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Cadillac DTS V-Series
Is there in any formation on the possibility of V-series for the DTS?
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If the DTS becomes a rear wheel drive model, then possibly a V-series could make sense, but I see no reason to add yet another model to the V-series cars. The CTS_V and STS_V models make some sense to me, with their BMW counterparts being the M3 and M5 models. However, there is no BMW M7 model, which would be silly as the 7-series is a luxury sedan, not a sports sedan. There is the AMG S-class Mercedes cars though, unfortunately, none of Cadillac's current V-series models are competitive with them, so rather than Cadillac spending money on a DTS V-series car, they should upgrade the current models to make them better able to compete with the AMG Mercedes models.
I agree with you on the front wheel drive status.
Nevertheless, a full size Caddy boosting sport performance would complete the line up for Cadillac. Additionally, by having a sport sedan, the image would rub off on the regular "DLS" buyer and increase sales overall.
Since the DTS-V would a speciality model, as are the other V-cars, the regular buyer would purchase the "DLS" by association.
Another impetus get the DTS-V would be to simply compete in the class. A reason the upscale American cars are not taken seriously is due to lack of being competitive.
"You've got to be in the race to win the race."
As for the BMW -7 series, look at the general performance stats, and its clear to see that its a sport sedan, just short of the AMG class.
I want my DTS-V!!! Just call me a silly american, looking for some serious american performance.
A DTS RWD sedan might make a good platform for a DTS_V if and only if the V-series version sports a V16. Building this would probably complete the job of bankrupting GM.
I still think that a FWD DTS V-series is a silly idea. A more upscale RWD DTS might be a good platform for a V-series, but now the base price will probably be $60,000 for a V8, $120,000 for a V12 and, finally, $300,000 for the V16 V-series model.
To me, the STS-v splits the difference between them all. The car is an everyday user, not as hard edged as the M5, and more fun to drive than the E55, more reliable also.
As for the V16, we may as well forget it. That engine will never be produced unless Caddy finally decides to go upmarket. However, the V12 Escalade is a go for '08, along with hybrid. We may see this engine in a so-called DTS-v, if that ever comes true. I do believe that Caddy wants to get serious with the Europeans, witnessed by the awesome STS-v/CTS and CTS-v. And this is why the next DTS will be RWD with a sport variant similar to the S63/S65 AMG's from Benz.
My point has been that the FWD DTS would not make much of a platform for a serious V-series car. The issue for a RWD DTS is what sort of car should this be. If the future DTS is to continue as a popularly priced large sedan as the Sedan deVille has been historically, then what platform it should be built on is the question. The sigma platform is expensive, and a large sedan (larger than the STS) should be more expensive than the V8 STS is. This would move the DTS into a higher price range than the popularly price DTS is currently. The "global RWD platform" that GM's Holden models use for their larger sedans would make sense for a popularly price RWD deVille Cadillac. This would not be the best platform for a serious V-series deVille though. The best platform for a V-series deVille would be the sigma platform.
At this point in time, with the future deVille replacement's platform in some question, I think talk of a V-series model is premature.
A 16 cylinder engine is out of the question with gas prices above 2 dollars, and that is not even considering the current 3 dollars prices that we are seeing, which by the way is just un-American. Additionally, these prices are overpriced with the amount of oil that is available throught out the world, however this is an issue to a different forum.
A FWD DTS-V is a non-sensical competitor; however an AWD is the way to go, since the parts bin is already established by virture of the STS. The base components are in place and balancing is all that remains for the extended wheel base necessary for a DTS.
Further, base competition is now 500 hp in the upper eschelon class of the M cars of BMW and the S cars of Audi, and Mecerdes Benz. The North Star power plant is easily capable of producing these horses and if necessary to play hard ball, GM can certainly lean on the Corvette engine to get the job done and get into the game.
As for marketing, using the Chrysler model of the 300M and the hemi-engine; most 300M are base models, but the hemi-engine gets folks to by the base with the association of the hemi. A DTS-V can do the same marketing job!
With all this being said, I want my DTS-V!
SuperCool
What you seem to be saying is that the refinement of the DOHC VVT northstar V8 should be replaced with an unrefined pushrod V8 of at least 500 horsepower.
In any case, I think that more can be done with the existing V-series models before wasting good money on yet another half baked V-series model.
Essentially what happens is the the STS becomes stretched to become a DTS. It's no engineering marvel or feat to make this move.
As for horse power, I'm of the opinion the DOHC WT Northstar is capable of cranking out 500 horses. Once again, the parts bin already stocked with the components to make this happen. I only mention pushrod V8 as a matter of raw power capability in order to compete against the Europeans.
Hence, its no major leap or half-baked concept to create a DTS-V because all the components are already in place.
The major move is to assemble, balance and refine the components to fit the "big boy" and then Cadillac becomes a complete player on the performance realm matching up against BMW, Audi and M-Benz. From this stand point, then Cadillac can begin to improve on its stats.
Currently, according to all the car rags, the V cars are only lagging by 1-1.5 seconds. Of course, 1-1.5 seconds is significant, but its clear where we stand and where the improve needs to come. Easy measurements and improvements to monitor.
The final piece is the marketing to make the V-series luster and "bad assness" glow over to the base models.
I want my DTS-V!
The current STS is about $10,000 more that the CTS. One assumes that the V8 DTS would then be about $10,000 than a similar V8 STS. I would guess that the base price for a sigma DTS would be around $60,000.
DTS-V simply needs to incorporated the systems of the STS-V; upgrade, beef-up, or strengthen materials to accomodate for the larger size of the DTS and you've got a class car!
I want my DTS-V!
I want my DTS-V
Please try to understand that the current FWD DTS will remain in production for a few more years, and a RWD DTS is only in the planning stage at this point. There is no public information on this that I have seen. A V-series DTS would be a longer term project.
A very serious question remains as to what Cadillac will do with the DTS or the deVille series. This has been a popular Cadillac since the mid-1950's. Please try to grasp the point that making the DTS on the RWD sigma platform will increase its price tag considerably. It would make no sense to have a small STS model priced at the same level as a larger DTS model on the sigma platform. In any case, the cost of building a larger model on the sigma platform would be higher than the smaller STS, thus the price would have to be greater.
Taking a DTS to the sigma platform does not requires major engineering changes; its simply a matter of scale for the production line. This is one of the reasons, GM & Ford are being killed at the market place, due to their unwillingness and slowness to meet the demand of the market place.
BMW, M-Benz, and Audi series cars are virtually identical in components, and what they offer is size differentials.
By way of example: BMW 3-series, 5-series, and 7-series.
These cars are all "fundamently" the same and then scaled up from the basic design for size.
With this being said, taking the sigma platform and pumping it up with the steriods, bears you the DTS-V.
Price: $70-75,000.
The DTS/DeVille popularity has been with an aging demographic, which has probably bought their last DTS/DeVille.
Unless Cadillac is looking to relinquish the full size car market to the Europeans and Lincoln-Ford, a change has gotta-come! The change opportunity is in the DTS sigma platform! With respect to time and long term project, Cadillac/GM does not have time to for play. Toyota has surpassed Ford to be the number 2 car manufacturer in the states, and for sure as the sun will rise tomorrow, they're looking to be number 1, which means the products have to make it to the show room swiftly and they need to be "hot" to capture the American car buying market. They worked for the SUV, but with gas prices hitting the roof, they're outdated by economics. Cars and crossovers are the future.
With a Cadillac luster in small (CTS), mid-size (STS), and full size (DTS) via the V-series, Cadillac will be able to command a presence and product in the upper eschelon of the car market, which will capture the American buyer.
I want my DTS-V!
The BMW 3, 5 and 7 series cars are not priced the same. So, the CTS , STS and DTS models should not be priced the same either. The V-series versions also should not be priced the same. The CTS_V is about $50,000; the STS_V is about 75,000; therefore the DTS_V should be about $100,000. Perhaps, with a V12, $125,000.
GM has plenty of factory capacity in Canada, Mexico and the United States (unless they're deciding to shut it down!) to set up a DTS sigma line (this of course based on the premise the only engineering necessary is a scaling up for size).
Pricing however is an issue. $100,000 DTS-V is a steep price for the current image of Cadillac. The Escalde is only going for 75K. A solid way to go is to introduce the model at about 80K, show its value and build the cache, and then bump it incremently. Additionally, DTS-V would be a steriod version of the regular DTS which could be sold for 60K, with a good built in mark up. With this approach, Cadillac is down to one platform with all associated engineering consolidated and efficiency maximized.
I want my DTS-V!
Perhaps Cadillac should only build V-series models since that seems to be what you want.
What make you think the sigma platform is expensive to build?
Any platform short of a model T is expensive.
You cite quality of components with respect to engineering capability and production line creation.
If you used higher grade/quality components on a Ford Tarus or Chevrolet Impala, it would be more expensive too. Hence, the issue is not component quality and price, but engineering capability, market demand and marketing.
The engineering capability question is alreaday answered! The sigma platform exists and is a finished design. Scaling up for a full size version is not a major feat, and I would venture that a full size plan (DTS)is already drawn.
The unknown question is market demand. Certainly, keeping it easy on the current FWD platform is nice for GM, but this attitude of not making a push to the next level is killing GM and Ford on product placement versus the competition. A look at the market share number in any category tells the story.
Certainly my sole voice calling for the DTS-V would not prompt GM to create a production line to meet my demand. However, I am of the opinion there are other unvoiced voices out there that desire a full size Caddy capable of competing with the full size BMW, Audi, and M-Benz. This is the push that GM needs to make in order to keep Cadillac in the game. They done a nice job with the CTS in the lite division, doing nice with the STS in the middle division. Now its time to start playing like a big boy and move to the heavy weight division with a DTS and stand up and be counted.
Hence, the standard GM market approach could be to create a base model DTS for the masses and a DTS-V model for the performance crowd. This would allow for a halo effect across the entire Cadillac line up.
If GM can take a Chey Suburban, change the badging and interior appointments and call it an Escalde, then anything is possible.
I want my DTS-V
If the DTS is going onto the expensive sigma platform as a larger car than the current CTS and STS models, then it makes sense to me that it will cost more to build and the price should be higher. However, they could put cheap plastics and cloth seats in it and keep the cost and price down. It this what you are looking for?
The Escalde is not really a Cadillac from my point of view, but if people are dumb enough to pay extra for the bling, then why not?
The more you produce, generally the lower price becomes due to scales of efficiency/economy.
My argument is not on whether the price will be steep.
My argument is that the demand "may" be sufficient to have scales of efficiency/economy to become a significant factor.
If the DTS on sigma platform sells in the same numbers as that psuedo-cadillac the "Allente" then its doomed to failure and priced out of the market. However, if the market calls for it in the same numbers as the CTS and STS, then its a winner, coming in at the lower end of the high scale.
By the way, I enjoy this exchange of ideas, concepts and views with you.
Nevertheless, I want my DTS-V
If they want to keep the DTS sales at a high level, then I think that a cheaper platform is needed. Adding another factory to build expensive sigma vehicles would simply make all of them more expensive since I doubt that they could sell 300,000 annually. It makes more sense to me to put a lower priced DTS on the Zeta II (or Global RWD platform) platform, and then build a RWD Buick sedan that could be sold at entry level luxury price (replacement for the Lucerne). However, I doubt that this platform would be good for the V-series model you want.
The general problem with volume sales is the small number of potential buyers in the full size sedan market segment, and the even smaller subset of buyers for the full size luxury sedans. If 25,000 were sold, that would be darn excellent.
The big sellers are the crossovers, and small to mid-size sedans. Pick trucks will typically do well as a general segment. However, the full size sedan market is basically dying off, the baby-boomers are most likely into their last full sedans.
Hence, from a real market perspective, I would not argue the realities of a DTS-V product placement, however, I find the STS-V to be mid-sedan lacking the creature comforts of a full size sedan. In the role of a Cadillac booster, a DTS-V completes the line from small to full size. Further, absent a full size model, Cadillac relinquishes the market to the Audi - A8, the BMW 740/750 (an what ever other mid-production numbers they create), and the M-Benz 600.
This is where the rub is; the front-wheel drive DTS is good for the disappearing baby-boomer, but to sell to a new crowd, a DTS-V type product must be in the competition zone, which are the models I previously mentioned.
So Cadillac can either be a second tier competitor and stop at the STS or it can a first teir competitor and place in product in the full size zone, as a true compititor.
As for the Zeta II platform, sounds like its homework time for me, I not familiar with this platform.
I want my DTS-V.
The V-series is supposed to be a high performance version of a "performance" model. Cadillac considers the sigma line, the CTS, STS and SRX to be performance cars, with better handling, harder ride, more European Sports Sedan than American cruiser.
Moving the DTS into the sports sedan market will result in a smaller car, or it will result in a very expensive up-market sedan, which will sell slower. Now, if the DTS is priced somewhere in the $60,000 level, with the base model perhaps a bit less, but with options more, the sales rate may run upwards of 25,000, but my guess is that half that is more likely.
Perhaps Cadillac will drop the old luxury barge market that the old deVille was very popular in. The Town Car is old luxury barge style too. While the BMW 7-series is not quite the best choice for a sports sedan (the 5-series is best), the 7 series is bigger and more luxurious, so it is BMW's luxury model. Note that there is no M-series version of this model. However, the 7-series is far closer to the "sports sedan" class than the FWD DTS is. As far as pure handling goes, the 3 series is considered best, but with a V8 the 5 series is perhaps the optimum for overall performance.
The question is: should Cadillac make the DTS into a hard riding BMW sports sedan style of car? OR: Should it be more like the S-class Mercedes? or maybe more Lexus LS. The Lexus is a luxury barge style of car.
There would only be two V-series models, the CTS_V and the DTS_V. Unless, the STS_V is a V12 super luxury performance car with say 700 horsepower. They would only sell one per year at cost 1 million each.
Buick could fill in as a lower end luxury barge sort of car with a big De Ville style sedan.
The division wants to compete in the performance luxury class but has a problem with lining up properly in the class, since the Europeans are setting the bench marks.
The STS and CTS do a nice job in the small to mid-size, but the problem comes at the full size. Ultimately the question is price. Once a person starts to lay out over $60K the current inclination is to go Euro.
I'm of the opinion that when the new styling was introduced it caught alot of attention and the attetion became acute with the "V" line up. Now however, the look is getting stale and Cadillac failed to drop the hammer, that being the full size version, a-la, the DTS.
Herein lies the dilemma, stay with the sure seller luxury barge or continue the cutting edge push.
This is where I think Cadillac can have its cake and eat it too. Create small volume run of DTS-V and the associated price, and also put out a knock-off DTS at the lower price relying on the halo effect. (This probably where the Zeta II platform should be appropriately exploited.) This is the same game plan Chrysler is doing with the 300M. They have the base model, which is the bread and butter, but they also have the Hemi performance option which show as the muscle and attention getter. Hardcore folks buy the hemi, but the general buyer is happy with look general look without hemi.
Incidently, I do find is curious that there is no M series for the 600 Benz model.
I want my DTS-V
#1 - The 300M is no longer in production.
#2 - Mercedes does not have an M series of any sort that I know of.
Discussion of Cadillac V-series models is totally without the base model is nonsense. For the V-series to make any sense what-so-ever, there must be an appropriate base model from which to make a limited production V-series.
I will agree that Cadillac does not have a model in the Audi A8, BMW 7-series, Lexus LS, or Mercedes S-class category. As far as that goes, Cadillac does not really have a good Audi A6, BMW 5-series, or Mercedes E-class model either. Rather than spending money GM DOES NOT HAVE on yet another mediocre V-series model, they should focus on getting what they have now improved. At least they have had the sense not to make a V-series out of the SRX.
I meant to say the "AMG" series on the M-Benz.
For certain a V series needs a base model, this where I propose the Zeta II platform might be the answer. V series and base model DTS both on the Zeta II platform.
As for not having money, GM needs to make salary pay cuts on executives that are producing lame products, this might free up some factory tooling money. As for the SRX, lame product!, enough said there.
For me the base issue, is for Cadillac to have a product placement of a full size sedan, that has performance grade capabilities. Building a performance sedan is not a major engineering feat, but the desire to put one the market that will compete is a major feat of will.
The name brand Cadillac should signify upper eschelon quality and performance, absent a full size sedan, Cadillac is rudderless and not taken seriously, by the big boys: Audi, BMW, M-Benz, Lexus. Now if that is the GM position, then they better rely upon Chevrolet sales to keep them in the auto business, and they can continue to sell small volume CTS, STS,the rest of the alphabet and rebadged Suburbans until the devision becomes meaningless and results in shut down, ala Oldsmobile.
I want my DTS-V
The SRX is considered by some magazines to be a very good SUV or crossover or whatever. It is not selling as well as the big Suburban (Escalade), but is selling. The 2007 gets a much nicer interior, which should help, along with a 6 speed transmission on the V8.
It is not the big boys that count, Cadillac must be taken seriously by car buyers, and right now the car magazines have written Cadillac off as a has been. The current line up just does not compare well with the competition. The STS falls way short with its interior material quality compared to Audi (any audi), Mercedes (E-class) or other German makes.
All this Yada-Yada-Yada about a DTS-V is nonsense. What is needed at Cadillac are better current models. Now that being said, the 2007 SRX will get a much nicer interior than it currently has. The 2008 CTS will be all new, with a much better interior too. Of course the 2006 DTS had an all new interior too, and while it is better than before, I don't see it being all that much nicer than the interior on my 2002 Seville. So, while I think things will improve, I doubt that Cadillac will compare well with the German cars for interior quality. I think that GM has lost the ability to make nice interiors.
Back when they did know: http://www.fedrelandsvennen.no/amcar/brochures/cadillac/66cad/bilder/5.jpg
The art & science styling is growing stale, though it made a nice splash on introduction.
I agree with you on Cadillac mediocrity, but I'm hard pressed to agree that Cadillac wants to stay there. Maybe there are still some brand management executives still in place that don't have the thinking/idea power to be produce models that can be considered seriously by "car buyers."
Lack of full size performance model (my claim), lack of solid interior appointments (your claim), lack of a line up(an agreed claim), this all points to what is Cadillac?
Anyone with reasonable taste shelling out $60K or more might consider a Caddy as an idea base on name recognition, but when its time to make the purchase, the other manufacturers are eating Cadillac's lunch.
Hence a DTS-V would be nice punch to being seriously considered by car buyers. However, I'm lone voice pushing the envelope, and possibly ahead of my time.
I want my DTS-V
Anyway, interior quality is a combination of style, materials, and the fit and finish of those materials. GM is upgrading the fit. The finish quality is also improving, but this has been somewhat hit and miss, or so I read here and there. Style is a matter of personal taste, but I think the STS's interior style is not quite as good as the FWD Seville's was.
When you speak of full size, do you mean Town Car, or perhaps the 1975 era DeVille? What do you mean by full size, and what do you mean by a performance model?
Mercedes C-class: 178.4, 68.0, 55.6, 106.9 - luxury or sport sedan trims - CTS price range.
BMW 3-series: 178.2, 71.5, 55.9, 108.7 - the ultimate sports sedan - CTS price range.
Other competition are Lexus, Audi, etc.
Note that the CTS is a bigger body.
STS: 196.3, 72.6, 57.6, 116.4 - Price ranges from $42,000 to $65,000 depending on options
Mercedes E-class: 191.0, 71.7, 58.4, 112.4 - not called a sports sedan by Mercedes - price ranges from $50 to 60,000.
BMW 5-series: 191.1, 72.7, 57.8, 113.7 - price ranges from $43 to 60,000.
The STS is a longer body. In fact the CTS body is about the same size as the E-class and 5-series, although not as wide.
Town Car: 215-221, 78.5, 59, 117.7-123.7 - a big sedan. Price similar to DTS.
Mercedes S-class: 205, 73.7, 58.0, 124.6 - large luxury sedan - price range $86 to 140,000
BMW 7-series: 198.4-203.9, 74.9, 58.7, 117.7-123.2 - BMW's luxury model - price range $71 to 119,000
Clearly the DTS and Town Car are bigger than the Europeans, but are priced much lower. Unless you understand what the differences are, none of this makes much sense.
From your argument position, I'm understanding that Cadillac can't match-up to these vehicles, or . . . shouldn't even try!
Now of course if your saying Cadillac has already relinquished this segment, fine, but then what is the value of the rest of the V line-up? They're not really matching up to the junior varsity line up of the Europeans already.
I argue that the Cadillac needs to get into the game and get into serioursly such that the auto rags will give a nod of recognition, which potentially will tweak marketing and capture the interest and purchasing option of the North American market. Otherwise the entire V concept is futile.
I want my DTS-V.
Way back when, in the late 1950's to be exact, Cadillac tried with an Eldorado Brougham. I don't know if it was successfull, but they sold about 1000 altogether, over a 4 or 5 year period. It was priced at about double that of a well equipped Sixty Special. Note that 60,000 Sixty Specials were sold in the same period.
The Allante was a similar experiment, except that it was after the Mercedes SL roadster market.
Cadillac has not had any experience in building a quality S-class car. I think the better Cadillac's have been closer to the C-class than E-class for that matter. I think that the DTS, which is the DeVille model of old, should continue on as a lower priced luxury car (base price over $40,000). I also think Cadillac should introduce a sigma platform model along the lines of the old Fleetwood Sixty Special. Something elegant, but still a drivers car. I do not attach much importance to a V-series designation, as these are hot-rodded Cadillacs for the purpose of stock car racing, not really street cars. However, the STS-V seems less hotrod and more street luxury performance. The CTS on the other hand, is ready for stock car racing.
It was totally a specialty ride.
The Allante I thought was a loss cause, right along with the Cimmaron. This was all part of the brand management era.
Alas, what you argue is the very dilemma I see with Cadillac, a little bit of this and not enough of that, leaving a line that has significant strenghts, e.g. CTS, but significant weakness too, e.g. DTS.
I'm sure the brand managers are content with the SRX, Escalde and CTS sales, and will ride the bubble on DTS, but they will surely find themselves lost when the demographic runs its course, the Japanese will scoop up the market with new models and consumer satisfaction. Toyota has already displaced Ford from the number 2 spot, and GM is next.
Will I ever get my DTS-V, realistically . . . doubtful!, but its interesting to push the envelope.
The DTS, basically the old DeVille series, has always been a basic Cadillac luxury model. I do not think moving it into the sport sedan market segment will do it any real good. Moving it up market will also not work. What Cadillac needs is a new model in the higher end category, but they need a lower end model too, so that they have some basis for making the upper end model.
The CTS, as an entry level sports luxury sedan, is attractive to younger buyers. The STS is a higher end model, and probably is not going to attract BMW or Mercedes owners. As I see it Cadillac needs to keep the DTS as the low priced luxury model that is a large sedan. The basic point here is that the STS and DTS define what you can get in the over $40,000 price which is where the luxury car starts. These two models define the lower end, and Cadillac could build something in a higher price range, but this higher end model will need to be much better in terms of refinement (stronger body structure, more luxury) than the lower end models. I think that the STS's sales are weak because most interested buyers want the sports sedan options (packages 1SF or 1SG) which are very expensive, making the STS a dubious value.
The one thing that Cadillac does have going for it at present is the sigma platform, which they are using for the sports sedans and the Cadillac crossover SUV. This does give Cadillac a few models on a special (and expensive) platform not shared with lower end GM models.
Cadillac has always done a fair job with lower end luxury models. The original Cadillac's (in the early 1900's) were mid-priced cars, not luxury cars. When GM took over Cadillac, Cadillac was moved into the luxury range for GM. However, GM has always wanted profits, and for Cadillac to generate profits, they need a volume seller in the lower price ranges, that is not horribly expensive to build. So I think that the future DTS probably needs a lower cost platform, not quite suitable for a sports sedan, that will be shared with other GM makes, making a profitable lower end large luxury sedan possible.
I'm in agreement with you concerning the general brand position of Cadillac, after all GM is a for the masses auto manufacturer. Nevertheless, I still pine for a performance Cadillac, but then of course there is reality.
Its hard to stay on the American name plate when the products are not being offered.
On the topic of first applications, Cadillac had put in place a night infrared radar system on the DTH and DTS runs through 2004, and then discontinued the offering. Now the systems are all the rage on BMW and M-Benz.
Cadillac seems to be on the cutting edge, but then dulls very quickly.
I want my DTS-V
Cadillac does have two performance sedans. I really do not understand exactly what it is that you want.
The Reatta, mine was a 91, did not sell too well. The 91 model year was delayed for months until they got as many orders (about 2000) as they could.
I'm a fairly large sized guy, and the CTS is too small, the STS is a little better for the long drives that I like to run, but after awhile it can feel tight. Hence, the DTS is the ticket for me.
On the night vision system, it actually was a good system, but true low light situation were required. It does not perform well in any type of urban situation where there is street lighting or background lighting. Back country roads or no light interstate roads combined with fog or rain, and it works light a charm.
The M-Benz systems and BMW systems are the evolution of the concept, but Cadillac had it out first. It was a low selling option, but in my opinion they should have keep available.
However, as we are in agreement, Cadillac is looking solely on the profit side, and if it doesn't turn the profit, its out. They is where I think GM makes a mistake and doesn't permit a longer run on certain products to capture sales interest.
On the Reatta, I liked the styling when it first hit the market, but it hasn't maintained a good appeal with age.
I think GM also did some type of production technique with the Reatta, where the traditional assembly was not used, and assembly teams were incorporated whereby the team would be with the car from start to finish. This was part of the delay problem.
I didn't get a chance to drive one, but I imagine it was a good smooth ride, not overly performance based, but got the job done.
The Reatta was not a bad car for ride, and handling was good. It was built in an experimental factory where the parts came to the car instead of the car proceeding down an assembly line.
I have some doubts about whether the XLR is profitable or whether the XLR_V or STS_V are really profitable. But the basic idea behind the V-series was to justify putting the Corvette engine into the CTS, which as a six cylinder only model did not have great performance.
Looking at the emblem on the front grill of the Caddy was the simple giveaway that the car was equipped with the feature.
I've haven't had an opportunity to test the M-Benz system or the BMW system, but placing it down in the console seems to fundamently go against the grain of safety and ergonomic design. You always want to minimize the amount of time you look away from the road. I've read some articles about what M-Benz and BMW is putting out, and I hoping that GM gets into the competition, but if there's no profit straight away they're out.
I like the V-Series as a concept, but its really for the hard core folks, like me. Cadillac really has a job to do with defining itself as a brand. The Art & Science design has run its course and question becomes "Now what?" Design styles are currently on the move, look at the M-Benz and the Toyota line ups. What is Cadillac going to do? Seems to me that the movement is toward more curves in the lines.
For me the XLR is really only an XYZ, a car without a true sense of what it is. Its cute, but it will go the way of the Allente.
The CTS and CTS-V is nice, if you like a small car.
I haven't liked it all. Where Cadillac caught my attention was with the performance hardware that went into the CTS.
They upped the ante with the STS-V, expecially with the all wheel drive system and accompaning 6 six speed tranny of the 07 model. With all this is where my expectation was flowing on the DTS. However, from our discussions, it clear to see that there is not a good chance of it happening. A hope on my part.
What was the sister car to the Skyhawk?, I think a had an 79 version of the sister but by Pontiac, the name escapes me at the moment.
The current DTS is on a platform that will terminate at the end of the current production models; the DTS and Lucerne. The basic question is what will Buick do for a large sedan and what should Cadillac do for what has been their best selling large sedan. I think that the six speed FWD transmission will not get added to the DTS or Lucerne, but a lot depends on how much longer they are going to be in production. How much longer they remain in production depends on what the replacements are going to be. In the short term, the DTS and Lucerne will remain much as they are through model years 2008 and probably 2009. The biggest change could be the six speed automatic for 2008, which probably would mean that production would continue into model year 2010. But all of this is a guess on my part.
I didn't get an Edmunds alert, hence I didn't know you had responded.
I had the Sunbird version of the Shyhawk. It was actually one of favorite past rides. I had a basic model, nothing fancy, what liked about it was its interior spaciousness for a small car. I had a two door version, but I think the Shyhawk and the Cavalier had available four door versions.
I doubt Cadillac will go with a Six speed version. Seems that Ford and GM are also slow to adopt and/manufacture the upgrades in transmission. Took them a long while to get on board with a 5 speed, mean while many models have gone to 6 and even 7.
I caught a glimpse of the Car & Driver rag, and the DTS is staying on the the tried and true, styling was the main upgrade. Also, the rag stated that the STS all wheel drive had a 5 speed tranny, but I think it actually has an available 6 speed option when you get the AWD.
I have yet to really get a good look at the Lucerne. I've enjoyed Buicks for their comfort. I was not a happy camper when the Park Avenue line was eliminated and not the mention the Electra 225 too.