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It is 3 years old with about 25,000 miles. Edmunds gives me a private party value of about $13,000 and dealer price of about $14,500. So someone buying my car used would pay only about $1500 to $3000 less than I did. They'd also save $75-150 in sales tax. The insurance savings would be insignificant here, except that you might pay for collision/comp coverage for fewer years. The cost of this for me is about $200 per year, so assuming 3 years less of this coverage would mean $600 in savings. OTOH, since someone buying used missed 3 years/25K mi of no repair bills, what is that going to cost them later on? $1000?
For my case, at most, the net difference appears to be maybe $3000. Far less than your $10K guess. If I keep the car 10 years, that difference is only $300 per year.
A 3 year old Mazda 6 can be had for $11000 without trying(dealer) and $9000 private party if you haggle(some dealers have 45-50K mile examples for $9K even). I checked this right now with Autotrader, so it represents real street prices.
16K vs 9K? At that savings, you could trade cars every three years *still* and end up saving an enormous amount over new. I seriously doubt is anything made in Japan will fall apart any more or less in years 4-6 vs 1-3.
All depends on location and supply vs demand.
I just sold a 2008 Mazda6 i SV with 31K on it for $11,995. I am currently toying with the idea of selling my 2005 Mazda6 i Sport Hatchback (loaded) and it has 62K on it, and I have had 3 offers on it, all over $9,500.
The smart person always gets a 1-3 year old(certified if it makes them feel safer I guess) car versus brand new. That initial $10K in depreciation is really rough.
Personally I have gone the slightly used route lately, and it works for me and what I need in cars right now. But I've bought new before and will do so again when it's the right thing to do. And I won't feel I am "stupid" for making that choice to buy new, when the time comes.
Maybe we could talk about cars?
There's no shame, really, in buying used versus new. Many of these program/dealer cars and short-terms lease vehicles are so close to new that sometimes the driver's manual hasn't even been removed from the shrinkwrap.
I've had 2 used cars in my life and in both cases I had to spend a lot of money with upkeep. New tires, repairs, etc...
I decided to just buy new and at the very least have some financial stability for a few years in the fact that the Fusion is an extremely reliable car. I'm sure I'm going to be pissed off at the value when I try to sell it, BUT cars are plummeting in value so fast nowadays I don't think anyone will be happy!
However, if one keeps their car for 10 years, it's a basic wash. Or if one puts on 30K miles a year a used car is a bad bet. Or if one gets a lemon a new car, in that instance, after the fact would have been a better bet.
One used Mazda6 I test drove before I bought my new one, seemed like a deal based on the online listing. But it turned out to be an amazingly crapped up 1-2 year old car. This is why edmunds gives different average prices for clean vs. average, etc. So one cheap listing with 2x the mileage does not prove anything about what a buyer would need to pay to get a "clean" car with 1/2 the miles of your examples.
No one has said it costs the same, but it certainly is not going to cost me anywhere near your figure of $10,000 more to have bought my new car, that I will likely keep for 10 years or more.
Full test
Bottom Line:
The 2011 Sonata ticks all the boxes, but the chassis feels underdone, leaving us to imagine how good this car could be if Hyundai charged a couple grand more.
Surprised?
They do charge a couple grand more--I think they call that one the Sonata SE!
Exactly. When you put 100 miles a week on a car, have your wife and kids with you for part of that ride each day, you want a safe reliable car, so in this situation, its a no brainer. You also have the peace of mind that you have a car that has no hidden issues the previous owner covered up that you will wind up paying to have repaired. You have a full warranty for a good portion of that time, so no out of pocket expenses for a while, and you get the latest in safety features that you may not get on a 3-4 YO car. When it comes to the cars I have, there are no USED models out there with the features I have. There may be a few used Flex models, but they don't have telescopic steering wheels. The Fusion Sport is new for 2010, and it is the car that I have been looking to get for the past 3 years, so used in this model? One other thing about buying new vs used, finance rates, where can you get 0% for 60 on a used car? When you add up how much you pay for the finance rate on a used car, vs a new one @ 0%, the finance charge more than makes up the difference on a used car. If you can get a 1.9% for 48 months new, vs a 6.9% for 48 used, and depending on the car and bank, could be higher, 5% interest can add up to quite a bit. 1.9% on 22K is roughly $864, 6.9% on 18k is roughly $2649. So if you buy a car for $22K, get 0% for 48, the same used car is $18K, you are only paying roughly $1400 more for it in the long run.
That said, yes, the old Toyota is in need of replacement. But I have no problems with buying something with 30-40K on it and running it for 300-400K.
Edmunds '11 Sonata 7.7 secs
Edmunds 09 Accord LX-P 9.1 secs
Edmunds 10 Kizashi 9.1 secs
Edmunds 10 Legacy 9.4 secs
Edmunds Fusion SEL V6 7.3 secs
CR 09 Camry LE 9.4 secs
Edmunds 09 Sonata LTD I4 9.8
I would say it gives a pretty respectable showing and certainly would beat a Camry I4 easily. Not that I personally care very much about 0-60 times(now 60-0 is a different story) but a lot of people were bashing the new Sonata because of those videos.
The Flex I have is the Ecoboost, 355 HP 350 PdFt torque, V6. I get 19-20 MPG daily driving(when I can keep my foot out of it), same as the non turbo 3.5L V6 in the other models. I can spank the pants off most other cars, yet get much better FE than one equipped with a V8 that meets those numbers. So why would anyone knock the I4 in the Hyundai? Why would you want a gas guzzling V6 when you can get the FE I4 that puts out more power? Smart move on Hyundais part.
Insurance rates vary. In my case, as I mentioned collision costs me about $200 per year. I typically will drop that when the car's value is about $5000. So I would still have that coverage, for a time, were I to buy newish used cars...which is the sort of cars that I thought you had been touting.
The other thing is the value of the coverage to me is more than $0, which is what you have assumed it's value is by saying you save the $500 per year that it would cost to have that coverage. Should there be a loss, I am out my $1000 deductible in addition to the premiums, you would be out the entire amount of the loss. So the proper comparison is not to assume that you will never have a loss while you are driving with no collision coverage.
For me, the expected value of $1000 deductible collision coverage appears to be about $85 per year and for comprehensive it is about $10. So the true net cost of my $200 premium is, perhaps, about $115 per year. According to this calculator, anyway: http://insuranceriskcalculator.com/
My entire policy does not even cost $500 per year...and no, this is not with minimum liability or anything. However, "high coverage limits" have absolutely nothing to do with the cost of collision/comprehensive. What is covered by that is only damage to your own vehicle, so the cost is not affected by your liability coverage limits.
I would have a huge problem with putting 300,000 miles on a car...which is that it would take me about 37 years!
I would have a huge problem with putting 300,000 miles on a car...which is that it would take me about 37 years!
Yeah, I unfortunately go thorough tires about every two years it seems. Commuting here in Los Angeles, home to the never ending freeway jungle, will do that for you. A manual transmission alone is most of the savings and issues with reliability. The rest of the car won't possibly literally fall apart in the first 10-12 years. So I tend to buy 8-12K used cars and drive them for several years. The truck I got with about 300K on it, but it's really my fun off-road truck. I kind of need a better commuting machine. MPG and power is kind of so-so.
Though, it DOES make yuppies get out of my way, which is actually making driving easier I guess. :P
I haven't heard the new Sonata's yet but so far it seems that the Camry's and Sonata's, based on what I've read is suppose to be the most quiet of the mid-size sedans!
what do you all think?
I strongly disagree.
If you read the review, the reviewer's main problem was with the manual transmission they tested. The reviewer noted that the auto transmission would give much better results:
But with the new six-speed automatic transmission (which has no such throttle-dampening), we're betting the Sonata would close in on the Volkswagen CC as well as the VW Passat, which are good for acceleration to 60 mph from a standstill in 7.3 seconds and a quarter-mile of 15.2 seconds at 92.0 mph.
But only about 5% (or fewer) GLS's are sold with the manual transmission - so why didn't the reviewer test the car with the automatic transmission? Strange, don't you think?
Also the review contains a link to a second opinion by the Lead Senior Editor Ed Hellwig which is 100% positive.
My advice to anyone shopping for a midsize car - test drive a bunch of them, as I did (Camry, Accord (two test drives), Malibu (two test drives), Fusion, Altima, 2010 Sonata). You'll find that the 2011 Sonata is by far the best car.
I did read the review, and I'm questioning which review you read, since he mentioned the manual transmission once, yet mentioned the chassis feel at least a few times, as well as mentioning it in the Bottom Line.
And congrats on your purchase. It's not on my list due to a few details (lack of V6, lack of manual with SE, bundling moonroof with Nav), but it's still a huge step forward over it's predecessor.
http://www.edmunds.com/hyundai/sonata/2011/review.html
What Edmunds.com says
The previous Sonata was a solid contender, but for 2011, the Hyundai Sonata vaults itself to the top of the class.
Smooth ride, spacious cabin and trunk, capable handling, impressive value, strong safety scores, lengthy warranty.
But the 2011 Hyundai Sonata, like a maturing great band that comes into its own, has become worthy of headliner status in the family-sedan arena.
ll things considered, the latest Sonata manages to stand out in a segment chock full of good choices. It's more fun to drive than the ubiquitous Accord and Camry, and though the Altima, Mazda 6, Chevy Malibu and Ford Fusion are also good picks, the Sonata has the price advantage. With its spirited performance, impressive fuel economy, solid build quality and strong value, we have a feeling that the 2011 Hyundai Sonata will have no problem climbing the charts.
Maybe it was attempt at sarcasm?
Nonetheless it is true.
I did find the Accord to be a pretty good performer for a midsized car, though its thinly padded front seat and constant road noise were a problem for me. As for the Camry, it was very comfortable but fun to drive it ain't.
I think that what you meant to say is that the Sonata is by far the best car for you, which, as I'm sure that you'll agree, is the strongest claim that can be made for any car.
As good as it is - & it is certainly very good - the new Sonata won't get the job done for those buyers who want or need 6 cylinders or AWD.
I don't have a dog in this hunt because I have no plans to buy a new car until next year at the earliest. I'm merely pointing out the obvious.
For me I think the Sonata hit's a nice spot in the pack of mid sized cars, and does it for a great value.
Also, who could feel safe buying a used Toyota, I'd be thinking was this one of the cars that they didn't fix?
Do you know that you can get killed in any car you drive, even big trucks with the 5.7 liter engine?
You can go around worrying or you can live.
Shouldn't everyone who owns or drives one know how to perform this task?
I've never driven a Prius at anywhere near that speed so i don't know if it would react substantially different than a normal car. If engine braking is so strong or what. But it sounded like he definitely knew how to put in neutral but decided against it. Now, why he didn't shut the engine down completely I don't know. It wasn't like it was rental or a loaner and he didn't know how. This went on for 30 miles. ????.
It's one thing to get hit by a falling building, it's another thing altogether to put yourself in its way when you had other alternatives.
Or me - I just have to push the clutch in. Heh. I'd buy a manual transmission Toyota without hesitation because even if it does this on me, I can deal with it in a fraction of a second. Probably get it cheap, too, since the massive numbers of automatics will devalue both the manual and automatic versions.
Some of these are driver error and are being reported due to the increased visibility, but clearly there are problems out there that Toyota is refusing to even admit exist. That's the troubling part for me and I think it will hurt them in the end.
All I heard him say on when he was being interviewed was that he didn't put it in neutral cause he thought it might flip. Did you actually see another interview where he mentioned about reverse or are you assuming that's what he meant? You're probably right cause I can't think of any reason why anybody would think putting it in neutral would make a car flip. Unless there is some kind of huge regenerative engine braking that goes on in Priuses. I'm not that familiar with them.
In any new car, especially these newer car with push button start and hybrids, you need to read the owner's manual on how to operate these more fancy electronics. Don't assume you already know how to use all the features.
Some people I talk to don't even know if their car is a 4 or 6 cylinder. Many people just know how to add gas and go.
Exactly. There may be a problem, but due to the negative media attention some driver related issues will be blamed on the car itself.