2015 BMW 4-Series Lease Questions

ash4421 · September 2014

edmundsfan8,

kyfdx and Michaell can answer best, but I just did the math out of curiosity to see if I'm doing it correctly and I get a payment of $620.73 pretax.

(50185 - 53975 * .61) / 36 + (50185 + 53975 * .61) * 0.0017

MF is marked up a lot.

zoepup · September 2014

Are the September lease rates out for a 435 xdrive? Thanks!

edmundsfan8 · September 2014

@ash4421 said:
edmundsfan8,

kyfdx and Michaell can answer best, but I just did the math out of curiosity to see if I'm doing it correctly and I get a payment of $620.73 pretax.

(50185 - 53975 * .61) / 36 + (50185 + 53975 * .61) * 0.0017

MF is marked up a lot.

Thanks for the response ash4421, glad I was close to the right path. Looking forward to hearing from kyfdx and Michaell about this deal.

robphanz · September 2014

Here is the information I received from the dealer:

MSRP: 56,425
Discount: 2,560
Sale Price: 53,865

MSDs: 5,250
Upfront Charges: 351.63
Monthly Payment is 733.69

Money Factor/rate .0012
Residual amount 33,855
12k miles

Due one Delivery 6,335.32

I feel like this is too high of a monthly payment. What do you guys think?

ash4421 · September 2014

Is it possible to haggle on special lease offers posted on BMW's website? Can or will dealers go below the special?

edmundsfan8 · September 2014

@kyfdx‌ @Michaell‌ could you share your expertise on the above posts when you have a moment please?

robphanz · September 2014

I realized that I posted in the wrong section. My post is actually for a 2014 435i xDrive

kyfdx · September 2014

@edmundsfan8 said:
Hi Guys,

Getting ready to lease my first car so please have patients with this newbie Based on reading the previous comments, I have asked for the following information from the dealer:

Model: 2015 428i M Sport/Tech/DriveAssist/Premium/19"Wheels/HK/Heated Front Seats

MSRP: 53,975

Invoice: (Price quoted): 50,185 (wheel locks, window tint included)

Money Factor: 0.00170

Residual: 61%

Duration/Miles: 3yr/10k

Drive Off: First Payment, License Fee, $150 Documentation

Acquisition Cost: 925

State: Washington

Questions:

Any more information I need to get from the dealer?

Based on previous comments, I think the Acquisition Cost and Money Factor are high. If so, what's a number that is reasonable to negotiate considering I am getting the car at a discount?

From previous posts, I see that I shouldn't put any money down, does this hold true and if so should I leverage MSDs instead?

What is the best way to calculate an estimated monthly payment with the numbers above, I got 701 with zero down including tax but I think that is low so I must be doing something wrong?

Any other feedback?

Thanks so much for your patience, guidance, and information.

.00129 MF and 63% residual, as of 9/03. $750 Innovation credit. I assume your quote was from last month's numbers. Your price is okay, but not with a marked-up money factor. Residual is better, this month, plus the $750 incentive, so that alone would give you a better deal.

I calculated around $620/mo. plus tax on your old numbers, but I didn't add the acquisition fee, as it wasn't clear if you were paying that upfront. With the new residual, base money factor, adding in $725 for acq.fee, but subtracting the $750 credit, I get a payment of $558/mo.+ tax.

kyfdx · September 2014

@zoepup said:
Are the September lease rates out for a 435 xdrive? Thanks!

.00129 MF and 60% residual for 36mo, 15K/yr. 2015 model. $750 Innovation credit.

kyfdx · September 2014

@robphanz said:
Here is the information I received from the dealer:

MSRP: 56,425
Discount: 2,560
Sale Price: 53,865

MSDs: 5,250
Upfront Charges: 351.63
Monthly Payment is 733.69

Money Factor/rate .0012
Residual amount 33,855
12k miles

Due one Delivery 6,335.32

I feel like this is too high of a monthly payment. What do you guys think?

Looks like they are marking up the money factor, before giving you the MSD MF discount..

kyfdx · September 2014

@ash4421 said:
Is it possible to haggle on special lease offers posted on BMW's website? Can or will dealers go below the special?

Most advertised lease offers leave some room for negotiation. The typical BMW dealer will try to mark up most of the numbers, so that getting the advertised deal will be difficult. It takes a lot of work to get a good lease deal.

robphanz · September 2014

Thanks for the input @kyfdx‌. I'll be sure to mention that to them.

robphanz · September 2014

@kyfdx‌ that's the money factor after applying the 49-BP reduction is what the dealer told me. Any thoughts?

kyfdx · September 2014

@robphanz said:
kyfdx‌ that's the money factor after applying the 49-BP reduction is what the dealer told me. Any thoughts?

The base MF is .00129.. If they are giving you .00120, then they are marking up the base MF to the maximum of .00169, then subtracting .00049 to get .00120.

The base MF minus the reduction is .00080.

it_guru · September 2014

What is the base MF and Residual for a 2015 435i xdrive Gran coupe for Sept. .0013 and 63% still? $750 options credit.

thanks

it_guru · September 2014

@it_guru said:
What is the base MF and Residual for a 2015 435i xdrive Gran coupe for Sept. .0013 and 63% still? $750 options credit.

thanks

Forgot to add 36/10k

Michaell · September 2014

@it_guru said:
What is the base MF and Residual for a 2015 435i xdrive Gran coupe for Sept. .0013 and 63% still? $750 options credit. 36/10

thanks

MF drops to .00129 this month, and RV stays is 63%. $750 in 'innovation credit' this month.

kball2 · September 2014

I am looking for the MF and residual % for a 2015 425i Gran Coupe. I am assuming the MF is .00129 and the residual is 63% for 10k. What is the residual % for 12k and 15k,

Thanks

obanhawy · September 2014

Are the September numbers out on a 428 xi coupe 36mo/12k. MSRP as built is 52,505. What discount should I be looking for off of MSRP, I also have a $1000 credit to use as I participated in the BMW u4gettable drive. Can this credit be applied in addition to the $750 innovations credit? @kyfdx

kyfdx · September 2014

@kball2 said:
I am looking for the MF and residual % for a 2015 425i Gran Coupe. I am assuming the MF is .00129 and the residual is 63% for 10k. What is the residual % for 12k and 15k,

Thanks

428i or 435i? Either way, your numbers are correct. Subtract 1% for 12K/yr or 3% for 15K/yr. $750 Innovation credit.

edmundsfan8 · September 2014

@kyfdx said:
I calculated around $620/mo. plus tax on your old numbers, but I didn't add the acquisition fee, as it wasn't clear if you were paying that upfront. With the new residual, base money factor, adding in $725 for acq.fee, but subtracting the $750 credit, I get a payment of $558/mo.+ tax.

Thank you so much @kyfdx‌ for such a detailed response. I will be paying the acquisition fee up front and it is $925 not $725, is that reasonable ? Any tips on negotiating the money factor down? Where do you get your money factor and residual from and what is a reasonable money factor that I should consider acceptable in your eyes when negotiating as .00017 to .000129 is a big mark up.

Also, do you suggest leveraging MSDs and can you explain a little more as to what I need to consider when leveraging those?

Michaell · September 2014

@edmundsfan8 said:
Thank you so much @kyfdx‌ for such a detailed response. I will be paying the acquisition fee up front and it is $925 not $725, is that reasonable ? Any tips on negotiating the money factor down? Where do you get your money factor and residual from and what is a reasonable money factor that I should consider acceptable in your eyes when negotiating as .00017 to .000129 is a big mark up.

>

Also, do you suggest leveraging MSDs and can you explain a little more as to what I need to consider when leveraging those?

The base acquisition fee from BMW is $725 - dealers will often mark it up to $925 for a bit of extra profit.

Be polite and firm and explain to the dealer that you won't sign a deal that includes a marked up MF.

Our numbers come from BMW.

Base MF is your target.

The MSD program allows you to 'buy down' the MF by providing cash up front in the amount of the monthly payment rounded up to the nearest $50. Each MSD reduces the MF by .0007 - a maximum of 7 are allowed, so your net MF would be .00080 (.00129 - .00049).

sanjuro1 · September 2014

Current MF and residual on a 2015 435i RWD Coupe 12k/36?

Michaell · September 2014

sanjuro1 said:
Current MF and residual on a 2015 435i RWD Coupe 12k/36?

.00129 and 62%. $750 innovation credit this month.

sanjuro1 · September 2014

Thanks!

Can you tell me what the August MF/Residuals/Incentives were on a 2015 435i Coupe 12k/36?

kyfdx · September 2014

sanjuro1 said:
Thanks!

Can you tell me what the August MF/Residuals/Incentives were on a 2015 435i Coupe 12k/36?

.00129 MF and 62% residual. $750 Innovation Credit.

Michaell · September 2014

sanjuro1 said:
Thanks!

Can you tell me what the August MF/Residuals/Incentives were on a 2015 435i Coupe 12k/36?

Did you really mean to ask for last months numbers? @kyfdx gave you the September numbers...

sanjuro1 · September 2014

Yes need August's numbers, that's when I ordered. Dealer said 59% residual and that doesn't seem right.

Michaell said:

sanjuro1 said:
Thanks!

Can you tell me what the August MF/Residuals/Incentives were on a 2015 435i Coupe 12k/36?
Did you really mean to ask for last months numbers? @kyfdx gave you the September numbers...

obanhawy · September 2014

2015 428xi coupe. MSRP 52,050 after 750 and bmw un4gettable drive credit the dealer is offering negotiated price 47,700 Mf 0.00129 residual 62% 725 acquisition fee. At this point monthly payment of $586 for 12k 36month lease. How does this sound?

kyfdx · September 2014

sanjuro1 said:
Thanks!

Can you tell me what the August MF/Residuals/Incentives were on a 2015 435i Coupe 12k/36?

August numbers

.00130 MF and 60% residual. No incentives.

Michaell · September 2014

obanhawy said:
2015 428xi coupe. MSRP 52,050 after 750 and bmw un4gettable drive credit the dealer is offering negotiated price 47,700 Mf 0.00129 residual 62% 725 acquisition fee. At this point monthly payment of $586 for 12k 36month lease. How does this sound?

I calculate a pre-tax payment of $531.75/mo using your numbers. What state is this - the tax obligation varies from state to state.

Base MF and a decent discount from sticker on a 2015 model.

obanhawy · September 2014

Michaell said:

2015 428xi coupe. MSRP 52,050 after 750 and bmw un4gettable drive credit the dealer is offering negotiated price 47,700 Mf 0.00129 residual 62% 725 acquisition fee. At this point monthly payment of $586 for 12k 36month lease. How does this sound?
I calculate a pre-tax payment of $531.75/mo using your numbers. What state is this - the tax obligation varies from state to state. Base MF and a decent discount from sticker on a 2015 model.

@Michaell‌I live in michigan. That should be the payment including tax or atleast that's what they told me. Also they spent a really long time trying to convince me to buy tire and wheel/tire insurance plan, saying the Run flat tires and wheels get damaged often. Any thoughts on that? Thank you

Michaell · September 2014

obanhawy said:

Michaell said:

2015 428xi coupe. MSRP 52,050 after 750 and bmw un4gettable drive credit the dealer is offering negotiated price 47,700 Mf 0.00129 residual 62% 725 acquisition fee. At this point monthly payment of $586 for 12k 36month lease. How does this sound?
I calculate a pre-tax payment of $531.75/mo using your numbers. What state is this - the tax obligation varies from state to state.

Base MF and a decent discount from sticker on a 2015 model.

@Michaell‌I live in michigan. That should be the payment including tax or atleast that's what they told me. Also they spent a really long time trying to convince me to buy tire and wheel/tire insurance plan, saying the Run flat tires and wheels get damaged often. Any thoughts on that? Thank you

Michigan only taxes the payment each month - to get to the $586/mo payment you were quoted by the dealer, the tax rate would have to be 10.25%.

The wheel and tire insurance plan is a good deal -- for the dealer. I know the roads in Michigan can be rough, but ... really?

obanhawy · September 2014

Michaell said:

Michaell said:

2015 428xi coupe. MSRP 52,050 after 750 and bmw un4gettable drive credit the dealer is offering negotiated price 47,700 Mf 0.00129 residual 62% 725 acquisition fee. At this point monthly payment of $586 for 12k 36month lease. How does this sound?
.

Michigan only taxes the payment each month - to get to the $586/mo payment you were quoted by the dealer, the tax rate would have to be 10.25%. The wheel and tire insurance plan is a good deal -- for the dealer. I know the roads in Michigan can be rough, but ... really?

@Michaell‌I just used the Edmunds lease calculator and it came up with the 586 number. Are you using a different calculator? Could the dealer be inflating the payment?

I figured about the wheel/tire insurance.

Michaell · September 2014

obanhawy said:

Michaell said:

Michaell said:

2015 428xi coupe. MSRP 52,050 after 750 and bmw un4gettable drive credit the dealer is offering negotiated price 47,700 Mf 0.00129 residual 62% 725 acquisition fee. At this point monthly payment of $586 for 12k 36month lease. How does this sound?
.

Michigan only taxes the payment each month - to get to the $586/mo payment you were quoted by the dealer, the tax rate would have to be 10.25%.

The wheel and tire insurance plan is a good deal -- for the dealer. I know the roads in Michigan can be rough, but ... really?

I just used the Edmunds lease calculator and it came up with the 586 number. Are you using a different calculator? Could the dealer be inflating the payment?

I figured about the wheel/tire insurance.

I've built my own lease calculator using a spreadsheet - the Edmunds calculator may be assuming certain costs are rolled into the lease, whereas I'm not.

If the numbers are as you state, there isn't anyplace for the dealer to inflate the number .. the only two variables in a lease are the selling price and the MF. They may be rolling in the up front costs (acquisition fee, etc.) that takes the payment up.

Get them to break down all their numbers.

obanhawy · September 2014

Michaell said:

Michaell said:

I just used the Edmunds lease calculator and it came up with the 586 number. Are you using a different calculator? Could the dealer be inflating the payment?

I figured about the wheel/tire insurance.
I've built my own lease calculator using a spreadsheet - the Edmunds calculator may be assuming certain costs are rolled into the lease, whereas I'm not. If the numbers are as you state, there isn't anyplace for the dealer to inflate the number .. the only two variables in a lease are the selling price and the MF. They may be rolling in the up front costs (acquisition fee, etc.) that takes the payment up. Get them to break down all their numbers.

@Michaell‌ here is the breakdown

MSRP 52,050

Selling Price 47,700

MF 0.00129

Residual 32,271

Aquisition fee 725 they say nothing else is rolled in and michigan tax is 6%

They were rolling the aquisition into the financed amount. Would you pay that upfront? Thanks again for your help

Michaell · September 2014

obanhawy said:

Michaell said:

obanhawy said:

Michaell said:

I just used the Edmunds lease calculator and it came up with the 586 number. Are you using a different calculator? Could the dealer be inflating the payment?

I figured about the wheel/tire insurance.

I've built my own lease calculator using a spreadsheet - the Edmunds calculator may be assuming certain costs are rolled into the lease, whereas I'm not.

If the numbers are as you state, there isn't anyplace for the dealer to inflate the number .. the only two variables in a lease are the selling price and the MF. They may be rolling in the up front costs (acquisition fee, etc.) that takes the payment up.

Get them to break down all their numbers.

@Michaell‌ here is the breakdown

MSRP 52,050

Selling Price 47,700

MF 0.00129

Residual 32,271

Aquisition fee 725 they say nothing else is rolled in and michigan tax is 6%

They were rolling the aquisition into the financed amount. Would you pay that upfront? Thanks again for your help

With your numbers, I get a pre-tax payment of $531.75/mo for 36 months - 6% tax takes the payment to $563.65. Adding in the acquisition fee increases the pre-tax payment by $20.14/mo.

Your call as to whether you pay that up front or not.

needatls · September 2014

All, Here are the details... Would like opinions...

2015 BMW 435i Gran Coupe:

MSRP: $58,650
12K Miles: 62% residual
$58,650 x 62% residual = $36,363
MF: .00129 (and they didn't want to give it to me at first.... unreal)
Tax: 4.05% (tax is on total sales price of car)
Negotiated price: $53,500

Paying up front: $925 Acq fee + $499 Doc Fee... nothing else down

Totals Monthly lease: $659 (Disposition fee of $349 rolled in) I calculated it at $651, but the only thing I can figure as to why it came out higher is that the disposition fee kicked it up to $659... $349/ 36 months = $9.70... I'm sure MF applies to this fee since I'm rolling in, so maybe it's an extra $3 ($9.70+$3 = $12.70 +$651 = ~$664)... still doesn't add up exactly, but I might be over thinking it...

I'll do Multiple SD's - Net MF would be .0008 (.00129 - .00049) for $4,900. Total savings of $43/ month or $1,548 over 36 months.

New total payment would be: $616

Factory order for the car was placed last night. Left $1K deposit which I'll use towards acquisition. Lease won't actually be finalized until they take delivery of the car (6-10 weeks from now), but these are how the numbers came out after we negotiated on sales price.

Can anything else be squeezed out of the deal?

Thanks in advance for reviewing this!

kyfdx · September 2014

Looks okay... but, disposition fees aren't paid upfront. They are paid at lease end, if you turn the car back in. There is no process for paying the fee in advance (or rolling it into the lease), because it isn't charged until lease disposition.

obanhawy · September 2014

Order placed. Thank you mods for all the help. The advice made the process much easier. I'll be back in 3 years!

cgibson2 · September 2014

Are the 428 convertible rates the same as the coupe? Thanks so much!

Michaell · September 2014

chrisgibson1 said:
Are the 428 convertible rates the same as the coupe? Thanks so much!

Convertible numbers are the same as the coupe for 2015 model year.

needatls · September 2014

Thanks for the advice on disposition.

[Deleted User] · September 2014

My ED purchase is going through in the next few days and wanted to make sure on the numbers. What is the mf and residual for September for 2015 428i convertible for 12k/36?

Michaell · September 2014

ravi13 said:
My ED purchase is going through in the next few days and wanted to make sure on the numbers. What is the mf and residual for September for 2015 428i convertible for 12k/36?

.00129 MF and 62%. $750 innovations credit, though I admit I don't know if that compatible with ED.

[Deleted User] · September 2014

Michaell said:

ravi13 said:
My ED purchase is going through in the next few days and wanted to make sure on the numbers. What is the mf and residual for September for 2015 428i convertible for 12k/36?
.00129 MF and 62%. $750 innovations credit, though I admit I don't know if that compatible with ED.

Thanks for the numbers. I was able to confirm with my advisor that the $750 credit can be applied to ED.

kyfdx · September 2014

ravi13 said:

Michaell said:

ravi13 said:
My ED purchase is going through in the next few days and wanted to make sure on the numbers. What is the mf and residual for September for 2015 428i convertible for 12k/36?
.00129 MF and 62%. $750 innovations credit, though I admit I don't know if that compatible with ED.

Thanks for the numbers. I was able to confirm with my advisor that the $750 credit can be applied to ED.

ED money factors are .00030 higher than standard.

edmundsfan8 · September 2014

Thank you @kyfdx‌ and @Michaell‌ for helping me with my first ever lease! My brand new 4 series was ordered yesterday

. I appreciate you both empowering me with such great information and I will be recommending all my friends to Edmunds forums in the future! Thanks again.

SoCal_Bimmer · September 2014

How is this:
2015 428i M-Sport Estoril Blue, Tech, Driver Assist, M Brakes, Black Grill
12k/36month
San Diego
MSRP: $50,300.00
Negotiated: $45,300.00
MF: 0.00129
Residual: 62%
Drive off: First month +$550 title/reg/doc fee
Acq fee: $925
Monthly payment: $515w/o tax, $556.00/tax

Just wondering if I should jump on it as they are trying to hit a month end quota.. Do you know what the MF and residual will be in October?

kyfdx · September 2014

alecks18 said:
How is this:
2015 428i M-Sport Estoril Blue, Tech, Driver Assist, M Brakes, Black Grill
12k/36month
San Diego
MSRP: $50,300.00
Negotiated: $45,300.00
MF: 0.00129
Residual: 62%
Drive off: First month +$550 title/reg/doc fee
Acq fee: $925
Monthly payment: $515w/o tax, $556.00/tax

Just wondering if I should jump on it as they are trying to hit a month end quota.. Do you know what the MF and residual will be in October?

I've heard that the 4-Series numbers will be the same for October... no guarantees, though.

2015 BMW 4-Series Lease Questions

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