All-New 2010 Legacy/Outback

ateixeira · January 2010

Perhaps Edmunds could acquire a ramp like that and include a ramp test for every AWD vehicle.

That would be great.

Hosts - can you forward that suggestion to the road test team? That would be totally unique, an industry first. Such a ramp can't cost a lot, either.

I've seen Mercedes and BMW haul them out to events they host.

birdboy · February 2010

Can anyone share with me their experience so far with the navigation system both pros and cons. I have never had a built in nav system, only a Garmin portable. I am considering this option. Thanks for any help.

jeffm5 · February 2010

Birdboy, You might want to look at my post #632 on this thread. One correction to that post. I believe the system comes with 3 DVD's, not 4. I still believe that the NAV is not worth the money.

1hhead · February 2010

A mid-level Garmin in less than $200, has almost the feature set of the best car nav systems, you can take it hiking or wherever and you can buy more than 10 of them for the price of the typical Nav setup on the Outback (considering the trim level you have to pay for to get the Nav.) Keep your Garmin in a relatively out of sight spot in your new OB and buy your family 10 really special dinners instead of the Subaru nav unit.

Over the years, you'll forget the Subaru Nav, but you'll remember those fun family dinners.

birdboy · February 2010

Thank you 1hhead. You are probably right. I already have a Garmin widescreen 265T. I travel between NYC and upstate New York. It is just such a chore at times to remember to take the window mount off, take the unit, unplug the bluetooth before leaving the car and setting it all up again. In the city ,you just can not leave anything visable. I thought having this built in and having the sound spoken through the car speakers while the radio fades would be nice, as I often find it hard to hear the nuvi with the music on. I never had a built in Nav. Yes it is quite expensive. I also never had a back up camera either. On my test drive , rear visibility was less than what I thought. More importantly, I am hoping for someone already usuing it to share with me the good and bad.

birdboy · February 2010

thank you for the comprehensive set of experiences with the Nav system.

ateixeira · February 2010

I have the same unit.

Here's what I recommend: get a vent mount, which brings it closer to your fingers, and helps you see the image better.

I keep a hat in the car. When I park, I put the hat over the whole thing. You can't really see what's behind it, it just looks like a hat is hanging on one of the buttons on the dash. It doesn't draw any attention (black interior - use a black hat, etc).

A determined thief will look for the wires, but let's face it, a determined thief will steal the whole car anyway.

ateixeira · February 2010

Here's what mine looks like, it was $10 or so IIRC:

Don't tell too many people else my secret is out!

rsholland · February 2010

To be honest, I much prefer the window mount that comes with the GPS.

Why? Because the GPS is in your line of sight. You don't have to take your eyes off the road and look down to find it on the dash vents.

I always remove the GPS when I park the car, unless I'm parked in a very secure area. If I'm in a questionable area, I'll also remove the mounting fixture and plug.

Bob

dcm61 · February 2010

I'll meet you half way.

I use the window mount on a bean bag.
http://www.amazon.com/Bracketron-UFM-100BL-Nav-Mat-Friction-Dash/dp/B000U5TUWE/r- ef=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1265302719&sr=1-2

Works great.

rsholland · February 2010

Why even do that, when the normal window mount works perfectly, for me at least?

Bob

xwesx · February 2010

I have heard that there are states that prohibit windshield-mounted devices (California?). Plus, with that, you could take the whole unit and put it on the floor, under a seat, etc., without having to disconnect anything... I suspect.

dcm61 · February 2010

Plus, with that, you could take the whole unit and put it on the floor, under a seat, etc., without having to disconnect anything... I suspect.

Exactly. Plus, you don't have that dreaded suction cup circle on your windshield. If you pull the window mount, you gotta also "erase" that circle.

ateixeira · February 2010

I've heard that theives know to look for the telltale circle mark left behind when you remove a suction cup mount.

Wifey uses that and on a *really* hot summer day it will actually fall off.

I get what Bob is saying about line of sight, but the vent mount makes it much easier to enter addresses, and I listen to the audio instructions most of the time anyway. I only look down if I'm not sure about something.

colloquor · February 2010

I use the window mount, and so far... knock on wood... no problem with the tell-tale suction cup circle. Here, GPS units are as ubiquitous as cell phones, so thieves don't even bother. I remember just having a hint of a cell phone in the car years ago guaranteed trouble. But, no more.

ateixeira · February 2010

True, now everyone and their mother has a GPS.

We own three!

xwesx · February 2010

I have neither GPS nor cell phone, but they are certainly common amongst nearly all others I know. I cannot imagine living in a place where one would need to be earnestly concerned about theft of such devices inside a closed, locked car. It is a sad world in which we live.....

rsholland · February 2010

I enter addresses, etc, when the car is not moving. I like being able to see at a glance how far the next turn is, and the other tidbits the Garmin displays; much easier to do so when it's up on the windshield, than down low on the center stack.

As far as the suction cup ring? It's barely visible on my car. A thief would really have to look hard to see it.

As I mentioned, I take the Garmin with me when I leave the car, but most of the time I leave the windshield attachment on the window. My thinking is a thief would most likely think, if they see the windshield attachment only, that the driver has removed the GPS from the car; and therefore not bother breaking in.

Bob

jimbres · February 2010

Dunno about that. I'd say things were much worse 20+ years ago. At the height of the late 1980s crack epidemic, my car was broken into every other week -- or so it seemed at the time. I live in a suburb of NYC, & back then, if you parked your car on a NYC street, you'd hang a "NO RADIO IN CAR" sign in one of the windows. Then you'd walk away, hoping that the local junkies were halfway literate & could puzzle out your message. More often than not, they'd break a window anyway, just to make sure that you weren't lying.

The last time anyone broke a car window to get at my stuff was in 1989 or 1990 - fully 20 years ago. Maybe I've gotten complacent, but I long ago stopped worrying about that. When I think of it, I put my Garmin on the floor of the car before I leave, but sometimes I don't bother. In any case, nothing happens.

Perhaps it's because crime in the Northeast has been dropping for the past 15 years - violent crime in NYC is at a 50 year low - or perhaps it's because electronic gadgets have gotten too cheap to steal. I used to spend $500 for a good car stereo back in the mid-1980s, which would be the equivalent of $1200+ today. But my 4-year-old Garmin is worth less than 100 of today's bloodless dollars. So why bother?

So put me down as someone who thinks that we're much safer today than we were 20 or 30 years ago.

lasubeguy · February 2010

I've noticed that on my new 2010 Legacy Limited, with just 1300 miles on it, there is a nearly constant ooze of black oily stuff (bolt grease, I presume) on all 4 wheels in and around the 5 bolts that fasten the very nice rims to the car. I noticed a little of this same seepage on my 2006 Legacy, but on this new car, it is more so and very noticeable. I've wiped away most of it a couple of times with a paper towel, but alas! it returns within a few days. Anyone else experience this? And does anyone know what could be causing this and how it could be eliminated? :confuse: Thanks.

birdboy · February 2010

I am happy to jump ship from the 2009 Forester forum to join this one. I just purchased my new Outback. My 2009 Forester had more rattles, squeaks and interior noises coming from everywhere in the cabin, thus making my experience with it extremely dissapointing. It did handle and drive beautifully which is why I bought another Subie. I find the outback fit and finish of the interior and exterior to be quite better than the Forrester. I hope in time, this will ring true I appreciate and thank everyone for all the postings thus far. Being educated and aware of any issues out there benefits all of us and allows Subaru to issue quick fixes when possible. I have seen this happen with the 2009 Forester.

ateixeira · February 2010

Hmm, they should not use grease on the lug nuts. They could work themselves loose. Anti-seize, perhaps, but not grease.

At your next tire rotation (if not sooner) ask your dealer to trace the grease and clean up the mess. Doesn't seem normal to me.

lasubeguy · February 2010

Thanks for the input. I'll get it checked out.

millwood0 · February 2010

"I have never understood the statement "tends to fishtail if throttle is lifted midturn."

when you accelerate, the weight of the vehicle moves backwards (because the center of gravity is above the contact plane (tires touching the ground) where the traction is formed.

this allows the rear wheels to have more "friction" / traction - a reason rwd vehicles are preferred.

when you lift the throttle, the weight of the vehicle moves away from the rear wheel back to its steady state position. this lifts the rear wheels and reducing the downward force on the rear wheels, thus making them more likely to lose traction.

a worse situation develops if you brake - in that case, the weight moves forward. this is actually how you get a fwd car to oversteer, with a little bit steering input.

ateixeira · February 2010

Ah, the old Scandinavian Flick. :shades:

xwesx · February 2010

Yes, and yet that still does not validate the statement, "tends to fishtail...."

birdboy · February 2010

Picked up my limited 2.5 black outback yesterday. I am impressed with the quality of the fit and finish. Although I only drove a few miles so far I noticed last night an unusual shadow-dark spot at eye level where the projector beam did not illuminate. Is this normal? They do project light much further on the road, however it seems the light is more on the road . I guess I will get used to it. Any comments are appreciated.
Also the upgraded Harmon radio does not have a menu button on the bottom left as the one in the quick start guide. It says RPM ( which allow track mixing) I was trying to set the SVC or speed volume. I really liked this feature in the Forrester. basically the volume automatically gets lower when you slow down and louder as you go faster.
Is this a feature dedicated only to the 6 cylinder model?

sweetsoul · February 2010

Congrats birdboy! As far as the headlights go, I have a little shadow dip right in the top center on the low beams. It's basically like the light from the headlamps arcs assymetrically and the shadow dip occurs right in the middle where the 2 headlights meet. It's only a dip or shift in "height" from one light to the next and only occurs at the very end of the lights- hopefully I am explaining this well enough. The low beams are pretty directed at the road and almost have a sharp cut off, which I found much different than my previous SUV. But I will tell you that after the first week I got so used to it I completely forgot about it until your post. The low beams actually work perfectly in the environment they were meant for and the high beams are fantastic - best I have ever had in a car. As far as the stereo I have not found the feature you mentioned. Have you googled it at all? There are some Outback experts blogging out there and they might be able to answer you or research it for you. Good luck and enjoy your new ride

gened1 · February 2010

I just ordered a 2010 2.5 Limited Legacy. Each of the two other cars I test drove - a 3.6R Premium and a 2.5 Limited had the Harmon Kardon audio system in it and while stopped and listening to them really didn't think they were all that great. Neither car had a nav system. Is there an equalizer with the HK system if the Nav isn't in the car? I also tested a Buick LaCrosse that had the HK system and it was great. I'm hoping that the new car HK system can be tweeked. Anyone that has the Limited without the Nav can you share what you have done to get the sound to be better? I did play with the treble and bass and fade and balance but not too long as I wanted to drive the cars with the radio off. Also with the car I ordered I didn't think I needed to order the self dimming mirror with compass. The other cars had it and I thought that it was standard on the Limited. Do I need to call tomorrow and have it added as I really do like that feature. I don't miss the Nav as I have a Garmin and the Factory Nav I have in my Toyota Convertible is really poor.
thanks for any help.

easypar · February 2010

"Also with the car I ordered I didn't think I needed to order the self dimming mirror with compass."

I just saw this question and I don't feel like going into the new car build either here or on Subaru USA but I think it's standard, only an upgrade if you want the "homelink". AFAIK they can add the homelink at the distribution center or at the dealer by changing out the mirror assembly. Just for the compass and self dimming I'm pretty sure that's standard on all cars.

Nice call on the Nav. BTW, what color did you order?

easypar

gened1 · February 2010

My wife (and I also) liked the azirite blue but in Limited trim it only comes with the light colored leather and with the Grandkids I'm afraid they would do a number on it. We had a Sebring convertible with the "butter colored" (wife's description) leather and they made me work too hard to get it as clean as I liked. We ordered the Ruby Red Pearl 2.5 limited as it has the off black interior and we wanted the Legacy actually without the sunroof (remember I have the Convertible) but there are none available in the northeast. The dealer looked for one with the sunroof and there are none like that in red that they could find either. So we ordered one. I'm not in a hurry so if it takes 6 to 8 weeks I can wait.( I say that now but in a week I will start to get jittery for it)!!! As far as the mirror I only wanted the one with the compass. I found the homelink on the convertible to be a pain to program but necessary as when I park the car someplace I don't have to worry if I leave the top down as the remote can't be stolen.

birdboy · February 2010

Drove my new OB 2.5 limited back to the city today. 3 hour drive. Averaged 29-31mpg @65mph. She drove beautifully. Gened , I personally would recommend the few extra bucks and have the dimming mirror put in. It is such a great option especially if you drive at night.
The HK does not have an equalizer. The CD's sound great overall to me. Some radio stations as well. Overall I am very happy with the fit and finish as well as the ride so far. I did notice a little steering wheel vibration at 65 on the NYS Thruway.

birdboy · February 2010

Thank you sweetsoul, You explained it well, I am relieved to know that it is expected and that I will get used to it. I have never had this before either . The lights do project beautifully and yes the high beams are great. As for the speed control volume, it seems to be in the 3.6 radio, which to me makes no sense to have the exact radio with one differing feature. I am going to check again..

gened1 · February 2010

This site that had info on the HK system
http://www.subaruoutback.org/forums/showthread.php?s=0f270d3d1ff9c3d0ddf63fa5eae- 1ff0e&threadid=22586&perpage=20&pagenumber=2
Also I did order the auto dimming mirror. I like it and have had it on other cars that I have owned or now own.

gened1 · February 2010

found this site on the radio at carreview.com

The base stereo isnt much to write home about, but I will tell you to leave the bass setting at zero. It sounds like it is centered at 125Hz and bumping it up will induce clipping. If you want to hear the bass, use the menu button on the left side of the unit and scroll through until you get to CS-auto and select 1 for normal to loud listening and 2 to hear the bass with low volume. The manual talks about some phantom center speaker hocus-pocus, but its mostly a bass-boost at around 60 Hz.
Don't have the car yet so not really knowing what it refers to but maybe it will help someone else that can refer to their cars system.

birdboy · February 2010

Please tell me which model outback you have. I just got a 2.5 limited and am disappointed that the SVC sped control of volume is not there, as a matter of fact there is no menu button on the left. I assume you have the 6 cyl model, am I correct?
Thanks

gened1 · February 2010

Here is a very comprehensive all-in-one -place Legacy information website..Hope it will help somebody else doing research on the Legacy. (I think other models can be accessed too). more comprehensive than anything I have found so far.

http://www.cars101.com/subaru/legacy/legacy2010.html

avery1 · February 2010

Any thoughts on the pluses and minuses of the two different AWD systems found in the 4cyl and 6cyl Outbacks?

jtny1 · February 2010

yes my thoughts are
if i would have known there were 2 diffrent systems i would not have bought mine. i love it dont get me wrong the 4 cly, great milleage etc but i dont hink it is as good as my old subi on ice etc
what happened to the symetrical awd i dont get as much power to the rear wheeels as the older models, what is that about i am a very disappointed. everything gets cheaper and cheaper! :mad:

ateixeira · February 2010

Get the H6 for the VTD if you want the best AWD system.

elena_l · February 2010

My husband and i have one failing car (a Suzuki) and need to buy a replacement immediately. I love the Legacy, however i don't like any of the new colors. Azurite blue is a possibility although i much prefer a softer, more silvery blue. I hate the shiney black fabric in the Premium that comes with many of the other colors (silver, for example.)

Question: I don't know if i should wait until Subaru comes out with a replacement for their unpopular sky blue (perhaps this August???), or if i should buy the azurite blue pearl and live with it for the next decade. We do need a reliable second car NOW.

Also i wonder if the dark blue is as hard to keep clean as black. Any comments?
I would appreciate any input.

Thanks!

elena

redrose1 · February 2010

We went to Subaru last week with the exact same question and were told that the ONLY difference between the 4 and the 6 was the power. We were not aware of any difference in the AWD systems. Will both systems do the same job or is the differnce noticeable? We gave back a 2005 Outback 3.0R and loved the AWD system on that car. Would the 4 be similar to that or should we go for the 6?
We were going for the 4 for the excellent fuel benefits and felt the 4 would be adequate for the strict speed limits everywhere you go nowadays. We would appreciate any feedback to help in our decision.
Thanks!

avery1 · February 2010

If you look on http://www.cars101.com/subaru/outback/outback2010.html about two thirds of the way down you will see

3.6R, automatic 5 speed transmission
VTD (Variable Torque Distribution) All Wheel Drive system with VDC and Hill Holder VTD traction control system has 45/55 performance oriented, front/rear power split with Limited Slip rear axle.

">link title2.5i, Premium, Limited with Automatic CVT transmission
Active All Wheel Drive system with VDC and Hill Holder. Electronically controlled, constantly varying front/back power split 90/10 front/back power split.

jtny1 · February 2010

if i would have known my subi had the 90/10 i would not have got it. it is not as good as my old subis int he snow. its still good but not the same, which leads me to beleive i could have bought any type of awd and got the same results
that is very disappointing for subaru. i was use to the 45/55 and i think it does make a diffrence

i was wondering if anyone knows when it says 90/10 when more is need in the back wheels does it go higher than the 90/10 or is the 90/10 the most it will do?? i'm a little upset to say the least.
its been an icey winter here so its hard to judge the how it is doing since its icy

rsholland · February 2010

Elena, Any very dark color will show dirt, as will any very light color. If that's a concern consider something that's neither too dark or too light.

I was recently at the Baltimore car show, and they had a light blue Outback Limited on display that really looked good. Frankly, if you really like the car, I wouldn't be quite so picky about the exterior color. Obviously don't get something you really don't like, but I'm sure there must be some color choices that are acceptable.

Personally, I'd be more concerned about the interior color, as that's where you spend all of your time with the vehicle. So I'd chose the interior color first (black or tan), and then live with one of the exterior colors that comes with at interior.

As to next model year colors? I'm sure there will be a change or two,but who knows what color will be changed, and what it'll be changed to?

Bob

rsholland · February 2010

We have a 2001 Forester automatic, which has the front-biased AWD. Just last week, in our third (or was it fourth, or fifth?) major snow storm of this winter, I just didn't have the energy to once again shovel my driveway. So I took the Forester, and drove it up and down our somewhat long driveway (with a hill) eight or nine times. Mind you, we're talking about 17" - 19" of fresh unshoveled snow here. The Forester, with all-season tires, did just fine.

Bob

bigfrank3 · February 2010

According to my salesman who goes to the Subaru classes, the 90/10 is the steady-state ratio, that is just cruising along. As soon as wheel slippage is detected, or any time the vehicle is accelerating, more power is sent to the rear, up to 50% depending on the computer calculation for the conditions it "sees" via the sensors.

avery1 · February 2010

Is that 2001 or 2010?

xwesx · February 2010

2001.... the AWD system is the same except now VDC is standard on all models, which the 2001 did not have.

birdboy · February 2010

and I thought I was the only one.. I just got my black outback.. My priority was the beige interior, wood trim. My last two cars had black leather and dark insides so that eliminated the silver color and the charcoal colors which I would have liked. Next I wanted the Harvest gold, however there was a two month or more wait. I am not a navy blue person so the azure blue was out. The cypress green, well it was a strange shade and I did not love it. The black looked so classy and elegant so I went for it knowing that , in general black is a higher maintenance color. Oh yes , the white also did not do anything for me. I also felt that none of the color offerings were good for me. I also was lucky enough to see all the colors lined up in a row in the sunlight,
Good Luck!

All-New 2010 Legacy/Outback

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