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Mercedes-Benz C-Class Maintenance and Repair
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Comments
I've owned EVERYTHING over the past 43 years - there is no question that Toyota and Honda do a better job of making trouble-free cars than any of the Germans. But drawing any distinctions among the German makes, including the all-too-self-satisfied BMW [I also belong to BMWCCA] is just foolish. They all make the same mistakes and all buy flawed parts from the same suppliers.
If you want a trouble-free ownership experience, you need to stick with the Japanese. I keep coming back to MB because of how the car behaves on the road. I give every potential owner the credit for the common sense to know what is most important to them, and act accordingly.
I would also recommend that Consumer Reports be consulted so one can view their predicted reliability for cars. BMW surpasses Mercedes Benz across the board.
The suspension perch failures on W210 ( particularly diesel ) model cars is not a supplier problem, but a design flaw.
The issue is not even about trouble free, the issue is about dealer performance, access to quality service, and ability to have contact with Mercedes regional managers.
I don't know that there is much argument from the motoring press, private analysis by financial institutions and quality survey firms, that Mercedes brand cars presently under warranty, being leased or in dealer stock have quality issues.
The problem is global and extends to Mercedes Credit Lending.
Yes, I know a lot of people might say that they know friends who are not having problems and that is fine. You can post your message. That said, many of us are experiencing problems on our new MB. Also, I can not speak for other automakers so please do not compare this posting with any.
Anyway Thank you for your posting lets hope that it does help someone.....
-During our test drive, I noticed it needed a wheel alignment to correct pulling; this was accomplished in the first week, and the appt. to do it was part of the sales process.
-Because our car had been unsold for nearly 6 months, and spent some time on a dirt lot, the vent tube in the differential got plugged, causing a leak. This was remedied with one visit.
-During the most recent B service, I had them apply a TSB to our car that addressed bogus messages about ESP failures [the message appears, then is reset by an engine restart] - this was accomplished as part of the service visit.
-I had them replace one of the horns - it was sounding like a bleating calf.
You decide for yourselves what this means, if anything, in the context of this discussion. Let's just say our last Toyota Camry had just as many problems, with more time getting worked on.
There were lots of early production W203s that were hopeless cases. There were lots more with a history like ours, which I regard as pretty normal for a car this complex. And the driving experience is just about the best we have had - the only better car we've owned was our '98 E320 in terms of how it behaves out there in the real world.
I think the new Lexus IS is significant competition, but issues already bubbling to the surface on the new E90 BMW 3er suggest that you aren't going to be home-free there, either. I was all set to order the RWD version of the BMW 3er wagon [due in our market in the Spring], but not after I've been following the stories of some of the early adapters of the new 3er. If I do it at all, it probably won't be for at least another year, to allow them to deal with the same kinds of problems that seem to affect all of the German makes when a new model comes out.
The build date is shown on the data plate on the doorjamb.
After the first service, the computer will be reset and then go from there. The dealer might be willing to reset yours now, since 4k is awfully early to dump the oil, though an early oil change never hurts. Talk to the dealer service people and see what they say.
Our car has the FSS system, and it is programmed for 2 years, plus monitoring the oil quality based on usage. In other words, when MBUSA was paying, going 2 years was considered OK for a low-mileage user with mostly freeway miles; now that the customer is paying, it's a maximum of 1 year. What a surprise....
2 or 3 dashboard lights went kablooey 3 years ago
airflow direction selector for heat/AC is stuck on one setting and can't be changed
AM radio reception is, and always has been, terrible
6-CD changer in trunk went belly up a year ago
front cup holder doesn't close
LCD readout on radio doesn't work; only bottom half of numbers visible
power headrests no longer work
power moonroof slides when I tilt it and tilts when I slide it
cruise control cuts off on a whim
low fuel warning light blinks even after vapor lock is checked and reseated
Inquired about getting some of the minor glitches fixed but was told by the dealer tech that it might not be worth it - said that fixing the cupholder alone could run $300. No thanks. I'll play out the string with this car and then go back to Japanese.
Seats squeak badly.
Excessive wind noise from all doors on the highway.
Axle shaft boots splitting again, and one is starting to click bad in turns.
UppleUpper joint boots are starting to split.
Motor mounts have lost their touch.(The electronic one is supposedly $400 +labor)
Transmission still shifts too hard.
Speedometer needle is starting to bounce at freeway speeds.
Brakes are still squeaking(dealer installed)
Right rear window regulator broke.
Steering wheel covering is seperating from the wheel itself.
Clear coat paint is beginning to flake off.
Cruise control stopped working years ago.
Left rear door actuator makes this mysterious ratchet/groan every time car is locked. This car only has 60k on it.
My fathers 02 Toyota starter went out at 40k( car just went out of warranty)
Cost: $550 for the part, two and half hours labor, plus towing.
My sister in-laws Toyota had the air bags deploy while parked, thank God she wasn't driving. And Toyota did not give a hoot! The dealer was absolutely useless, with the
service mangager failing to return a single phone call. Toyota corporate never returned calls and would transfer the call to some "pseudo" persons voice mail at every attempt to contact someone regarding this matter. It took six months for Toyota to admit there was a design flaw and to finally fix the car.(new control unit and air bags).
Back to my 97 202. It still drives like new, no wind noise, no road noise, and typical German road manners. This CANNOT be said about the Accord. It 's driving dynamics and above mentioned noises on the road leave a lot to be desired. Is it reliable? Well, if you mean that it doesn't leave me stranded, then yes(except for the ignition igniter problem that left the car not wanting to start). But is has required more than it's share of up-keep.
My 202 has also been very reliable(never stranded) and has had less maintenance work performed overall than the Accord.
This is why I went German again. Our 203 has been outstanding. It has had a total of 4 dealer visits in nearly two years. Once for it's scheduled A-service, and the rest was for 3 seperate tire repairs, all caused by nails. The dealer didn't even charge for repairing the tires.
I have had a few MBs and still do, for two main reasons. The cars drive to my liking and I have had very good service from both the dealers and MB HQ. I had a bad ML (I mean bad) and the dealer plus MB jumped in and eliminated the problem. Maybe I was lucky, but, I was impressed and picked up another MB (2004 C320 4matic wagon). FYI - MB called me back when I called.
I know MBs can be painfully unreliable, but, I do have an extreme comparison that keeps me thinking it is not so bad. I have a 2003 Audi A4 3.0. It has been at 4 different dealers for a total of 150 days - after 2 years of fighting Audi they finally sent experts. Car still can't be fixed so Audi said I can go to another dealer. Audi has absolutely refused responsibility, no return calls and false promises (you can see my points on one of the related Audi boards). In fact, they have told me they are not responsible for their dealers behavior or repair ability often. And talk about trying to find someone to talk to, unless you are savvy with Google you won't find a human that is not just blowing smoke.
I really like German cars, I've got fingers crossed hoping MB will keep up the service that I am used to.
(1) fuel tank sensor replaced (under warranty--apparently a common problem in ALL German cars)
(2) both rear taillamp clusters replaced after smae bulb bulb went out 3 times (under warranty)
(3) CD changer swapped with remanufactured unit (just under $350 installed--part not covered under Starmark extended warranty)
Now, I realize my mileage is low, but I for one think this is a good track record. This is my first Mercedes, after 13 years of driving Honda products (3 Accords and an Acura Legend). So far, I'd rate the Benz's reliability equal to the Legend's, and at least as good or better than the Accords'.
Believe me, I still like Hondas quite a bit. I could very well buy another one. There is just something satisfying about driving an M-B--especially on the open road (and I have the "economy" model).
If someone is wavering over what to buy, I tell them to consider what I call the "wow factor." Make a list of every single car you are interested in. Drive all of them, preferably over a long weekend so each is fresh in your memory. Finally, when you walk away from each "candidate," ask yourself "which one is the toughest to part with?" Or, when you see each vehicle on the road, ask yourself which one you would REALLY like to own--in other words, which one "wows" you the most. Not the most scientific or "Consumer Reports" method, but it worked for me.
Needless to say, if you are contemplating buying a pre-owned M-B, make sure you can check ALL service records. Also keep in mind that EVERY manufacturer--particularly of luxury cars--is expected to provide more and more electronic gadgetry while keeping prices steady. More complication obviously results in more potential for repair. I believe the Japanese still have an edge over the Europeans in reliability of electronics. However, I think M-B still (with a few exceptions) has an edge in body structure, drivetrains, suspensions, brakes and steering. These "hard" parts have a stoutness that I just don't think you find elsewhere, lending to a feeling of security, whether you are a driver or a passenger.
The nice problem for enthusiasts is that there are a lot of really good vehicles out there today, so choosing one is never easy. I hope this helps.
Best of luck--
Any ideas would be appreciated. I will look at the brake light switch soonest opportunity......is there any other component that could cause this repeat problem?
First off, I am very new to Mercedes Benz, having purchased my first one earlier this evening. It is a 2001 C240 with 66,700 miles, and with one exception, looks and feels like a brand-new car.
The one problem (which at the price I paid, I cannot really complain about), is the ESP malfunction indicator on the multifunction display came on, and won't go off. When I evaluated and selected the car everything showed normal, but 20 miles after taking delivery (this is a 5-year-old car with no warranty) the ESP malfunction indicator came on, telling me to go to the dealer (expensive).
Honestly, I don't care much about fancy traction control systems here in sunny Southern California, is there a way to either just disable the system or at least turn off the malfunction warning so it isn't in my face every time I turn on the car? I have the complete service history of the car and it had electrical repairs three times prior to 25,000 miles, but none after.
There is a well known problem that results in bogus ESP messages. It involves replacing a wiring harness and adding some new gold connectors, the old versions of which were subject to corrosion. I just had this work done on our '02 C240; there is a Tech Bulletin out that covers this.
Look to the specifics of the "electrical repairs" and see if any attempt was made to update your car.
ESP malfunctions will not necessarily disable traction control. TC is a lower level function than ESP, which is designed to help get you out of extreme road situations where the car is about to go out of control due to excessive steering or throttle inputs [oversteer in a turn, combined with loss of traction, for example]. It is a safety feature that MB helped invent, and which is widely sought after these days in lesser makes. I wouldn't exactly describe it as a "frill", and it could save your bacon just as easily in SoCal as in Minnesota.
You have to do what you have to do, but I caution people against buying these cars used if you're not prepared to spend money on maintenance - and this advice applies to EVERY "upscale" make, including Lexus and Acura and Infiniti, all of which are allegedly less troublesome than the Germans. Once you get out of the warranty, things will go wrong and they have to be fixed, and it's expensive. In this case, I think there is a known solution, but you say you're reluctant to spend the money - that's legit, but this won't be the last time....be prepared.
The check engine light I am not worried about, as the fuel tank was low and the light came on after a panic stop from 85MPH on a 6% downgrade. The freeway in front of me was closed suddenly due to a fatality accident and after coming to a screaching halt (extremely smooth and undramatic, by the way), the car sat for two hours on the downgrade waiting for the freeway to reopen, at whcih time I had the check engine light (car was shut off until the freeway opened). I tried openeing and closing the gas cap but to no avail, called the roadside assistance and they suggested adding fuel.
So far I love the car, it is the most comfortable and quiet cruiser I've ever driven, just nervous about electrical gremlins that these are famous for.
I do have one gremlin that the selling dealer (not MB) will cover repair of and that is that the sunshade in the back window doesn't work about 60% of the time. Sometimes I push the dash button and it works perfectly, sometimes it does absolutely nothing. I'll have this checked in 3,000 miles when I take the car to MB for my A service. Hopefully they can explain the ESP warning and other messages at that time.
My car's service history shows two electrical system services at 18,000 and 25,000 miles, so obviously this has occured before.
I've owned dozens of cars in my time, and our '02 C240 is our 14th MB - and there is nothing else out there at anything like the price that I would want more. Ours has been reasonably trouble-free - the wiring fix was the only thing that smelled like the ubiquitous electronic problems that so many people have had. In our case, the ESP messages could always be reset by shutting the engine off and restarting, and it only happened a few times, but twice in the last year so I told them to get out the Service Bulletin and apply the standard fix. No problems since.
thanks
For this model year, and assuming you're talking about automatic transmission cars, it is almost a straight wash. The BMW is in its first year, and there are the usual list of first-year problems, though none of them are especially serious so far. The MB is in its 6th [and next-to-last] model year, though the drivetrains are heavily revised as of this year. The BMW handles better, the ride is probably a wash, and the MB has a bit more room in the cabin and the trunk. BMW has gone exclusively to run-flat tires, which for a variety of reasons I am unhappy about [expensive to replace, can't be fixed if you actually USE the run-flat feature]. MB has the worse reputation for problems, but that is mostly old news and simply doesn't apply to the current year car - the E90 BMW is in its first 9 months, and there are some teething problems.
If you want a manual trans, then I would probably go with the 325; by a small margin, I think their manual box is better.
Also keep in mind that the C230 comes standard with the so-called sports package, which is extra on the 325. That's why, for me, the car to have is the non-sports C280, not the C230, but to each their own. I think the sports package is nothing but problems - ride compromised, staggered tire sizes, unidirectional tires - but again, it's whatever your priorities are.
You'll hear a lot of bad-mouthing here about the C; I think the '06 version of the C matches up very nicely with the 3er. It comes down to how important that last bit of handling and "sportiness" of the BMW is to you vs the better refinement and slightly more room of the MB. And, what you think of the local dealers - this can easily be the tie-breaker is all else is equal in your mind - whichever one you pick, these cars are German, not Japanese, thus you and the dealer are inevitably going to spend some time together after the sale. I've had mostly good service from the MB dealerships I've dealt with [MB Sacramento, Reno, and Portland OR for our current car]; my history with BMW, which goes back a few years, was less good. It all depends on who's better in your market, and that's a hard thing to know in advance...
Technically, once out of warranty, you're out of luck, but dealers have the power to make these decisions, within reason. It's going to be up to you to make someone see reason, assuming this is the problem, of course.
It's a Service Bulletin, or a Service Campaign, or words to that effect....mention the ESP messages as the primary symptom. Because ESP is a safety feature, you may get more consideration out of warranty.
There are a few other things that weren't mentioned that are important to me. I believe the C280 is 3.5" narrower than the 325i - although that may have changed. I live in an urban area, and stuff like that is important to me. In addition the C280 has a slightly narrower turning radius; albeit not significant. I like to be able to make sharp turns.
These are subtleties, though.
Try someone else for the job as this does not make any sense at all.
JR
JR
The foul odor usually occurred within 15 to 30 minutes after there was a mode change in A/C operation - from OFF to ON, or vice versa.
In August 2005, the dealer replaced the A/C evaporator unit with a new one, coated with Biocide. After two weeks, the odor problem came back.
We have written to both the dealer and MBUSA. However, there has been no response from MBUSA. The dealer called and left message: "bring the car and we'll see what we can do".
The dealer did not offer any clues what they'd do to address the odor problem.
If other readers have had the A/C foul odor problem solved, we'd appreciate it if you can share your success stories.
Regards