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I am guessing Honda might be changing their policy on this or else we just ran into exceptionally bad luck, we had 109k on it, and they offered nothing (see my previous posts for the sordid details) - I hung in there and kept lobbying because I have seen on this and other forums, where folks with over 100k got a decent deal from Honda, but, we too could not afford $4100 so we now have a parked 02 Honda Ody that we can't use...
Definately, take it to Honda and nowhere else and get involved with customer service as soon as possible. They didn't honor the trans changes I did myself (with Honda ATF) and acted like that meant they were never done, so it the work isn't done at a Honda dealer, chances are, it will work against you. I know this is not supposed to be the case, but it my case they basically said as much...
Best of luck to you -
When in Colorado in 2003 I used L to go down the 10,000 foot mountains so that I would not run out of brakes. I started in D3; then shifted to 2; then to L. This is 5-speed. I currently have 185,000 kms (115M miles) on it and had to have a rebuilt transmission put in by honda at 178,600 kms in October 2007. Since the rebuilt I have been searching for information about downshifting. The dealer has advised not to shift down; espesially from D5 to 2 in one movement. Beside the rebuilt and wanted to know what else they updated. I was only told they also added a blue knob oiler thet the newest transmissions have. I take it in my case it's brought up to the 2004 equal.
The Honda Manual Booklet states to use the gears like a manual transmission.
After reading many forums I am not prepare to back to the manual shifting rather just use my brakes and let the transmisssion computer make these decisions.
My previous Ford 1992 vehicle stated in the booklet what the gear speed ranges were.
Expert comments please?
Again, thank you so much for your comments and advice!
I had to pay 2100K to get my tranny replaced the second time. It could have been 4000k, but I insisted on an escalation to Honda for reimbursement.
Honda doesn't want the negative publicity and they should foot part of the bill. Also make sure you ask the the service rep for recalls. Even if you have gone over the 100K, they should work with you...
Good luck.
I took my car to my dealer for this recall. My dealer installed this oil jet kit which I now feel being deceived by Honda to do so. If the oil jet kit was not installed in 2004, my transmission might have broken down within 36,000 miles. I feel this 04 recall was merely to prolong this defective transmission's life to protect Honda to replace all the 03 Odyssey transmissions. Honda did not have the decency to ensure the functioning of this oil jet kit.
I trusted Honda 100%. I took my car to my dealer in April, 2007 to have a 40 point checkup. I did the transmission service by this dealer as recommended. On Dec. 23, I was on my way back from the bay area, my car suddenly came to a complete stop shortly after the engine and tcs lights came on. I merely escaped a crash on the high traffic freeway. All the drivers following my car jammed their brakes and swerved to the side.
I have computerized diagnostics from two reputable transmission shops which had arrived at the same conclusion that the transmission was locked up due to overheating as described in the above Honda's Service Bulletin. Honda denied responsibility only blaming this properly maintained transmission with only 89,000 miles to normal wear and tear due to high mileage. Is this a joke? How irresponsible can they get? The service manager did a great job to harass me and my husband and to threaten us to fight for our rights to hold Honda responsible for their design failure.
May God bless us to obtain fairness in this as we will take this matter up with Honda corporation after this holiday. The representative of the Department of Highway Safety wants me to spread the word that anyone has problem like me should make a report by calling 800-424-9393 or visit their website at www.safercar.gov.
We have a 2003 Oddessy with 85k. Transmission is starting to go bad. We live in South Jersey. Any advice?
Thanks, Dan
Don't go anywhere else- do not pass go, do not collect $200. Go directly to a Honda dealer.
I wasn't aware there was a settlement for 2000-2002's - was this just the increase of the warranty to 100k? I couldn't find it online.
While I don't expect Honda would cover all these failures 100%, I am appalled that in nearly all cases they first try to get 4k from the owner and then only after a long battle do they agree to assist for "some" cases. To me, it seems like they would offer a standard amount of assistance based on mileage as opposed to it being a gamble as to whether you get a reasonable case manager. Mine is still sitting as I can't see dropping 4k on a trans that might not last all that long (the rebuilds fail at an alarming rate as well - from this board I've seen 20-30k in some cases)
This experience gave me a new insight on car warranties etc - I don't think I'll spend 30+k on a car again, and never another Honda. I figured that, sure, it might have a premature failure beyond the warranty, but if so many fail it really isn't a warranty issue alone anymore.
This is not surprising since the 2nd gear lubrication problem was not properly inspected by many dealerships (or the stress discoloration was really not that much of a factor in the whole failure) in the '03 Accord V6's & Odyssey.
Also, it wouldn't surprise me to see some '05 & '06 Odyssey failures popping up. My '06 Odyssey with 28k miles slams gears & slips on several occasions.
In my case, Honda is agreeing to pay for some of the transmission replacement. I'm still not sure I'm satisfied. Even if they agree to cover the whole cost, this has been a hassle and more importantly a dissapointment. My wife and I have owned 6 Hondas (this is the first mini-van) and we've never experienced a problem or breakdown. My experience has always been if you follow the maintenance schedule, the car will run forever. Now looking back, it's curious to me that our other 5 Hondas were 4-cylinders (4 of the 5 were manual transmissions).
Here is my 2 cents. Think of the SUV/Truck craze of the 90's. Honda wasn't in this game because they didn't have their own products or V-6 engines (ie the Passport was a rebadged Isuzu Rodeo, the pre-1999 Ody was a small mini-van with a 4 cylinder engine and not big enough for the American consumer to haul the family off to DisneyWorld). They rushed to get these new vehicles developed and built. Likewise, they developed and built V-6 engines to go into these new models. They were behind the curve and needed into this very profitable segment of the auto industry (remember this is all before 9-11, high gas prices, etc). Unfortunately, I think they forgot the transmission design in their haste.
Below is launch timeline for Honda's V6 models made in N. America:
1998 - Accord V6 engine (most or all previous Accords were 4 cylinder, I think?)
1999 - Odyssey V6 engine launch (previous model was 4 cylinder).
1999 - Acura TL V6
2000's - Acura MDX, Pilot, Ridgeline (all with V6)
Honda launched a lot of new cars in a very short time to enter the SUV/truck/minivan race. They were way behind in this very profitable market. They pushed the Hp in these new vehichles because that's what the American consumer likes to see in their monthly addition of Car and Driver. They needed the Hp numbers to attract people away from the Big-3 brands and towards their new products. Look at the Ody, before 1999 it was a 150hp engine, since then it has gone from 210 to 240 to 255 hp. The 210Hp Ody's got the tranny settlement. Now those of us with the 240 hp engines are starting to see tranny problems. I'm sure the 255 hp Ody's are next, they just need a few more miles since this model was launched in 2005.
If you look thru these sites you'll also find V6 Accord and Acura TL tranny complaints. They are pushing too much power thru undersized and poorly designed transmissions. It isn't a manufacturing defect. Honda would fix a manufacturing flaw. It's an inherent design flaw. To admit it's a manufacturing flaw allows them to fix the transmissions on a case by case basis -- 'oh yeah, that one had a bad bearing, replace it'. However, to admit it's a design flaw would put a serious squeeze on them to address every single Ody, TL and Accord out there.
BTW, not sure why I haven't seen Pilot, MDX, Ridgeline issues with the transmission. I think these are all 4WD vehicles, so likely a very different transmission design.
Since this tranny problem, paranoia has the best of me. I've spent a lot of time looking up other Ody defects. I see mpg is often an issue. Our mpg started dropping about a year ago. Hindsight now it seems that that the mpg got continually worse as the 'reverse clunk' got louder right upto the transmission failing.
At least Honda has set a precedent, and would have trouble arguing that if the older models were bad, and they kept using the same design, that it is now the customers fault when it fails!
I assumed when I got out 2005 that they must have fixed the design flaws (plus the failure rate wasn't quite so bad in 2004 when we bought!) but now I am starting to expect the worst. I just hope if it goes, it goes early! If not, wait until I trade it in..
For this reason, I make sure to get my oil changes, etc. at the dealer, and had them do a tranny fluid change at 30K (even though they said it wasn't required yet). If the trans in this van goes, it is a defect, since we drive it carefully, and over maintain.
of course, my SIL has a 1999 that has led a hard life, and now has about 130k, and as far as I know, the tranny is working fine (I know it never failed on her).
I can't seem to get more than 5-6 years out of a car before the desire for a new one becomes too strong (and the squeaks and rattles that vans develop become too annoying), so I will probably trade at 5/60 or 6/75, so I should be safe.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
See http://www.batfa.com/
My Odyssey transmission went at 180,000 kms (Canadian). I currently have 185,000 kms. I have a dealer warranty on the rebuilt of 20,000kms.
Brought it back home to MN, found this thread, took it to a dealer 2 days ago and said I wanted to do a parts/labor split for payment (Honda pays for the parts, we pay labor) and told the service guy I was very informed about the transmission issues the Ody's have had for this year and know that Honda has done many out of warranty "goodwill" repairs for other people.
Got a call from the dealer today and Honda agreed to do the parts/labor split on both the transmission AND the catalytic converter! So we'll pay just the labor to put them in. So finding this thread and being firm but polite with Honda saved us probably $3000. Thanks everyone!
And if you are having similar issues, be informed and find a good dealer, because you can save yourself some serious cash and stress.
Thanks
Thank you.
Before my transmission went, I had visited the dealer where I had it replaced maybe twice. When it went, I limped the car into the dealership, and they called up Honda and got them to do a parts/labor split, where I paid labor and they paid parts. I also got a free rental car for the time period.
So try a different dealer. Getting the money takes some legwork, and it sounds like your dealer is too lazy to get the money from Honda and not you.
1. Check Engine light on with TCS on and off.
2. Brought car to dealership for code check. Paid 99 dollars.
3. Dealer finds two codes PO730 indicating transmission problems and P1491 indicating EGR problem.
4. Dealer says transmission fix will cost 3500 dollars. EGR is a recall so it is free.
5. Refused repair at dealership. Brought the car back home. Parked it in the garage.
6. Called Honda. Fisrt response was the car was out of waranty and nothing can be done. Try to be persistent, polite, provide info that you are a loyal customer of honda. A case was the opened and I was told that someone will contact me in 48 hours.
7. I was contacted after about 36 hours and told that the cost of repairs will be shared. Inform the case manager about your loyalty and the service history at the dealer. Next day the Case manger called me and said that the dealer will contact me. Dealer calls me in another later in the evening and tells me that given the service history at the dealership, they will replace the transmission for free.
8. It took about 3 days for the dealer to fix the car. I would think that they fix it over multiple days as they do not want an expert car mechanic to spent all day fixing one car.
9. I was told there is 36 month 36k warranty on the remanufactured transmission.
Tips:
I did not drive my van for almost a week from the day the problem was found and until I brought it back into dealership.
Be persistent and polite with Honda.
Do not blame or curse honda or dealership for the failure.
Do not even think of bringing your van outside of Honda dealer service shop.
Read as many posts about your problem on this forum and the internet
Although I am not happy with the episode, but I am satisfied with the fact that Honda took care of this. Although I do wonder that what would be the scenario if I had not done all my service at Honda dealership. From the first time the case manager contacted me, I knew that Honda will give me the remnaufactured transmission for free. The question was of labor then. In my case the dealer had told me it would be 1200 dollars. I had started calling other Honda dealership for the labor on putting the transmission back in again. It ranged from 850 to 1200 dollars. At one time I was planning to bring the van to the dealership with lowest labor and have Honda ship the remanufactured transmission to that dealership.
I wish best of luck to people who are dealing with this and want to thank this forum for helping me save the money.
Not to be a killjoy but you do realize the original design defect(s) was not corrected. You were simply issued a refurbished transmission with the same inherent Honda V6 transmission problems (bad torque converter design, gear slipping, etc). Some of these problems are still in the '05 & '06's.
Keep this in mind when determining the life cycle of your '03.
Just a caution to readers that are facing this issue; many situations turn out well like this one, many others do not. I had full maintenance records (though some done by myself) and had just spent nearly 3k on a timing belt, brake work etc AT the dealer, told them this is our 3rd Honda in 10 years and the dealer and Honda USA treated me very poorly and offered NOTHING!
I was very polite and persistent and even shared posts from this forum and others and nothing swayed them whatsoever. The interesting thing is that my dealer only reluctantly went to Honda USA after gentle prodding on my behalf; that may have been the beginning of the end. What I'm saying is these posts prove that Honda's support for this issue is all over the map - so even if you do everything right, they may tell you to jump in a lake! (almost sounds like the insurance company trick to trash every third claim to contain costs!)
Some have suggested to get a rental car thinking would cover it as well, I wouldn't chance that, I had to rent a car 1 WEEK for them to decide they would offer no assistance; can you believe they kept the car 1 week to do/offer nothing!
When I tried to reference the instances in this forum where they did the right thing they simply dismissed it and said each case is evaluated individually. Which means for whatever reason, they decide they aren't going to offer assistance, you're screwed.
I have to reiterate this really surprised me from Honda, we kept at it several weeks thinking they would help out. I almost think if would help other folks to track which dealers are getting good results in support for these; all I can figure is the dealer/case manager combination did me in!
Yes, I believe you are right, we had a CRV with AWD. My point really was that the transmission in the Pilot/MDX/Ridgeline is a much different design then the transmission in the TL/Accord/Odyssey, which has the obvious design flaw.
I guess the AWD/4WD must send half of the transmission problems to the rear tires thus doubling the life of the transmission
Quick downshifts. The transmission has a computerized control system called grade logic. When going down a hill, even a light touch of the brake pedal can cause grade logic to downshift to the next lower gear. Downshifting helps to slow the vehicle through engine braking.
I took it to my dealership and initially diagnosed this as an EGR and I paid for the EGR (About 250). That did not fix it and I persisted.
They finally came up with a diagnosis of a shot tranny and rear motor mount which they got Honda to pay for in full. I did not even have to fight or argue - they are probably the most easy and helpful delearships I have in my area (tranny cost about 4k while the motor mount about 1200). The very week I had my tranny done, the delearship told me of another similar case where they got Honda to pay for another 05 Ody tranny and motor mount.
Seems like the rear motor mount that was put in was an "updated" one meaning it was poorly designed. The reason for it being so expensive - it is a new kind that send signals to the on board computer for the active noise cancellation. I suspect that the VCM engine in the 3-cyl mode generates way too many vibrations killing the mount (seems like poor design). Interestingly the 2008 ODY has a new VCM system that goes from 3 to 4 to 6 cyls. May be it was the motor mount?
As to the tranny even after the rebuilt tranny it doesn't shift right. I am persisting and trying to get the dealership to help me out.
Does anyone know if they fixed the tranny issues in the 08? I will probably replace the 05 with an 08.
It quite frustrating that a company like Honda with a great reputation haven't fixed the tranny issues even as late as the 2005 models after a redesign!
My '06 Odyssey EXL-NAV/RES transmission with 28k miles has been slipping occasionally but not enough to reproduce for the dealer. I will more than likely unload the car before the 60k mile factory warranty expires.
As for the '07 & '08's, they have the redesigned 4-shaft transmission from the Pilot/Ridgeline trucks. There is not enough data yet to see how reliable they are. Personally, if you are looking for a 100k mile tranny I would look elsewhere other than Honda. They have a horrible track record (many cases not reported on forums or consumer guides since Honda is great about paying for design defects.
But that's the 1st story I've heard of a 2005+ model having a failed transmission- all the stories so far have been 99-04 models.
I remember my first job working in a Japanese Company. It was all total indoctrination about quality- you eat, drink, and sleep nothing but quality in mind. To get to the point, what Honda is doing regarding this transmission issue is unthinkable to Japanese standards. To deny responsibility to something wrong for years is just unthinkable. i just can't understand they let go these transmissions out their yard. Where's the HONDA TOTAL QUALITY CONTROL? KAIZEN? 5-S?
DAME DESU NE!
Like everyone else here who trusted Honda 'Quality', I too felt betrayed. I will definitely get in touch with the attorney general and BBB. I am so dissatisfied and unhappy right now that i wished I had told My Case Manager (Jack) that it is better to make your mother-in-law angry than make one customer dissatisfied and unhappy. You know why? you can live without your mother in law but your customer will never buy from you again.
Hope we all be united.
I was at the other end of the spectrum, they offered nothing and cost me a 1 week rental fee to say so! As per my previous threads, I didn't expect 100% but after the dealer asked for $4100, reluctantly contacted the dealer - kept the car 1 week and game back and said sorry nothing! Then ran the Honda cust service route and the case manager actually deffered to the regional manager who offered zero - why call Honda corporate cust service?
I kept at it because of the "success" stories I really thought they would meet me halfway but no dice. Point is, this is our 3rd Honda as well, and we really thought highly up to now.
Honda richly deserves some legal action in my opinion - as I've said before, think about all the folks that just paid the $4100 or so and trusted the dealer - they probably couldn't afford it any more than I can but maybe they hadn't run into great forums like this one!
I've worked at a Mitsubishi funded company and toured many japanese companies as a quality professional; this problem screams out design fault - proven also by the rebuilds failing at a high rate. I have to wonder if Honda Japan is in the loop here.
Japanese companies audit its suppliers and 'punish' those with high defect rates by switching to other suppliers. Plain and simple.Natural selection.
Honda surely gets the worst supplier award and for Defect Recurrence - year after year after ...that's consistent in quality - BAD QUALITY.
Now back to business.
Shouldn't automobiles be better as the years go by? Facts show Honda did nothing to improve reliability but pour its resources to cosmetics only. Shame.
We are partly to blame. I think we can help improve Honda quality by not buying their products. The more they produce - the more they make defective products and in turn eat up their profits on 'goodwill repairs'.
Honda is a monster we American Consumers created. We are feeding it and it is eating us alive.
think..think...think...
I'm sure a lemon law suit helps get their attention, and if you are lucky, it will lead to a replacement vehicle if they obviously can't fix yours.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
http://nhthqnwws111.odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/acms/docservlet/Artemis/Public/Recalls/200- 4/V/RCRIT-04V176-2519.PDF
Hause
As for me. No more Hondas.