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Comments
I'm wondering if you would mind calling my dealership: Hoy-Fox in El Paso, TX and explaining what you said to me to them.
"don't worry about the brakes" "VW knows the fix"
were you even paying attention to what I posted
1. I would worry about the brakes on these cars...after all..they're the BRAKES and when you don't even consider that at 4200 miles they might be gone you are heading for a wreck.
2. VW may "know the fix" but my dealership and the national complaint line for VW flat out denied that this problem has ever been reported or encountered before. If you're on this forum and have had/seen this problem I strongly encourage you to call the VW national complaint line on behalf of all of us and all the people who might buy a VW Jetta--VW doesn't consider this a problem and blamed me outright. If VW hears about this from other people maybe they'll take it more seriously.
But at this time, I think homerkc is dangerously wrong.
Tom
I have a 2008 Jetta that I purchased in September of 2007. I had a defective rear passenger rim and had to have the dealership replace it. At the time the rim was replaced I was notified at 16,500 miles that my rear brakes were almost out and if I waited another 2 weeks or so I would have to replace brakes and rotors. It wasn't two weaks before I was cringing every time I stopped my car. I finally broke down and took my car to Good Year for a 2nd option. Let's say I have been very impressed. Good refused to repair the brakes until they spoke with the dealership service manager. Apparently they have received a lot of work from the 2007/2008 Jetta's and are just as floored as me that they will not replace them under warranty. If I have to pay this out of pocket I will, but I will never buy another VW. I'm a first time VW buyer and I am happy with the brand, but the warranty sucks. Also, I had a blow out on the interstate within about 17500 miles and the tires didn't have road hazard warranty. Never experience this issue as well. I must say that there are some benefits to buying American made as well as Toyota.
thank you for your reply
to anyone who reads this forum and has had or heard of similar problems...please please please call the VW national complaint line at 1-800-822-8987 and for all of our sakes register a formal complaint.
oh and tell them that I sent you--Tom Repine from El Paso, TX and have them addend my formal complaint with your example (I'm serious--tell them that)
Again, VW flat out denied this problem existed to me and refused manufacturer defect issues, warranty issues, etc....
If you have a dealer that responded favorably to this issue then please show them this forum and ask them to chime in with their company.
thanks
Tom
Also, I was told that since I lease, if I go to a place other than a VW dealer, my lease is void? Is this true? I ask because my cousin, fixed his own and said he would do mine as well if I bought the parts? I'm not paying $500, period. Love my car, but maintenence is outrageous on it.
Not sure about getting it repaired at a VW dealer because it's a lease. I would think as long as you produced a receipt showing the brakes were replaced that would be enough.
Maybe others will chime in. Good luck.
I am an Engineer who used to work for the OEM of Jetta Brakes (through 03 model). There are rigorous Dyno and Wear tests that are performed on pads, and typical minimum mileage is usually 50K miles. There is no way brakes should wear before then. When I was working for this manufacturer, we never had any complaints or recalls from VW, and all customers were very satisfied (Toyota, Honda, VW, Chrysler). I can honestly say that 99-03 VW brakes themselves are designed, manufactured very well, and are extremely reliable. Although, it is correct that poorly designed calipers have caused increased brake wear on certain vehicles. The dealer will not admit this b/c they would have to replace calipers + brakes, and since caliper wear is impossible ... they blame defectiveness on brakes + owner. When I purchased my 03 Jetta TDI back in 2004, VW had worst reputation, and was voted worst by consumer reports for dealare customer satisfaction, so I am not surprised by everyone's complaints. FYI, if a dealer tells you it's time to replace your breaks, ask them to tell you how much wear in (mm) the pads have. then ask to see the pads. If they cant pull them off, then ask them to bring you to the vehicle, and measure the brakes in front of you. Why? because there are VW wear specs for brakes. I purchased a VW Jetta, Golf, GTI service manual for 99-03 models (published by Bentley Publishers) which contains documented service instructions for areas of the vehicle (Engine, suspension, brakes, HVAC, electrical, transmission, body, interior, steering, clutch, exhaust, trim, etc) this manual has pictures, diagrams, step-by-step instruction, specs, wiring diagrams, etc) it has everything the owner needs to troubleshoot, identify, and fix the issue. And if you can't fix the issue yourself, at the very least it prevents you from being ripped off by the dealer of other mechanic. Ebay - $80. Anyways, the wear limits for 99-03 Jetta, Golf, GTI is: 1.8/2.8L (FN3 caliper) Front: (both pads) - 7.0 mm thickness (including backing plate). Rear: (both pads) - 7.5 mm thickness (including backing plate). for 1.9/2.0L (FSIII caliper) - Front: (both pads) - 7.0 mm thickness (including backing plate). Rear: (both pads) - 7.5 mm thickness (including backing plate). for all of the above pads, the new pad thickness is 14mm for fronts, and 9mm for Rears. this means that for 99-03 models the front brakes work harder, hence the reason for thicker friction material, and therefore will wear out faster than the rears. Also, you should not have to change the front brakes until the electonic wear sensor indicates change needed via your info panel next to the speedometer. The rears do not have wear sensors. My Jetta has 92K miles, and I have not changed either the front or rears. Th reason I accessed this forum was because I am experiencing squeeling, but the brakes do not look that worn, and the rotors are not scored. I may be getting down close to the friction underlayer (used to absorb noise and vibration) becuase I can see more brkae dust than usual at the rear. I hope this helps anyone who is in need. Overall, my Jetta has performed well, but has had several issues. At 80K miles the bearings seized in my alternator and I lost power steering and a pulley belt. Cost me $350 for new alternator and labor (not at the dealer) . Now I am experiencing A/C issues where I cannot get cold air when I turn to full blast, or I turn on my recirc button. In closing, I suggest never going to the delaer after warranty expires, and try to find a reputable mechanic (by a friends referal only). For TDI owners, and VW owners in general, Try these websites also:
www.TDIClub.com
www.TDIparts.com
www.illicitvw.com
I'm curious if you have any specific comments for my case with no brakes at 4200 miles, and how you, as a brake engineer, might have approached things with my dealer.
their assertion to me was basically so preposterous that I didn't even know how to argue it...certainly didn't do it right b/c I ended up having to go off warranty and pay out of pocket outside of VW to get my brakes fixed and get reasonable customer service.
very interested in your reply: 1) is it possible to have no brakes/damaged rotors on both rear brakes on a 2008 VW Jetta in 4200 miles? 2) how would you explain this if it is possible--driver error?
thanks
oh, and btw, I'm gonna take your post #61 and shove it up my dealer's [non-permissible content removed], or wallpaper his car with it and snot/superglue , or make it into a banner behind an airplane and fly circles around his dealership all day and then parachute out of the plane using a big blown up version of it as my parachute, and then stuff the parachute version...up his [non-permissible content removed] too.
thanks
Tom
its really funny because i just stumbled on this forum and found my exact problem that all of us have in common, i leased my 2007 vw wolfsburg edition jetta in may 2007 and i now have almost 22,000 miles on the car. my rear brakes started sounding like metal rubbing together and i realized that there was a problem. my step dad is a mechanic and he looked at the car and said that the rear brakes are shot. i had a ford explorer before this car and only needed the brakes changed once in the ten year period that my family had the car. my step dad says that a car with only 22,000 miles should not need the brakes changed so soon, especially the rear ones. and to top it off the vw dealers have special bolts on the brake parts so you can only get the done at the dealer. this is ridiculous.
This is interesting because I also have a 2003 Jetta that sits next to the 2000 in the driveway and has none of the same problems, i.e. shaking when braking. Anybody have any ideas?
Thanks
welcome to my world and to our club.
You're not in El Paso are you?
Don't worry it's just your daughter driving around with no brakes
did the dealer specify the "outside influences", sounds like the old blame game they gave me telling me it was my fault that the brakes burned out to metal on metal in 4200 miles on a brand new 2008 jetta b/c I sucked at driving.
Have you ever heard of customer service like this???
:lemon: :lemon: :lemon: :lemon: :lemon:
no matter what, make sure you file a complaint with the national complaint line about this (see my previous posts for number) and tell them to addend it to my file Tom Repine from El Paso TX b/c VW still believes that there isn't any known problem about this--and I'm glad to show them the error of their ways.
Thanks
Tom
I'm in Cincinnati.
The dealer blamed VW and VW blamed the dealer for failing to live up to the warranty. Dealer won't do it without VW approval and VW won't do it because dealer says "outside influences" and thus the warranty doesn't apply. Seriously, as to outside influences, I was told heat and humidity, and the driver not driving the car enough. To be fair, the car did sit one week while she was at camp. Right.
Anyway, they offered to replace one of the two rotors and I pay for the other and labor, a total of $207.00 out of pocket for me. I called Midas and they'll do the whole thing for less since I don't need pads. This "offer" was a "goodwill gesture" by the dealer, and VW recommended I take the offer. I didn't.
The problem is that I have another VW, and the dealer has serviced that one, though no brake work (yet). The cars sit in the same driveway and are generally subject to the same conditions. I drive a little farther each day to/from work. However, the one with the new rotors (3642 miles) has the problems. Go figure. Clearly something is defective.
I've owned a '68 bug, an '85 golf and now these two Jettas, and i've generally liked and enjoyed the cars. I have to rethink that now, and will certainly not use that dealer again, he who put the rusting rotors in and now won't replace them.
I'll call the hotline. Will that do anything? I dealt with the "consumer advocate" already. Nice Fellow. Felt Bad Wouldn't Bend, recommended I take the deal. Spoke to his boss. Nice Fellow. Felt Bad. Wouldn't Bend. Recommended I take the deal. Not going to. Thinking about suing in small claims court.
Thanks again for your advice.
JTB
We just bought a Wolfsburg Jetta in July and I have noticed equal amounts of brake dust on the rims with both front and rears.
The '03 Trail Blazer I'm driving has over 40,000 miles with the original brake pads front and rear. Also hardly any if any at all brake dust in the rear.
If VW had a brake pad (rotor, or caliper) issue wouldn't it be found on most Jetta's and not just a select few???
Please help me understand this problem with the brake pads.
JTB
I'm the original owner of a 2002 GLX VR6. I put rear brake pads on at 95,000 miles. The fronts are still 70-80%.
Well this morning, I was driving the car in stop and go traffic. I was creeping up on the car in front and hit the brakes. Nothing happened. Pumped them still nothing. Hit the car in front. I left the car on the side of the road and called the dealer to have it towed and checked out. I was not going to drive a car with bad brakes.
The dealer takes it to the shop and finds nothing wrong. But earlier today I was not able to get the car to stop.
I am thinking that either they did not bleed the lines correctly or some sort of debris was blocking the line preventing me from stopping.
As of now they can find nothing in the computer and nothing in the repairs. Anyone have any ideas? Although I am now quite sure that I should have brought the car to a third party to check since I am sure the dealer "will find nothing they did" to cause the problem.
I am really concerned about driving this car. In this instance I was going about 5 miles an hour. What if I was on the highway and this happened? Someone could have been killed.
Welcome to our party.
You saw my posts right?? 4200 miles and no brakes, metal on metal, damaged rotors on brand new 2008 Jetta--not only did the dealer and VW both say "normal wear and tear" but that it was indeed excessive wear...b/c I suck at driving.
I'm wondering what the warranty actually does cover in the mind of VW??..maybe if the windshield wipers burn out at 4200 miles they'd replace them...unless, of course, I used them...which would be wear and tear and my fault again.
BUYER BEWARE
IF YOU ARE READING THIS
Tom
:sick: :lemon: :sick: :lemon: :sick:
This forum and others I've posted on are great for venting and warning potential future VW owners but I really want to take some action so that VW does not get away with it. So far I've complained to VW customer advocate people and my dealership. I've also filed a complaint with the NHTSA (National Highway Traffic Safety Administration) with their Office of Defects Investigations: http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/ivoq/index.cfm
I also filed a complaint with the BBB Auto Line: http://us.bbb.org/WWWRoot/SitePage.aspx?site=113&id=008c749a-ea0b-40ed-9be1-65db- - 5886a6fd
I have not heard back yet from the BBB Auto Line and was wondering if anyone has used them and if they were happy with the results?
This is also an excellent website to find out about existing problems with cars and to post your complaints: http://www.mycarstats.com/
Does anyone have any suggestions as to what else can be done? Has anyone tried Small Claims?
Just in case I come off as a little nuts, I have never sued anyone in my life. My motto is live and let live. But when VW looks you in the eye and tells you it's your fault that the brakes are once again prematurely worn (4,200 miles in Tom's case???) it pisses me off!!!
I'm a web developer and will be willing to create a website for pissed off VW owners. I wonder how many people this happens to that don't complain. It would be great to have one united front.
David
Dave
1. expect to be asked to do a ride along to "help diagnose" the car problems--refuse, tell them to do it themselves
by the way, tell them it started squealing about 30 minutes before you brought it in to them--DON'T TELL THEM ANYTHING
2. expect to be told you have no brakes and will need new brakes and new rotors if squealing...300$
3. expect to post your disgust on this thread for all of us
Tom
you saw my original post right--brand new 2008 car, 4200 miles, no rear brakes/damaged rotors
VW "it's your fault"
VW = Veneral Wart
Tom
An update on my situation with BBB Auto Line. They responded saying that they could not take the case because it is not a warranty issue. I'm assuming that they concluded it is not a warranty issue after talking to VW because VW probably told them that this is normal wear and tear so it is not covered under warranty.
I have 30 days to appeal their decision but I feel that if I have to convince the people that will conduct the arbitration to take my case I've already lost.
Jetta 7
Keeping my fingers crossed!! :surprise:
remember--DON'T tell your dealer anything but that "something doesn't seem right with xxx"...play dumb b/c they're only going to use anything you say to get out of their warranty/committment/other. DON'T go for a "drive-along" either--they're the mechanics...let them figure it out.
also, I have been formally reprimanded by the forum watchers for using vulgarity...am sorry if this bothered anyone (except if it bothered VW/Hoy-Fox)
In the future, I will use an old trick that works for my lack of control over my anger over this issue.
This company is Smurfin Smurf and their service is Smurf-smurfin-smurf-smurf
love,
Papa Smurf
Thank you,
David
Please please please
submit a complaint to the national highway transportation safety board
the contact info is in the very first few pages of your VW owner's manual.
This is the only way that VW is going to stop doing this to its customers.
Tom
:lemon: :lemon: :lemon: :lemon: :lemon:
I have a 2007 piece of JUNK Jetta!!! At 29,000 highway miles I started getting a grinding noise in the back. Called my dealer, advised of noise in brakes and was given an appt for 2 weeks later. At appt I was advised that it was going to cost $400 to have the pads and rotors on the rear replaced.
This issue started at the end of August and my car has been sitting in my garage ever since because I refuse to pay for an issue that is not my fault.
I just went online and filed a complaint with the highway transportation safety board.
I took jetta to tire dealer after noticing odd wear pattern on inside portion of rear tires, front tires have worn evenly. Tire place said that it could be cause by possible rear axle misalignment and that my brake actuators were sticking in engaged position and brakes were worn. They did not want to mess with jetta axle and suggested dealership...
dealership said that there was no misalignmen with the back end, or front end and suggested I replace rear brakes/rotors. I agreed to rear brakes/rotors, figured at 78k it was about time (never had it performed).
dealership threw me when they recommended I replace the emergency brake cables as they said they were rusted. I questioned them on this and lady said the cables can "swell" when they rust, thereby causing the brakes to remain engaged, like driving with e-brake on is what lady said....
Does this make sense to anyone, or was I getting fed a line of BS?? (i didn't allow them to perform the service)
:lemon: :lemon: :lemon: :lemon: :lemon: