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Comments
Other than this, the truck is GREAT
And the Cherokee comparison? Please. The Cherokee's will be discounted and on car rental lots in 2 years despite the re-design. The only good Cherokee is the top of the line which is 46,000!! The Cherokee feels small on the inside compared to the 4Runner. I have a feeling that their are some Chrysler plants on this blog.
Where is the news here? It's a well known fact that the bean counters were involved in the redesign of the new 4Runner. To name a few - no locking gas cap, no L.E.D. tail lights, old fashion radio antenna, and now your telling us a steel spare tire?
That's really no surprise.
BTW-if you really wanted to go through the trouble, you could rotate the spare by dismounting it and putting it on one of your regular rims, and then take that tire and mount it on the spare. It may be cost prohibitive to do it this way.
in one, it fits a lot of needs for its price level. Plenty of cargo space, decent miles per gallon of regular gas, enough power, fit and finish is very good. It sits you up high with an old fashion feel of strength with good handling. It is not a sports car that takes curves with abandon but it is quite fun to drive.
If like me you are here researching what to buy I hope this helps assure you this is a good choice if you like a big strong feel when you drive.
by all means, continue to enjoy and take care of your '08. but sorry, you're totally deluded if you think the 5th gen will be devalued in comparison to the 4th gen. they're both good vehicles.
yeah, i get that the dollar's dropped; and that the 4Runner (thankfully) has always been built in Japan. but like i said before, both the 4th gen and 5th gen 4Runner are good vehicles.
and sorry to dispel your illusions, but it's delusional.
Of course, even in the face of the foregoing, and the negatives you list, the ultimate measure of value applied by many of us is trouble-free operation for years and miles. Knowledge of how that most important issue works out is, hopefully, a long time in the future.
i also forgot to mention the addition of things like the factory rear locker on the Trail, heated wipers, and the addition of the backup camera and/or sonar... not to mention the beefier and reinforced 150 platform frame, stronger rear axle with 8.18" ring gear (4th gen had 7.87"), improved fuel economy and additional power of the dual VVTI V6 across the board, etc, etc...
i agree with you completely that the proof is in the pudding: how the new model holds up. i just think it's unfounded lunacy for folks to assert that the 4th gen is "more valuable" yadda-yadda. their individual plusses and minuses notwithstanding, they're both excellent vehicles.
Tired of the "clinger oners" going on and on about how they can never look at the new 4 runner...enough all ready! :shades:
“The Grand Cherokee is a big improvement over the previous model, with refinement on par with models that cost a lot more,” said David Champion, senior director of the auto test centre. “The 4Runner, which still uses a body-on-frame design, is disappointing on the road. The 4Runner doesn’t let you forget you’re driving a truck.”
They rated the redesigned (and decontented)">link title 4Runner at the bottom of its class.
honestly, tsu670, we get it: you don't like the new 4Runner. move on. it's over.
http://www.thecarconnection.com/marty-blog/1051106_consumer-reports-2011-jeep-gr- and-cherokee-tops-toyota-4runner
The link I provided in the previous post has the following statement:
"The Grand Cherokee is too new for Consumer Reports to have reliability data, and the 4Runner scored too low in the magazine’s testing to recommend it. The magazine only recommends vehicles that have performed well in its tests, have at least average predicted reliability, and performed at least adequately if crash-tested or included in a government rollover test."
I would imagine CR stopped deciding to recommend the 4Runner after the "vehicles that performed well in its tests" phase of analysis. There's no reason to believe the new 4Runner would not "have at least average predicted reliability, and performed at least adequately if crash-tested or included in a government rollover test." The 4Runner has always had high reliability and safety ratings, and one can reasonably hope Toyota didn't compromise on those factors in its decontenting of the latest version.
Personally, however, if it were time to replace our '08 4Runner Limited, I would seriously look at the new Jeep.
http://content.usatoday.com/communities/driveon/post/2010/11/new-grand-cherokee-- leads-37-chrysler-group-sales-rise-/1
Not saying I would necessarily buy one, but would certainly give it a fair shake, especially in comparison to the new 4Runner. I, too, would be concerned about Chrysler reliability, especially on a 1st year production run of a new version. Might be worth waiting a year or two. Same goes for the 4Runner. The dollar/yen ratio might someday improve substantially.
Thank you for the opportunity to rebut.
"The 4Runner doesn't let you forget you're driving a truck." sure sounds like CR penalized the new 4Runner for its "back to its [truck] roots" credo with the 5th generation design. my read on that is that CR placed a premium on a car-like ride and handling; the unibody, IFS/IRS Grand Cherokee delivers on that, of course. but for those of us who want, well, a truck, it just won't suit. different strokes, as they say.
Chrysler is really betting the farm on the new GC (they have to, after all!) and early anecdotal reports indicate the creature comforts are evident, but one can't ignore the company's storied history of crap reliability. the fact that 90 days ago Edmunds' 2011 Grand Cherokee test vehicle blew its power steering pump and threw its serpentine belt—requiring it to be towed home—is likely a strong indication that nothing has changed but the window dressing, i'm afraid.
but, like you said, time will tell. cheers.
the Grand Cherokee (Jeep itself, more broadly) has a well-founded/deserved reputation for poor quality stretching back many, many years. every mention of Jeep on this sub-forum has come with that caveat and commensurate hesitation, and the professional auto reviewers never fail to make note of it in their critiques either. the new JGC is an attempted "reboot" by a company that in the past decade has been bought and sold, filed for bankruptcy, and is now at the start of a new partnership (with Fiat of all companies... don't get me started). given the state of the american auto industry, of course there's a certain allure to the notion of a homegrown brand making good again, rising from the ashes, and winning out the day. it makes for an awesome story; i'm not immune to its appeal. however, the fact is that the JGC comes burdened by a family history—quality improvements must be deep to be substantive and lasting. and quite honestly, the fact that Chrysler has now grafted its already questionable DNA with Fiat... well, it just doesn't give me the warm and fuzzies, let's say.
the 4Runner, on the other hand is the 5th generation of a venerable brand, manufactured—as from the start—in Toyota's renowned Tahara plant with LandCruiser and Lexus models whose build quality exudes, well, quality. the 4Runner's new Prado 150 platform is an evolution of a trusted foundation that's proven its mettle and earned a rock-solid reputation for more than 25 years. despite the public drubbing it took last year, (and odd how the NHTSA's recent findings were nowhere near as widely publicized by the press) Toyota's quality system is still considered the gold standard and emulated worldwide.
buyers looking at a new 4Runner aren't asking themselves, "it's nice, but is it going to last?" because they don't have to. it's a stark contrast with the same inner monologue played out at a Jeep dealer, because that's the way it is. people will compare feature-by-feature, but when it comes to Toyota, the question of quality is simply off the table.
yes, yes, yen -v- USD, decontenting, blah, blah... those are real things, sure, but if you think that Toyota hit the "sloppy switch" on the 2010 4Runner assembly line because of the currency exchange—and that if the USD/yen ratio improves they'll return it to the "quality setting"—well, that's just bananas. yes, bananas.
your attitude about the 4th gen being the last "valuable" 4Runner is like a high school student chanting "Class of 2010 sucks! Class of 2008 ROCKS!!" they're both great vehicles borne of a storied history of great vehicles. and you do them both a disservice by presenting the 2011 JGC and 2010 4Runner as a parity choice.
I suspect there are more than just lousy seats causing your problems.
The MDX is a great vehicle with a uni body chassis and front (or all wheel?) drive.
It is NOTHING LIKE the 4Runner.
You would have been better off with the Highlander for every day driving, but it would not have met your towing requirements.
You can't have very thing. That Durango will ride like a truck as well.
First you misrepresent a statement of an article I linked that you admitted turned out to be from another article entirely, then you misrepresented my direct words. What appeared to be a potentially intelligent conversation instead turned disappointing. Perhaps for others reading this thread it isn't difficult to see where the "bla, bla, bla" is really coming from.
"The 4Runner has always had high reliability and safety ratings, and one can reasonably hope Toyota didn't compromise on those factors in its decontenting of the latest version.
...
I, too, would be concerned about Chrysler reliability, especially on a 1st year production run of a new version. Might be worth waiting a year or two. Same goes for the 4Runner. The dollar/yen ratio might someday improve substantially."
honestly, when i read your words again, it's difficult for me to arrive at a different conclusion, but in any case, i did not "misrepresent [your] direct words". based on your saying above that you believe "quality would not change" it would seem that i misinterpreted them, though i would be surprised to learn that i was alone in that interpretation.
secondly, yes, i admitted that i mistakenly quoted a different article reporting the exact same Consumer Reports story (CR is behind a paywall; can't link to the story directly). again, there was no misrepresentation; i explained the error. having said that, the quote from the article i sourced was that CR could not recommend the new JGC due to its "lackluster reliability" — which is a fact no matter which article you happened to read. moreover, the spirit of the article i quoted was precisely the same as the one you originally linked to because, obviously, they were reporting the exact same CR test results. the differences are trivial and ultimately immaterial. further, the quote "The 4Runner doesn’t let you forget you’re driving a truck” is indeed from the article you linked to in your post.
please illuminate me as to how any of that amounts to "misrepresentation"? ... "You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means." - Inigo Montoya, The Princess Bride.
i regret that you feel a "potentially intelligent conversation turned disappointing." i feel i've made some exceedingly cogent (if impassioned) points and, like anyone on the Internet, leave it to readers to separate the wheat from the chaff for themselves.
1. Someone comparing a $40k vehicle's comfort to a $80k+ vehicles comfort. Well, at least he did acknowledge that the $80k vehicle was perhaps not very reliable.
2. Someone keeps on harping about the greatness of a Jeep.
3. Little annoyances like the lack of locking for the gas cap, bug's eye like protrusion of the side lights etc... btw, it is amazing that my wife picked at all those little nits after just walking around the vehicle at the dealer's and the test ride.
There are some serious complaints like the hissing brake which deserves careful attention. Otherwise, I think I just read a bunch of pages with nit pickers trying to portray inconvenience as a problem. I think they knew that going in and should not have purchased the vehicle as those were pretty obvious at the first glance.
Now that you have the vehicle, why not just try to enjoy it and have fun
I then bought a 97 T4R SR5 and still own it to this day with it now having 154,000 miles. Truck is totally undestructable.
Yes it has no locking gas cap, and it has the poll antenna with no longer works, no LED's, no heated mirrors, etc, etc. But the truck is depenable as hell.
I never buy the first year production of a new MY and I will probably keep mt Runner or give it to my daugher who wants it bad, but I am just soooo nervous about buying a new Runner because they just don't make them like they used to. But if and when I need to buy a new truck the 4Runner will be number one on my list.
4th Gen Better Than 5th
Let's review - mast antenna, no locking gas cap, no V8, no LED tail lights, etc.
Toyota has turned the 4Runner in to a low-volume niche seller.
Consumer reports stated in this article stating that the new "redesigned" models inc. the Volkswagen Jetta, Toyota 4Runner and others were actually inferior to the models they replaced.
Maybe they did hit the "sloppy switch".
So, if you're looking for a true off road SUV the buy the 4Runner since that is what it was engineered for. If you're looking for a smooth quiet ride then buy a crossover. :mad:
Very disappointing, since I am kind of looking at a new SUV and the 4Runner was on top of my list.
Until the Prius and the first Scion, I always though of Toyota as having rather poor design, kind of being the Japanese Oldsmobile.
But the Prius and the Scion, as well as the rather over-designed FJ Cruiser made me think Toyota is getting a bit younger and more stylish.
Well, the new 4Runner is just garish It's like a GM truck without the gold logo.
Bummer.
I am a subscriber, so it's probably not on the newstands yet, but check it out when it comes.
www.crutchfield.com
I am very amazed with my 4runner 2007 4 wheel drive ...
if you wanna save gas and emission free contact me because,I did some modification of my engine with regular OEM hardware..
city mileage runs around 18.8 to 21 so far....
I have almost 65thousand miles but never been at the shop yet only oil changes at approximate every 3,500 miles with synthetic mobil 1 5w30..my brake never been change until I bought the truck and coolant still full also at the same time my brake fluid.....this truck is the best toy,I ever had in my life......love it so much....