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The bearing has a metal shield covering the balls on one side, on the other side it is held in to the transmission housing. The question is how is oil possibly getting into the bearing. It seems to be isolated from the oil. I am impressed that it actually worked so well for 63,000 miles. It must be a good quality bearing to have lasted this long without proper lubrication. We can only guess at this time how Toyota redesigned this flaw, but I am certain it has to do with making sure oil can reach the bearing. My feeling is that my bearing will last another 63,000 miles......
I'm up for going after Toyota...sign me up
pf_flyer, "Matrix Transmission Problems" #1, 11 Jul 2006 8:32 am
I, (along with many others) have had our manual transmissions FAIL at various mileages. I have driven manual transmission cars my whole life (I'm 50)and have NEVER had a transmission FAIL COMPLETELY. I have had to replace clutches but that's it. Apparently this is a major problem that Toyota will not acknowledge. I can assure you that if I am not given some satisfaction by Toyota over this problem that you have known about for some time, two things will happen. First, I will never buy another Toyota. Second, I will be sure to relate my (and everyone elses) misfortune in every conversation where the subject of automobles comes up. This is horrendous. $3800 to replace the transaxle and clutch? Please copy and paste the link above and see all the complaints.
At 157,000 km / 98,125 miles, my transmission is dead. The dealership that I purchased the car has quoted C$ 5,400 for the repair of the transmission. Which is absolutely ridiculous. I hit every serive point and did exactly what was recommended by the manufacturer.
I have brought this issue up with Toyota and am hoping that they will pay for some or all of the repair. In the event they don't, I am going to pursue other means such as small claims court and get as much exposure to this problem as possible. :lemon:
By the way, my Matrix sat for about 2 months, which I'm sure didn't help the oil not getting to the bearing. The mechanic at Clark Toyota, Fredericton acually ASKED ME if it had sat, like as if he was fully familiar with the issue. You have to talk to mechanics willing to talk about the design of this transmission to get the details. Obviously Toyota changed it in 2005 knowing there was a problem. Recalls would have never happened because they would have had to replace every transmission AND engine since the 2005 transmission doesn't work with the 2003/4 engine. Still not sure why the VIBE doesn't seem to have the same complaints in forums. Built in California not Ontario, but should have the same parts shouldn't it??
I wasn't going to do it because I bought a Toyota! They are supposed to be as good as my old beater Hondas that I've driven to 200K miles and never had to do anything to but brakes and exhaust.
What do y'all think? Get the warranty? It's going to raise payments $30/mo for 60 months.
Have you seen problems in the 2005 and newer cars?
And, by the way, I sympathize with everyone here. I bought a used 2002 MINI Cooper and the tranny went out 4wks after I bought it, 34K miles. $4000 repair. MINI was as pathetic as Toyota. "Oh we never heard of that before" even though I found as many posts about that tranny as you have on your 2003-04 trannys. WILL NEVER BUY ANOTHER MINI even though they also upgraded their transmissions (hmmm... wonder why they needed to upgrade if there wasn't a problem???)
Shannon
Sorry for the delay...I guess it's too late for you now, and I'm in Ottawa at the moment w/o the car so I don't have the part number. I had the service done at aToyota dealership in BC, and they showed me the tranny once they had it apart...I don't know much about transmissions but it was obvious that there was something wrong with the one bearing (output bearing apparently). The dealer quoted me $30 or $40 for the bearing and after seeing it, it was clear that there wasn't much to it. Anyway, Toyota sold be the bearing for $40 so that should be the absolute most you should pay for it. I was lucky, it hadn't blown all apart so nothing else needed replacing...sorry I can't be more help.
TOYOTA NEVER AGAIN!
Any aftermarket exclusionary service contract (covers only named parts) should be viewed with extreme caution; aftermarket "bumper-to-bumper" contracts slightly better. Remember that these are not warranties, this can really matter if you have a major failure, as I'm dealing with now on another brand of car.
jc
Toyota Corolla
Chevrolet Prizm
Pontiac Vibe
Toyota Matrix
Toyota Avensis
Toyota Wish
Toyota MR2
I have a 2001 MR2 Spyder with 73k miles. That engine is a slight variant (2ZZ-FED) and built in Japan. Not sure if the trans is the same due to the rear mount of the engine.
At any rate, no manufacture makes a 100% perfect product every time. There are some risks involved. The testament to Toyota quality is the cost of the exteneded warranty. I declined the coverage, but was offered a 6yr/100k mile Toyota Platinum warranty for $615 (Additionally, they would have knocked off some of the processing fee to bring the cost closer to $450).
Bottom line - the 5 speed is the most economical way to go. You save $1000 off the bat in MSRP, you get a heavier discount out the door because nobody wants a stick except me, and you'll get about 3 mpg better real world mileage (that's about $750 over a 100,000 mile period. I bought my 2008 Matrix XR (Moonroof, ABS, all power + cruise) with 282 miles on the odo due to dealer transfer (MD to VA) for 15.5k (stickered at 18.9k). So, in my experience I'll save nearly $3000 vs the comperable automatic over the first 100k miles (resale isn't that important to me because I'll drive it into the ground). So if the tranny goes, then it will be a wash, but since I like stick better (Slush boxes are boring) I still come out ahead.
Try to beat that with a Toyota Scion XD (made by Daihatsu by the way).
For me the Vibe was the best combination of sport, economy, and interior volume. I'll post more as I build miles on the odo.
Even the Toyota Platinum extended warranty doesn't cover clutch friction disc and pressure plate. So if you are that concerned with a clutch wearing out - then you should buy an automatic transmission. Automatic transmissions cost more ($1000), get less mpg (about 3 in this car), are slower, and are no fun.
If you want to save more money - you could learn to change the clutch yourself. For example, you can replace your brake pads for about $50, but a shop will charge you $300. I have never heard of anyone filing for a class action suit for brake pads wearing out.
You need to have realistic expectations. Toyota cannot defy the laws of physics. For perspective, I was in the Toyota dealership recently and a womon was having the automatic transmission in her Sequoia replaced at 80k miles on her dime (likely didn't change fluid and filter regularly). So a clutch is a much lower expense than replacement of an automatic transmission.
I hope your mileage has otherwise been trouble free in the Matrix. We just broke 500 miles on the car and love it!
I filed a complaint. If you purchased your Matrix in the US, and your tranny blew on you at ANY point, you should file a complaint too. Once the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration receives enough complaints, they'll begin an investigation. If enough proof of faulty transmissions is found, then they'll either ask or force Toyota US to issue a recall.
Here's the website: http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/ivoq/index.cfm
I bought mine in Oakland, California in April 2003. At 65,300 miles, the transmission broke down due to bearing failure, preceded by the now-infamous grinding sound when in gear and letting off the gas.
Good news: dealer goodwilled all parts, which totaled roughly $2,000. Bad news: I paid for labor, which came to $2,300. From what I can tell, based on how many other people have posted here regarding the same problem, I paid $2,300 more than I should have. This is clearly a defect that Toyota is hoping to sweep under the rug, which is why I decided to add to the list of posts. Power in numbers.
Will I ever buy another Toyota? Only if I get compensated for what is clearly an unjust cost. As noted by others, every car manufacturer is entitled to its share of mistakes, but to not accept responsibility for them is completely unacceptable.
If Toyota follows through on its advertised promise of "Moving Forward", it will reimburse all costs to all Matrix owners. Short of this, I will forgo buying a Prius (my original intention) and buy Honda's soon-to-be released competitor hybrid.
Toyota: wake up.
6-speed. I've suspected something wrong with the clutch or transmission since I bought it (it had just enough miles on it to be considered "used"). It came with a "certified warranty." In other words I bought it from a dealer. I had a bunch of trouble with the dealer and stopped taking it there for service quite awhile back. I haven't had the problem officially diagnosed but am pretty sure that it's something with the clutch on it's last legs. Thanks for the info re: National Highway Traffic Safety Administration.
Another Toyota? Not likely.
The transmission was rebuilt and re-installed only to find that the 5th gear set sent by Toyota was defective and would need to be replaced. The second set of gears arrived and was installed. We were told that we could pick up our car. After a couple of days my husband drove the car and noticed that 4th and 5th gears were nearly the same. After much head scratching and a couple of calls to the repair-shop, it was discovered that Toyota had sent the 5th gear set from a 6 speed manual transmission not a 5 speed. Apparently the tech hadn't caught the lack of a difference in rpms during his test-drive. Back to the repair shop. It has been an exercise in patience.
We purchased this car because of our needs as parents for a safe, reliable, functional vehicle. Through combined research and experience my husband and I decided on this American Pontiac brand because of it's design and it's use of the time tested, well proven reliable Toyota engine and transmission. We chose a manual transmission because of fuel efficiency and again, the proven reliability of a Toyota 5-speed transmission. We felt secure purchasing this used automobile because of its low mileage, quality construction and proven drive-train, its clean Carfax report and because it's a smart, roomy car.
After the breakdown, we began researching the transmission failure and found that there are MANY complaints on various internet auto forums which mirror our failure. The transmission failure occurred in both the Pontiac Vibe and also it's sister car the Toyota Matrix at various points around 100k miles. The culprit each time is a failure in rear pinion shaft bearing, usually giving no warning before its failure usually damaging some of the gears as it spins apart.
As per advice from our NC State Attorneys office, we have filed a formal complaint with the NC State Highway Patrol and are gathering interested participants in an inquiry to have the many failures examined for possible future recall. We feel that there is a safety risk with the defective transmission bearing and consider ourselves lucky to have not been injured in the incident. We are seeking compensation for the 1927.00 incurred in repair expenses only and believe there is precedence for such a request. We are not seeking lost wages or pain and suffering or anything other than what's right and fair.
teresa blackburn :mad:
I was wondering if your transmission has actually failed twice.
When I ordered the EBC replacement rotors they do not appear to be the same are the 4WD rotors different than the 2WD version?
Now I must decide how to repair. How can I find the best deal on a used or rebuilt transmission? Is there a website that has good transmission deals? I am concerned about finding a good price but also one that comes with a good warranty as well. Any ideas?
thanks
http://www.taprecycling.com/inv-toyota/matrix.htm
If you can find a recent model car that was crashed, chances are very good that the transmission will be fine, and it's your cheapest price for sure. Of course, it's also not warrantied like a rebuild would be.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
The output bearing is going, at the 95,000 km mark I asked the dealer to check the noise in the transmission and the fluid level, they said nothing was wrong. Now at 130,000 km the noise is very very loud. I found this forum and starting asking the dealer questions, the parts guy admits there are alot of failures but the services guy act like they've never heard of it.
I'm in Fredericton, NB, Canada
Tried phoning around for used trannies but the yards say, yup very familiar with this problem, sorry all our vibe, corolla and matrix trannies are sold out.
The dealer wants 600$ for the parts alone and no returns on unused pieces.
I found one used tranny a distance away but its about the same milage as mine, no guarrantee the bearing has been done.
Anyone have the updated bearing number? Anyone have an aftermarket cross number?
I'm going to call the Toyota line this afternoon but I doubt I'll get anywhere.
Sure wish I had bought the 1999 Tacoma that was next to it for the same price, would have 20,000$ in hand to spend instead.
Can't believe Toyota won't admit there is a problem!
3 days after the service ($300 overall check of the vehicle) the engine seized-apparently the radiator drained instantly with no warning. "We've never seen anything like this happen before on a Matrix"
4 days after the engine was replaced the transmission seized-apparently this was related to the engine failure. "We never see transmissions go on these vehicles."
Replaced with a used transmission by the same dealership. "We'll put in a used one for you, as we never see problems with these transmissions."
6 months later I hear a strange grinding noise. Told that my transmission needs to be replaced. "Sorry the used transmission only had 3 month warranty, we can't help you out. We never see any problems with these transmissions though. Just bad luck I guess."
Have now battled it out with the dealership and Toyota Canada. Neither of which will admit to any problem or wrong-doing. Write it off to really bad luck I guess...it was such a good car until that fateful service. Very disappointing.
Last bit of advice from the dealership "Vehicles do not become more valuable as they get older, or increase in value as their mileage increases, the cost of maintenance starts to sky-rocket and reliability and safety decreases. The point is the longer you keep your vehicle, the more it will start to cost you due to wear and tear."
Thank you to Peace Arch Toyota in Vancouver, BC for the mind-blowing advice!
A recall must be started. To do this everyone must send an email or letter to the Ministry of Transportation. The link to his contact page is here - http://www.tc.gc.ca/minister/contact.htm.
Everyone also needs to send a link of this thread to Toyota Canada and their local dealership. Toyota prides itself on reliability and low maintenance costs - we for us it was a lie. They are tarnishing their image and word of mouth.
This is not a one off issue. This is Toyota have a known manufacturing issue and not being responsible for it.
Good luck everyone.