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BMW 335i vs Infiniti G37

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Comments

  • millwood0millwood0 Member Posts: 451
    for me, the E / GS are out as I don't want to be seen in a MB or Lexus - too old for me to drive them, as does Cadillac.

    the M makes good sense from a performance point of view (vis-a-vis the 5 series) but it is considerably more expensive (due to its low residual).

    what would have been nice? a Camry V6 awd: cheap, utilitarian, unassuming and reliable.

    the C-class is actually pretty nice, though a little bit tight for a family of 4.
  • stuckintrafficstuckintraffic Member Posts: 6
    Just came back from a weekend test driving all 2010 models of Volkswagen CC sport, base A4, base C300, G37S, and Audi Q5. I came backed impressed by all based on my prior expectations except the G37. I had higher expectations with the handling - too high I guess. I came back super impressed by the Q5 but that's another story. My conclusion is that nothing drives like my '07 bmw328 coupe and inspires as much confidence on the road. Too bad I can't stand not having options, gadgets and gizmos and bmw's are overpriced and aren't satisfying, otherwise I would stay w/ my car.

    The whole 328 vs 335 it came down to where I wanted to spend the $7,000 difference between the 328 and 335 -- on an engine upgrade or on more toys. I went with the toys because I'm a middle of the road enthusiast - sport, prem, ipod integration, leather, space grey, nav, rims, comfort access, etc. After all those options the MSRP matched the base 335 or more. I see most 335s with base trim because the car would be almost in M3 territory with all those options by then.

    I understand and respect that the 335 is really the highlight of BMW next to the M3 for many reasons. I drove my brother in-law's 535 and I was amazed how the engine made a heavier car feel lighter than my 328. It must be a beast then on the 335 but my old manager confirmed that his wife's '08 328 sedan is a softer, better daily commuter car for him than his '08 335 sedan. Using the 80/20 rule here, 335 will impress the 20% of the population; the enthusiasts. But 80% of the time ... it doesn't matter to the public whether its 328/335 (if you are at all that is).

    All said and done though, I was just quoted a 2010 G37 Journey w/ Nav, Sport, and Premium for 36,500K before TTL. Now that's a great price for a combo of power/toys/luxury and I'm mulling over whether I should pull the trigger.
  • jmarounjmaroun Member Posts: 151
    I can't resist offering my experiences for others to consider before ultimately making their own decisions. I've owned a manual 08 335 sedan with sports package for 10 months before BMW bought it back from me, after 22k miles, under lemon law due to repeated high pressure fuel pump failures. Before purchasing the 335, I test drove the 09 G37S and 335 twice each, and researched both cars intensively.

    First let me say, no amount of research can replace the value of test driving both cars back to back for comparison. Research to me is also extremely valuable as test drives tend to be short and thus can lead to incomplete and possibly misleading impressions. I like to read everything about a car, to take everyone's experiences and perspectives into account, albiet with a grain of salt in many cases, then to test drive the cars and come to my own conclusions based upon my personal desires, needs, and situation.

    To address the points you've listed:

    1- Reliability: I obviously believe the 335 fails in this category as mine was a lemon due to failed hpfp. Remember however that there are zero maintainance costs up to 50k miles. The 08 hpfp warranty was extended to 120k but I'm not sure about 2010. The worry is, what about after 50k. Due to my experience, I'd find it hard to purchase a 335 or any BMW. Rather, I'd consider leasing. Infinity's reliability scores are markedly better according to consumer reports.

    2- Handling: The G37S felt disconnected and less engaging compared to the 335. I suppose this statement is more drive and feel oriented. It was clear after back to back test drives; the 335 is simply more fun to drive and inspires more confidence. It feels more planted and precise than the G37S. Steering is also more communitive and well weighted on the BMW.

    3- Toys: Hands down, the G37S is equipped with fancier gadgetry.

    4- Interior room: To me, both sedans offer an adequate cabin size However... If you're sitting in the back of a G37S coupe, most likely your head will hit the rear glass hard when the driver goes over any bump as this happened to me while sitting in the back of a friends 09 G37S. I didn't get a chance to ride in the back of the G37S sedan that I test drive. Just looking at the rear slanting roof line of a G37 in general and it is clear that there's an issue here that Infinity should correct.

    5- Better looking interior: the Infinity has more of a "socially sophisticated" look and feel..while the BMW has a more "minimilist yet professional" look and feel. Depending on your tastes, the Infinity interior can look either refreshing or stuffy; while the BMW might look either clean or bland. Of course a bit of both might hold as well.

    As for my recommendations..given my experiences and tastes:
    I'd probably wait a year or two, before deciding, when the new 3 series design is offered. If you can't wait and are a purest.. Lease the 335. If you can't wait and want to keep a car for a long time.. consider buying a 370Z or if you're not really an enthusiast, buy a G37.

    The 335 offers such a good driving experience, it's hard to match at its price point nor well above it. Even the E9x M3 can't offer 335 torque levels, nor as tight steering feel, at low rpm. I've compared a 335 to a lovely day, and night, you spend with someone you care about. It's just satisfying in many respects. It's that good! I would have leased another 335 after BMW bought back mine had I not been concerned about job security due to the dreary economic outlook of the time/s.

    I hope this helps some and infuriates no one. Good luck with your decissions.

    :)

    Joseph
    San Diego
  • ffxjackffxjack Member Posts: 47
    The whole 328 vs 335 it came down to where I wanted to spend the $7,000 difference between the 328 and 335 -- on an engine upgrade or on more toys. I went with the toys because I'm a middle of the road enthusiast - sport, prem, ipod integration, leather, space grey, nav, rims, comfort access, etc. After all those options the MSRP matched the base 335 or more. I see most 335s with base trim because the car would be almost in M3 territory with all those options by then.

    I almost pulled the trigger on a G37 but in the end couldn't because I didn't love the car either time that I test drove it but absolutely loved the 335xi. That being said, at this point in my life, I can't justify paying more than $200/month to lease the BMW instead of the Infiniti.

    Should I look into the 328? I also looked that the Lexus IS 250 because of all the interior conforts but I'm afraid the back may be too small even for my kids' rare ride in my car.
  • stuckintrafficstuckintraffic Member Posts: 6
    Dude I completely agree with all your points, all 1 through 5. The most important thing in your post I want to highlight is if a person doesn't mind leasing, go for the beemer. If you are looking to buy, then the G37 is the way to go.
  • stuckintrafficstuckintraffic Member Posts: 6
    I had a different experience between the 328 sedan and the coupe. I test drove the 328 sedan base and it didn't blow me away. The 328 coupe with the sport and premium package changed my life. I would say yes test either out with both those packages and let me know how you like it :)

    I can't comment on the latest IS250 (my cousin's '04 IS300's backseat feels like my '99 corolla's sadly). In terms of backseat I don't know how tall you and your kids are and how often you would carry more than 2 passengers. I'm not a tall guy but whenever I do drive 3 others in my car, I feel sorry for those in the backseat unless they are all average height or under. A 6'4" person driving the coupe will definitely push the seat all the way back rendering the seat behind him unusable (according to my buddy who owns a 328 too). I once had a 5'7" girl on the passenger side in front of a 6'4" beast and the beast didn't enjoy the 1 hour business trip we had to take. It was once in a blue moon trip so I wouldn't factor that in long term. G37 is definitely smaller than the beemer's. I hit my head on the ceiling in the G37 coupe in the back but never in the beemer's.
  • jimbresjimbres Member Posts: 2,025
    The most important thing in your post I want to highlight is if a person doesn't mind leasing, go for the beemer.

    Just a friendly reminder: "beemer" refers to a BMW motorcycle, while "bimmer" denotes a BMW car. Mixing them up here on Edmunds isn't a big deal, but if you ever post on one of the dedicated BMW boards, the regulars will flame you without mercy for calling a car a "beemer".
  • jtlajtla Member Posts: 388
    I was just quoted a 2010 G37 Journey w/ Nav, Sport, and Premium for 36,500K before TTL

    That is a great price for a 2010 which just hit the showroom. Which region are you in and which dealership quoted that price?
  • millwood0millwood0 Member Posts: 451
    there is a lot to a car than just horse powers.

    to me, a 328 is a better / finer car than a g37. however, the g offers better value.
  • stuckintrafficstuckintraffic Member Posts: 6
    thanks for the heads up. I've no shame to admit i'm still learning the ropes. heck just found out what staggered meant yesterday.
  • stuckintrafficstuckintraffic Member Posts: 6
    socal metro infiniti. this was a quote in december.
  • jmarounjmaroun Member Posts: 151
    Hp isn't everything. If it were, I'd recommend a Mustang GT or GT500 over a 335i..but I'd never do this.

    Regarding a 328 being better than a 335 or G37S, in a real sense, you're right IF, one is like my brother with his 330 who never redlines or even comes close. And that's just fine and respectable, I suppose, if that's all one want to do. For me, it would be a shame since I find a 330's scream to redline so beautiful, refined, and rewarding. But, if like my brother, one rarely if ever takes rmps above 5500 or so..then Yes..I'd agree with you. In that case one would be better off getting a 328 or 330 instead of a 335i. And I feel, in this case, that a 328 would be a better car than a G37 as well since when driving a 328 or 330 causually..the drive is far more rewarding and precise than for the more endowed Infinity..plus the 328 is cheaper. Some people don't need, nor want, nor will notice due to their driving style, the immediacy, and wonder of the additional torque and hp provided by the 335. Why pay for it then? I agree.

    I suppose it's a matter of one's character or personality that determines how one drives. I, myself, step on it every single chance I get. I try not to speed mind you. And try is the operative word. Stupendous speed is not my real goal. I'm not stepping on it in a blind and careless manner. Quite the opposite, I do so with full attentiveness. My goal is not only to milk this baby for what she's got. But it is to take note and appreciate what a car has to offer. I want to feel a car's spirit, to hear her scream, to get there with authority, yet precision, and efficiency (in the sense of not only path but gear/rpm choice. Grace or maybe temperance is the word. That's what I want.

    I highly recommend the 328..even to buy as it does not suffer, at least to my knowledge, from the 335's dreaded high pressure fuel pump failure. The 328 has a beautiful balance..but please get a manual. And if you can't drive a stick.. you can learn and it'll be all the more rewarding. Trust me.

    And good luck.

    Joseph
    San Diego
  • srs_49srs_49 Member Posts: 1,394
    I agree with everything you said, even though I went with the G37S-6MT :shades: .

    but please get a manual. And if you can't drive a stick.. you can learn and it'll be all the more rewarding. Trust me

    +1 here also.
  • jtlajtla Member Posts: 388
    That was one really nice post and summary. I agree with you almost 100% -- I drive a 2007 328i 6MT and have the same driving style as you. ;)

    The only thing I take exception is about 328 being cheaper than G37. That may be true in term of base price, but once you load it up with options in order to compare with G37 apple-to-apple, the price for 328 quickly exceeds that of G37 by a few grands. And that's just for the MSRP. With all the incentive available to G37 right now, the actual transaction price difference may be $5k or more.

    It is always a tough choice between the two. I went with 328i 3 years ago with no regret. I truly enjoy it every time I take the wheel. Nevertheless, I am facing the same dilemma again now that my lease is up in March. Decisions, decisions....
  • millwood0millwood0 Member Posts: 451
    I largely agree with your points.

    there are many types of drivers out there. some favors hp and others handling and then others something else entirely.

    I am more or less of a person who likes better handling over others. I would be perfectly happy in a miata, a rx7, or a m-coupe than in any BMW 3-series. But that's just me.

    As to 328 vs. 335, I am not sure if I care that much. If I have to chose, I would have gone with a 128 or 135 for its smaller size.

    to me, the 3-series represents a nice compromise between sports handling and utility. and the 1-series is somewhere in between the 3-series and M3 in terms of performance. and if you value acceleration that much and want to stay within BMW, the 135 would be a great car to have.

    the M3, and M5/6 in particular, is a little bit pretentious for me.
  • kdshapirokdshapiro Member Posts: 5,751
    Pretenious is just a label. All of those cars GTR, 750, 550 LS 460, LF-A, FX45, RL they are all in the same category of upper echelon cars, with some being more upper echelon than others. But a little off topic.

    Me, I would drive an M5/M6/M3 in a heartbeat. Pretentious or not.
  • fedlawmanfedlawman Member Posts: 3,118
    One issue I don't remember coming up is styling - specifically, the tendency for Japanese cars to look outdated rather quickly compared to the more timeless designs of European cars.

    Just look at a 5 year old G35 next to a 5 year old 325i/330i.

    There are a few exceptions (the 90-93 and 98-02 Accord come immediately to my mind), but in general, that's my opinion.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    This is because BMW has "genetic" styling....one offspring resembles another. You could show people a 1937 BMW and probably close to 100% would know immediately what type of car is was.
  • jimbresjimbres Member Posts: 2,025
    I own an E46, so it's probably not surprising that I agree with you.

    But I do think that the Japanese are closing the gap. The current generation G is a big step forward from the original. Although I liked the styling of the E46 much more than that of the 1st generation G35, I don't feel that way about the E90 vs. the G37. It's likely that I'd pick the BMW if I had to decide today, but not because of the BMW's looks.

    To me, it looks as if the Infiniti design team has gained skill & confidence since the 1st G was launched.
  • sjaievesjaieve Member Posts: 252
    Just came back from a weekend test driving all 2010 models of Volkswagen CC sport, base A4, base C300, G37S, and Audi Q5. I came backed impressed by all based on my prior expectations except the G37. I had higher expectations with the handling - too high I guess. I came back super impressed by the Q5 but that's another story. My conclusion is that nothing drives like my '07 bmw328 coupe and inspires as much confidence on the road. Too bad I can't stand not having options, gadgets and gizmos and bmw's are overpriced and aren't satisfying, otherwise I would stay w/ my car.

    Well you are contrasting yourself a bit here but my take on what you are saying is you LOVE the 328i but since the G37 is cheaper you will get that. My advice is NEVER buy a car because its cheaper, you will not appreciate what you have. Buy what you like. To be honest, in your case, stick with BMW, this is what you appear to love.
  • sjaievesjaieve Member Posts: 252
    Impressive post. My list of 6 was used as well here and we agree for the most part. That list was meant to highlight that its not just HP that drives the purchase of a G37 but I am happy that you saw what I see:)

    On handling, I try not to say much about what I think, it can be perceived as "make believe" however allow me to post something from C/D

    "This is a serious machine: planted, professional, poised. The steering always knows how to find straight-ahead, and the effort builds progressively as you turn. Unlike most of the others, the brakes are not overboosted. They have a linear feel, just right for holding the edge of the friction circle as you trail-brake into curves."

    http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/comparisons/09q2/2009_infiniti_g37_vs._bmw_3- - - 28i_audi_a4_and_acura_tl-comparison_tests/2009_infiniti_g37_sport_page_4

    And here at Edmunds
    "But driven with a purpose, the Infiniti is the most capable car in this test when it comes to handling."
    http://www.insideline.com/infiniti/g35/2007/comparison-test-2007-2008-sport-seda- - ns.html

    I am not too bothered in where the G landed in these tests its not important. However if the point is handling this is one of the G's strong points. Every article you will read will tell you that. Which is why I was suprised when you used the words "disconnected" to describe how the car drives.

    Like you said, its more how one feels when driving thats important, if you felt a certain way then thats important. The G however cannot handle the same as the 335i as there are made differently, its handles in its own way but I believe it handles "great" and I agree the 335 handles better.
  • sjaievesjaieve Member Posts: 252
    Well here I agree, there is more to a car other than HP, which is why I went with the G35 and will be going to the G37 soon. Currently the 328i's are priced lower than the 2010 G sedans after incentives.

    Something I do not understand here, why is the G37 better value than the 328i? You indicated earlier that there is more to a car than just horses (so lets take horses out of the equation completely), the 3 series has a more refined engine and does not have the bright lights of the G. It would appear from your line of thought the 328i is the better value, No?

    HP helps with residual values though if considering cars in the same class.

    Not trying to offend anyone, just giving this discussion a different twist
  • millwood0millwood0 Member Posts: 451
    "However if the point is handling this is one of the G's strong points. Every article you will read will tell you that. Which is why I was suprised when you used the words "disconnected" to describe how the car drives. "

    the bmw 330 I had handled better than my g37x: the bmw is more communicative, more civilized and more confidence inspiring. the g is rougher, firmer and harshier for the sake of being firmer and harsher. the steering is very (overly in my view) boosted vs. the bmw.

    the bmw represented a better compromise between comfort and handling.
  • millwood0millwood0 Member Posts: 451
    " It would appear from your line of thought the 328i is the better value, No? "

    a base 328 is cheaper than a g (not by much though). a comparably equip'd 328 would be as expensive as, if not more expensive than, the g.

    so to me, the g is a better value.

    However, it is highly likely a comparably equip'd 328 is cheaper to lease than a g. :)
  • sjaievesjaieve Member Posts: 252
    Wait a minute, you have the X, now that makes sense. The G in X form is not like the S4 AWD system. The handling will be slightly compromised but will still be better than most cars in this segment, serve for the non X 3 series probably. The G37S, thats the car which handles probably at par with the 3 series as my post from Edmunds indicates and most articles you read out there will state the same.

    I know you also spoke of the car not driving well in the city which to me is a suprise as I find the car just does everything I would expect in the city or on the h/way. To put things into perspective, I had an IS250 which I got rid of less than 2 years into owning it for the G35. I can confidently say the G rides better than the IS250, less road noise too (the IS engine is quiter though). I know the IS250 is no 3 series but the point is the G's ride is not harsh or rough.

    The only thing I would like to add to anyone choosing between the 3 & the G is be careful when you start seeing the use of words such as:

    Rough, loud, disconnected, not as pleasant to drive etc. There are myths out there that can easily be disregarded once you start researching and taking these cars out for a test drive. You have to remember you are comparing a +100 year sports car heritage with a 20 year heritage, you have probably been bombarded with so many myths it will take some time to identify the truth. However cross shopping these 2 shows how far Nissan has come and I have to say for +40k I deserve better than to return a car @ less than 30k miles.

    A measure of handling and confidence of taking curves is the slalom test. Here at Edmunds in Coupe form, the G achieved the better speed compared to the 335i, in sedan form the 335i was better I believe but it was very very close. Check out the lateral grip numbers too.

    On the free maintenance issue, I have incurred just under 2k in maintenance expenses (all routine no reliability issues here) after just over 50k miles in about 2 years. This is just a weekend car and over 50% of those miles are just me having fun. Now my G is fully loaded, around 43k MSRP. A comparably equipped 335i would be just over 50k, so you tell me if the free maintenance is of any significance here. In base form the 335i is 40 & the G37 is 33k
  • sjaievesjaieve Member Posts: 252
    Its interesting that there is one 328i owner here who clearly wants out and is looking for alternatives, the IS250 being one of them. LOL, IS250 man good luck with that:)

    The point here is contrast the ownership experience with mine. I am set, G37 is the next move, the only car that may change my mind is the 2010 S4. I love both but then the issue of reliability comes in, the jury is still out on the S4. I spend time on an S4 forum where someone said Audi showed BMW that if you are going to make a +50k (with added options) sport sedan, here is how you do it. I think we will all agree on that.
  • millwood0millwood0 Member Posts: 451
    for the 3-series vs. g talk, i was making comparison between a 330i (rwd) vs. a g37x.

    the g's handling is far less civilized - crude would be what I would describe it: rough over the smallest bump; and sudden shift when pushed to the limit. the g performs comparable vs. the 3-series at highway speed or over a large diameter turn (highway on or off ramp).

    for small bumps the 3-series provides more cushioning so when driving around town, it is easier in a 3-series. but it doesn't lose anything to the g during sharp turns or at high speed.

    the g's steering wheel is also highly boosted, aka camry like.

    the 3-series' steering feedback reminds me of mr2: it gets progressively lighter as the vehicle was about to lose control. that "band" is considerably smaller in a g.

    I am not a suspension specialist but to a layman, the g coupled a harsher / firmer spring with a linear dampening shock. the 3-series has a softer spring but progressively higher dampening shock.

    if that makes sense.

    Again, I loved the 330 when it worked. the problem is the problems I had with it, and the high cost to keep it running. so I swore I would never own another german again but the dealership gave me a good deal on the X3 so I took it.
  • millwood0millwood0 Member Posts: 451
    one thing that really surprised me when i moved to the infiniti land is that 1) infiniti doesn't use synthetic oil and 2) the oil changes aren't free.

    how do they expect to compete in this segment?
  • millwood0millwood0 Member Posts: 451
    the 330 I had was a 2004. the chassis is good but the next gen's chassis is absolutely fabulous: it is solid as a rock.

    I think the best deal is the 328 (with the 3.0 engine): it is cheaper than my 330 but has a better chassis.
  • srs_49srs_49 Member Posts: 1,394
    the steering is very (overly in my view) boosted vs. the bmw.

    That's one of things I've notice with my '09 G37S. There appears to be more power assist at road speeds than there needs to be. Heck, at highway speeds, I would be happy with no power assist at all :P .

    Now, I only have 1200 mile on the G37, so maybe I just haven't got used to the car yet. I test drove a '328 when i was shopping around and during the (short) test drives of both cars, I did not feel much of a difference. It has taken me several hundred miles to come to this conclusion about the G37's steering.

    I also still have, and drive an '87 '325. In my mind, it's steering feel is just what it should be, even though I don't think it has speed-adaptive power steering.
  • millwood0millwood0 Member Posts: 451
    I was driving today behind a Jetta and it dawned on me that the G's handling is very much like that of a VW: sporty in a crude way.

    obviously, the G has a much more solid body but almost in every way it reminds me of an old VW Santana in terms of how the suspension behaves.
  • members78members78 Member Posts: 140
    "I was driving today behind a Jetta and it dawned on me that the G's handling is very much like that of a VW: sporty in a crude way. "

    it's odd that the G's 'crude' handling earned it a top 10 best car for 2009 by C&D, but what do they know?
  • srs_49srs_49 Member Posts: 1,394
    obviously, the G has a much more solid body but almost in every way it reminds me of an old VW Santana in terms of how the suspension behaves

    Never having driven a WW Santana, or any VW for that matter, it's hard for me to comment.
  • kdshapirokdshapiro Member Posts: 5,751
    Didn't I read something about 'value' in that review? I personally discount reviews where a car wins on 'value'.
  • millwood0millwood0 Member Posts: 451
    "it's odd that the G's 'crude' handling earned it a top 10 best car for 2009 by C&D, but what do they know?"

    maybe there is a difference between top 10 best cars and top 10 best HANDLING cars?

    hopefully that's not too difficult to understand.
  • millwood0millwood0 Member Posts: 451
    "I personally discount reviews where a car wins on 'value'."

    it obviously depends on our individual financial situations. if you have unlimited resources, you buy the best car.

    for the rest of us, we buy the best car our money can buy. aka value is a big part of our consideration. A great car to Bill Gates can be a terrible car for you if you have to mortgage the rest of your live.
  • members78members78 Member Posts: 140
    "maybe there is a difference between top 10 best cars and top 10 best HANDLING cars? "

    C&D described the G's handling as agile and MotorTrend couldn't decide who had the better handling between the G and 335i.

    should i go with the automotive experts, or some joe schmoe on edmunds? that's a tough one... :confuse:
  • jimbresjimbres Member Posts: 2,025
    should i go with the automotive experts, or some joe schmoe on edmunds? that's a tough one...

    Neither. You drive both cars & you go with your own impressions.

    After all, neither the "automotive experts" nor "Joe Schmoe on Edmunds" will make your payments for you.
  • millwood0millwood0 Member Posts: 451
    "should i go with the automotive experts, or some joe schmoe on edmunds? that's a tough one... "

    you should go with no one. trust your own experience because that's what matters end of the day.

    anyone taking the words of others is a fool. assuming of course you comprehend the difference between top 10 best cars and top 10 best HANDLING cars.
  • millwood0millwood0 Member Posts: 451
    on the value question, I was just curious how MSRP would differ between a 328x and a comparably equip'd G37x, with premium + navigation packages.

    G37x, P+N: $41K.
    328x, P+N+auto+a few others: $45K.

    I got my G37x P+N for $34K+TTL.

    it would be very difficult to get that 328x into the same territory, I assume.

    However, the higher msrp on the BMW (and higher residual %) make it quite competitive leasing wise.
  • millwood0millwood0 Member Posts: 451
    "Neither. "

    wise answer, :).

    I used to be in investment banking, dishing out M&A advices. in a (free) pre-engagement sale, we typically lay out options for the board and stop at that point. Upon engagement, we give them a recommendation as to what they should do.

    More than one fellow commented to me that all the big money fees they paid bought them is our recommendations, :), as all the options on which the recommendation is based are free and laid out for the board before hand.

    yes, opinions are free for a reason: everyone has more than one to offer.

    :)
  • members78members78 Member Posts: 140
    "anyone taking the words of others is a fool"

    wait, so the legions of people taking advice are fools? why go to doctors or lawyers when you can diagnose or litigate yourself. seriously, where do you get your lines from?

    and yes i have driven the 335i and I own a G37. theyre both great cars, and i wouldnt describe either one's handling as 'crude'. and after reading just about every professional review of the G, ive never heard anyone describe the handling in such a way.
  • fedlawmanfedlawman Member Posts: 3,118
    You only got your G37 for that price because of current dealer incentives on 2009 models.

    There are also incentives on leftover 2009 328xi's - $1,850 customer cash and $3,500 in dealer incentives. If you are careful with the options, you could get one for under $30,000.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    True but if you make a bad decision on a car you don't die or go to jail. (usually).

    Packard used to have a slogan "Ask the Man Who Owns One" and it's still pretty good advice, because the concept of "handling" or "value" is way more subjective than one might think.

    I recall one time we had a topic on "handling" here at Edmunds and after about 300 posts, a group of very intelligent participants couldn't even agree as to what "handling" actually meant! :P

    Also there's a bit of fussiness and ego in car magazines that you have to watch out for, or it could mislead you. I'm thinking of things like a car getting a "great handling" score, and the buyer finding out that yeah, it handles great, but it rides like a stagecoach over cobblestones (e.g., early MINI).
  • srs_49srs_49 Member Posts: 1,394
    My G37S was $36,649 + TTL. That was with Premium+Nav+Aero+Dest.

    I could not have touched a 2009 '328 for anywhere close to that price.

    So yes, value is part of the decision making. I think that's true for 98% of the people out there, not just for cars, but for pretty much everything else they buy. No matter how much you spend for something, there's probably another similar product out there that's even more expensive that, you decide for whatever reason, is not just worth the increase in cost. That's the "value" decision. And that break point is at different places for different people.
  • millwood0millwood0 Member Posts: 451
    "after reading just about every professional review of the G, ive never heard anyone describe the handling in such a way."

    there is always a first for everything.

    next time when someone tells you that the G's handling is crude, you will remember that you heard it first here.

    and you know, hopefully, that top 10 best cars aren't necessarily top 10 best HANDLING cars.
  • cdnpinheadcdnpinhead Member Posts: 5,498
    value the "ride" over handling.

    The trick is to have a stiff suspension that allows great cornering while not jarring ones fillings out. I put seriously stiff springs & shocks in my 240-Z, then my 510, then bought a Miata R package, all of which value handing over ride. Me. . .jar away. Most people, not so much.

    BMW seems to have figured out how to produce a car that will corner wonderfully and still absorb pot holes, or so I've heard. I've never driven one, because I'm fairly confident that if I did, I'd be ruined & have to have one.

    It's a long story.
    '08 Acura TSX, '17 Subaru Forester
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    Combining excellent handling and excellent ride is a *very* sophisticated process of engineering (and somewhat expensive) .
  • kdshapirokdshapiro Member Posts: 5,751
    Yeah. :)
  • millwood0millwood0 Member Posts: 451
    'Combining excellent handling and excellent ride is a *very* sophisticated process of engineering (and somewhat expensive) . "

    absolutely. That's why BMW can charge what it is charging for BMWs: they offer a great compromise between handling, comfort and luxury.

    the alternative, of having two or three cars each excels in one of the goals, would have been far more expensive, and less convenient.

    What some folks failed and continue to fail to see is that a great handling car isn't desirable all the times, especially when you are hauling the family to the local market, or going from NYC to LA.
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