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2010 Toyota 4Runner redesign

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Comments

  • nippononlynippononly Member Posts: 12,555
    The linked article was written more than a year ago, and I think Toyota will certainly have had cause since then to reconsider keeping the 4Runner in the North American lineup. Unless they are actively planning a diesel model, of which I see no signs at all, I think they may be planning to just let the model slowly fade away. It is BOF when all the SUVs have moved away from that formula except the full-size ones, it is not much smaller than the Sequoia, which is selling relatively well, and with the intro of the Venza you can bet they will be planning to extend the Highlander again to give it proper third-row room. At which point Highlander will step all over 4Runner in size and utility, while offering 20% better fuel economy at a lower purchase price.

    How can they keep 4Runner with all that going on? Where would it fit in, and how would they find buyers for it?

    It would be kind of cool to see them just return to their original formula: take a Tacoma with existing powertrains including the 4-cylinder, add the bare essentials for some jump seats and a removable shell in the bed, make that the next 4Runner.

    2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)

  • jonesok1jonesok1 Member Posts: 97
    That could be, but if they were going to just let it fade away, then why keep the web page? You would think they would simply delete that line, but they haven't done so. At least it's a good sign that the 4Runner will be around a while longer.

    The reps at the NYS autoshow said they thought the 2010 would debut in June or October, but they really didn't have any more information than we do. It was more like "I think" it will but don't really know.

    Also, the statements of Bob Carter, Toyota Div. group vice president and general manager, seem to indicate a newly designed 4Runner will be introduced. See http://wardsauto.com/ar/toyota_4runner_place_090305/. It's amazing how they can keep it under their hat this well.

    GM
  • donringlerautodonringlerauto Member Posts: 27
    I dont think there is any reason to worry about it not coming out. It still comes up in every Toyota meeting and everytime I talk with anyone from Toyota. Also, its still on their "Launch Calendar" with an October 2009 launch date. Who knows, it may get pushed back a month or two, but I doubt it would get chopped from the line...

    That being said, everything in the Auto industry is abnormal right now.... BUT if you wanted to bet against it coming out, I'd take your bet! Just let me know! :)
  • jonesok1jonesok1 Member Posts: 97
    I hope so! I'm ordering one as soon as they will take an order!
  • tombrighttombright Member Posts: 1
    Great car for crumbling California roads. A 2008 on lot for 180 days, $2k off plus usual Fleet arrangement ($34k on sticker, so $27k was a deal), SR5, no Limiteds around that we could find. Her 1999 only had 94k on it and was only worth a ridiculous $4k despite being new in every way but on the calendar, so I'm putting the miles on it for work. T-100 has 228k, so it's out to pasture (in the barn, actually) at the farm now, still tight and shiny. Our Fleet guy was delivering a Tundra right beside our 4Runner, and he whispered to me, "We've had this one 514 days." They call that Lot Rot. I found two loaded SportTrac Fords with a build date 27 months ago!
  • donringlerautodonringlerauto Member Posts: 27
    Got this in an ordering announcement on Current Model 4Runners from Gulf States Toyota -

    "This was the last order for exterior colors Shadow Mica, Salsa Red, and Nautical Blue. TMS has turned
    these off in preparation for the launch of the new gen 4Runner."
  • kfrohlichkfrohlich Member Posts: 6
    Any update when the new 2010 Toyota 4Runner will be available in the US? I'm shopping for a Toyota 4Runner and need to make a decision on whether to get the 2009 model or wait for the 2010 model.

    Thanks.
    Kenny
  • brandonWIbrandonWI Member Posts: 26
    Good news....hopefully. The sooner it arrives, the better! I am hoping to see some spy pics and some details on it soon too. I would have to imagine we shall find these things out soon if it truly does come out by fall.

    Keep us posted,
    Thanks,
    Brandon
  • jonesok1jonesok1 Member Posts: 97
    I attended a grand opening of a local Toyota dealer's new facility. In attendance were regional rep's who told me that the 2010 4Runner will definitely launch in October, and that orders will be taken in Septemeber. He didn't know when the official announcement would be made, however.

    Other than that, he wouldn't comment, probably because he didn't know much more than that.

    GM
  • sanishsanish Member Posts: 66
    2010 4Runner has been nominated for 2010 Truck of the year.

    http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/News/articleId=151107

    This means that it will be released before 12/31/09, don't know when.
  • brandonWIbrandonWI Member Posts: 26
    I just ran across the same nomination page and thought that was very odd considering the public has not seen or heard much if anything about it:)

    Here is a link to a pdf file about the '10 4runner. Looks like a 268HP V6 & 4cyl only. Should arrive around September. More rugged with improved interior mentioned. I also see that a fold flat 3rd row is offered, does this mean they went to a IRS setup?

    http://www.tundrasolutions.com/forums/4runner/160791-10-4runner-2/

    The one thing that surprises me is no mention of a 6spd tranny. I was really hoping for it for gas mileage reasons......hmmm.
  • nedzelnedzel Member Posts: 787
    Interesting information. I too am looking forward to a 6-speed transmission, but I'm disappointed to see the V8 go. I wonder about the IRS, too.
  • jonnya40jonnya40 Member Posts: 1
    I was at a dealership this week and was told end of July for 2010 4Runner - would be bigger and similar to the Sequoia but not sure about any other details.
  • rsarramirsarrami Member Posts: 47
    Hi:

    It is now official, 2010 4runner will start production on Aug and will be available in dealers in late Sept to early Oct. I have a pdf copy of dealers order form, someone let me know if it can be posted.

    The highlight are as follow:
    V8 discontinued, V6 only, 4.0 Lit DOHC Dual VVTI – 4 trims, Base, Upgrade Package, Trail Edition, Limited and Limited Navg.
    :)
  • sven007sven007 Member Posts: 7
    Yes rsarrami, it can be posted.
  • qs933qs933 Member Posts: 302
    If you could post it, that would be great. I'm really curious as to where the 2010 4Runner will be positioned in the lineup.

    Based on what we've read so far, it seems like Toyota may be aiming it more at the Xterra type of crowd, versus the premium/up-market turn in the 4th Generation.
  • rsarramirsarrami Member Posts: 47
    snev007,

    How do I post the pdf here? Let me know and I'll post right away.
  • rsarramirsarrami Member Posts: 47
    Based on this document, they are aiming at both. (Xtera and pathfinder in one vehicle but based on the trim)

    The trail edition, has the Kinetic suspension, Skid plates, crawl control (don’t know what it is), Multi-terrain select, multi-terrain ABS, roof rack, Mat black, bumper-door handle-mirrors, deleted running board.

    The limited is X-reas Suspension, 20” wheels, 15 speaker, rear subwoofer, climate control, chrome grille-door handles-around fig lamps, deleted splash guard, running board, and yes full time-4WD for city driver.

    I want an off-road capable but I am not crazy about their pigeon holing my taste. For example, I want the running board since my off road is very limited annually (for hunting) and I would be using this for family as well. I am also not a fan of the back matt stuff. So what if the color coded bumpers get scratched? If you recall they did have the black matt fenders with earlier versions of the 4gn of 4runners. It was very unpopular so they color coded it after one/two year.

    As I said, if there is a way to post the pdf let me know and I will post it. Unfortunately, coping in the document is locked and I can not copy and past the text.
  • sven007sven007 Member Posts: 7
    rsarrami,

    My bad, you can't post a PDF on this forum. But look at post #63 above by brandonWI. He posted a link to a PDF on the tundrasolutions.com website. Earlier today I clicked on that link and downloaded the PDF. When I responded to your post I thought I had downloaded the PDF from this website. Sorry for the confusion.

    If you want, you can post the PDF on the tundrasolutions.com forum and link to it in a post on this website (like in post #63). I know I'm dying to see a copy of the dealer's order form!
  • qs933qs933 Member Posts: 302
    Thanks for the info -- it's great. Hopefully there's a way to post it (the other way would be one of public file uploading sites -- Google "file upload").

    I'm guessing Toyota is trying to bring the base price down significantly from the $28K starting point of the 2009 SR5. The 4-cylinder and the "Upgrade Package" sound like there will be a true base model similar to the way the entry-level Tacoma is rather basic.

    I'm interested in the Limited trim -- everything I've read so far sounds great. Will it have a power rear liftgate (either standard or optional)?
  • rsarramirsarrami Member Posts: 47
    I'll see if I can upload in Google and let you know.

    ps. There is no indication of 4-cyl, V6 is the only option. You guys are lucky; the 4runner starts at $36,800 in Canada. We always pay significantly more since we are a smaller market. However, the options and packages are different. The info that I have submitted is for Canadian Market. Canadian version of vehicles most often have more standard option. For example, current version of 4Runner only comes in 4WD in Canada and the sports package in here has more options. But still we pay about 15% more than you guys in States.
  • brandonWIbrandonWI Member Posts: 26
    rsarrami,

    Thanks for the info. Were you able to post the pdf elsewhere yet? As you know I posted a link to a different pdf on the tundra solutions forum. Yours seems to have new info. Any word on when more info will be released publically and when dealers can begin taking orders?

    Thanks once again!

    Brandon
  • rsarramirsarrami Member Posts: 47
    Hi:

    Attached is a link to a .pdf file, 2010 4Runner dealer order form. It contains detail info on the new model. The production is scheduled to start in Aug with estimated arrival date of late September to Early Oct at the dealers.

    The link is:
    http://uploading.com/files/K39NC7N7/10_4Runner_VOAS_COST_EN.pdf.html

    This site makes you wait 60 second, watching their add, before it allows the download, but it is public and free.

    Please note this information is from Canada and the trims and options may be different in US (as it is today).

    Enjoy, and please post new info and Pics if you come across any recent valid ones.
    :)
  • rsarramirsarrami Member Posts: 47
    Hi Brandon:

    I just created a new tread with the link to the pdf file.

    I should be having more info by end of this week or early next week. I will post as soon as I get it.

    R.
  • brandonWIbrandonWI Member Posts: 26
    R,

    Awesome! Thanks for the pdf file! Thanks for keeping us posted, I cant wait to finally see some pics too :)

    Brandon
  • rsarramirsarrami Member Posts: 47
    Hi:

    Check out post #76. I have the link to the download there.

    R.
  • qs933qs933 Member Posts: 302
    Awesome! Thanks for posting it.

    Several things I noticed:

    * The V6's automatic remains a 5-speed (kind of makes sense -- none of Toyota's other V6 trucks have a 6-speed).

    * No power liftgate (answering my earlier question) -- I thought it might be due to the weight of the retractable rear window, but the Sequoia has both the power rear window and power liftgate

    * No beige interior (but black leather is now available) -- this might be a Canadian thing, though. I noticed the Canadian 09 is only available with a Stone interior (and with a more limited set of exterior colors than in the US).

    * Leather available via the Upgrade Package on the SR5

    * Puddle lamps and turn signal repeaters on the mirrors (Limited)

    * Eco Drive monitor -- pretty neat; glad to see it available on non-Hybrids as well

    I'm trying to picture what the various trim levels will look like. It's interesting that the SR5 will move towards color-keyed elements including the mirrors except for the fender flares, which will be matte black.

    The Trail Edition goes matte black for the bumpers, fender flares, mirrors and even door handles.

    The Limited gets color-keyed fender flares, but the grill is chrome (the reverse of the 09).
  • rsarramirsarrami Member Posts: 47
    The most interesting thing that I have noted is that finally Toyota has acknowledged its initial base customers, the Hunter and Anglers and off-road users.

    Limited packaged for city users and Train for Off-road users with meaningful differences ,for parts which counts and they are:

    Key differences
    - Ttransmission (Full-Time 4WD versus part time), Multi-terrain features
    - Suspension KDSS versus X-REAS (although X-REAS is very good as well)
    - Skid Plates on Trail (although not enough, you must buy your own engine plate like FJ)
    - Wheels 20” all season low profile versus 17” M&S

    Notable differences
    - 3rd row seating on Limited
    - Leather versus water and dirt repellent fabric (hopefully with rubber cover cargo and floor area similar to FJ)
    - Running board and underbody spoilers (although as a off-road user I disagree with removal of running board. You loose about ½” when the vehicle is on its side, but you get to hit that before your vehicle’s body. It also protects the side from stone splash from M&S tires on off road use)

    Regards,

    R.
  • tommatetommate Member Posts: 4
    Does anyone know if the 2010 4Runner 3rd roll can seat 2 or 3 people?
  • qs933qs933 Member Posts: 302
    > Does anyone know if the 2010 4Runner 3rd roll can seat 2 or 3 people?

    If I had to bet, I'd wager that the 3rd row will seat 2 short and skinny people. More than likely it'll be a 7-seater in a 2-3-2 configuration, just like the current 4Runner and the Highlander.

    There's just not much room for a 3rd row in a vehicle of the 4Runner's length. The current 4Runner's 3rd row is not very practical given how tight it is and how much space it takes up when folded. The 2010 is supposed to use a fold-flat 3rd row, so at least it'll stow out of the way when not needed.
  • owenmaeowenmae Member Posts: 1
    So, does anyone know if the 2010 4Runner has an Independent Rear Suspension ?
  • huck1776huck1776 Member Posts: 1
    If the ordering guide pdf is for real, then which is a better vehicle for daily commute and weekend offroading- the 2009 (Trail Edition) or 2010 (Trail Edition)?

    Huck
  • brandonWIbrandonWI Member Posts: 26
    The 2010 has a solid rear axle like the 2009.......in the pdf it mentions the same suspension setup as the current gen.

    As for which model is the better combo, its yet to be seen but from the specs it looks as if the 2010 is catering more to the off road crowd with crawl control, KDSS, and etc. Personally I would like the trail version for 2010 but I need leather & heated seats. Although maybe the US version will offer this:)
  • nedzelnedzel Member Posts: 787
    "Does anyone know if the 2010 4Runner 3rd roll can seat 2 or 3 people?"

    If it is anything like the current 4Runner, it can seat 2 midgets. If you really need 3 rows for adults or older children, you need a bigger vehicle (Sequoia, Expedition).
  • nedzelnedzel Member Posts: 787
    " Personally I would like the trail version for 2010 but I need leather & heated seats. "

    Agreed. I would take the Limited edition, but not with 20" wheels.
  • rsarramirsarrami Member Posts: 47
  • thammer62thammer62 Member Posts: 48
    People forget that you don't have to buy limited to get leather heated seats. Buy the trail edition and have an aftermarket shop recover the seats. My friend had a cloth Tahoe entirely done up with heated leather for around $1,200. You'd never know the difference. Save 4 or 5 grand by not getting the limited this way.
  • brandonWIbrandonWI Member Posts: 26
    No word yet? Someone mentioned they would have more info on the '10 soon and that was a week ago or so. I assume the dealers must still be in the dark like us:)
  • rsarramirsarrami Member Posts: 47
    Hi Brandon:

    Sorry forgot to post the info earlier. I have uploaded a pdf file with more info on the 4runner. It actually has highlight of all new features for Toyota line up. It seems that US will be getting the 4 Cyl. I bet it would be 2 WD. We never get any 2WD in Canada (no Market for it. It also has the updates on FJ. No more Premium gas.

    You can download it using the link below.

    http://uploading.com/files/BI0T1RSY/New for 2010 Toyota lineup.pdf.html

    Don’t curse, the site makes you watch a add for 90 sec but upload and download is free.

    R.
  • donringlerautodonringlerauto Member Posts: 27
    Heard today that there will be dealer training on the 4Runner in late September and that the new 4Runner will be featured/shown at the Texas State Fair in Dallas.

    The fair begins on September 25th I believe.

    - Donnie
  • brandonWIbrandonWI Member Posts: 26
    Thanks R.!

    I belive someone posted that same .pdf a week or so ago, but no biggie:)
  • brandonWIbrandonWI Member Posts: 26
    Good news Donnie, especially considering the 25th's my B-day!

    Will this be the first public showing or will Toyota release anythig beforehand?
  • rsarramirsarrami Member Posts: 47
    I believe release of information in bits and pieces is deliberate and controlled by Toyota to generate interest for the launch.

    It makes no sense to have this level of detail info but no photos. A US version of dealer order form, such as the one I posted a couple of weeks ago, should have also been available in US.

    The info I got from my contact at dealership & posted yesterday is old (but was new to him). My contact at the dealer is away on vacation for another two weeks. He indicated that more official info from Toyota should be available upon his return.

    It was no surprise to see that the new 4runner engine is duel VVT-i. But it was disappointing to see the torque remains almost unchanged (HP did increase). Nissan Pathfinders 4.0 lit 5 year old engines produce Horsepower of 266 HP @ 5600 rpm and Torque of 288 lb-ft @ 4000 rpm. As we all know while both HP and Torque are important, in trucks/SUV Torque is what we often desire/need for towing and low speeds.

    Further, I do not see why Toyota have chosen not move to a 6 speed auto instead of 5 speed or for that matter CVT in their SUV line up similar to Nissan. Both technologies are now relatively mature and deployed in many cars and SUVs.

    Ramin
  • donringlerautodonringlerauto Member Posts: 27
    I wish I was more help, but I really dont know. They are doing this as more of a "Soft Launch" as opposed to the launches like the new 2010 Prius.

    I would imagine that they will be in Dealerships right around that time as well and, as Toyota usually does, each dealer will probably receive at least one around then...

    The training, probably, will be in the Dallas area... Again, this is all just speculation :)
  • brandonWIbrandonWI Member Posts: 26
    Ramin,

    I feel the same way you do. I think Toyota dropped the ball on offering a mediocre V6 and no V8 option with the upcoming 4runner. Granted, I have not seen nor driven one, but modern day V6's are putting out closer to 280-290hp and more torque than this one. Plus, discontinuing the V8 when it could have just been an option was odd. Heck, my wifes IS350 with a smaller motor puts our 306HP and 277lbs Torque?

    Then dont get me started on not offering oa 6sp auto, what year are we in:) Even compact cars lately are offering them and Toyota has them in other cars why not the 4runner? The benefits of more gears if done right is tremendous. My mom just bought a LS460 with the 8spd auto, and this huge heavy car gets 26-28MPG on the highway(I have done the math to know).

    I have always loved the 4runners, this upcoming one would be my 4th in a row and my parents owned 3 or 4 also. I just hope the rest of the truck is impressive!
  • qs933qs933 Member Posts: 302
    Geez, the 2010 hasn't even launched and we're griping about it already. :)

    Comparing the 4Runner's V6 to the IS350's V6 is entertaining, but that's about it. Apples and oranges.

    I'm not surprised that we're not seeing huge advancements in the engine and transmission. Does any other Toyota truck have a V6 with a 6-speed auto? No.

    With all the signs indicating that Toyota was on the fence about even launching a new 4Runner for 2010, I'll be more than happy with an improved V6 and the good ol' 5-speed.

    We're making judgements based only on a "higher number is better" approach, which is understandable without any other info.
  • rsarramirsarrami Member Posts: 47
    Hi qs933,

    As you know the significant cost in manufacturing is the R&D. In times when auto manufacturing survival is based on fuel efficiency, one would presume that companies would offer their more fuel efficient and high power engines in a lower price category vehicles (not that 4rnuuer can be considered as an inexpensive vehicle by any means).

    The Ontario government (a province of Canada) has announced rebates ranging from $4,000 to $10,000 for people who buy plug-in hybrid and battery electric vehicles after July 1, 2010.

    Wrt numbers, HP and torque (sometime presented and kwt) are auto industry’s standard mean of measuring engines output and performance. You are very correct that there many other factors contributing in performance of a vehicle over all than just the engine (tires, aerodynamic shape, transmission, etc..). As far as using a 6 spd auto in truck, it is purely manufacturers marketing decision rather than variability or mechanical obstacles.

    However, looking at engine alone and looking at the history of this vehicle in compression with its competitors, we see it often lack the necessary/desired/competitive edge in engine output for smooth towing. Toyota does posses such technology and it no longer is considered premium. Camary V6 has a 3.5 Lit fuel efficient engine producing 268 HP, 248 torque @ 4,700 rpm with Tier 2 Bin 5 Emissions Rating. A shared engine and transmission with Lexus ES 350.

    Toyota 4Runner has claimed its reputation and leadership among SUV's primarily based on reliability, longevity and off-road compatibility, but most defiantly not engine performance (historically lacked enough torque for smooth towing). V8 was their solution to this shortcoming in the last generation.

    To sum it all it up, I had higher expectation from my favourite auto manufacturer. But as you said very effectively, we should wait and see before judging.

    Ramin
  • qs933qs933 Member Posts: 302
    In times when auto manufacturing survival is based on fuel efficiency, one would presume that companies would offer their more fuel efficient and high power engines in a lower price category...

    I'd guess fuel efficiency is why Toyota is bringing back a 4-cylinder offering. It would also allow them to position an entry-level model, making the base 4Runner more affordable.

    I'd agree that R&D is a significant cost to a car maker. Is it really all that surprising that we're not seeing any major breakthroughs in terms of a new engine or transmission for the 4Runner given it's realistic sales volume?

    Looking at the 4Runner Towing thread, I don't see any complaints about the engine lacking torque for towing. I do agree that they seem to be moving away from positioning the 4Runner for serious towing without the V8, but reading that thread, it looks like the 4Runner's relatively short wheelbase excluded it from some of the larger towing jobs anyway.

    You mentioned the Camry and ES350's V6 as examples of the engine technology that Toyota possesses. This is probably over-generalizing, but I'm sure if they could've used the same engine, they would have. They reuse them in the Highlander and Venza (also both Camry-platform-based), so reuse of technology is not something Toyota shies away from.

    The 4Runner's V6 is different from the engines used in the Camry-based vehicles. When the Gen4 4Runner launched in 2003 with the V6, it was heralded as a brand new design for their truck engines. I think squeezing over 30 more horsepower and a bit more torque over the current 4.0L V6 is a pretty good accomplishment.

    My expectations are pretty high for the 2010 in terms of exterior appearance and interior quality. But I'm also going to be realistic in terms of what Toyota will choose to offer -- i.e. this is going to be neither a luxury car nor will it be a fuel-sipping econobox. As one of those uploaded documents said, it's going to return "to its roots."
  • rsarramirsarrami Member Posts: 47
    Hi qs933:

    Based on the Canadian Dealer Order Form that I received from my dealer, Toyota will not be offering a 4-cyl line in Canada.

    Is there any confirmation that they will in US?

    I would have expected a 2wd V6 in US but not a 4-cyl. I also wonder if there would be any other significant variations in US.

    R.
  • qs933qs933 Member Posts: 302
    The 4-cylinder offering is based on that PDF of "2010 Toyota Changes" that was posted to Tundra solutions (and I think you posted the same PDF). I'm assuming that the document is legitimate (and no reason to think it isn't). But no official confirmation -- we won't see anything "official" till Toyota launches.

    Reading between the lines of the Canadian order document and the "2010 Toyota" PDF, I would guess that the US lineup would include:

    - SR5 2WD 4-cyl
    - SR5 2WD V6
    - SR5 4WD V6
    - Trail Edition 2WD V6
    - Trail Edition 4WD V6
    - Limited 2WD V6
    - Limited 4WD V6

    Kind of makes sense that if the 2WD is not offered in Canada, and if the 4-cylinder engine is not mentioned in Canada, that it's probably a 2WD only model. Again, just a guess based on those documents that were posted. I don't think there will be major functional differences other than the 4-cyl/2WD availability. Probably just more option freedom and more color choices, similar to today's model.
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