, reasonable mileage, beautiful and serene interior along with a magnificent V-8 engine burble available on the market today. I find the leather seats to be of very high quality and I regard the Bose audio system with XM radio to be one of the best stock systems available in a car presently on the market. I also very much appreciate the fact that you can adjust the units on the speedometer along with external temperature, tire pressure, etc. to either Imperial or metric at the touch of a button; now who else offers that feature in their cars? The transmission is oh so smooth and shifts seamlessly. Who needs five, six or seven gears when four do such a superb job?! And the power of that small block V-8 is absolutely exhilarating. It puts a smile on my face every time I drive it and that is what a car should do!
  • tjc78tjc78 Member Posts: 15,856
    " also own an Impala SS and consider it the best car bar none among the vehicles being compared on this thread"

    May I ask which vehicles you have driven on this thread? The Impala SS is a nice vehicle but in my opinion, GM's own Lucerne V8 trumps it in terms of Luxury and ride. Not to mention the Avalon or Azera that provide almost similar power and better FE out of a V-6, without the need for DOD or any other electronic gadgets. Lets hope these new DOD systems GM and Chrysler have don't prove to be problematic like the early ones Caddy had in the late 70s early 80s.

    I guess if all you are looking at is 0 to 60 the SS wins and is a nice "sleeper" car. However, IMO, there are too many downsides to consider it a class leading vehicle.

    2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Ram 1500 Bighorn, Built to Serve

  • 101649101649 Member Posts: 192
    Bose stock system the best???? Come on....You haven't driven or listened to many stock systems on other vehicles..That system is blown away by the stock systems in BMW's, Mercedes', and Lexus'...I don't think we use the imperial or metric systems in the US ....who cares about kph?? It also appears that you haven't driven the new CVT trannys.....
  • captain2captain2 Member Posts: 3,971
    I meant GM's transmissions are relatively trouble free
    while it is certainly true that the 'American' trannies have been relatively trouble free (and cheaper to fix) I submit that this is more a function of how relatively simple and outdated they are. This is rapidly becoming a thing of the past now that even Ford/GM/Chrysler are putting these newer more complicated higher tech 'electronic' trannies in their products as well. The days of the $1500 tranny repair is about over!
  • captain2captain2 Member Posts: 3,971
    Suggest to you, allmet, that the average new carbuyer is NOT effectively looking for anywhere near 100k of use. They simply get tired of a specific car, are lured by something shinier (or higher tech), and therefore, as statistics would indicate, put maybe 60k on a car in the 4 years you are talking about. And then promptly take some sort of bath trading it in on a newer model! Warranty, long or short, will rarely come into play for this buyer as it might if those warranties were transferrable and we all took a more intelligent (in a financial sense) approach and bought all our cars a coupla years old.
    For my part, I also put 25-30k on my car/year and regard 100-150k as the point at which I likely want to be looking for something new - if only because I can afford NOT to have to be inconvenienced by any sort of mechanical problems. Warranty plays little role in any car buying decision I make - I look under the hoods first, FE second, resale value (as it relates to COO) third, and mfgr. history fourth - which, I guess, is how I end up in an Avalon.
  • alexstorealexstore Member Posts: 264
    An excellent choice of a vehicle. I totally agree with you on 4 points of your choice. However in my case FE was not main concern since I drive mostly on highways and most cars on this forum average 25-30 mpg. Though I have Maxima and I love it but in 25-35 K I agree that Avalon is the best combination of Value, FE, resale value and reliability. The only reason I did not buy it , its not my age car and was more expensive than maxima.
    Sorry Azera lovers, but your car's only advantage is price and not Value that you get with Avalon.
  • jaymagicjaymagic Member Posts: 309
    Lol, if the worst analysis we Azera owners get is that the Avalon is a better overall value, somehow I am not that offended. If I had wanted to spend the additional $3-5K upfront to get an Avalon, I would be thrilled to own another one. But, I did not want to spend the extra cash and so am very happy with its closest rival, and the cash still in my pocket.
  • captain2captain2 Member Posts: 3,971
    its not my age car
    an unfortunate perception that the Avalon has going back to the days (2004 and earlier) when they really were luxed out (and certainly very tame) Camrys. As an owner/former owner of 4 VQ engined Nissans, it was the G35, the Maxima, and the TL that topped my shopping list a coupla years back - if anybody would have told me that I would end up in an Avalon - now that would've really gave me a good laugh. Anyway, the G35 was easily the best driving car (for obvious reasons) but simply too small, the Acura (believe it or not) too rough riding and too much torque steer, the Maxima, substantially less expensive but didn't like the interior (SL) and, of course, the torque steer. Didn't even know about the new Toyota V6 at the time and what Toyota had done to the Avalon - drove one (the tightened up Touring model) and the rest is history. I really do believe though that the 05+ Avalon might just be the ultimate traffic light sleeper and likely leaves some streaks in the drawers of those traditional 'geezer' Avalon owners, but I too would have told you not too long ago that is 'not my age' as well ;)
  • prigglypriggly Member Posts: 642
    I have driven all the vehicles on this thread. The Lucerne, another GM offering, is an excellent vehicle and would have been my second choice but it is slower than the SS and has a floatier ride. It is also more expensive. The DOD is seamless and suffers from none of the reliablity issues that plagued the earlier Cadillac. It is truly an ingenious system and contributes to a highway mileage of 28-29 mpg on the highway in my car. For 303 hp and 323 ft.-lb. of torque, it simply has no comparison. The Avalon is plagued by transmission issues as have been well documented on the boards, at least in some cars. The SS has no such issues. The Azera I found to have a cheap interior and I am not really into Hyundai's depreciation. As for the "downsides" to which you refer, I have yet to find any in the SS.
  • prigglypriggly Member Posts: 642
    Wrong, bud. I have indeed listened to all the stock systems of which you make mention and for the significant increased costs commensurate with the cars in which these systems appear, their superiority of sound is marginal at best. For value and overall quality, the audio system in the SS (Bose) is more than comparable.

    And yes, you do use the Imperial system of mileage in the US. Where the ablity to adjust the units to metric or Imperial comes in very handy is if you drive the car in both the US and Canada, which I and many others do, so that you can switch effortlessly between the two and this is a very great convenience. It represents yet another indication of GM's attendtion to detail.
Sign In or Register to comment.