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Comments
Not all the "shakers" are apparent during a test drive and some of the affected units do not manifest a shake until thousands of miles have been accumulated. Therefore, having no shake at one or more thousands of miles is not a guarantee that your car will not eventually be a dreaded "shaker."
Subaru does not have a definite "fix" for the problem should your car be affected. They have tried many, many different band-aids but none has worked consistently. Hence, buying a new Outback is a real crap shoot. You may get a good one, you may not.
If you do get a "shaker" there is no guarantee that if it is not fixable that Subaru will take it off your hands.
In short, the new Subaru Outback is the "Russian roulette" of cars!
In short, the new Subaru Outback is the "Russian roulette" of cars!
Unless some organization like Consumers Union has a shaker and publicizes the problem. Such publicity could kill sales, If Subaru had that kind of pressure, the problem would certainly be fixed. Let's hope CU's 3.6 gets the shakes.
Do tell us more about the "nature of the problem" and the "ability for correcting it." I would just love to know what the nature is and so would the many disillusioned new Outback owners on many internet boards, including this one, who have bought this defectively engineered car in good faith and have ended up with "shakers" that cannot be fixed despite your disinformation to the contrary.
It is true that Subaru has come out with many so-called "fixes" for the problem but it is also true that none of them work consistently. Don't try to inform us otherwise.
Yes, I have an issue. I don't like the thought of paying tens of thousands of hard-earned dollars for a potentially defective car that cannot be fixed. I also don't like being told the car has a "fixable" problem when that is not true consistently or reproducibly.
If you got one that does not shake (yet), consider yourself fortunate but please do not try to deny or minimize the far less satisfactory buying experiences of many others as detailed on the internet forums to which I made reference earlier. Just because your particular Outback does not shake hardly makes the car the "best choice for the money." It was the best choice for your money perhaps but it certainly would not be the best choice for the money of someone with the shake problem that could not be fixed and required either SOA buying back the car or replacing it.
Does it seem strange? Does anyone have problem in the summer keeping cool. I don't like to keep the air on on me at times, But my passingers like to keep cool. any complaints. Another problem is the tinting some basic models have tinting but the color we are thinking of doesn't. Sales person sugests be paid on our own for it. What. Why pay for something that somes standard on another car. Not really sold on suburu. Seems lacking.
Rear A/C in a passenger car sounds like overkill to me, but I hear tell there are some out there with the feature.
Spring for a model with the all-weather package for the heated seats, as those have tint as well.
Your experience underscores the fact that the dreaded "shakes" may not show up for several thousand miles.
Reliability? I've been left stranded twice by mine (one occasion the head gasket at advanced mileage, the other the alternator when the car was almost new).
Safety? Definitely, yes. One of the safest cars on the road. It's known as the "Japanese Volvo" which is probably a misnomer because lots of cars are as safe as Volvos.
The AWD capability is also second to none. If it's possible to get through it, Subaru will do it!
The price is indeed high enough (even higher in Canada) but it is going to continue on up because of currency debasement. The company has no choice.
I would have moved on to a new 2010 or '11 model by now but not with the shake issue still unresolved. I am not one of those infinitely patient enough to jump through all the "fix" hoops in hopes of resolving a serious issue which has not yet been consistently and reproducibly resolved. But maybe in the next iteration. It's really too bad because otherwise the Outback is a truly great car.
OK, I agree with you about the German, Swedish. That being said, there are many Korean cars BETTER than the OB. How about some Japanese brands that are just as good or better than the OB?? All those cars are probably less in cost than the Subie.
I have had 6 Subies and loved every one. Took several over 200k. But I'm not going to drive a car 200k with a shake.
So I will wait to see if they get it fixed (for real) if not, I'll be getting a Kia or Hyundai
(same company you know).
I'd rather have a Subie but only if it is guaranteed not to shake.
So I will wait till the end of this year. My dealer knows my position. I told him I would buy an OB (IF) the shake has been fixed.
It is experiences such as yours that are making many prospective buyers, including previous Subaru buyers, very leery now of the Outback. I will certainly not buy one given the present situation.
I therefore am looking elsewhere and considering the Forester (which is a poor second to the Outback in my opinion but a creditable vehicle nevertheless) as well as other brands including the Equinox and the new Grand Cherokee.
It is really a shame that Subaru is tarnishing its previous good reputation over this issue but this shaking thing is now in its second year and still new "shakers" are being built and sold according to posts on other forums.
I hope you get your car properly and truly fixed. Life is way too short to be spent with vibrating hands and arms and, in your particular case the entire car, as you cruise on down the highway!
Outback simply clobbers the Crosstour while costing less. And that's not just Edmunds' opinion - it's true in Consumer Reports as well. Even the 4 cylinder Outback easily outscores the Crosstour.
It also costs less than a similarly equipped Venza, and again, CR rated the 4 banger Outback higher.
So I dunno about the "better than OB" and "less in cost" part.
If you're not happy with Subaru, I can't blame you for buying something else next time, though.
Personally I'd like to see the Koreans try harder - their sedans get DI engines but their crossovers get weaker versions of the same engines, and they're not as powerful nor as fuel efficient. Disappointing.
If this was a brand new company to the automotive industry, I can maybe understand something like this steering shake issue, but there is really no reason why it should be so persistent and pervasive on a model that is in its fifth generation.
Wes,
This shake comes with introduction of a new "frame" (front unit body parts). No one has discussed the possibility of a front end unit body problem. I'm reminded of my 1965 Mustang V8 which developed the shakes when the lower firewall had thinned from rust. I replaced all suspension components, but that didn't help.
A shock tower brace kit like those installed on some WRXs might be a way to determine whether the front unibody is the source of the shake.
Dave
Thanks for posting that! After I keyed the last message, I began to think along the same lines. It's not the components, it's likely the structure to which they are attached.
It makes sense, too, especially with regard to the problem becoming increasingly worse over time. If this is the problem, I hope they address it soon because if the shake does grow worse, it will eventually cause a structural failure that could prove disastrous if it occurs at the wrong time.
I'm glad we both are just spectators in this debacle; our new Foresters not only look better than the Outback but are more reliable too.
If it is indeed the front unibody, the resultant recall will make the Toyota fiasco a distant memory. I wonder if there are any Toyota parts involved?
Dave
Apart from better appearance and reliability compared to the latest generation "shaking" Outback, how else do you like your Foresters?
Can you comment on cabin noise levels at highway speeds, stock audio system quality, NAV system if you have it and ride quality? Normal 2.5 engine adequate or is the turbo the ticket?
I am in the situation of finally deciding to turn my "back" on the Outback because I will absolutely not chance getting a shaker and then the hoops I would have to jump through to get a "fix!" [Reminds me of a Subaru joke: Q. How is a new Outback owner like a heroin addict? A. They are both desperately looking forward to their next "fix!"]
Thanks for any info you can provide.
I don't like the exhaust rap (heard in the cabin) on the naturally aspirated 2010 Forester; it is identical to my long ago 1997 Legacy GT. The 2011 Forester appears to have a new header and exhaust manifold design; it may have eliminated the problem.
The 2011 without turbo...if it has the better block design from the turbo...might be a good bet. A test drive will tell.
Wes,
Another possibility that has not been mentioned is engine mounts. One poster said the shake starts after driving quite some time which would correlate to possible change in engine mounts (probably softer) with heat. I had a 1989 Maxima that developed poor steering after an engine mount failed.
Dave
Overall, I am very happy with the Forester. Compared to the last Outback I owned (a 2008 2.5i), it has more passenger room (but a shorter cargo area). Since we have two young children and take relatively frequent long trips (some as long as 4000-5000 miles one way!), passenger comfort was paramount.
All 2010 models (four) in which I have ridden have all had door rattles (left and right front doors), but they were easily fixed on my car with one visit to the dealer. The car is perfectly quiet (in terms of rattles) aside from that. There is very little wind noise at speed, even less with the sunshade closed on the massive moon roof. I love the moon roof, though, so that shade is rarely closed!
I am not a good source of info on the radio. I think it sounds great, but then I have never owned any cars with "premium" systems in them and have never owned a new car that was not a Subaru. I think it sounds nice, but that may also be a result of the cabin being so quiet. I don't find myself turning up the volume on the stereo at highway speeds unlike any other car I have, such as my Escort, where I will double the volume at speed versus being stopped. When I'm driving, I don't really care about having a sound system with perfect fidelity because the stereo is just a peripheral - I'm in the car to drive.
Unlike Dave, I have the normally aspirated engine mated to a manual transmission. I think the engine power is fine, and it is quite peppy when I ask it to be. I haul and/or pull pretty decent loads with it now and again, and it does an admirable job for such a little car. hauled about 1500# (maybe more) 1100 miles last summer on my annual fishing trip, and I was able to run it at speed the whole way, hills/mountains and all. Of course, it only averaged 17.5 mpg on that trip, but I was okay with that given I had stuff on top and was pulling a trailer at 60-70 mph.
The Subaru MT is okay. I don't mind the 4-speed AT either but prefer a manual in general. I really liked the locking rear differential on the previous Outbacks (great for the fun factor), but the VSC works well on the Forester. In terms of go-ability, this one is definitely the most capable. I think the new Outback has the same system on it now, though, so that's a non-issue comparing new to new.
I run synthetic oil in it on extended drain intervals, and the engine is whisper quiet and smooth. I am not familiar with the "exhaust rap" Dave mentioned. I mean, I can *hear* the exhaust/engine inside the car, but I think I would feel uncomfortable (disconnected) in a car where I couldn't.
I would call the ride "firm." It is not a cushy sedan ride, but not uncomfortable at all. I like it.
He concluded that it was just a slight vibration that would not affect performance, the customer took the vehicle on a trip and returned after the problem persisted. I met with my service manager about how to fix it, and he let me know he started a file with Subaru.
About a week later I see my customer driving at the dealership and somehow the service department was able to minimize the effect. Sorry I don't know how he did it, but good news is there is a fix.
It is good that your service manager is really trying to help your customer.
Thanks to all who have posted their experiences on this problem. I am sure that you have saved many potential buyers a lot of money and agony.
AWD is a must for me, and it seems to be better value than the Volvo XC70, Audi A4.
Obviously I'm very concerned about the steering shimmy issue.
I read Outback sales are still very strong for 2010 despite this.
Would love to get info on % of cars by build date having this problem.
Does anyone have an idea about that?
Many thanks
After much deliberation, I decided that I would thoroughly test drive an Outback and if it did not shake, I would take it home. And thats what I did, and I have not looked back. Some people have reported that their Outback developed the shakes later on, but again, I decided I would accept that chance.
Like many other people, I love this car and I am glad that I was not scared away from it.
Best of luck to you and your decision.
Subaru claims 66,384 outback sales for 2010 through September, which is on pace for approx 90,000 cars in 2010.
Suppose say 500 cars have/develop the problem? (total guess from amount of forum posts. Please correct me if this is a bad estimate).
That would be just over 0.5%.
I guess I'm weighing that against dropping another $10,000+ for an audi a4.
Kinda wish I had kept my Volvo wagon I traded in on it. It was SO smooth and peppy but the Warranty was almost out so...there ya go!
If it were me, I would walk and consider the Forester or new Jeep GC, both great cars.
The new OB is for the gambler. I've heard it's Kenny Rogers' favorite vehicle!!! (Tongue-in-cheek!)
The above quote is: WISHFUL THINKING AND JUST NOT TURE.
Subaru has a great AWD system for the size of car it is. It may be the best "in it's class" but that is not saying much if you live where you get 10 to 12" of snow all the time. If you put a Subaru in 10 to 12" of snow it goes nowwhere!
It gets stuck due to: #1 Not enough power and #2 Not enough ground clearance.
I have had 5 Subies and have one now. They are great for snow and ice on plowed roads. If you have over 10" of snow I leave the Subie in the garage (as it is worthless. (power and clearance). If the snow is 10" I take one of my Jeeps which will go through up to 14" without much trouble. If the snow gets over 10", power Is much more important than clearance. A Jeep has the power (and a low range) Subies do not.
And don't even talk about off raod or mud if your driving a Subie. You need an AWD with Power that a Subie doesn't have.
That being said, I always sent my kids to college in a Subie, and that is all my wife drives when we have less than 10" of snow (as long as she stay on the roads.)
CK
.
By the way, I almost bought a 2011 Outback 3.6 R Limited, but due to the potential problems with the shaking, purchased an Acura RDX instead.The RDX has "asymmetrical AWD" which Honda calls Super Handling AWD. I have purchased Pirelli Snow and Ice snow tires from the Tire Rack for the RDX and plan to use them this winter. If the Outback?Legacy steering wheel shaking problem becomes common knowledge in the years ahead, the resale value of the affected Subarus will be poor.
I just didn't want to take the chance, so I got a different car.
I think the worst conditions I've driven in was 22" on the ground, unplowed. This was last winter during the Mid-Atlantic blizzard. I have to go pick up my daughter, about a mile away. I made it all the way until there was a steep up hill, just 100 yards from the house. I had to use a shovel a little bit, then I made it.
Going back was easy because I followed my own tracks.
Just be careful and take a shovel with you! The more capable, the farther you are from help should you get stuck!
Haha! That's for sure!
I intend to obliterate both characteristics with my 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland with Terrain Select and and Quadra-Lift suspension, and of course, Quadra-Drive II AWD. And of course it will not shake!
Did I mention the interior looks like a million bucks with that gorgeous saddle leather?
And for those still harping on Jeep reliability of old, don't even bother. The 2011 is a brand new game and could hardly be worse than the new Outbacks, now could it?
For what it's worth, and I know to many it's not worth much, the Tribeca scored higher overall in the Consumer Reports' tests.
Also, the Grand Cherokee "tended to skitter and hop sideways" when you exceed lateral limits they described as "mediocre". Ouch.
I expect a recall from Jeep for the stability control failure, to be honest. Jeep has its own set of problems, IMHO far worse than a little shimmy on a few Outbacks.
Before people scream bias, let's remember when the Lexus GX did this they plastered a huge "do not buy" on that model, while Jeep is getting a 2nd chance with an upcoming test of the V8 model.
The Outback is not perfect, but is any vehicle?
Here is an actual copy of their resonse. (as far as they are concerned, there in little or no problem with the SW shaking.
Thank you for your recent e-mail to Subaru of America, Inc. We appreciate you taking the time to contact us.
As a company, we carefully monitor warranty claims and quality survey comments to watch for any trends or concerns that can lead to customer dissatisfaction. The process we have established works well for us and in turn, it is helpful to our customers. Because of the number of various web sites out there, we cannot monitor the activity in them or report on anything that may be seen there.
While the information presented on internet sites is broad, our needs are more specific than what is supplied there. For example, we would need to track owner information, vehicle identification numbers, production dates, etc. An open public posting forum is not the best place for a customer to include this information in the interest of safety and privacy.
Please be assured that Subaru is very committed to customer satisfaction. We take a very proactive position if we become aware of a concern via our tracking methods or by monitoring owner contacts.
We have received a very small number of customer contacts about a vibration issue with the 2010 and 2011 Outback and Legacy models. We are working very closely with our dealers concerning this issue and our engineers are working very hard for a resolution. Please also know that we have heard from many more 2010 and 2011 Outback owners telling us how much they "LOVE" their Subaru.
At this time, we would recommend that you go to your local Subaru dealer and test drive the specific vehicle that interests you. As always, take it on a thorough test drive on local roads and highways to determine how the vehicle performs in various conditions. I think you will be pleased with the results and hope that you will become a member of the Subaru family.
Also, if for any reason you experience concerns after you purchase our dealers are there to assist you in any way that they can.
Should you have any additional questions, please do not hesitate to contact us again. Thank you for the opportunity to address your concerns.
Regards,
Nancy Quinn
Subaru of America, Inc
Customer Dealer Services
WOULD YOU BUY A CAR (OR A BOTTLE OF SNAKE OIL) FROM THIS COMANY?
What a shame that Subaru is trying to sweep this under the rug as Toyota did their problems.
CK
http://www.autoblog.com/2010/12/13/2011-ford-explorer-first-drive-review-road-te- st/
We experienced some disconcerting behavior in the Jeep when it unsettled a bit as we turned starboard to make the corner, as if the rear suspension was oscillating both vertically and somewhat laterally as well
And that's a well-received vehicle. Like I said, nothing's perfect.
The New Jeep Grand Cherokee, especially the Limited and and Overland models, are running rings around the competition. The "skittering and hopping" are hardily indicative of the frequency of the shaking of literally hundreds, perhaps of thousands of Outbacks, which defective vehicle Subaru interestingly continues to sell (perhaps they need the money).
You also might be interested in the fact the JGC is safer than the Outback. She www.informedforlife.org for details.
Give e the new Jeep Grand Cherokee over the "gambler's" Otback any day!