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Subaru Forester (up to 2005)
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Comments
I dropped it from consideration after seeing those crash results.
-juice
If you look at the detailed numbers, the biggest issue is the footwell intrusion, which is higher than the best performers, and resulted in the grade of "acceptable" on the structural rating instead of "good" (= highest). The head acceleration measures were a little high, but IIHS didn't slam them for it.
It's clear that nothing can touch the Sienna, a 5 year old design. Not even the latest Honda. Too bad the Sienna is so roundly disparaged by the auto press as being dated. I really don't like the Sienna's ride and handling - which is a deal killer for me, given that these results were still pretty positive.
These results give me pause, but they're not a deal killer. The gov't tests are quite good (different tests of course). Overall a pretty safe van, significantly better than any of the top sellers by units (DC, Ford).
-juice
Depending on what MY2003 brings. If I do decide to keep Al'Gator, I might add these
http://makeashorterlink.com/?E2AE12F7
or
http://makeashorterlink.com/?X1CE45F7
and move the DE Xenon on the '98 OB to the '99 OBS
-Dave
Gene
The new CR-V is not rated yet, but newer Hondas have not matched their predecessors (Civic, Odyssey) in reliability.
All Subies are better than average in reliability, and all earned the Recommended rating. They are all recommended as used models, and there aren't any on the used cars to avoid list. That's solid consistency.
I realize that's an average, and some of us of course will have had some issues, but this means the odds are in your favor with the Forester. Even if you had bad luck with yours, pick any other cute ute and it would likely have been worse!
Let's all give our Foresters a nice bath this weekend. :-)
On the vans - the Ody and MPV are set up best for 2 kid families. With 3 you can't fold the seat, so you give up cargo space. That's fine for me because we don't plan on having more than two, but other may prefer a different interior layout.
For the vans, reliability went Sienna, MPV, then Odyssey, then the also-rans.
-juice
Good news for Subaru!
Steve
Host
SUVs, Vans and Aftermarket & Accessories Message Boards
-juice
Does anybody know if there are any aftermarket Xenon headlamps for Foresters?
Any hints about Subaru installing them as standard for '03 models?
I am satisfied with normal headlamps, but would not hesitate in upgrading to Xenon if available.
Tomas
Got to http://www.hella.com
They have a wide variety.
-Dave
I apologize if any of these items have previously been discussed. I did review the Boards and found numerous helpful comments but no real consensus. And you all know a lot more than I do. Thanks for the help.
Bob
Ross
- Updated styling inside and out
- More rigid chassis
- Slight increase in rear legroom
- Improved handling: quicker steering and higher roll center
- Less brake dive and squat
- Improved saftey features (side impact airbags)
You may be able to get a slightly better deal on a 2002, but in my area (Bay Area, CA) Subaru dealers usually sell new models for 3-4% over invoice so the price difference isn't that great, IMO.
Ken
Unless you much prefer the 2002, or need it right away, I'd wait.
The new one is also 90 pounds lighter. Throw in the extra inch of leg room for your kid, and the choice is easy.
-juice
Pete
-juice
Ken
Bob
I would recommend getting the up grade.
I got the factory tweeter kit, speaker upgrade, sub-woofer/amplifier and the difference from the model I test drove without those was dramatic!
Whether you choose to do the work yourself our at an after market shop or go with factory is up to you, but I would definitely do it.
The one thing you might consider is that if the dealer/factory has any problems with the install or you experience any problems down-the-line, you're covered. As I've seen posted here, if
someone screws up your electrical or you have problems with the electrical at a later date, some dealers won't do repairs until the after market stuff is removed and the system returned to original.
Good luck!
-Donn
The stock speakers are cheap paper units with whizzer cones. The upgrades not only add the tweeters and subwoofer, but the speakers themselves are of higher quality material. Since high frequency sounds are directional, the tweeters mounted at the top of the door will give you the perception of a wider stereo sound.
If you like taking things on by yourself, you can get even better quality by going aftermarket. The door speakers are of standard size so you can simply swap them out with an aftermarket brand of the same size with no modifcations.
Here's what I recommend:
- Get the tweeters from the dealer and install them yourself. The doors are pre-wired for them and the installation is simple.
- Buy front and rear speakers (get at least two-ways) from any reputable audio shop. Crutchfield is a good start.
- Buy the subwoofer from the dealer or get the equivalent model (I believe it's a Clarion) aftermarket. I'm not sure about the installation but I believe it's prewired as well.
Ken
thanks in advance,
S
--'rocco
On low speeds, stop and go travel, the engine temperature indicator on the dashboard veers dangerously close to the 'red' zone. However once the speed rises to about 30+, the needle comes back to the center. Today when I was going up a steep incline in San Francisco, the needle even shot past the red zone!. Does anyone know why this is happenning?
Also, I think the recommended tire pressures (27f/28r) is too low, I get comfortable handling at (32f/33r)-any comments?
This being my first Subaru and AWD, I am surprised to experience some problems so early in the vehicle's life.
Thanks
It manages on the flat at high speeds because of the cooling as the car pushes the radiator through the air, but as soon as you ask the engine to do more, or reduce the air flow by slowing down, it can't keep up and your water temperature goes up. Temps into the red zone are not good.
This is not a Subaru problem, or anything to do with AWD, simply a cooling problem.
Get it looked at, and good luck!
Steve
rashorange -- Follow Steve's advice and check the coolant level ASAP. Could be that it's just low. As for tire pressures, the general consensus is that the recommended pressures are too low. Many of us have gravitated to around 32psi for everyday driving.
Ken
-Frank P.
I did the swap to the premium speakers. You basically go from 10/15 watt front/rear to 20/30, something like that. But they also swap out cheap cones for true two-ways. They do sound better. Now if I could only talk my toddler out of her choice in music...
rashorange: check if the fans are stuck. Do they spin when you are idling? When the engine is off, do they spin freely?
Once you figure this out, I would definitely have the coolant flushed completely, and change the oil. At those high temps the oil breaks down. In fact I would not drive it until you solve the problem.
-juice
I just bought a new 2002 Subaru Forester S with the following options:
- upgraded speakers
- tweeter kit
- subwoofer
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I just read above that the tweeters are directional and installed in the upper part of the door (A-pillar???). What the hell?! I don't have ANY tweeters mounted on the upper part of the door. Only speakers I see up front are the big ones in the doors and little ones just above the door handles.
Please, for the love of St. Peter, tell me that THOSE are the tweeters.
Thanks,
burnsmr4
-Frank P.
-juice
Ken
I have two basic questions I'm hoping some of you seasoned Subaru owners can answer for me.
First, is the Subaru AWD system's reliability as good as the systems offered by Honda (CRV) and Toyota (RAV4). Or stated another way, the fact that the systems operate differently from one another, will one system wear out before the other?
Second, concerning the boxer engine. The information I read and hear about the boxer engine makes alot of sense to me namely how the engine is so well balanced, compact, can be positioned further back in the chasis and so on. If in fact this is such a good way to build an engine, which I believe it is, why haven't the other manufacturers, namely Honda and Toyota, built a boxer engine themselves?
Would appreciate some feedback on these two questions as I usually drive my vehicles a long, long time so long term reliability is of major concern to me. Out here in Washington's Olympic Peninsula, Subarus are as common as any brand and I am impressed at how many real old Subarus are still running around.
-wags
We also have '92 Legacy wagon with 206,000 miles, which is still running OK but has begun to feel tired lately. Its AWD system is "tight" now; the electromagnetic clutches at the center differential don't fully release each axle. Some bindup is noticeable at low speed turns on dry pavement. Replacement or rebuild of the clutch pack is in the $1,000 range. The 2.2 liter engine uses and leaks some oil, but runs well otherwise. This car has had more short trips and also multiple drivers, including 2 teenagers learning how to drive. Not sure we want to put a lot of money into this car.
I don't know the AWD reliability/durability experience with the CRV or RAV4, but suspect the Toyota would be the more durable of the two. I have utmost respect for Toyota's build quality as probably the best worldwide. I just don't feel their product packaging & marketing strategy provides the best value in the small/midsize sport utility/wagon market these days. I bought the Forester instead of the RAV4 because the Subaru is more solid, carlike and fun to drive. I would do the same thing again today. IF I were in the $27,000 - $30,000 market today (fantasy only...), the Toyota Highlander would compete seriously against the 6 cylinder Outback for my dollar, even though it would have less equipment for the buck.
My bottom line: The Subaru Forester provides a much better designed package at a better price for the combination of charachter, features & equipment - even if over its long life with me I may spend a thousand or two more for rebuilds & repairs vs. a comparable Toyota.
Boxer engine? Good question. Subaru is a relatively small car company. Fuji Heavy Industries probably decided to put its eggs in this particular less conventional basket. They have good company: Porche. There has been some cross pollination with Porche / Audi over the years, I believe. Subaru's other (conventional) automotive engines are all small 3- and 4 cylinders. I wonder what Subaru would do if they went to making larger vehicles, if they would keep the boxer design for say a 5 liter 8 cylinder engine. I don't know what the engineering limits on the boxer are. I don't think FHI has the resources to develop a radically different larger engine on their own, the way VW has. FHI's collaboration with GM may change this, though.
Last thought: The redesigned 2003 Forester is expected at dealers in the spring and is from all accounts even more refined. No doubt worth the wait. (I'll be checking it out at the NYC Auto Show at the end of the month. Still plan to keep my '99 to 250,000 miles though.) Good luck, and keep us posted.
John
Many people think Honda and Toyota are slipping just a little from their position as the gold standard for quality. I think that probably has more to do with competitive pressures than with the location of their plants.
Do check out the 2003 Forester. I'll see my first one at the local car show in three days. On paper, it is a much nicer car that will apparently sell for virtually the same price. But you won't get the deals on the 2003 that you will on a 2002 Forester.
Oddly enough, a reason to buy the Forester is this set of discussion boards on Edmunds. Subie owners are simply the most friendly, helpful and fun people to hang with, even if you are only hanging with them in cyberspace. And Subaru has a secret weapon in their competition with Honda. Her name is Patti, and she is the fairy godmother at Subaru who reads all these posts and occasionally waves a magic wand to help some poor soul whose dealership isn't doing the right thing by some Subie in trouble. Honda doesn't have Patti. Toyota doesn't have Patti. Just the Subaru Crew.
Good luck. You seem to be doing this the right way.
Patti
Thanks,
Patti
Sorry for the TWEETER outburst, folks. I am a little high strung this week. Getting married on Saturday. {:-O
You see, my new Forester (just turned 2000 today) is up for his first series of long road trips during the wedding and honeymoon. I was so excited about getting a bigger car to carry all our crap to and from my fiancée's hometown and our honeymoon destination. It was going to be so cool!
Then, she told me that the back seat is for her wedding gown only. Doh! $100 later, and I have a MacNeil Automotive WeatherTech cargo carrier to install tomorrow. Most likely in the rain. Then, her parents told us that someone delivered a big wedding gift to haul back after the big day -- a piece of furniture (???). It just barely fits in a Ford Explorer. Double doh!
You see where I'm goin' here? The utility of my Forester is suddenly at the mercy of wedding gowns and gifts. So, again, please pardon the TWEETER episode. And bring me a drink. Several of them. And a Valium. Several of them. ;-)
Later,
burnsmr4
Serge
P.S. get her her own Subie!