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Is Cadillac's Image Dying and Does Anyone Care?

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Comments

  • questiongeekquestiongeek Member Posts: 19
    The XLR is not supposed to sell in huge numbers. It's for the rich, like the Ferrari Testarossa is. If it sold in huge numbers, there would be no sense of exclusiveness to it. The XLR supposedly has a Corvette chassis but is no where near as fun to drive as a Corvette, and at the price point they ask $80,000, there are things about the XLR that scream ---> lacking refinement.

    I found it quite surprising that in your post you claim the STS is not big enough. How big does a car have to be? By the way, the STS replaced the beloved Seville. The DTS replaced the Devilles, Fleetwoods, and Eldorados, the CTS replaced the Cimarron and Catera
  • questiongeekquestiongeek Member Posts: 19
    Dude.. Bravo! I couldn't have said it better myself! In the 1980s Cadillac caused massive defections from their brand and GM cars in general with the junk they foisted upon the public. Then they had the nerve to turn around and complain that people weren't buying their junk, and refused to pay top dollar for it. LOL! It's laughable. An top brand luxury car whose engine destructs at 20,000 miles is inexcusable no matter how someone trys to explain it. Oh and I just love the "brilliant" V-8-6-4 engine. Jeeez what was GM smoking when they developed heap of an engine

    I remember in 1988 when my boss told me, "Well the reason I bought a Honda Accord instead of a Cadillac, is because the pieces fit."

    Cadillac really didn't become decent again till the late 1990's with the exception of the fiasco called the Catera
  • questiongeekquestiongeek Member Posts: 19
    dieselone that's why people that buy the 3 series BMWs buy them, BECAUSE OF THE WAY THEY DRIVE, not because of snob appeal. Snob appeal is an unfortunate stereotype that BMW developed, because rich yuppies like them, and it's a European car (where all the people with the stuck up accents live)
  • questiongeekquestiongeek Member Posts: 19
    It had very much to do with lack of vision on GMs part. That's a major part of their problem. The Hummer was one of their biggest mistakes to date - Very poor timing They should have been the ones that developed that Pepsi throwback commercial and aired it with the Hummer commercials, cause that's what it was, a setback. The Hummer reminded me of when they introduced the Buick Roadmaster; another monumental flop. Here it was the mid 1980's and they introduce a car that looks like it was from a 1972 time warp.

    Most people dont realize that the EV1 had nothing to do with GM wanting to get into the LEV market or Hybrid market. At the time, California had a law that required 2 percent of vehicles sold in the state to be ZEV. GM developed and sold the EV1 to comply and compete with this law. Once the law was scrapped, the EV1s were scrapped and crushed too. They were very expensive to build and market, some became safety hazards, and there was no service infrastructure for them. However despite the EV1s problems, they were a huge success because people were willing to support the idea ,actually liked the car and got used to not having to fill up the car with petro fuel. Almost every EV1 leasee offered to buy the car or continue leasing it. GM didn't care, and didn't want to hear it.

    If GM had vision, they would have found a way to stick with the EV1 project to compete with the successful Asian hybrids, but no what did they do? ; they offered FLEXFUEL. "Come on everyone, come get our FlexFuel vehicles, that have very limited fuel availability, costs more than petro fuel, exploits another commodity-->corn, when we could be using those vast lands to grow food to feed people instead of cars and gargantuan SUVs and trucks". Jeeez. give me a break...

    Then almost ten years too late, they introduce the Chevy Volt to effectively compete with Asian hybrids. I dont even think it's available yet, but almost. The Chevy Volts expensive price point has already turned many buyers off. And based on GMs past behavior many don't have confidence in the car or trust it.

    It's this kind of behavior and marketing that makes many think of GM as backwards, scatterbrained, behind the times, terribly mismanaged, and yeah, having lack of vision
    ___________________________________
    cooterbfd wrote:
    Selling the Hummer wasn't a lack of vision, not expanding the EV-1 to a Prius like car, or offering a Duramax in the Hummer WAS.
  • questiongeekquestiongeek Member Posts: 19
    Well excuse me but some of us are not so fat that we can't comfortably fit into a BMW 3 series. I realize this is the land of the fatties (USA) but not everyone in this country is huge. Many of us are slender like Italians and French
  • questiongeekquestiongeek Member Posts: 19
    And why is this approach 30 years late? We had to wait until 2009 to get a nice interior in a Cadillac. Does anyone else see anything wrong with this picture?
  • questiongeekquestiongeek Member Posts: 19
    Not only that, but Caddy might be made by Toyota, Honda or Hyundai very, very soon!
    ________________________

    In a loose interpretation, this has been done before since many Cadillac chassis share with Chevy and Toyota has made some cars for Chevy
  • questiongeekquestiongeek Member Posts: 19
    The reason some people have a problem with GM cloning, is because their clones look too similar, or in some cases almost identical and GM does this cloning too much. Actually cosmetic engineering is the proper term for it, or badge engineering as some like to call it
  • questiongeekquestiongeek Member Posts: 19
    In case you didnt know, the STS is supposed to satisfy everyone's past Seville cravings. (Seville Touring Sedan),

    The DTS is supposed to satisfy everyone's past Fleetwood and Coupe De Ville cravings (Deville Touring Sedan)

    and the CTS is supposed to satisfy everyone's Catera and Cimarron cravings (Catera Touring Sedan or Sport, and Cimarron Touring Sedan or Sport or Special)
  • lemkolemko Member Posts: 15,261
    I'm big, but I'm not fat. I'm 6' @ 194 lbs. I can fit in a 3 Series, but I don't care for its dimunitive dimensions. For the same price, I can get a real car like a Mercury Grand Marquis LS and still have change left over.
  • british_roverbritish_rover Member Posts: 8,502
    Yes cause real cars have body on frame platforms from 1979.

    Seriously man what are you smoking?
  • circlewcirclew Member Posts: 8,666
    Business as usual: Clone for the Escalade, SRX that is second-rate, a bigger CTS and a 3-series fighter (probably will look very much like the Catera).

    2010 SRX Comes Up Short

    It's not exactly the lean, mean competing machine I was expecting from Cadillac, or any of the GM core divisions, and I'm particularly disheartened about the way Caddy seems to be developing vehicles to match up with the competition instead of going its own way. Remember, it was only seven or so years ago that the General's luxury division was essentially dead on its wheels. It took the introduction of the CTS, which looked unlike anything else on the road when it debuted, to start changing people's perceptions of the division. (Okay, that and some serious cash.)

    I just hope GM management isn't forgetting what it took to get people to forget the CTS' predecessor.

    Caddi-LACK of Planning

    Regards,
    OW
  • cooterbfdcooterbfd Member Posts: 2,770
    I think you're missing lem's point. The 3 is a sport sedan. Anything lemko may find at fault with it, (small, rough ride, etc) is EXACTLY why it is considered to be the best sport sedan in the world.

    Considering lemko's car choices, what a G.M. offers in spite of it's 30 yr old frame is more palateable to his tastes.
  • british_roverbritish_rover Member Posts: 8,502
    I get his point and I don't have any problem with the Grand Marquis it is a nice big floaty boat. It is a good highway car and gets ok mileage for its size. Its not fair to call the Marquis a real car and say the 3 series isn't. They are on two polar opposite ends of the market and Ford could make a much better big floaty highway cruiser without using a platform from 1979. That would cost a lot of money that Ford doesn't have right now which is why the aren't doing it.
  • cooterbfdcooterbfd Member Posts: 2,770
    True enough. I think from that perspective, the Panther platform is the poster child for what has been wrong with the American car. Had they built a new platform every say, 10 years for it, then it would've been more than just fleet fodder for the last 10 years.
  • questiongeekquestiongeek Member Posts: 19
    2010 SRX

    That doesn't even look like a Cadillac. Looks like the Volkwagen Touareg or Nissan of some sort
  • questiongeekquestiongeek Member Posts: 19
    Luckily my dad had the patience to teach me how to drive a stick, although it wasn't easy for me to learn at first. To this day, I still prefer a stick shift, even in traffic. Automatic trannys are so boring, it's pitiful
  • questiongeekquestiongeek Member Posts: 19
    I'm very glad that GM said NO when the Tesla Group asked them for financing. Instead Mercedes took them under their wing. GM would have ruined everything.

    I adore the Teslas. It's the kind of innovation and forward thinking we need instead of arrogance and complacency.
  • questiongeekquestiongeek Member Posts: 19
    lemko the main reason that a person would like a BMW 330 as opposed to a Mercury Marquis is because the BMW handles much better. A Mercury floats on the road and can't turn sharp corners, seats are too soft, the suspension is like a seasick inducing ocean liner., etc..

    Besides, this is like comparing oranges and apples. Two different markets here. The Cadillac CTS is long overdue. They should have introduced that car 23 years ago
  • marsha7marsha7 Member Posts: 3,703
    "I remember in 1988 when my boss told me, "Well the reason I bought a Honda Accord instead of a Cadillac, is because the pieces fit."

    Where were you when we needed you in the United Auto Workers topic???...that sums up the crap of the UAW in one sentence...

    Kinda makes me wish I was that smart to describe why I bought 4 Hondas from 1985-1988, keeping the two 88's until 1998 and 2001 respectively...
  • circlewcirclew Member Posts: 8,666
    Agreed. GM will never be number one again, I'm afraid.

    Regards,
    OW
  • circlewcirclew Member Posts: 8,666
    The UAW discussion was a riot...seems to have died down since the C11's.

    Regards,
    OW
  • questiongeekquestiongeek Member Posts: 19
    nvbanker this is not a problem if a person can plug the car in when they get to work, then only 4 to 8 hours is needed to charge the car. I am in love with the Tesla! It's gorgeous, quiet, sleek, and just the kind of forward the thinking we need. The range of Teslas between charges is impressive. You don't get just 40 miles on a charge. :\

    Chevy Volt Schmolt. Somehow I don't think so. It's a hybrid. 40 miles on a charge, then it switches to gasoline, and another big problem. It's got the GM name attached to it.

    I'd rather pay $50,000 for the Tesla than $40,000 for the Chevy Volt. Teslas are made my car enthusiasts, not financiers, wall street "whores" and people who think like dinosaurs.
  • questiongeekquestiongeek Member Posts: 19
    She's probably on her cell phone too. Although I can't say anything, because I've paid my money at the gas station and driven away without putting any gas in the car. We all have our blonde moments
  • questiongeekquestiongeek Member Posts: 19
    Thanks Marsha7. It was obvious to everyone but General Motors, UAW, and their delusional customers. Their recent bankruptcy was of no surprise to me. It had been stewing for decades.

    Oh and I've been here, I used to be "mediapusher" on here :). I Lost interest in the discussions for a while among others things.
  • cannon3cannon3 Member Posts: 296
    Cadillac is well on its way to becoming world class. GM needs to keep this rolling even through this bankruptcy deal. GM needs to let Cadillac engineers/managers continue to develop cars/crossovers to compete with Acura/Lexus/BMW/Audi ect..
    The image of Cadillac has greatly improved in the last 5 years. I work with young professionals and Cadillac is once again in the auto conversations that take place.
    Are you listening GM??
  • marsha7marsha7 Member Posts: 3,703
    In theory, what's left of GM and Cadillac should be able to engineer some great cars, simply because they can put their money into better engines and design, rather than spend money trying to figure out how to badge engineer across 4-5 other lines...

    Of course, great engineering and design will be made by the UAW, so, like it or not, we are truly back at Square One, just in a smaller company...the lousy, worthless, overpaid, unskilled UAW workers are still going to be there, so will anything REALLY change???
  • circlewcirclew Member Posts: 8,666
    Everything changes. That's why GM went bankrupt. Let's see what they do with Cadillac.

    Using the same Lambda platform for yet another GM crossover tells you something. Targeting the 3-series tells you something. Stretching the CTS tells you something. The 2010 SRX tells you something.

    AFAIC, nothing really world class there so far. Let's let the products speak for themselves. GM typically will overprice. Pricing strategy is not their strong point, never has been...except, arguably, for the Corvette.

    They really should under promise and over deliver but they are not made up of that fabric.

    Regards,
    OW
  • alain_changeralain_changer Member Posts: 25
    GM going bankrupt was actually a good thing. Liquidation would have been better, as opposed to Chapter 11 or whatever they filed. They were really just too large of a company/corporation. When a corporation gets that large many problems develop, one of those is too many layers of management , which equals ineffective communication between levels of echelon (red tape)

    Also the way GM did business didn't make financial sense. Having extreme liabilities with health care and pensions, etc.. There was no way they could compete effectively in today's market. It goes way beyond the bad decision they made to cheapen the quality of their cars.

    All this, yet they can compete in China very well. Perhaps much of the financial success of their brand over in China has much to do with licensing. It's the same way vehicle fuel stations operate in the U.S.A. Underneath the GM name in China, business operations probably look and are very different from their USA cousins.

    If American origin car makers hadn't had serious European or Asian competition, we in America would still be driving 1960's/ 1970's like Detroit automobiles. Who would really be ok with that?

    Let's hope they changed their tune in the U.S.A., cause that's the only way they will be able to survive here. Right now the only "Standard of the World" is the CTS, and many would even question that badge of honor based on the transmission problems many on the Edmunds blogs are complaining about. I really am not sure what "standard of the world" means anyway. It's an ambiguous phrase. Was Cadillac ever the standard of the world??
  • caddilistcaddilist Member Posts: 6
    YES!! caddy has ups and dpwns since 1902!!! we will prevail as the standard
    of the world !! my new caddy proves it as heads turn daily!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    if the world is watching? iam there too help each person matters and all
    cadillac owners WILL UNITE!!!!!!!
    CADILLIST RENO NV. U.S.A.
  • circlewcirclew Member Posts: 8,666
    Caddy might compete with "My Bob's Furniture" on wheels but it's NOT the standard of the world in anything except Bankruptcy. Period. :P

    Regards,
    OW
  • alain_changeralain_changer Member Posts: 25
    Your new caddy proves it cause it turns heads daily? What kind of validation is that? Let's see how you do after 50,000 miles, then come back and talk to us.
  • alain_changeralain_changer Member Posts: 25
    Bravo circlew. The only "standard of the world" I see from Cadillac is the CTS, but when compared to the competition, even it seems to fall short of expectations based on the reviews I've read. For instance, 35 years later, and at last we have an interior in a Cadillac that a BMW would envy or at least an interior that emulates the BMW. :\ Why did it take 35 years. They can't afford to miss the mark and be so far behind in the future. The 2009 CTS should have been here when all the yuppie adults and teens were driving BMW 325s in the 1980's. That's how late it is, and that's how late GM is.

    It would be different if GM priced their cars correctly, but they want too much for them, based on what you get.

    Nissan is about to challenge GM in 2011 with a full fledged pull all the stops electric car, something they could have capitalized on in the 1990's. Is GM prepared for this? Probably not, just like they weren't prepared for the Prius, huge demand for small cars, or how to build decent interiors for luxury cars that don't screamcheap. At $3.00 a gallon now, we will never see long bouts of $1.20 per gallon vehicle fuel again, because the oil industry doesn't like those low prices for consumers.
  • plektoplekto Member Posts: 3,738
    Wait - you have it wrong. The CTS is supposed to be a 5 series competitor for 10-15K less money. It's not supposed to complete at all with the 3 series, but people mistakenly put them together based upon price and the fact that they don't see a smaller Cadillac.(though they do make a smaller 3 series sized model... in Europe - they don't ship it over here is all)

    GM does price the CTS correctly. Compare it to a 5 series and it's suddenly a very good deal. Note - this is exactly what Hyundai is doing against Toyota and Honda - 90-95% the quality and feel for 20% less.
  • rayainswrayainsw Member Posts: 3,192
    I do not typically test drive cars I am not seriously interested in buying sometime soon – I don’t think that is fair, to the sales person or the dealership. I made an exception recently.

    I am not seriously interested in trading my G8 GT in for a Caddy CTS-v – today. But I was very curious, after reading a number of reviews by professionals & owners, to see if this could be something I’d look at as a used car - in a few years.

    I hope the new CTS-v survives for a while. With GM and the general economy where it is & looks likely to be headed, I seriously doubt that GM will develop & build anything similar in the next decade.

    So, anyway: I drove a used [ approx. 8,500 miles ] CTS-v with 6L90 automatic trans one Saturday morning. A relatively short drive – only 3 or 4 miles. Impressions here first – then a couple of observations below:

    Though the drive was brief & included no speeds above 60 \ 65 MPH or so [ no highway – just gathering initial impressions here ] I was quite impressed with the acceleration & ride. The Eaton supercharger’s whine is reasonably well muted.

    As many have said: The wealth of TQ at any RPM provides very satisfying acceleration in any gear at any speed – with a feeling of effortlessness.

    The ride was quite pleasant, given the capabilities of the car & the tires – and the approx. 4,200 pounds of vehicle weight [ plus me & another 200 pounds of ballast = Sales Associate ] being controlled. Kudos to mag-ride.

    I certainly did not stress the car in braking or handling, but it felt quite competent & reassuring in normal driving.

    I believe the 0-60 & quarter mile times I have seen reported. The acceleration in the 5 – 60 \ 65 MPH range, using moderate RPM but wide throttle openings was exhilarating fun. The road test results I have read indicate that the maximum acceleration is better than my Corvette Coupe. And to feel that in a car more similar in size to my G8 GT is quite interesting & very entertaining.

    I found the interior materials, fit & finish quite acceptable.
    The exterior paint & trim seemed well planned & executed. The entire vehicle seemed to reflect quality at least in line with this class.

    The MSRP of a similar new 2009 CTS-v would be in the mid-$60K range. And anything else in approximately this same class \ category [ looking at both performance \ functionally & luxury appointments ] I see prices quite a bit higher.

    I do hope this car survives.

    In spite of the EPA MPG ratings, I will keep the CTS-v on my “short list” – for when I decide to seriously look again for a Sport Sedan.

    Does this mean that GM has made Cadillac “..the standard of the world Again?”

    What this does mean [ to me ] is that GM has produced a very well equipped & well engineered Sport Sedan – that is quite comfortable, and exhilarating to drive – for a very competitive & reasonable price. In my humble opinion.

    Cheers,
    - Ray
    Just 1 data point . . .
    2022 X3 M40i
  • ajvdhajvdh Member Posts: 223
    My teenage son went out with a friend of his and his friend's father on a tire-kicking mission last Saturday: The friend's dad wanted to look at (among other things) the M3 and new CTS-v. The BMW dealer had no M3s on the lot. I found that interesting because a couple of months ago they had 6, and were desperately trying to move them. Must have worked.

    The Caddy dealer had a new "v" in the showroom. He wouldn't let them take it out, which I guess is not too surprising. Right off the bat, the salesman quoted $55,000, and after a little conversation let it be known that they'd be willing to come down to close to $50k.

    Impressions of the car? My son described the interior as "incredible" - in the good sense. "I can't believe it's from the same people who made the old CTS. It's a nice design and well put together. Really, really nice!" He didn't like the overall shape of the outside, reiterating my observation about its unfortunate resemblance to a Braun shaver with wheels, but said, "it still looks meeeean!"
  • circlewcirclew Member Posts: 8,666
    Great post. You give some of the best reviews I've seen in Edmund's forums.

    The CTS is one bright spot out of Caddy. That's it.

    The CTS-v is interesting but for 20K cheaper your G8 GT is a way better value. I agree with alain changer that the price is too high for all Cadillac models presently. The level of quality of the CTS is a few notches down than the Europeans, particularly Audi. Their designs are going the right way afaic and I never went for the weird science look of Caddy. The CTS interior is a breakthrough in 2008 as is the 2010 LaCrosse.

    I'd say you have the best of both worlds out of GM, 2 of the best models produced to date. One developed over 50 years and one Aussie-built gem.

    Regards,
    OW
  • plektoplekto Member Posts: 3,738
    I second this the Holden "G8" (it's worth noting that it's designed and built in Australia which has tastes and desires in vehicles as different from the U.S. as Europe) is by far the best car GM has ever made. 400hp, inexpensive, awesome interior, good handling... And it looks awesome.

    It's the quintessential "last hurrah" for GM. End of an era and so on...
  • alain_changeralain_changer Member Posts: 25
    Ok, I stand to be corrected. The CTS isn't a BMW 3 series competitor. But at first I didn't think it was as large as a 5 series.

    And actually I think you're talking about the BLS in Europe that has the Saab engine. I don't know why they're not selling that stateside. Hello GM? Anyone home?

    In regards to Hyundai, the stuff they first introduced to the market was absolute junk. Unfortunately, I think they just did that to hurry up and get into the market. It took a while but they were able to rebuild their image and reputation. It's that simple. Provide quality and your customers will come in droves.

    Based on what I've read in reviews the revamped CTS has some shortcomings, but seems worth the money overall if you drive it lightly. I know a couple that is on their 2nd CTS. They love them.

    Now if only GM could replicate the excitement over the CTS with their other cars. I must say, I'm really surprised that the STS has not garnered more excitement. It basically looks like an enlarged CTS. But then again once I took a look at the interior of an STS, I was turned off too. And if they have the STS, why do they need the DTS? I don't understand.
  • alain_changeralain_changer Member Posts: 25
    I know that many people have a problem with the crystal- meth synapse looks of the front of the CTS, but what I dont like is the retro Eldorado budding fin looks in the back of the car. We don't need to go backwards, we needs to move forward.

    I must admit I was impressed at the CTSs interior as well. If I hadn't seen the logos, I would have thought I was sitting in a BMW or similar car. This coming from someone who in the past wouldn't touch a Cadillac even with surgical gloves
  • caddilistcaddilist Member Posts: 6
    THINK before you type people!!people make mistakes as cadillac did!! pastense!
    !!!since 1902!!!!! wake up!!! smell the fertilizer!!!!
    a century of greatness and some are still mad about a cimeron????????
    or a humpback?? i like caddys so what about people who love caddys
    like myself and own plenty!!!i own a lemans racer big bucks$ and it commands
    respect everywhere its shown!! EVERYWHERE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!plus iam a millionaire
    and love cadillacs!! i might be the avenging angel for GM!!!pick on yugo or
    dawoo NOT! cadillac....
    GREG BERLIN (cadilist) RENO NV. :)
  • rayainswrayainsw Member Posts: 3,192
    "!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!plus iam a millionaire
    and love cadillacs!! i might be the avenging angel for GM!!!pick on yugo or
    dawoo NOT! cadillac.... "

    Good grief.....
    2022 X3 M40i
  • lemkolemko Member Posts: 15,261
    I would like to respond to that with all the profanity in all the gangsta rap ever recorded and all of Martin Scorcese's movies, but that would get me banned forever.

    Cadillac was, is, and will always be the Standard of the World in my book!
  • lemkolemko Member Posts: 15,261
    I can come back to you in 157,000+ miles with my 1989 Cadillac Brougham and talk to you - and this is supposedly a Cadillac from the dark ages of the 1980s. The car still looks and runs like a brand new car. If I wasn't happy with my Brougham, I wouldn't have followed up with three more Cadillacs in 1994, 2002, and 2007.
  • lemkolemko Member Posts: 15,261
    What competition? At least I can count on the CTS to get me to work. One of those Teutonic tanks would leave one bankrupt and at the side of the road. Well, at least you'll look good waiting for the tow truck next to your 3-Series.
  • lemkolemko Member Posts: 15,261
    I'm with you, caddylist! I've been in love with Cadillac ever since I was 3 years-old and saw my neighbor's sleek black 1963 Sedan DeVille. I currently have a 1989 Cadillac Brougham and a 2007 Cadillac DTS Performance - both of which I have purchased new.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,167
    That's a generous way of looking at it, but at least in my opinion, the market does not take the CTS to compete with the 5er or E. It's what GM hopes for, but reality doesn't match it. And upon seeing a loaded CTS (non V) in a showroom stickering a few hundred dollars shy of 50K, it's not always terribly cheaper. It's seen as a relatively equal priced larger competitor to the 3er or C.

    The BLS is probably the rarest new car in Europe.

    The answer isn't to offer something almost as good for a quite bit less, it is to offer something better for a little bit less. When brand cachet has decayed like what happened to Caddy, one is in no position to try to define a new market. It hasn't worked.
  • tlongtlong Member Posts: 5,194
    The CTS is supposed to be a 5 series competitor for 10-15K less money. It's not supposed to complete at all with the 3 series, but people mistakenly put them together based upon price and the fact that they don't see a smaller Cadillac.

    That may be true, but Caddy would REALLY be the standard of the world if they could produce a 5-series competitor that would sell successfully *at* 5-series prices. That would be a statement that Caddy was perceived as equal in value to BMW.
  • tlongtlong Member Posts: 5,194
    And actually I think you're talking about the BLS in Europe that has the Saab engine. I don't know why they're not selling that stateside. Hello GM? Anyone home?

    I've harped on this for a long time. If GM says it can't be profitable making small cars - well BMW and Audi and VW are making profitable small cars. Why can't GM make a 3-series competitor? Not all Americans are 250lb tubs of lard, some of us like quality small cars. And we have had NO viable vehicles from US nameplates! GM and their lack of strategy should have put out a quality 3-series type car rather than the typical muscle machine Camaro that is likely going to be a flash in the pan.
  • ingvaringvar Member Posts: 205
    some of us like quality small cars. And we have had NO viable vehicles from US nameplates!
    +1. Why GM can't build something like 335i, G35/37.
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