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SPORTS CARS OF THE '70s
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with the Ford "Fairlane" 260 V8. Later Mk.2 Tigers used a 200Hp version of the 289 cid V8, the 302 was never fitted from the factory.
Tiger production was cancelled after Sunbeam's parent, the Rootes Group was purchased by Chrysler Corp in 1967. Chrysler small blocks with distributors at the rear could not be fitted into the Sunbeam chassis so remaining cars were sold off and production shut down.
Sunbeam Tiger history.
2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93
The Tiger is a car that I'd have no problems modifying so as to make it more habitable and controllable---at which point it's really a neat little car.
But alas, muscle car mania has touched the Tiger, and now, what was once an $18,000 car is pushing $30,000 and over.
Personally (and I know you'll be shocked to hear me say this), for that kind of money I'd buy a nicely done fake Cobra kit car, which would be much better in every way except that it isn't "real".
Care to add to this list, or comment on my choices?
But, after '74? Ugh...
240Z and 2002? I'm not sure what condition #3 is, exactly... but, $4000 would be the upper reaches of most of those that are available..
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I'm going by Shifty's suggestion regarding a similar matter on the "Sports and Sporty Cars of The '80s. He said there are very, very few #1 cars, because these are perfect, unblemished examples, and #2s are rather rare too. That leaves high #3s for those who are looking for good quality, but less than perfect cars.
In terms of Japanese cars from the the '70s, is the 240Z the only one that seems to have retained some value, little as it is, above and beyond pure well worn used car utility value? I know the 260Zwas a dud. How about a nice '79 280 turbo with <200,000 miles? What might that be worth?
I'm thinking there are probably some Porsches that are worth more than transportation value, but I'm not familiar enough with them to mention specific models. And how about Fiat and Alfa spyders, and MGs and Jags?
The 260Z and 280Z from '74-'78 are still nice Zs.. they just have ugly bumpers...
I love the Fiat 124 vert.. and the Alfetta GTV.. Really nice, restored MGBs are probably worth over $4K.. Any E-type Jag will also be worth more than that...
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I'd kill for one of these>
2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93
I'll take two of those Carreras, thank you very much..
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Hell, I saw a decent-looking Porsche 944 going for $1,350 at a local repair shop. I'd be tempted to drive it until the first big repair bill hit and then just junk it.
We diverge from topic, gentlemen, 924s and 944s are Sportscars of the 80's.
2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93
Every time I see an X1/9 (which is rare these days), I feel like buying one for him. What could an one in excellent shape go for,maybe $3k ?
I know they were crappy little cars, but sometimes crappy has it's own charm. And the removable roof was cool.
So. Calif. guys that drives one was in an article in either Grassroot or Classic
Motorsports Mags with several others that had both clones or originals. It is a
proven track weapon that for the HP can be wickedly fast in the right hands. Then
again in the wrong hands they can be very tough to handle.
Randy
2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93
Sure, any Ferrari is going to bust your chops in maintenance. As I always say, if you cannot afford to LITERALLY spend $1.50 to $2 per mile in maintenance, don't reach for a Ferrari, no matter how cheap. So yeah, 3,000 miles in a year costs you $6,000, and an engine rebuild is $35,000 bucks.
That's why the first word out of anyone's mouth in buying ANY Ferrari, old or new-ish, is "May I see the service records?"
If there aren't any, you might as well either a) walk away, or b) low-ball the hell out of the car.
1973 Carrera RS: Sure, any car with the engine hanging off the back end and with that much power (they would do 0-60 in about 5 seconds pure stock) can be a handful to drive. You really have to concentrate and you can't lose your focus and get stupid. The car will bite you so fast you'll miss the entire event.
Now if you're talkin' 914/6, that's another story.
Maybe the rear end and taillight treatment of the '82 Chevy Cavalier, but I'm hard-pressed to come up with anything else!
Bill
That's the decade where cars were choked by emissions controls. Maybe some early 70s examples would cut mustard. But, the vast majority of them I've seen (which are few) are poor examples of sports cars.
Then again, I've never owned a Porsche. And, the last one I drove was a 928 (which I liked, quite a bit).
I'm thinking of the "wedge" TR 7s, the afore mentioned (and much maligned) Fiat X 1/9 (which I've also had the "pleasure" (loose term) of driving.....neutered American muscle. Are those the cars we're speaking of?
RX-7 (wonderful new car from the '70s)
911 (great in the late '70s)
928s (great GT in the late '70s)
MGBs (early '70s)
Alfas
Fiats
I love them all. The mid '70s seem to be the low point, but there is good stuff before the emissions and once they started figuring out how to engineer them later.
never mind..
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The 280 was arguably still a better sports/gt car.
I also like the C3 Vette, up until '73, which was the last year for the chrome rear bumper... not so much, after that..
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-forgot about those early 240Zs. Revolutionary. But, weren't the other iterations of '70s Z cars less than sterline (thinking the 260z, here)
-RX7....no debate
-Posche's....can't comment. I never drove anything but a 928. But, that was about 10 years ago. Very nice sports car, though
-MGBs? I had a '69 MGB-GT. Fun car. Spent every weekend working on it, though. The ones after that had the "BIG BUMPERS", right?
-Alfas....no opinion. I've seen them, but rarely. Heard the horror stories, though.
-Fiat...my older sister had an 850 (?) Spider. Road in it. Fun car. Nowhere near reliable if I recollect, however.
Maybe it's the mid-70s sports cars I'm thinking of. That's when I first started to take an interest in cars (well before I even got a license).
The 260Z was essentially the same as a 240Z, with a little more displacement to compensate for the different carbs required for emmission controls. Smog controls began sapping the performance of nearly every car beginning in 1974.
-RX7....no debate
Outstanding car for it's time with plenty of performance and a rev-happy engine that delighted sports car purists.
-Posche's....can't comment. I never drove anything but a 928. But, that was about 10 years ago. Very nice sports car, though
The 928 is regarded as a mixed bag. Some think of it as a "German Corvette" but it's size and weight led most to regard it as more of a Gran Turismo than a true sports car like the 911. 911s oif the era suffered from emissions controls and heavy bumpers like everything else but in '76 they got galvanized steel bodies, a significant step forward. Early 70s 911s with the 2.7 motor are considered among the most desirable 911s, especially in Carrera RS form.
-MGBs? I had a '69 MGB-GT. Fun car. Spent every weekend working on it, though. The ones after that had the "BIG BUMPERS", right?
By 1969 MG-Bs were obsolescent thanks to the emergence of competitors like the Fiat 124 Sport and the Datsun 240Z but yes, they were fun, tossable and delightful to drive. The Triumph TR-6 with it's body-on-frame construction was even more obsolescent but the silky six was very nice. Big bumpers and revised ride heights ruined both cars in '74.
-Alfas....no opinion. I've seen them, but rarely. Heard the horror stories, though.
Early 70s Alfas included some highly desirable cars, my personal favorite being the GTV 1750/2000. Not a true Sports car with it's four seats, it was the very definition of the term Gran Turismo IMO.>
-Fiat...my older sister had an 850 (?) Spider. Road in it. Fun car. Nowhere near reliable if I recollect, however.
I bought a 124 Sport Spider 1608 new in '71 and drove it thru 77K miles until 1979 it was no more problematic than any 1970s automobile with rust being the worst problem (cheap Russian steel!). I can't think of many affordable '70s cars I'd rather have. By the end of the decade they were ruined by big bumpers and jacked up suspensions to meet headlight height requirements.
Maybe it's the mid-70s sports cars I'm thinking of. That's when I first started to take an interest in cars (well before I even got a license).
Yep, it was all over after '73 thanks to the regulations on emissions and crash-worthiness. '70-73MY sports and GT cars were often quite nice.
2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93
Next to an MGB, an Alfa of that era is like a machine landing from another galaxy, built by an advanced civilization.
I wonder if Shifty or anyone who has driven one could tell me if they feel as ponderous as my Dad's old '72 Mercedes 240 sedan? If I thought they were nice to drive I might seriously consider a Pagoda.
2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93
The 230/250/280 SLs are...well...very feminine in how they drive and feel. The shift lever is delicate, the power steering is light, with a HUGE steering wheel, poofy seats, tiny little control knobs. This is not a Cobra or a Sunbeam Tiger, that's for sure.
They handle quite well and if you remember to drive them as the engineers intended, quite lively in performance for a 2.8L. But you have to wind the hell out of them to get excited.
Alas most of the time we see them driven very leisurely by lovely women in big straw hats.
Me myself---I'd prefer a stripped down 230SL with a stickshift. Although smaller in displacement, they are lighter in weight than their 280SL brethren, hence just as "fast".
The AC totally sucks as you would expect from a 70s German car. The build quality is superb.
One thing to watch out for is that someone didn't put a cylinder head from a 280 sedan on it. The head surfaces corroded on these cars, and the sedan head was a quick substitute. Also many of the body panels are coded to the VIN number.
Some colors cause a loss of value, like Brown, Mauve, Beige and Black. Silver looks great, and so does White oddly enough. Red is okay, BRG is very nice, my favorite.
Then it's my kind of car! the motor in my Dad's old Benz didn't care to rev very much.
Unfortunately, I need to get an Automatic, my left side limbs don't work well. Have you driven an A/T W113? Any particular ergonomic problems aside from the tiny controls? The throttle on my Dad's car had a hellaciously strong return spring so that it was an effort to hold the pedal to the metal?
I'd love a nice dark brown, BRG or Navy Blue example. IMO silver is a cliche on a German car, white I don't like on any sports car; Black Red would be Okay.
Price ranges for a good 280SL w A/T?
Thanks for your help Shifty.
2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93
From what I can tell, probably something like half of earlier cars, 230SLs especially, were white. Colors became more diverse as the years passed.
I know a good driver 230SL can be had for no more than 20K, I think a 280 does carry a good premium, maybe 25% or so.
I'll second guess The Fin and say that really decent 280SLs that are nice drivers without major problems (certainly not show cars however) start at around $30K these days, and run up to $80,000 for super nice ones that have been restored. They get real ratty under $20K.
A 230SL is, IMO, a better buy all around, but less likely to find an automatic, and more likely to be a European car. Most 280SLs are automatic, the vast majority and most are Federalized cars, which is good.
Most come with hardtops, which weigh about as much as the car itself and require two sturdy people to install---hence, if you find a car without a hardtop, you can pay less for it. Most people who use the hardtop put it on in September and take it off in April. It's a real pain to lift, store, etc. A pulley system helps.
Gear ratios and differential benefit acceleration, not highway cruising, so at 70 mph the engine sounds really busy. This can be annoying to some.
2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93
So that's why I was always seeing these in car accessory catalogs:
I recall reading that the first place to look for rust is behind the headlights, esp. at the top of the fender, Anyplace else?
2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93
I know of someone who, a couple years back, bought a nice looking driver quality 230SL, old but nice repaint, I think white on blue (the most popular combo in 64-65 I would bet) for around 16K. It had both tops and a good Becker radio too.
Yep, the dashes were metal and chrome and the metal should match the body color
as should the centers of the wheel covers. I think it makes the car look less original iof the wheel covers are all chrome.
2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93
The last 280SLs could be ordered with bundt wheels I think.
2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93