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I can tell by your posts that you understand the physics involved in having an unloaded pickup with the rear wheels locking....the rear wants to come around and you end up pointing the wrong way on the freeway.
Here is a list of the four major ABS systems in case any of us wish to fall asleep from boredom early tonight. I just cut and pasted from wiki...
Anti-lock braking systems use different schemes depending on the type of brakes in use. They can be differentiated by the number of channels: that is, how many valves that are individually controlled—and the number of speed sensors.[17]
Four-channel, four-sensor ABS
This is the best scheme. There is a speed sensor on all four wheels and a separate valve for all four wheels. With this setup, the controller monitors each wheel individually to make sure it is achieving maximum braking force.
Three-channel, four-sensor ABS
There is a speed sensor on all four wheels and a separate valve for each of the front wheels, but only one valve for both of the rear wheels. Older vehicles with four-wheel ABS usually use this type.
Three-channel, three-sensor ABS
This scheme, commonly found on pickup trucks with four-wheel ABS, has a speed sensor and a valve for each of the front wheels, with one valve and one sensor for both rear wheels. The speed sensor for the rear wheels is located in the rear axle. This system provides individual control of the front wheels, so they can both achieve maximum braking force. The rear wheels, however, are monitored together; they both have to start to lock up before the ABS will activate on the rear. With this system, it is possible that one of the rear wheels will lock during a stop, reducing brake effectiveness. This system is easy to identify, as there are no individual speed sensors for the rear wheels.
One-channel, one-sensor ABS
This system is commonly found on pickup trucks with rear-wheel ABS. It has one valve, which controls both rear wheels, and one speed sensor, located in the rear axle. This system operates the same as the rear end of a three-channel system. The rear wheels are monitored together and they both have to start to lock up before the ABS kicks in. In this system it is also possible that one of the rear wheels will lock, reducing brake effectiveness. This system is also easy to identify, as there are no individual speed sensors for any of the wheels.
It looks like a bigger combination of mid size cars.
Accord front, Fusion body, Sonata back.
How old was the Elantra? Maybe it had weak springs or something along with being overloaded.
I tote three kids in my car daily, and we went on vacation with all of our luggage and boogie boards, cooler full of ice and food, etc and my car barely looked like it was loaded down from the outside.
Glad to hear there was nothing wrong with the car.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Why am I mentioning this? Well, I saw all kinds of hybrids, including 3 Optima's, countless Sonata's and 2 new Honda Accord Hybrids. I can't even begin to tell you how many Priusususes. With that kind of stop and go commute I would DEFINITELY be driving a hybrid with battery only operation for at least 20 miles. There would be no way to afford the gas driving anything else. It was nice to see far less large SUV's, which used to make such a status statement. Remember Hummers? Have you seen any lately? Me neither.
I think America is just beginning to get the picture, which is a good thing. Now we need a better selection of sedans with turbo-diesel hybrids for the best possible fuel savings while still offering loads of power down low, for torque-thirsty American tastes.
I was really looking forward to testing out the new Mazda 6 TD, but alas it's release was delayed by EPA certification problems. Mazda is saying late Spring before they show up at dealers lots. Bummer.
(Yes I know it is a Prius question....but they do steal business from the mid-size market as they are priced fairly competitively).
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When I switched it off it was like a breath of fresh air. I like the fact that it can achieve 30 plus mph on long trips, and it can offer good city mpg if you are patient enough with traffic, and the ECO programming. I would use it if I lived in the country, or the mid west where there is more space than people and traffic is very light, but here in the bustling east coast megalopolis, I would rather get home with as much alacrity as possible, with the least amount of frustration, and the most driving pleasure possible. I still get 22 mpg average, and that is fine with me.
I had a similar experience with an IS350...I had to leave it in sport mode. The default felt like a corolla driving through sand. Actually felt my blood pressure rise; very annoying.
I can get a Titanium Fusion with Nav, Sunroof, Driver Assist, and H spoke wheels, FWD for 33,600 OTD. Or, I can get a Toyota Avalon Limited loaded except for wireless charging tech package for 35,500 plus taxes and destination. That'll probably equal 39,000 OTD. I've looked t the Kia, and could get a 2.0 Turbo loaded for 30,000. In my mind the Avalon will be worth 10k after 7 years whereas the Kia will not. That's the difference between those two.
But is the Avalon worth 5 or 6 k more than the fusion. Help me spend my money!
If money is the overriding factor, buy the Avalon. They are a nice car and sell in small numbers. Not so much competition when you go to sell it.
I'm assuming you aren't going to take the difference in price, invest it, and make a fortune.
'17 Chevy Volt Premiere
"I had a similar experience with an IS350...I had to leave it in sport mode. The default felt like a corolla driving through sand. Actually felt my blood pressure rise; very annoying"
2012 Optima EX. Driving a Corolla through sand is a very apt metaphor. I missed a merge into traffic because it wouldn't downshift, and right when I let off the gas having missed it, the car suddenly lurched forward and I almost hit someone. Not good.
You're stating the Avalon will basically cost $9K more than the Kia to buy. The question is then not what the Kia & Avalon will be worth after 7 years but will the Avalon still be worth $9K more (or greater) after 7 years. If the Avalon is worth $10K and the Kia only worth $4K, the Avalon will have cost $3K more to own (only considering purchase & selling prices; operating costs are another factor).
Avalon: $39K-10K=$29K net cost
Kia: $30K-4K=$26K net cost
Really, though, it shouldn't matter as long as you can afford it. As another poster said, buy the car you like. Or, as I say it, buy the car you want to drive, not the car you want to sell.
The Fusion 2.0 E/B Titanium is really nice if you can haggle down to 29,990. I would not pay $33 k for it, especially when I just saw a 199/mo lease deal on the Fusion yesterday. Of course it would not be on a fully loaded Fusion for 199 but it does show that Ford is now willing to deal.
There is another choice. The VW CC is also 30 to 37 k. It is absolutely gorgeous, it is comparable size between mid-size and large sedans on the outside, (but does have less headroom in the back) and is a step up from the Passat IMHO. I think you should go drive one before you commit.
Here is an excerpt from the Edmund's review of the 2013:
"The CC is a step above most other midsize sedans. You can see it in profile, as it combines the lower body of a sedan with the tight roof line of a coupe. It's fractionally smaller inside and more expensive overall than the conventional Passat sedan, but it also boasts higher-quality construction, a more advanced base engine, sharper driving dynamics, better overall refinement and sleeker style. It also costs considerably more, as this is an entry-level luxury car with a commensurate level of comfort and convenience features."
I would avoid the Fusion as they are everywhere and you don't want to spend $30K on what is perceived as a rental car. I do like the Optima but only if you get it for the right price as it is still a Kiyundai and their long-term value is still an open question. If you are shopping Avalon, then I would also suggest a drive in the Lacrosse or new Impala.
2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6
Red Top already has 58 older Fusions, so they must be continuing their relationship with Ford and buying new ones. I found the article in the Washington Business Journal. See it here:
http://www.bizjournals.com/washington/morning_call/2013/04/new-taxicab-comes-to-- arlington.html
I think it says something good about the durability of the car if cab companies are buying them. I wonder what engine they prefer? I would guess 2.5.
Calling something a "rental car" implies that its primary purpose is to be a rental and that can only be attributed to the old Impala at this point.
I posted over a month ago about chatting up a guy with a Fusion at the gas station and he said it was a rental. It had small alloys and cloth seats, but was very nice inside. Great materials and still very stylish. Put a tint on it and some 18' wheels an no one would know it was ever a rental.
Nothing wrong with rental cars - heck, my 2002 Intrigue was a Certified used car I bought in '03 that was ex-Avis. I liked it. But I didn't pay $30K for it either.
I agree that the purchase should be based on the car you like best for the money you're willing to spend.
2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6
I read an article in C/D (sorry to keep using references from them, but I have been a subscriber since 1987), that said anyone buying a car more expensive than $25,000 is making a very emotional decision. There is something about the car that they LOVE, almost like a human.
I enjoy that feeling about my car. I still look back as I am walking away in parking lots, I still use the shirt I am wearing to wipe smudges off the window, and I hope I never stop doing either.
See, even James Bond doesn't have a problem being seen in a Fusion rental!
Avalon is smoother, although from what reviews I have read, it has stiffened the ride a bit. Now it shares chassis with Lexus ES which is no longer based on the Camry. V6 is the non hybrid engine choice.
Fusion is sportier, and only comes with a 4 cyl, not as smooth as a V6, but will most likely return better mileage.
????. I guess you mean that the Avalon is a full size car and the Fusion is a midsize car. Most full size cars drive somewhat different....because they are a different class of car. Toyota's Fusion competition in the midsize field is the Camry. Avalon is comparable to other full sizers like the Taurus, Impala, Alzera, LaCrosse and 300. All a class up from the cars that are discussed here. Equipped with similar equipment these cars usually run about $6-9k more than the midsizers.
I guess there was a point to be made and I don't know what it was, but I'm listening.
I know you have been trying to decide between three cars, two of which are mid size. So, I think it is fine you are posting about it here. If you choose Fusion 2.0 E/B Titanium or Optima SX you will save some money and have a great car
In response to m6user:
If you buy the Avalon you have to talk about it on the large car board after all is said and done, but I still want to know if you did choose it, and how you like it every now and then.
I feel there should be a board called "Modern Mainstream Sedans", and have it done by price range. Until then though, mid size is the focus here,
I have a 2011 Hyundai Sonata. I purchased it new, and now have 47,000 miles on it. Aside from several interior squeaks and rattles it has been reliable. Dealer service has been exceptional. It is my first Hyundai, and I would not hesitate to buy another Hyundai product.
Based on ALG residual value figures, the Avalon will probably be worth $10,000 after 7 years. The Fusion Titanium would be about $7,000 after 7 years. As others have pointed out, you will have spent $29,000 on the Avalon, and $26,600 on the Fusion. The KIA Optima Turbo will have a value of $6-7,000 after 7 years as well, so you will have spent only $23-24,000 on the KIA.
It all comes down to which one makes you happiest and where you feel your money is best spent. I would probably trust a 7 year old Toyota or KIA/Hyundai product more than I would a 7 year old Ford product. I have owned 2 Fords and had no luck with them. I was no stranger to the Ford service department for unscheduled work.
Capless fuel fuel filler is convenient, although minor.
My Fusion also has remote start. I rarely use it and when I do, it's to find the car in the dark.
It's less obnoxious that using the panic feature.
I don't have the remote start, but I very much wish I did!
The car does not like to be left running without the me in the car. It "screams" at me with an irritating, ear-piercing warning chime. ( but I understand why). It only last about 10 seconds and is helpful if you really did accidentally leave the car running with the key-fob in or even forgot to turn the car off even if you didn't leave the fob.
I'd be very surprised if the Avalon was worth only 10k after 7 years.
'17 Chevy Volt Premiere
My Fusion does have keyless entry, which is what you are referring to.
When my car is running or active and I exit it with the key in my pocket, I get scolded too.