Suzuki Grand Vitara vs Subaru Forester vs Hyundai Santa Fe vs Jeep Liberty vs Ford Escape vs Saturn

tidester · September 2002

IMO, it defies reason to drive off with a cup of hot coffee on your lap. Oh, well.

juice: Was that for real re: the cruise control lawsuit and payment?? wow!

tidester
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p0926 · September 2002

Glodencouple1- While your point regarding big corporations balancing profits with potential law suit losses is a good one, the McDonalds instance is a poor example since "the nice older woman" knew full well that the cup of coffee had the potential to scald her yet chose to balance it in her lap anyway. Had the drive-up window attendant accidentally spilled it on her then I'd say she had a case, but since it was her own stupidity that caused her to be scalded, I think the jury was flat out wrong. And speaking of juries, hasn't it been proven that juries almost always award higher amounts than judges do? Personal injury lawyers know this and appeal to the sympathies of a jury against big bad corporation in getting those "punitive" judgements. Unfortunately, in most cases, those multi-million judgements are passed on to Joe Consumer in the way of higher prices.

-Frank P.

tincup47 · September 2002

might tend to not put safety above all else...

http://www.auto.com/industry/buyer18_20020718.htm

Personally, I feel most companies go out of there way to develop safe products, unfortunately it is impossible to totally "idiot-proof" everything.

mtngal · September 2002

I can see, though, why price and low interest rates would score higher than safety concerns. A safe car is no good to me if I can't afford it. And for long distance commuters, a well placed cup holder is safer. The Taco has very inconvenient cup holders and a couple of times I haven't been able to find it with the cup when something unexpected happens (I know, I probably shouldn't be drinking anyway).

I think most people think that structurally most vehicles are pretty much the same, so it isn't the safety they are as interested in as other things. And if the idiots I saw passing multiple cars on a 2 lane road with difficult visibility yesterday are any indication, they don't care about their safety or the safety of anyone else. It looked like one of them managed to pull back into his lane only about 10 feet in front of the oncoming car (who had moved over onto the shoulder as much as he could).

goldencouple1 · September 2002

I'd like to see the citation on the Winnebago case. I'd like to read it.

Re: coffee. The point might have been that the coffee could have been rendered more safe with a lower temperature, while maintaining its appeal. And that McDonalds had shown a disregard for safety, choosing to injure people and settle, rather than take a safety measure other similarly situated companies had taken.

Re: juries. The Defendants have good attorneys too. There is a right to jury participation. The jury system gives the public a voice in how these situations go. If there is a problem with jury awards, it is the public at large that can remedy the situation.

If manufacturers and insurance companies had greater regard for safety and the sanctity of contracts, there'd be fewer claims and frivilous claims could be better contained.

Yes there are ravenous lawyers looking for a big score. No argument. But it takes clients, juries, injuries, negligent manufacturers or service providers, and a supporting body of law to the lawsuits possible. And most are valid claims.

Further, blaming attorneys for an ill that is basic to American culture is just one more time that people do not take responsibility for their actions. Without America being America, in all its complexity, the lawyers that try to trump up false claims could never succeed, and they would not try, as economic forces would discourage it.

tidester · September 2002

There is a right to jury participation.

Doesn't that apply only to criminal cases? I believe the McDonald's case (and the others mentioned here) are civil cases.

Any lawyers here?

tidester
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ateixeira · September 2002

tincup: well placed cup holders may BE a safety feature to some consumers! LOL

I do agree that safety isn't any good if I can't afford it.

-juice

stever · September 2002

There's some links out there about the McDonalds coffee case. Basically MickyDee's kept its coffee at some crazy temp (180F?) and knew people were getting hurt from it spilling. I think McD's got everything they deserved, even if the judge, iirc, lowered the amount the jury awarded.

Funny how people love to jump on the lawyers, but never their clients, the juries, the judges. Guess we're all so easily manipulated by lawyers and led down the garden path by our noses.

(don't mind me - I just read John Grisham's book about jury nullification last month or so ago, so I'm an expert ).

Steve
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clever1 · September 2002

Here's a link to the McDonalds case:

http://www.lectlaw.com/files/cur78.htm

While the plaintiff, Stella Liebeck, legitimately suffered and was relatively paid her due, the story of this case inspired The 'Stella' Award for the most frivolous lawsuit in the U.S. Look that up on any search engine and you will find the Winnebago story and many other amusements, although it's hard to say what's urban legend and what's not without further research.

Otherwise, juries tend to favor whichever side they can empathize with on a personal level, certainly not just the facts. That's one of myriad reasons so many cases against monolithic corporations settle out of court without establishing precedent, and an obvious driving force in the vicious cycle.

4wdisfun · September 2002

I'm buying a car for my wife. Our budget is close enough to buy a Forester, Escape, Santa Fe or Liberty. She'll use it 90% of time in the city. IS forester the best option?. We've never owned a Subaru before, but AWD and security (excellent crash ratings) seems to give the subie an edge over the pack. Am I correct?
Thx

clever1 · September 2002

4wdisfun: You're probably going to get a lot of conflicting feedback about that question. One important factor has to do with that 10% of time your wife's not driving in the city. Will she go into rough terrain? Does she want/need to tow anything? Do you have another vehicle that takes care of the heavier duty 4x4 stuff, or will this be it? Does she prefer the feel or appearance of any particular one?

Generally, I think the Forester is an excellent choice for good mileage, adequate pep, easy urban parking, excellent full-time AWD, etc.; but the others each have their definite advantages and no terrible deficiencies. Be sure to also check the other boards about these vehicles to help your decision.

mtngal · September 2002

And the answer to me is, it depends. There are many on this board who disagree with me totally on this. And further, I don't own any of these, but am pretty sure I'm going to buy a Subaru when the time comes next spring. I would probably go with the Forester in your case, mainly because it gets better gas mileage, and you don't indicate a need for the additional power/capabilities that you might pick up with any of the others. In my case, I like the Forester, my other half prefers the Outback, and we could easily compromise on a WRX. Bottom line: any of them would be fine - which one does she like best?

bess · September 2002

All are good vehicles. Which one does she feel the most comfortable in or like the look of most?
I'll go ahead and stir the pot..

If you want to off road 4x4ing: Liberty
If you want great acceleration,performance: Escape
If you want great MPG's: Forrester
The Sante-Fe doesn't really have anything that makes it stand out. It has a rather 'unique' styling, but no more or less so than the Liberty or the Forrester..

Personally, I (or really my wife) drives an Escape. We never go off road, it gets a quite acceptable 21+ mpgs for us, has a great look to it and is a blast to drive..

In addition to the vehicle itself, how good are the dealer services (both in the sales and maintenance departments) for the different brands in your area?

If I were forced to rank them..
Escape, Sante-Fe, Liberty, Forrester.. My rank isn't completely based on how the vehicle 'looks', but it just has a look that doesn't appeal to me at all, coupled with its higher price and mediocre performance put it last. I also didn't like the lower seating position.

The Liberty is a small step up in performance (not handling). It is rugged (and has more of an SUV look to it) but you pay for this off road ability with a much firmer ride than most others in this class. I'm not a fan of the spare on the rear tailgate. I don't have any off-roading needs that you cant do with common sense and a front wheel drive car with decent ground clearance. (gotta have the bottom of the vehicle above the snow).

The Sante-Fe doesn't have the acceleration that the Jeep has, but makes up for this with a comfortable ride, great price for the options you get, and decent interior.. I didn't like the exterior look of the Sante-Fe, and the Hyundai dealerships in my area have questionable reputations.

The Escape was the best for what mattered most to me. Great acceleration, excellent handling, comfortable ride and seating position, excellent exterior look, good value, reliability and dealer service.

Everyone has different priorities and tastes. All of these are great vehicles. No matter which you choose, you won't be disappointed..

goldencouple1 · September 2002

Criminal trial via constitution. Civil trial via law in a particular jurisdiction.

If lawyers did not exist, certain persons would fulfill the role, and...lawyers would exist. Lawyers fight bullies, and are generally well compensated for it. And they are unpopular. And they suffer tremendous stress. They are responsible for their clients' welfare, morally, ethically, and legally; and the vast majority take that responsibility very seriously and end up losing sleep over it. Without lawyers willing to face an unsympathetic public and espouse unpopular causes, many if not most of your rights would not exist now. It is not out of the goodness of the hearts of large US businesses and the US government that civil rights are enforced or that you are protected from tainted food, unsafe working conditions, poorly manufactured products, or pollution, or a host of other hazards and infringements of privileges and rights granted by law, or God, or whatever. It may not always be convenient that people can behave as if they live in a relatively free country -- not if you have to pay some price for it. But when it is your rights or health that is on the line, and the majority of people would you prefer that you suffer in silence, take your loss, and disappear, then it is pretty good to have someone that will take up your cause.

bess · September 2002

I too like the WRX..Currently we are a 2 truck family (Escape and SuperDuty), but if were to pick car, the WRX would be at the top of my list..

bess · September 2002

There are as many different types of lawyers and law practices out there to match the diversity of the clients they serve.. So I try to not over generalize all lawyers or law practices when making statements.

There are many individuals out there who's only interest is making a buck (or several thousand), when there was no wrong done. These individuals seek out a lawyer to pursue their cause, and it is the lawyers responsibility to help their client. My problem here is with the individual that approached the lawyer..

Then there are folks who are on the fence. They know there was no wrong done, and have no plans on getting a lawyer involved. UNTIL some lawyer looking to make a buck (or several thousand) and gives incentive for the individual to pursue the case (by offering that the customer can only make money, and not lose). My problem here is with the lawyers that do this, and the clients they represent.

There are other types of individuals out there that want to blame everyone else and not take responsibility for their actions.

Summary: I'm glad there are lawyers there to take up our causes. But often the 'cause' being pursued was created by the lawyer and not the individual.

Lawyers can't stop law suit abuse, but there are alot of lawyers out there encouraging it rather than discouraging it.

Sortof like the media which today does more 'creating the news' rather than just 'reporting the news'.

And now back to our originally scheduled program.

tidester · September 2002

Frankly, I'm all for it! I oppose limitations on what "awards" can be made as it represents undeserved and dangerous protection of corporations. I also oppose corporate campaign contributions but then that takes me way too far off topic! :-)

tidester
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diploid · September 2002

If you thought the McD's coffee case was stupid, I think it was last month where some guy was trying to sue the fast food chains that made him fat and suffered heart attacks. Apparently he thinks that fast food, like cigarettes, should have warning labels on them. *rolls eyes*

stever · September 2002

Must of worked, since McDonalds appears to be changing their french fry oil :-).

Anyone else want to weigh in with some opinions for 4wdisfun?

Steve
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tidester · September 2002

Apparently he thinks that fast food, like cigarettes, should have warning labels on them. *rolls eyes*

Speaking of which, I think all paper clips should carry warning labels admonishing the user from thrusting them into their eyeballs! :-)

tidester
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zmeenow · September 2002

GOT MY 2002 ES-VS TRIBUTE LOADED WITH THE TOWING PACKAGE.. PAID $400 ABOVE INVOICE(DEALER CHARGED ME INVOICE PRICE FOR TOW PACKAGE) NO RATTLES,NO STALLING..NO SMELL OF GAS.QUICK PICKUP FROM 0-60 ,AS WELL AS PASSING.TIGHT CORNERING,GREAT STEREO.VERY COMFORTABLE AND FUN CAR TO DRIVE. AS TO DEFECTS..I HAVE A C240 BENZ(2001) THAT CONSTANTLY HAS NAGGING PROBLEMS THAT REQUIRE DEALER ATTENTION. THERE IS NO PERFECTION WHERE ASSEMBLY LINES ARE CONCERNED.. NO MATTER WHAT LANGUAGE IS SPOKEN AT THE FACTORY
ENJOY YOUR NEW CARS... NO MATTER WHICH YOU GET!

p0926 · September 2002

4wdisfun- Bess made some good points. However, since he owns one, he clearly has an Escape bias. So here's my 2 cents (along with my Forester bias):

The Liberty is by far the best choice if you plan on doing any serious off-roading. It has striking looks and is arguably to most SUVish of the bunch. It also gets the worst MPG, has a stiffer ride and will be the most tippy in turns.

The Santa Fe probably offers the most features for the price and is an excellent all-around vehicle. Its negatives include questionable looks and long term reliability as well as a weak V-6 engine. However, looks are subjective and the Santa Fe's reliability thus far has been excellent and may continue to be so.

The Escape/Tribute twins also offer good value. Since Bess has already expounded on their positive attributes I won't repeat them here. However, I have to disagree with his inclusion of reliability as a positive attribute. These vehicles were plagued by several recalls when they were initially introduced and while Ford seems to have corrected most of the initial problems, their long term reliability is estimated to be average at best.

The Forester has the best handling, gas mileage, safety ratings and predicted reliability. Its 0-60 times are second only to the V-6 Escape and even then it is only a fraction of a second slower. Some people don't like the Forester because it has a relatively lower seating position and looks more like a wagon than a SUV. However, these are pluses when it comes to handling. The Forester also is a poor choice if you plan on towing much. Finally, the Forester's base prices are higher than most but then it generally comes with more standard equipment.

In summation, each of these vehicles is a good choice depending on what your needs are. In most cases it usually comes down to personal preference. Test drive each and then decide which you like the best. Good luck and let us know what you decide.

-Frank P.

baggs32 · September 2002

"The Forester also is a poor choice if you plan on towing much."

That goes for carrying heavier loads in the cargo area and/or on the roof too. The Escape/Tribute and Liberty easily win out there.

That's one of the main reasons we went with the Escape. Our frequent Home Depot/Lowe's trips almost always result in bringing something very heavy home, and the way home has a lot of hills to climb.

mtngal · September 2002

about this group that influenced me. I want a manual tranny. Subaru offers lots of luxury with a manual - the Escape/Tribute and Santa Fe only offer MT with 4 cyl. engines and very basic cars. The Liberty now offers a MT with the 6 and more comfort.

An interesting figure - I computed how much it would cost for gas for 2 vehicles - one running on premium and getting around 27 mpg (like the WRX) and another that got 20 mpg running on regular (most of this group, and includes the Wrangler). I assumed a 20 cent difference in cost (seems to be the normal difference around here) and the higher gas mileage vehicle came out cheaper. I didn't figure the mpg where they would be the same, but that did tilt me closer to the WRX (though I still would like the Forester).

p0926 · September 2002

Baggs32- Sorry but the Escape's max payload is only 978 lbs while the Forester's is 950 lbs IIRC. The Liberty's is somewhat higher at 1150 lbs.

-Frank P.

paisan · September 2002

I just picked up a '92 SVX which requires premium, but I get 28mpg on the highway with it, so that more than makes up for the price I pay for premium IIRC.

-mike

baggs32 · September 2002

"Baggs32- Sorry but the Escape's max payload is only 978 lbs while the Forester's is 950 lbs IIRC."

978 is more than 950 which is what I said. That's just how much the floor and suspension can hold. Factor pulling the stuff around (up and down hills or not) and the Escape does not get winded as easily. However, the manual transmission offered in the Forester can help in that area.

p0926 · September 2002

Baggs32- 3% more to be exact, not much of a difference. I agree however, that the Escape's larger displacement V-6 means that it probably won't get winded as easily.

-Frank P.

ateixeira · September 2002

It'll actually depend on the model and the source you use. The payload on my particular Forester model is 1020 pounds, which beats that Escape easily.

If you want to pick on a model's payload, choose the RAV4, which at 760 pounds cannot even carry 4 football players, never mind their cargo.

But "mediocre" performance? I beg to differ. 0-60 times even with an automatic are right around 9 seconds (Washington Post, Motorweek), so the Escape is only maybe 5% quicker, yet it consumes about 25% more fuel.

I think the 4 cylinder Escape, Santa Fe, and Liberty might be called mediocre, but the lighter Forester still manages to be at least adequate, if not better.

Let's look at what matters to 4WDisfun, since he was the one asking. All of these fall within his price range. Only high-end Libertys would be excluded.

90% city driving, are the other 10% on the highway? I wouldn't assume he meant off road, in fact I seriously doubt it. Forester has EPA city mileage in the 20s, none of the V6s here can match that, and only the Escape V6 is quicker.

He mentioned AWD, and I would give the nod to the full time systems of the Forester and Santa Fe. The Vue and Escape and primarily FWD, with part-time AWD for slippery surfaces only.

Only the Forester and CR-V are "Best Picks" according to IIHS. Escape fall flat on its face in this test. Sante Fe still does OK.

So Forester is a well rounded choice, with no significant shortcoming. If you want more power, a turbo will arrive in less than a year, and tests from other markets have it clocked in the 6 second range to 60mph (!), which will make the Escape V6 seem, well, mediocre.

-juice

scape2 · September 2002

There is really not much difference between the Forester and its sibling the Legacy wagon.

I can vouch for the Escape/Trib reliability. I have an an Escape with over 16,000 miles and not one problem. There are now 2 other web sites out on the net. I cannot link you because its agains Edmunds policy. One site has over 4,300 Escape/Tribute members. A poll was done to see how many have had this "stalling" issue along with any other terrible problems that would cause them to trade or use the lemon law. LESS than 1% had any of these problems! Another site has about 300 people who had responded to review there vehicles. With just a quick scan I counted about 13 people!@ This constant bashing that the Escape/Trib are unreliable doesn't pan out if you do your research.
If you need power to pass, pull, haul, or tow with the performance, ride and handling of a car the Escape/Tribute is the best rounded SUV on the market.

paisan · September 2002

The Forester is built on a different platform than the Legacy.

As for "16K miles of reliable service" Come talk to us when you 160K of reliable service on it.

-mike

speterson1 · September 2002

No single owner can vouch for the reliability of ANY model of car (well, maybe a taxi driver who's driven different vehicles of the same model for 30 years or something like that). The only true test is time. That's wonderful that you have 16K trouble-free miles on your Escape, just like I have 20K trouble-free miles on my Forester, but that's just two vehicles out of thousands on the road, statistically insignificant.

We'll only really know the reliability after waiting. I for one am curious to see how well Santa Fe's hold up over the long haul - if they don't Hyundai's 10-year warranties may be coming back to bite them bad!

oregonboy · September 2002

Funny that Scape, (who is the Escape's greatest advocate), brought up "this stalling' issue along with any other terrible problems", when NO ONE else had even mentioned stalling.

Why so defensive?

-james

ateixeira · September 2002

Forester is made in Gunma, Japan, and based on the World Rally-bred Impreza chassis. Legacy is made in the US on a bigger platform (shared with the Outback and Baja).

I own both a Forester and a Legacy, and they are actually quite different. You probably have not driven both if you are even saying that, in fact I bet you haven't.

The Forester has a shorter wheelbase and feels more nimble, lighter on its feet. It is lighter, so it's quicker off the line, has lots more ground clearance. I've taken it on the beach and through the Pine Barrens, and done things I would never even consider trying in our Legacy.

-juice

jaserb · September 2002

Check it out:

http://www.snopes.com/autos/techno/cruise.htm

Snopes is a great site for debunking urban legends.

Although I must say my grandpa wasn't much better than that when he had his motorhome. It was a rare road trip that didn't include an extended stay at a body shop. Now he drives a minivan, which makes him slightly less lethal.

-Jason

suvshopper4 · September 2002

Did they upgrade the cupholders in the Forester?

-ss4 (one of 4 football players)

p0926 · September 2002

suvshopper4- Yes they improved the cupholders for 03. They got rid of the flimsy ones on the dash and added two more conventional ones in the center console.

-Frank P.

ateixeira · September 2002

Yep, now they are molded into the center console behind the shifter.

They still won't hold a Big Gulp, though. ;-)

The Washington Post had an article about that McD's new cooking oil, BTW.

-juice

zmeenow · September 2002

does the average american car owner keep their car for 160,000 miles? I dont think so...!at 12-15,000 per yr.. thats nearly 10 yrs... now really comon... is your last car 10 yrs old???????????????????

stever · September 2002

Yeah, had a '89 Voyager that was almost exactly 10 (~90k) when we traded it. Second car was a 17 year old Tercel (~117k) that got left behind when we moved 4 years ago (still haven't replaced it yet).

Gonna try for 150k on the '99 Quest, but only 1/2 way there.

Steve
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odie6l · September 2002

Hey I had a 1980 ford Fairmont with 495,000 miles on it when I traded in on a 1986 T-bird in 1992. (all 495,000 were put on by my family, the car was my parents, then my cousins which he used to drive from philly to knoxville for 5 yrs, then mine.)

Plus my father had a 1974 F-100 custom that he had until he traded on a 1993 F-150 Lariat.

I'm planning on keeping my Escape until at least 8-10 yrs. My wife is the one who will have the sports car in the family (which I will drive too, LOL)

Odie

zmeenow · September 2002

you mean to tell me.... you took a car with 495,000 miles on it to trade in???? hahahah worth in the neighborhood of oh,,$1.37.. i think you would have been better selling it privately... and get $5.00...oh i know... there are dealerships that will pay $250.00 for anything you can drive,push..or tow onto their lot...
chuckling here

bess · September 2002

My previous vehicle before I wanted a larger truck was my 89' Ranger. I gave it to my dad after 11 years and 200k miles on it.. It's still running great with only one significant problem (clutch) at 210k miles, and currently has around 220k miles on it.

odie6l · September 2002

I got $1200 trade in on it because it was in great shape. I only paid $1000 to my cousin for it. So I made a profit..lol.

Odie

bess · September 2002

I understand. If a manual transmission is a requirement, the Escape is a bit slower and I would expect the Forrester would seem rather peppy compared to the 2.0L Escape.

P0926 brings up good points and provided good balance to the universe.. All of the vehicles on the list stated for this little discussion(Escape, Forrester, Sante-Fe, Liberty) have just average reliability.. btw, average reliability is still very good, but Honda and Toyota generally have a slight statistical advantage in most publications.

azeal · September 2002

The Subaru Forester is actually rated a good deal higher in reliability than the Escape, and Sante Fe, at least by Consumer Reports (I am not aware of anyone else doing any systematic review of vehicle reliability).

They have consistently rated it as "above average" in previous models (and the 2003 is more of an evolutionary than revolutionary change--same engine, transmission, drive train, etc...) Consumer reports predicted "much better than average reliability" for the CR-V, the class leader in this regard.

Consumer reports lists the Liberty as too new to have adaquate data for, but other recent Jeep models have not faired well in this department. The Sante Fe was listed as "just below average" in first year reliability, and for the Escape "reliability was poor" in it's first model year.
These are all quotes from the Consumer Reports web site (www.consumerreports.org, but you need to be a member to view the vehicle profiles). Again, I'm not aware of any other source doing a systematic review of vehicle reliability.

mtngal · September 2002

I hope that I get at least 160,000 miles on my vehicles. I have 106,000 miles on my '98 off-roader and winter daily driver. Our other daily driver is not yet 2 years old (got it end of Sep. 2000) and it has over 80,000 miles on it. Since I can't dump it until April at least, it will have well over 100,000 miles on it (unless we have a bad winter).

I would probably still happily own our '88 Nissan hardbody but once we moved to the mountains we started to go through auto trannys (2 in a year) so I sadly sold it with only 290,000 miles on it (and replaced it with that Taco I so dislike).

zmeenow · September 2002

I think the edmunds long term test of the tribute is somewhere around 30,000 miles... no problems with reliability.. as to the quality control problems the 1st model yr for the escape tribute.. they seem to have been taken care of..
as i had mentioned... my benz c240 has ongoing nagging problems...and as I go to the dealer to have it taken care of.. it seems that many owners have some problem or another...

azeal · September 2002

Not to belabor the point, but Edmunds long term test is a test of 1 single vehicle (the one they own). The Consumer Reports profiles are based on surveys of many different owners of a type of vehicle. Whether it is Edmunds or my brother-in-law, a single vehicle's record can't be used to judge the overall reliability of a particular model line. A survey of 100 different people who all own the same make and model can (at least in theory).

The down side to the Consumer reports info is that there is a one year lag (info on 2002 reliablility will not be out until 2003). So if you are shopping current year models of vehicles like the Sante Fe and Escape, you are stuck judging their 2002 models based on the data for the 2001's.

For vehicles like the CR-V and Forester, which were redisigned for 2002/3, you get projections based on previous models.

I like Consumer Reports because, despite what some critics... *cough* Suzuki, Isuzu, Mitsubish *cough*... say, they seem to be pretty unbiased. They gave the Escape pretty good marks in their initial reviews. Things started to go south after the recalls, and after the first year survey of Escape owners. Their reviews may not be totally accurate, but it is the best source out there that I know of. Hopefully the 2002 results will be better for the Escape. It will also be interested to see if the new CR-V's hold up as well as the previous generation, especially since half of the US models are now manufactured at a brand new plant in England.

paisan · September 2002

Funny that you mention Isuzu in there. Isuzu only has an issue with their testing methods, not their reliablity. As much as CR hates Isuzu, the Trooper is rated #2 behind the 4-runner in it's class of SUVs for reliability.

-mike

Suzuki Grand Vitara vs Subaru Forester vs Hyundai Santa Fe vs Jeep Liberty vs Ford Escape vs Saturn

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