Is a classic car right for me?

fintail · January 2013

I saw a few older cars crash when I was younger. In the small town where I lived, someone ran a pristine bronze and cream 57 Bel Air 4 door post as a daily driver, a nice looking car with wide whites. It got tangled with a few other cars on a bridge at ~40mph, and got pretty banged up - the front end of a 57 Chevy crumples in a dramatic looking way. But, only minor injuries. Someone else had a very clean 64 Fairlane sedan, which met a similar speed fate with significant front end and side damage. I think that one had no injuries. Seatbelts in old cars are probably the key.

My first car, a 66 Galaxie, was involved in a lower speed (~25 mph) frontal impact with a minivan moving a similar speed, but sliding into me at an angle, impacting on the drivers side harder. I walked away unharmed, and the car didn't crumple much, but it pushed the fender back so I couldn't open the door, and the hood buckled weirdly, sliding into the windshield at a corner and breaking it. It bent the frame, too - but this was already an old car in the 90s. I don't know when the domestics embraced actual engineered crumple zones.

fintail · January 2013

I see it as wasteful, but at least it wasn't a rare car. Could have been worse - would have been more sad even if it was a flat top. They maybe could have found a less nice looking car.

Just as seeing that old MB crashed doesn't upset me, it was an old heap, and was claimed to provide some insight about the cars of the era. Not the worst way to go down.

Had the 59 destroyed the Malibu, that would probably have the nannies all excited and upset about dangerous old cars.

Mr_Shiftright · January 2013

Nobody was ever going to fix up a car like that, especially a utilitarian 6 cylinder 4 door Chevy sedan. These are the very type of cars you see rotting in people's backyards ..."yeah, I'm gonna restore that baby someday..." and they never do. You can't save every garden shovel, old lawnmower or Ford 8N tractor ever built. Who spends $40,000 to make a car worth $8000? Would you? Doubt it.

What *IS* a shame, however, or would have been, if there were nice trim pieces or chrome on that thing---I'd have removed all that, if in fact they didn't, and would have saved them for a ragtop or higher line 2D hardtop.

They made over 1/2 million '59 Chevy 4-dr sedans, so I don't think you'd have much trouble finding one to restore if you really wanted to.

here's one, a V-8 even, ready to restore, only $3500 asking price (and it runs)!

http://www.desertclassics.com/Chev59BA4.html

uplanderguy · January 2013

I'm told the car didn't need much fixing up...from someone who looked at it when it was for sale, who buys and sells cars (including old ones) for a living.

And I think to think that nobody drives/wants a six-cylinder sedan, hasn't been to many local cruise-ins or even parking lots of auto parts stores. Do I want a '59 Chevy sedan? No. Do I think nobody else would? No, I don't think that.

It survived fifty years before some non-car-buff nimrod decided it would be sacrificed for a publicity video.

texases · January 2013

Well, it was 'sacrificed' to show folks how car safety has improved light years since 1959. I've used that video a number of times to illustrate that fact to fathers wanting a 'neat car' for their new (and therefore dangerous) driver son or daughter. The death rate from cars has dropped 5-fold since '59, folks need to see why.

A far better 'sacrifice' than putting a set of 'dubs' on it...

uplanderguy · January 2013

OK, we'll agree to disagree, but IMHO anyone who thinks an old car is safer than new, when old ones didn't have seat belts, air bags, side door beams, collapsible columns, crumple zones, etc., must never do any reading or research at all online about it. Just seems like 'grandstanding'.

Mr_Shiftright · January 2013

Well apparently nobody thought enough of it to save it. If the guy who saw it thought it was so great, why didn't HE buy it? You see this all the time in the car hobby---people talk a good game but when it comes time to whip out the checkbooks, the room falls silent.

The 6 cylinder Chevy sedans you see at show and shines are generally survivors, not cars that were restored.

And besides, we didn't see the car. What the observer "saw" may not even be true. It could have very well been an old rust bucket. I hardly think that someone would have smashed up a car worth $10,000.

andre1969 · January 2013

I hardly think that someone would have smashed up a car worth $10,000.

Well, the car they ran that '59 into was probably worth about $18-25,000! :P

uplanderguy · January 2013

...and is any '59 Chevy six sedan worth $10K, even original or restored? He wasn't in the market for a '59 Chevy, but he is constantly looking. He has a column in Hemmings, incidentally. If I bought every car I checked out, I'd be even poorer than I am sending a kid to Miami Univ. at MSRP!

I just think the whole exercise was dopey. Again, we'll agree to disagree.

hpmctorque · January 2013

I understand how you feel about old cars being destroyed. You feel sentimental and nostalgic about them, even those that were produced in huge numbers. They represent the past. They also have economic value to someone, otherwise the owners would have scrapped them. Even though there are many left, the numbers are only dwindling.

Aside from the fact that I felt that Cash For Clunkers was faulty economics, I was sorry to see a lot of old cars destroyed.

I also understand Shifty's point of view.

fintail · January 2013

C4C irked me too, as a lot of MB W124 and W126 bit the dust. But....useful parts were scavenged first, and it is probably easier now to find parts for a car of that era than ever before. If one assumes the scrapped cars were really heaps on their last legs - at least some parts of them were used to help keep others going.

Mr_Shiftright · January 2013

I thought the experiment was very interesting and really need to be done. Given the number of hits on YouTube, this was no doubt quite educational for a lot of people. I used to hear the old "they don't build them like they used to" cliche so much that honestly I would have donated that '59 Chevy under my own expense just so I can link people to the video. :P

Next thing I want to do is videotape the repair bills for all the "These cars can go 500,000 miles with no problem" advertisements I see.

texases · January 2013

I use it to defuse the "I drove a heap like that and survived, so they must be fine!" comments, which kinda ignore the fact that all those folks that DIDN'T survive aren't around to complain...

uplanderguy · January 2013

It is funny the way kids used to crawl around in cars, no seat belts, put eight people in a car built for six, etc., and here we are.

I think the bigger problem is, there are more cars today than there used to be (where I grew up, most everyone just had one car; we now have three daily drivers), and today's A.D.D. drivers always worried me when I was out in my Studebakers--that one wouldn't be able to see brake lights that didn't include a CHMSL; that they'd be on the phone or texting, etc. In other words, I worry far more about other drivers not paying attention than I did 35 or even 25 years ago. In fact, I went years without so much as being bumped. Both my wife and I have been bumped from behind by women in the last six months.

hpmctorque · January 2013

I'd also like to see comparisons of the cost of ownership of very high mileage cars versus those that are scrapped between 150,000-250,000 miles. Two hundred thousand seems to, more or less, be the new 100,000.

Mr_Shiftright · January 2013

I always advise people that once their car hits about 250K, to have it carefully looked over for structural failure---cracks in control arms, tearing of the chassis at anchoring points, mounting of the steering box--that sort of thing.

I guess as long as your monthly average repairs bills don't approach monthly new car payments, then you are technically "ahead" with a high mileage used car, but of course your loyal steed may not look, or smell, very good anymore.

Also people have different tolerance levels. Someone driving a car with 350,000 on it might be perfectly happy, as well as oblivious to 25 things wrong with it---"yeah, you just gotta pump the brakes a little" or "gas smell? What gas smell?" or "That clunk in the front end? Hell, I don't know--it's been that way for a year".

hpmctorque · January 2013

Yeah, any car with 200,000 miles, not to mention 350,000, is bound to have a few things that aren't perfect. However, that can be some of the charm, or character of the car, so long as safety isn't affected. Oh, and bad smells aren't charming.

michaellno · January 2013

My '06 Saturn ION will never be a classic, and with only 82K miles, is nowhere near approaching that 'old car' status referenced in the past few posts.

Mechanically, it is in great condition - original brake pads and battery, for example. Cosmetically - that's another story. Scrapes on the front bumper and front passenger door, a couple of missing trim pieces, a small tear in the drivers seat.

Since I really only use it for errand running and pizza delivery, it fills the bill for me nicely.

It's due for an oil change and the fuel filter needs replacing, which I'll get to in the next month or so. I'll have the brakes looked at as well.

uplanderguy · January 2013

This was posted on a Studebaker forum, about today's "Click and Clack" column. Interesting reading I think, whether you like those guys or not:

http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.com/showthread.php?68117-1962-Hawk-Road-Trip-- Click-amp-Clack

I don't even change my own oil, but I've taken two different Studebakers as far as 250 miles away at one time, and I never broke down. So I'd say it's not an absolute 'given' as Tom and Ray say! Of course, the thing is to be prepared, as they say.

fintail · January 2013

Yeah, the author is pessimistic. When I was younger, I took my old car on many road trips, with few incidents. Back in the 90s, my dad had a few old cars, all of which were taken on trips - no big problems either. Just keep up on the maintenance and be prepared.

Mr_Shiftright · January 2013

yeah it'll probably break down but so what? These old cars are pretty easy to fix. Usually with old cars that have been sitting such a long time, it's the little stuff that'll get you---belts, hoses, tires, wheel bearings, batteries, stuck thermostat, etc.

What he should do is the Shiftright 5-50-500 test. What you do with the old car is take it on a 5 mile round trip and drive it HARD. If it makes that, look everything over that evening and then do a 50 miler. Then, back home, same thorough exam, then take your 500 mile trip.

uplanderguy · January 2013

I agree, shifty. Before going to South Bend, I'd always try a 50-60 mile trip on the interstate. If everything looks OK before, during, and after, I'd feel a lot better, for sure.

This past summer I mostly (not always) stayed off the interstate going to South Bend...I enjoyed the drive much better, although it did take me longer of course.

It sounds like the kid's Dad is mechanically handy...unlike me. I have AAA's best towing plan available, although luckily haven't had to use it....yet.

andre1969 · January 2013

I'd guess that the biggest risk I take regularly in an old car is when I drive to the "Das Awkscht Feschst" car show in Macungie, PA every August. It's about 400 miles round trip.

I've been going to that show since 2002, but at first, only as a spectator. The first time I put a car in the show was 2008. That year, I registered my 1976 LeMans. At the time, my '67 Catalina wasn't fit to make the trip, neither was my '57 DeSoto, and, well, the LeMans is a much nicer car than either of my two '79 New Yorkers.

But, about 3-4 days before the show, I couldn't get the LeMans to start. And, it was blocking my '79 5th Ave, which I would trust to drive almost anywhere. On the morning of the show, I gave the LeMans one last try, but no luck. So, I started up my '79 New Yorker base model, a car that has a bad habit of staring up just fine first thing in the morning, but would then tend to leave me stranded at work.

Well, it started just fine, and I drove it to the grocery store to get some ice for the beer cooler. And, wouldn't you know it, damn thing refused to re-start in the grocery store parking lot! I finally got it to fire up, then went to the gas station to fill up. I didn't trust it enough to turn it off again, so I just let it run while I filled up.

Then, I drove up to Macungie...met Lemko at a Burger King parking lot, and then went to the show. Made sure to NOT turn off the car again until I was on the show field.

I was sweating bullets when it was time to turn the car on when the show was over, but thankfully it started up. We went back to the Burger King for dinner, and I remember the car starting back up on maybe the 3rd or 4th try after that. On the way back home, I fillled up at a gas station about 95-100 miles from home, but again, left it running, just in case. And got the rest of the way home without incident.

In 2009-2010, I took the Catalina to that show. In 2009 it was fine, but in 2010 it had developed some kind of issue with the transmission linkage, where it would hold second gear for way too long. But it still made the trip okay, and when I finally had it looked at, thankfully just needed a minor adjustment.

In 2011, I drove the LeMans to that show, and it didn't do too bad, except that it rained at the show, and the moisture seemed to make it a bit cranky.

In 2012, I drove the Catalina again, and it did fine.

Also in 2011, I drove my '79 5th Ave to the Mopar show in Carlisle, and while I saw up there, the power steering pump started to leak, and fast. It wasn't too ornery in most driving, but parallel parking would have been a chore. And in 2012, it started leaking fuel...again, naturally while I was up there. Got that fixed, so for 2013 it should be fine.

With luck though, my mechanic will have my DeSoto ready, so I might run that to the Mopar show. Not gonna hold my breath on it really being road ready, though...

keystonecarfan · January 2013

Andre, the gas leak from your Fifth Avenue is still evident on the street in front of our (soon-to-be-former) house.

andre1969 · January 2013

Sorry about that!

I got it fixed a few months ago, so it should behave itself and not christen the new place!

berri · January 2013

Oops, I gassed my pants - I know, bad pun!

keystonecarfan · January 2013

Don't apologize! Now I'll look for that mark on the street when I drive by the old place.

Is a classic car right for me?

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