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2008 Pontiac G8
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Comments
Better car, perhaps - for you..
Substantially more expensive, though.
And.
I rented a brand new one a while back.
I test drove a loaded 2009 before buying my G8 GT.
You may be proven correct regarding long term service.
We shall see...
- Ray
YMMV.
They really are in 2 quite different segments –
IMHO.
First, price:
Base \ RWD with 304HP V6 DI starts at $38,860.
Add the UltraView sunroof @ $900
And the Y43 performance package @ $1,490
[ to make the equipment level roughly comparable
to a G8 GT with every package & option ]
results in an MSRP of $42,575.
MSRP of the ‘equivalent’ G8 GT = $35,190.
The CTS lists for over $7,000 more.
Second – dynamics:
Based on my driving, both the rental [ not the DI ]
and the ‘loaded’ ’09 I test drove last Fall,
my view is that the CTS just is not a sport sedan.
I am not talking here about handling.
Though this is important, and the CTS
does handle competently – better than that,
with the Y43, I expect – the 304 HP DI V6
just is not particularly powerful, and the
6L50 trans calibration in the CTS just is
not aimed [ IMHO ] at performance driving.
The acceleration numbers I recall for the 304HP CTS
run in the mid-14s.
The G8 GT records mid 13-s.
That is a difference most seeking performance
could likely feel.
The V6 is certainly ‘sufficient’ – but driving one,
I knew that I would ** REALLY ** miss the G8 GT’s V8,
with deep wells of Torque everywhere, at any RPM –
as well as the much quicker ultimate acceleration.
Some will not care about this aspect.
By far, my biggest disappointment with the CTS’s drivetrain was actually the trans. I have heard \ read much about how great the 6L50 is in the CTS. My Corvette had a 6L80 & the G8 GT has the same trans. I drove my ‘Vette & drive my G8 a fair percentage of the time in “S” & manual \ manumatic mode.
2 things about the CTS trans. drove me nuts – to the point that after the first 50 miles or so, I never used that mode again.
Thing 1: In my Corvette, & in the G8 once in a gear ( fourth or fifth or sixth, for example, on the freeway ) it will NOT downshift without a manual request. Ever.
[ At least not exclusively based on throttle position. ]
The CTS will downshift based on throttle position – even in ‘manual’ mode. Often shifting down one or 2 or 3 gears. Weird. And not ‘manual’, by my definition. Not exactly sure what GM is thinking here – though I have experienced something similar in a couple of BMW 3s, with their Steptronic automatic.
Thing 2: If accelerating at ( or close to ) WOT, commands to upshift are ignored. Again, my Corvette & G8 will do as told. And again, I have seen this behavior in BMW 3s. Weird.
Both these odd ( to me ) choices in the programming of the CTS automatic are counter-intuitive, to me. And I dislike them both. A lot.
When driven like a luxury car ( the fun portion of my trip, with my Daughter ) the CTS was fine. When I tried to drive it like a Sport Sedan – no dice. Would not work, for me.
The 6L50, as installed in the CTS I find just weird.
Very weird.
Again, during the 3 days I spent driving the rental CTS
driving it as a luxury sedan – not a performance car,
with my daughter in the right seat, it was OK.
I will refrain from comments about the interior –
except to mention that I did not find the seats
particularly comfortable. I find the G8 seats
very comfortable & supportive. The interior ‘styling’
of the CTS is purely a personal opinion area.
Now, one ** CAN ** add a navigation system to a CTS –
and AWD – so if those are deal-breakers, clearly
the CTS is ‘the winner’.
Just my 0.2 gallons worth . . .
- Ray
Very pleased with the G8 GT – is that obvious??
The powertrain is rather common - I wouldn't worry about long-term maintenance too much...
The G8 auto shifts good on the normal setting and is up for some fun in the performance setting. Most normal drivers will be happy the way the LS3 carries the vehicle in normal mode but down shifting is much more responsive in sport mode. It easily out guns Maxima's Altima's, Accords in every situation.
That said, this post has a lot of jokers trying to compare a Accord to either one of these vehicles. You would have to have your head in the sand to not notice the unbalanced (60% front/40%rear) design in the Honda and built in torque steer.. I test drove the Maxima, CTS, STS, Accord and many more sedans prior to my purchase.
One other point, my G8 has been flawless for 10k miles so far. I would not worry about service, The engine is an American pushrod V8
My joy ride is an 09 Mustang Bullitt along with the 06 GPGT, both noisy with lousy fit and finish.
At 76, I need to get with the program before our incoming president outlaws fun..
The fact that the engine is assembled in Mexico
means [ to you ] that the engine is not “American”?
The fact that some BMWs are assembled in Africa
means that they are not German?
And Camaros or Grand Pix assembled in Canada
are not American cars?
[ edit: And a Honda built in Ohio is ????? ]
Seriously????
And, yes, I ultimately think that a Honda from Ohio has a more positive economic impact on our country than a G8 imported from Australia (or something made in Canada) that has parts made in Mexico. Factories are getting closed left and right and I'm supposed to be indifferent to where it's assembled? I don't think so.
And funny that you should ask but my co-worker waited quite a long time for her 3-series from Germany rather than taking the South African one.
(And none of it means I won't get the G8 when the time is right)
Kinda.....
[[ I am well aware of the issue -
and a muddy one it is:
http://www.cars.com/go/advice/Story.jsp?section=top&story=amMadeParts&subject=am- i
Yep! The Big3 uses some lots of parts and assemblies produced in other countries, but the final end is the bulk of the dough stays in the USA...
Any G8 in my garage will be the result of a giveaway by the dealer, $..22,500 w/sunroof. My Bullitt was purchased in Detroit and transported to Venice, Fl by covered carrier..it was a deal...
The G8 deals & GM-card round-up are enticing but currently I won't consider a new car for now unless I got paid and got a new car out of the deal, such as trading 2 used cars for one new G8, plus cash back from dealer.
If G8 GT were available with stickshift, I'd probably have already made that deal...
To answer your question, wideglide, I understand that GM does not offer the G8 GT with stickshift in USA due to homologation cost being per engine*drivetrain combo, and not enough
units/model-years to spread/amortize that cost over,
consider such low production # totals as well as even lower # that could have
sold as G8-GT with manual-transmission. skippy cheers to all ....
I think its expired now. /e
There is a lot more to a company than where the vehicle is assembled. For example: Nissan assembles vehicles here but only employs 12k people in the US out of 200k total.
I for one would like to see GMs Australia's division succeed and send the US a profit check for every vehicle sold abroad. This model seems to work for Honda & Toyota who have raped the US in trade deficits
For example, my Trooper warranty lasts until 2012 and even though Isuzu pulled out of the U.S. market this year, it's valid since they still have their commercial truck business here.
Um.
I do not see the Mustang as even vaguely comparable
to a G8 GT. . .
But even if it is \ was:
“Meanwhile, you can thank Mexican workers for the manual transmissions used with either Mustang engine. But if you want the automatic 5-speed, well, they're made in France.”
http://blog.cleveland.com/pdextra/2007/12/mustang_vs_camry.html
Has this changed significantly?
And are there not other Edmunds forums
where this sort of discussion could continue?
- Ray
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c6-c...-solvency.html
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I firmly believe the business model of Toyota & Honda has killed us at our own game. We have unions that have legacy contracts i.e. early retirement (30 yrs), excellent wages and health care, etc. Toy & Hon have none of this and collect a check every time they sell a vehicle assembled in the US. Tell me this is good for our trade deficit.
American's want the best health care & wages when they work but when it comes time for purchase, they run to Wallmart where not one item is made here.
A company consists of many departments that all take a share of the pie to make the entire entity. If you look at Honda, Toyota & Nissan, the lions share is not on our shores.
What is wrong with GM having a presence in Australia? If GM can build, sell, and share designs with a subsidiary that makes a profit for GM, what is the harm?. It doesn't seem to hurt Toyota & Honda over here.
Are you going to compete with someone making $100 a month in China? When you walk into Verizon, do you by an American made phone or do you buy the cheap LG?
The big three produced more profitable SUVs because they had to. The foreign transplants do not have the legacy overhead and therefore can produce a cheaper small car where the labor differential cost makes it impossible for GM to compete. GM pays the health care for just as many working as non working employees. If they go under, the Gov is going to have to support these people.
We need to stop borrowing money from our kids to pay for all this junk that we do not produce ourselves. Our own president did not want to back up the "buy American" clause in the stimulus package because China threatened a trade war. Obama doesn't want us to take the hit on forcing Americans to lower our life style by purchasing what we make.
We have puchased ourselfs out of our own jobs
1. When I stomped the gas on my 09 G8 GT from a standstill why is there an slight hesitation/buck/bogging down and not an instand jump? It remind me of my old 78 Lasabre. Also, my rear wheels do not spin.
2. I have not owned a new 8 cyclinder ever, is the engine "knock" normal? Am I spoiled by the line of silent Nissans I have owned?
P.S.
I received my first traffic violation in 5 years last night (doing 58 in a 40) by a NC trooper.
http://forums.justcommodores.com.au/...2-esp-off.html
Nope...
- Ray
09 G9 GT driver...
Also, I believe that GM is a little dated in creating dash gauges. The G8 is better than the other GM cars and tastefully done. Simple, but they need to put a little more thought it to the creation of gauges. Since you do look at them more than any part of the car. I love the red lighted gauges, and on some GM cars, it is blue. Nice! GM is slowly coming away from the old school gauges.
One thing I loved about my 06 Accord was the fact that the gauges were lit at all times, when the car was off, you could barely see the gauges, Made to glow. it was made like that. Although the new 08 Accord doesn't use that method anymore. But they have a more high end gauge. I wish my G6 gauges stay lit all the time. Without having every light on. Headlights and gauges are different. Its nice to have them lit.
Anyway. lol The G8 gauges are simply done, rather than they tacky, overdone, previous gauges GM has made.
I'll bet you wear baggy pants, and have a big sub-woofer in your trunk. Tan and/or gray leather looks great IMO, and apparently a lot of other people's as well. Sorry, I grew out of the all black Darth Vader look about 20 years ago. No car looks good with wood?!? Yeah, all those Mercedes, BMW's, Audis, Jaguars, and Aston Martins have terrible looking interiors, right? What is a classic interior to you, a 90's Grand AM? And the G8 is certainly NOT a sports car. A sports sedan, maybe. Sports cars generally have two seats, and do without a lot of creature comforts and a soft ride, in the name of lighter weight and better absolute handling at the limit. Sports sedans generally have 4 doors, room for 4 or 5 people, lots of creature comforts, and try to strike a compromise between handling and cruising comfort. If you're still confused about the difference, go to your library and read the last 10 years of Road & Track and Car and Driver. And I pretty much won't consider the G8 GT a proper sports sedan, until they offer it with a manual transmission.
The G8 GXP automatic is faster than the manual. Does the fun of shifting outweigh the fun of performance? Also, the automatic is much more entertaining after a Superchips Cortex tune.
and ‘manumatic’ functionality since late 1999.
[ Lincoln LS Sport 3.9L V8 and five speed auto. ]
The Current 6L80 in the G8 GT is, by far, the best, IMHO.
I drove a Corvette with an automatic labeled
also as a 6L80 for over 30,000 miles.
This G8 ‘version’ is superior in several respects:
The Sport \ Manual Mode = DSC shifts quickly.
Specifically, the response to manual commands
[ the time between moving the shift lever and
the beginning of shift execution ]
is short. This is good.
When driving [ um ] briskly, but not ** VERY **
briskly, the shift execution I find is a very good
compromise between quickness & smoothness.
The style of the shifts are very similar to what one might
choose if driving a manual trans. and not hurrying.
The electronic throttle is reduced and \ or timing
is pulled at the beginning of the shift, and
as the next gear is engaged, the throttle \ timing
is re-applied smoothly – and on we go.
When driving more briskly, the shift execution
seems quicker, but still very smooth.
The downshift rev-match is nearly perfect.
The RPM rise exactly to where they must be for
a smooth transition to the next lower gear.
Well done, indeed.
And on we go.
The Sport Automatic mode is improved even more
than the Sport \ Manual mode over the prior
6L80, as installed in the 2007 Corvette.
The timing and execution of the shifts is much
better, and the response to throttle input is
much quicker and much more consistent.
The multiple downshifts – say from cruise in sixth
at 50 or 60 to second or third gear as a result of
slamming the pedal to the floor are both quick,
& smooth - not jarring. Very well done.
No transmission [ automatic or manual ] will
likely please everyone all the time – but the 6L80
in my G8 GT pleases me every time I drive it . . .
Just my 0.02 gallons worth . . .
- Ray
Driving and driving and driving . . .
Well:
"Handsome styling, great motor with fine response, excellent 6-speed automatic transmission and a reasonable price make this a very entertaining sports sedan — I like it," wrote Editor-in-Chief Thos L. Bryant.
R&T's test of the G8 GT... with automatic trans.
- Ray
From my library...
From Googling:
"sport truck is nearly identical to the G8 sports sedan."
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/hot_lists/high_performance/features_classic_- - cars/most_significant_debuts_at_the_2008_new_york_auto_show_auto_show/2010_ponti- - ac_g8_sport_truck_auto_show
and from other magazines,
"AUTO SHOWS: 2008 Pontiac G8 Sports Sedan"
http://www.automobilemag.com/auto_shows/2007_chicago/0702_2008_pontiac_g8/
"The G8s are an accomplished family of sport sedans,"
http://usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/cars-trucks/Pontiac_G8/
etc.
Many posts on the various Corvette Forums I frequented
before & during my ownership were essentially:
A Sports Car is not really a Sports Car
if equipped with an automatic.
And \ or:
A Corvette is not really Corvette
unless equipped with a manual trans.
While I certainly respect the view that
a manual trans. has certain attributes
that may enhance the driving experience
for some – the reality is that
[ when last I checked ]
over two thirds of Corvettes were
sold with the automatic trans.
If you choose not to buy a G8 GT
because it is only available with
an automatic trans. – fine.
If you will only consider a car with
a manual trans – well,
the debate rages on here - Future of the Manual Trans. - discussion:
http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/WebX/.ef6716a/4576
The thing about the G8 and other RWD cars is the weight transfer you get to the drive wheels when accelerating. The faster you accerate the more weight you get over the drive tires.
A manual transmission is especially tricky with FWD off of the line because if you overdo it the front end lifts as the weight transfers to the rear of the vehicle and there goes the traction. The Accord sits and burns when the too much power is used in initial takeoff .
There is somewhat less control with an auto but there is a definite advantage too. Every time you shift a manual transmission there is no power delivery to the drive wheels. This is why autos can deliver better 0-60 runs in some situations. I also find the delay can hurt when dogging around on a crowded highway when short bursts of power is desired.
I believe in the end sophisticated semi automatics will prevail as they are coming available on some of the exotic sport cars.
You have wonderful taste.
[ kidding ]
Your ’09 sounds a lot like mine:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v298/rayainsw/new%20G8%20GT%202009/MYg8gttocro- pP1320363cropnewG8GT2009.jpg
I agree regarding the pricing issue – one reason that I waited until late last Fall to make my purchase.
Having looked extensively at every other Sport Sedan with roughly comparable performance, dynamics & comfort, I believe that at $30K or less [ actual transaction price ], the G8 GT is untouchable. If those are your personal priorities.
If a [ fairly good ] V6 is OK, the new Infiniti G37 sedan w/7 speed trans. sounds possibly comparable. There were none available for me to test drive when I was ready to decide.
YMMV.
- Ray
Very happy with the G8 GT’s “bang for the buck” index . . .
Well:
"Handsome styling, great motor with fine response, excellent 6-speed automatic transmission and a reasonable price make this a very entertaining sports sedan — I like it," wrote Editor-in-Chief Thos L. Bryant.
R&T's test of the G8 GT... with automatic trans.
Hi Ray...
I made the comment about reading R&T and C&D to the original poster to differentiate the difference between a "sports car", and a "sports sedan". I think the G8 is a great car, and I want one! But they're not getting my money until they offer the GT with a manual, and some interior choices other than black. (I know they offer a two-tone black/red, but that wouldn't go so well with magnetic grey!)
Mark
One of the disadvantages of an AT is the power loss from the torque converter when it's not locked up. There's less power reaching the drive wheels, compared to the direct gears of a manual.
This is true and was a big issue in the old days with 3 speeds. That said, autos these days lock up when cruising on the highway (very little loss in MPG). The electronic lock is released on acceleration. Some of the sophisticated semi autos do not have this hangup.
The other big advantage to a manual is being able to dump the clutch from a standstill. This is especially an advantage on 4WD 4 cyl cars like the WRX which can grip during the influx of energy. It is a false launch as these vehicles show there real colors (lack of torque) once the engine slows down. Some of these 4WD vehicles accelerate to 60 faster under slippery conditions. It utilizes the engine momentum for a longer time.
A buddy of mine did this with his WRX all the time. The car sounded like it was going to blow up when he did it