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IL has finally called the Sonata the "benchmark" in this one. Congrats to them. The Mazda is considered the drivers car (no surprise), and the Honda, well, it just was there.
They tested cars with manuals exclusively this time, that's bound to ruffle some feathers on this board... :P
Oh It has been 2 years since I drove a Prius, so I got the h backwards, but you can still press the park button while driving, and it will put it into neutral until it slows to under 3MPH. In a last ditch attempt if the car is running away, which after seeing what you posted(BTW Link to story would be nice), doesn't seem possible in the Prius, pressing the Park button is an option to get it out of gear.
How do I know this? I did it quite by mistake one day, don't know what I was doing, but I reached out to do something on the MFD and pressed Park instead. Car went into neutral, did not engage the park pawl, I put it back into D. A couple times I hit the power button instead of park, and it put it in park before shutting down.
V6 Camry vs Fusion Sport, Sport wins, the Camry may be quicker, but the Fusion out handles it. Camry=BORING Fusion Sport=Exciting. I have driven both, the Ford is definitely the better of the two. The one and only thing I miss about the Camry is the Smart key system. I certainly do not miss that overly bright center console, especially in foggy weather. The Ford does need some improvement, basically in ergonomics, too many buttons in the center stack, a little clean up in that area would go a long way.
Here's the deal, when you buy me my next car you can buy me what you want and I'll drive it. Until then, I am entitled to have my opinions about what I want to buy and spend my money the way I want to.
That post wasn't directed specifically toward me, but I find it funny that a remark would be made like that, given that nobody is stepping up to the plate to give the car of their choice to another fellow.
There's a resemblance, but the Sonata has a more streamlined look.
Those who've seen my black 2011 Sonata GLS are amazed that it's a Hyundai. I don't know if they thought it was a Mercedes but they sure didn't think it was the same old conservative, boring Hyundai Sonata
In past years Hyundai has maintained a large presence at the Atlanta auto show, which will open this weekend. I'll post my reactions when I get back.
Expect the Fusion 3.5L to get the new engine tech at some point which will boost it to 280 hp or so.
My 166hp Accord auto is rated 21/31 under the new standards. Gotta love technology.
The real test will be whether or not those numbers are achievable (think 2.4L Equinox).
Oh they'll be achievable, but not commonplace by any stretch of the imagination. My '06 Mustang GT (manual tranny) was rated at something like 17 city and 24 highway. In the 2 years I had it I was never able to match those ratings. It's just too hard to do in a sports car. Having said that, it should still do better on gas than a Mazda6 which is pretty sad IMO.
The new 'Nox is another story. I'm always able to get the EPA rating or better in our SUV/CUVs and I would expect the same from the new 'Nox. I'm still waiting for the first review that even comes close to averaging the EPA estimates in that thing.
I can easily beat the 2007 EPA estimates for my Mazda6 and the 2008 numbers are lower with basically the same exact car.
Same here. I've easily beaten the pre-2008 numbers with my '04 6 with the V6, even nudging 30 MPG on long stretches of highway. In summer months, I easily get 25 MPG in everyday driving, which involves about 60% highway, 40% city.
31 MPG on a V6? I like that...
:confuse:
Why would it? That is the norm for "enthusiast" testing. They pretty much always test manuals (if one is available).
I like how they claimed they chose to test 4 cyl, because that is what the vast majority are buying. But of course, they are not buying 'em with manuals. I suspect the real reason they chose to do this is the 4 cyl is the only way to get a manual on at least some of these cars.
I was actually rather stunned by the stat they gave "manual-transmission cars make up only about 2 percent of the mix of sales volume for these cars". Seems like pretty solid evidence that the manual transmission in mainstream cars in the US is in it's death throes.
Now that it's been shown that an automatic or DSG type transmission can attain higher mpg on the EPA tests than a manual can, CAFE pressures will probably prompt automakers to offer fewer and fewer standard trannies..
It will not be a mid-size (though it may be getting close) but I think I'll take a test drive of the new Focus with Ford's "power-shift", when it comes out. I think that'll be the first car with DSG that is both big enough and "normal" enough to potentially interest me.
The Jetta GLI and TDI don't count?
I saw the new, I think it's going to be a 2012 model, Focus at the Chicago Auto Show and it looked pretty nice. From what I've read it should be an interesting car with all available bells and whistles and great mpg....supposed to be close to 40 if I remember right. It's kind of funny cause it will probably be similar in size as midsize cars were 10 years ago.
I actually said that in jest, since the majority of midsize buyers only get automatics, which would make this test worthless to them.
I like how they claimed they chose to test 4 cyl, because that is what the vast majority are buying. But of course, they are not buying 'em with manuals. I suspect the real reason they chose to do this is the 4 cyl is the only way to get a manual on at least some of these cars.
...Which IMO is wrong. Why penalize the enthusiast driver that likes a more-powerful engine with three pedals, but HAS to drive a midsize 4-door?
I was actually rather stunned by the stat they gave "manual-transmission cars make up only about 2 percent of the mix of sales volume for these cars". Seems like pretty solid evidence that the manual transmission in mainstream cars in the US is in it's death throes.
Sad but true. Us three-pedalers are a dying breed...
True, but there were one or two on the 'Nox that didn't and they came the closest. I don't doubt 32 mpg is possible in a FWD 'Nox but all the complaints about having to really gas it to go anywhere would make it hard. That's why I question a lot of the too good to be true ratings we're seeing lately.
I did very well with my '04 Mazda6 S (manual tranny) compared to the EPA numbers. It was fun but it certainly wasn't a RWD Pony Car or an overweight cute ute.
I don't think the automakers make their decisions based on "who can we penalize today?". They are making bottom line decisions. If I can make more money by not even having a standard transmission offering...that's what I would do. That appears to be the case. I guess you could say the end result is a penalty. Some people like convertibles but they aren't offered in all models either.
There are plenty of midsize 4drs with a lot of power that offer sticks. BMW, Infiniti, Lexus, Acura, Cadillac, Pontiac GTO(can still be found). They just cost more and most enthusiasts are willing to pay for their fun. The mainstream family midsizers would probably offer them if people were willing to pay more for them. That's usually the case when someone wants something that is in very low demand....they pay more to get it. But I think you would find that so very few people would want to pay more that it would just not be worth it to the automakers.
It will be interesting to see if Hyundai will offer the new turbo in a manual in all versions of theSonata. That may be something to change the game for people that do want more power but want to row but get really good mpg as well. Could be a win, win.
mazda doesn't have to worry as much as ford about CAFE, so they may not tune their engines for max EPA test mileage.
Now? The Accord V6 with 6-speed manual is only available in the coupe, and good luck finding one of them. The 3.5 is now called SR and is saddled with a CVT (which IMO killed the V6 attached to it in terms of both smoothness and control), and Mazda, in it's infinite wisdom to try and appeal to a broader market, dropped what could have been a unique marketing item, and simultaneously alienated their enthusiast fans (and all but eliminated the fun that "zoom-zoom" was supposed to represent).
"Bottom Line" or not, it's not cool.
As for Hyundai, if (and that's a big IF) they offer a manual with the upcoming turbo, get ready to see a "limited edition". I can see it now: no options, a low-end CD player, and optional AC. No moonroof, no leather, no high-end stereo, etc. I'll also bet they have to be "special ordered" with no examples found on any dealer lots for 100 miles.
On the other hand, they could surprise all of us and win over the former 3.5SE and 6 owners, simply by offering a manual as a no-charge option, with any package, and stealing the "four-door sports car" title from Nissan (which gave up on that concept years ago)...
Hey, it could happen!
Why is that?
Mazda doesn't have to worry about a full-size pick-up, three different large crossovers/SUVs, or a cargo/passenger van to bring down their company-wide fuel economy.
Hyundai also has the Genesis (the V8 sedan and V6 coupe), plus a new S-class fighter called the Equus, which will be out in about a year.
Well, you do get a little more than just the three pedals if you go with one those brands.
"Bottom Line" or not, it's not cool.
If it increases their profit....it's cool to them!
This generally does not include turbo or diesel, or cars that are in the price range of the GLI/GTI that is why I would not consider the Jetta or Golf with DSG. The regular 2.5 does not offer it.
Aside from price, my reasons for not wanting diesel are I want my car to start right now no matter how cold it is and I want heat, ASAP. Turbo, again, aside from price, I just don't want the extra maintenance or repairs.
Also, I think the TDI and GLI/GTI may only come with leather or vinyl seat material. I only like cloth.
Yeah, I think I need to find the compact car comparison thread. The midsize cars like the new Mazda6 and Accord, just look way too big. I've not driven them, just seen them on the road, etc.
Maybe my local Tucson Suzuki dealer will lower Kizashi prices in time for me to buy a 2010 Kizashi GTS in Platinum Metallic Silver then. I loved the test-drive a couple days ago in Henderson, NV. I test-drove a Pearl Black 2010 Suzuki Kizashi GTS with an automatic transmission. Great car! I absolutely loved the driving mechanics. Solid and true steering and agility. I don't see how I'm gonna stave off a Kizashi purchase. This is what happened when I fell for my 2008 Mitsubishi Lancer GTS. I made it a reality.
But if Suzuki doesn't sell them that means prices should drop in turn. Right?
2010 Suzuki Kizashi GTS in Platinum Metallic Silver
This is the color I want the most. I want to test-drive one in 6-speed form before I buy.
Oh, BTW. This thing zips right along with a 4-cyl motor. The hp for the manual-trannied Kizashi is 185 vs. 180 for the automatic transmission 4-cyl.
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
There aren't many 50 state passenger car diesel engines that are new models after 2009. I can't think of any manufacturer except Mercedes and BMW.
My only point was that diesels today fire right up even in cold weather, and warm up quicker than gasoline engines, once you start driving of course. I would love to see a turbo diesel hybrid.
http://www.tdicurious.ca/2009/02/04/myth-3-a-diesel-engine-can%E2%80%99t-heat-a-- car-in-winter-driving-in-a-2009-jetta-tdi-clean-diesel-during-a-week-of-exceptio- nally-cold-weather/
Since the saving on fuel would be very minimal for me (~$200 per year) and it adds some minor inconveniences, I'd not be willing to pay for a diesel engine.
Anyway, in my case, there were several other reasons for not considering the diesel Jetta, besides the engine.
Speaking of diesels, have the manufacturer's pulled back on plans to bring diesels to the US? I seem to recall claims that a diesel Accord was coming. A google search turned up a several 2007 stories (C/D, Inside Line) saying that would be here in 2009.
Good luck finding a V8. From what my buddies tell me at the Hyundai store next to me is majority of the Genesis takers are buying the V6, and the over all sales of the Genesis are not great. Sales of the coupe and sedan combined were only 1,700 for February
Oh, and the Mrs. might wonder why Mr.iluv is getting a buy itch already, too. Waiting is probably a good idea at this juncture.
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
That's exactly the reason it is fairly easy finding a V8. When I was on a couple of Hyundai dealers lots on a Sunday a few weeks ago to look at the new Sonata I couldn't believe how many V-8 Genesis were sitting around. It was hard to find a V6 one!
That and I think they had planned to put it in the Crosstour, which is auto only, and terminally ugly. Maybe it was a wise decision. An obese Honda...just what we needed.
Since the Regal was not available at GM's "ride & drive" booth, my impressions are based only on a "sit & stare" method, in which I sat in, fiddled with, closely examined, etc. Also, bear in mind the small sample size--there were only two Regals present. Here are the things that stood out to me:
1. Interior quality. I'll admit to being easily swayed by the two-tone color schemes of the Malibu and the dramatic (some would say excessive) brightwork of the LaCrosse. The Regal's interior is more restrained, less likely to look out of fashion by the time the loan is paid off. It's better finished than I'm accustomed to seeing in European, American, or Asian vehicles at this price point. This may be the car's greatest asset in the market--it's distinctive without being gimmicky, and it definitely looks and feels expensive.
2. Interior space. The only significant dimensional difference between Regal and LaCrosse is in rear legroom--yet the Regal gives an entirely different impression, that of a close-coupled European sedan rather than a sprawling American luxury car. The range of seat adjustment is astounding--I'm of average proportion for a fortysomething American male (5'10, 200 lbs), so I can get comfortable in most cars, but I was completely blown away here. Anyone from Larry Bird to Billy Barty should be able to find a good driving position in the Regal.
3. Seating comfort. I've been impressed by the seats in both the LaCrosse and Enclave already, and I wondered how the Regal would compare. They're slightly firmer, and a bit more "sporty feeling," but not to the point of being confining. Again, it feels expensive.
4. Marketing and pricing. Sitting still, the Regal definitely gives the impression of being a $27k car. I don't have a problem with it being four-cylinder only. But I am concerned about the decision to launch before the 220hp turbo version is ready. Since the Regal is offered at a premium price, the premium powertrain should have been the first one offered. Sure, the 182hp Ecotec is probably sufficient in daily driving, but lots of cars that cost less have sufficient power (four-cylinder Accords, Sonatas, Malibus, etc.) As the Regal's differentiation from these cars (and the LaCrosse) depends on its sportiness, there's a problem here. To launch the car with this engine as the sole offering is to invite comparison with similarly powered, less expensive mass market cars rather than the Acura TSX and Volvo S60 that Buick claims to be targeting.
As near as I can tell, not one review of the 182hp Regal has been published--all of the buzz generated by the press pertains to the 220hp turbo, or to the "concept" GS. Is GM so desperate to book a few sales ASAP that they're willing to risk launching yet another not-quite-finished car?
I really want to see the Regal succeed. But to do so, it'll need to perform like a premium product. All indications are that the turbo model will do so--at $29.5k, when it's finally available sometime next summer. As for the base model--we'll see.
Also, Infiniti is coming out with a G37 lite called the G25(2.5L engine instead of the 3.7) that will be right in the ball park with the Regal turbo price wise so it will have another solid contender. I think most people that are spending around 30k+ on a new car prefer 200 or more HP. TSX is right on that borderline and all the others are on top of it.