Mercedes-Benz M-class (ML320, ML350, ML500 and ML55) 2005 and earlier

ml430s40 · August 2001

To all who replied to my flatspotting, thank you. I did increase my tire pressure from 27 psi (delivery) to 30 psi; it seems to help.

Does anyone notice a slight shaking at speeds of 60 or more. It was bad at delivery therefore I had the tires balanced and frontend aligned by the dealer. Although it is noticably better, I am not satisfied that the tires are fully balanced. I am ready to have a third party do it again. Could it be that the dealers balancing machine may not handle such large wheel & tire combo?. I heard that some tire stores have much better balancing machines to handle horizontal and vertical oscillations. I have not had the luxury of driving another stock ML to compare. My old Yukon with Michelins never shook at high speeds.

jferris1 · August 2001

You should have absolutely no vibration or shaking at any speed. The spec for tire pressure on my 99ML320 calls for 32 pounds all around.

Regards,

Jeff

camarena · August 2001

Hi!
I am considering buying an ML 320 but I don't want to get the third row seats immediately. I also want to get the base ML 320 without any of the packages (M1 luxury, M2 convenience or M7 third row seats).

Is it possible to add the seats later? The dealer told me I had to have the M1 with the M2 in order to get the M7, but I don't trust them since the seats are removable.

Does anyone know?

Regards,

B

califjohn · August 2001

I read your index re: the goo that forms from the U.S. gas station's failing to change their tank filters. Sounds plausable at first, but why isn't this effecting other make's in tank fuel pumps? My Tahoe, Audi, and Acura have in tank pumps and have never experienced this problem, yet my neighbor has replaced two fuel pumps in his ML320. I have no doubt that MB has found problems with U.S. fuel, but other cars seem to run fine including other MB's, it only seems as if the ML series has this chronic problem.

gpvs · August 2001

I think M7 requires the sunroof only, AFAIK. If you look back several posts, I'm not sure whether you can add that later. If you get your vehicle with it, it'll come with the cargo windows tilting and then the second row seat (right side i think) tumbles over for ease of access to third row. I think if you just add those, you don't get the other stuff or you can but it'll be more expensive. I think most ML arrive with M1, sunroof and bose stereo, but I'm sure you can special order one with just the base model. But with the current rebates they have, why not take advantage and just get one with the options you like?

rexconde1 · August 2001

What are people using to lubricate the moonroof?

When I open the moonroof, it vibrates. I thinkg that there is too much friction. Has anyone had this? I was thinking of using some JD MP-grease. Any better ideas?

R

kenyee · August 2001

califjohn:
You're not in the right forums for the other makes. Check out the A6 forum on audiworld. :-)

jwomac · August 2001

I recently took my 2000 ML320 in for a B service. I complained about the moonroof shuddering when it opens. None of my attempts to lubricate it did much good. The dealership replaced the motor, cables, and tracks under warranty. It took them a couple of days just for that job. They also mentioned finding fault codes on the fuel pump and replaced that too (although I hadn't experienced any problems with it). They replaced my flaky radio head unit for the second time with an "updated" version, redyed a portion of the drivers seat where the color seemed to be coming off and replaced a brake pedal switch which they said was responsible for my traction control and ESP warning lights (and system failure). I saw the invoice for the work and it totaled nearly $2700. The work took 5 days, but they gave me a reasonably-nice C230 to drive. All is well for now. I don't know if there is a known problem with the moonroof, but they were quick to jump all over it given that it was such a minor issue. Good luck.

mercara · August 2001

For those of you who are looking to add third row seats, here's my advice. If you haven't bought an ML yet and need the third row seating buy the car with this option. My 99 ML320 didn't have this option. About 6 months ago I emailed Ray Catena in Edison NJ and asked them the price of the seats. They quoted 800 plus tax for the seats + 3 to 4 hours labor. I should have done it then. Anyway I procrastinated and this summer, I have been having a lot of friends and family visit me and we had to go around it two cars.

I decided to get the seats installed. I called Mercedez Benz of Manhattan to get a quote and they said they don't install the seats anymore. So I called Ray Catena again and they quoted $1500 for the seats plus 4 hours of labor. Big mistake to not have done it earlier. Anyway I went ahead and had them istalled, cause I plan on keeping the car for a while. The package doesn't include any changes to the middle(Second)row seats. So getting to the back seat is not exactly easy. But once you get settled it is not a bad place to be in. If you are 6' and above forget about getting comfortable in the third row seats. It is good for kids and people with a smaller frame.

My ML320 has about 41,000 miles on it. It will run out of warranty soon. I am planning to get a third party warranty from www.warrantygold.com. I will keep you informed on how good they are.
I have been averaging about 20 miles per gallon, under various driving conditions. I think it is pretty darn good for an engine with this size and power. Compare it to the Discoveries 4.0 liter engine which hardly has 200 hp, gives such [non-permissible content removed] milage. Will some body from Landrover explain to my why you should have a 4.0 Litre V8 engine and such poor HP?

Cheers.

kenyee · August 2001

mercara:
Thanks for inquiring about our HP to liter ratio.
We rate our HP is so low because the oil spraying out past the pistons is needed to lubricate the fan and transmission.
-- Land Rover design person :-)

It's just a really old engine design...

cassiri · August 2001

I have a black ml430 and have had my share of a/c troubles. It turns out that the fuse for the a/c radiator fan (separate from the engine fan) keeps blowing. According to the service mgr., the system occasionally sends a spike through the system whent he fan kicks on and blows the fuse. Their solution is to put a higher amp fuse (40 vs. 30) in to keep it from happening. When it blows, you will notice that stop and go traffic prevents the a/c from ever getting very cold. At highway speeds you can't tell a difference though.

bob259 · August 2001

Does the radiator fan ever run after you turn your car off? We have had high 80 degree to mid 90's here lately and I haven't experienced any A/C problems with my MY00 ML320, nor have I noticed the fans running and the temp is in the normal range, maybe slightly higher in stop and go traffic and long pulls..

Although with my wifes Volvo XC her radiator fans almost always are running when we get home and turn the car off. Is that why our ML's have the circulator running to avoid that big drain on the battery from the radiator fans?

Should I be checking my fuses?

kenyee · August 2001

Which dealer is this who told you to upgrade the fuse size?
And is this an official MB tech bulletin recommendation or something this dealer does?
We've been talking about this for a while on the m-class mailing list. A shop foreman on it says he would not increase the fuse size in case the fan locks up and pulls more than 30A.

blehrlich · August 2001

Can someone educated (Drew?) please help me regarding the MB 4matic system vs. the Audi Quattro system. I know this isn't necessarily the right board, but the dealers have me confused.
Thanks.

sshowitt · August 2001

go to (www.geocities.com/mercfilms/index.html)
Lizzi'e Hampton 500 funny game see how many club goers you can take out

drew_ · August 2001

Unfortunately, the only realistic option for MY2000+ customers is to order the 3rd row seats from the factory. They are not available as a package like they were for the MY1998 and MY1999 MLs. The factory option also comes with an easy to use tilt and tumble passenger side rear seat (in addition to the power pop-out quarter windows), which really significantly improves accessibility to the 3rd row. Pre-'00 models all had a similar seat, so it wasn't as big of an issue.

drew_ · August 2001

If you're referring to the twin fans, in front then yes, mine always turn off when the vehicle is off. They seem to turn on usually when the A/C is turned on only.

The coolant pump (located upper left of the engine block) continues on for 5 minutes after engine shutoff so that the aluminum block is allowed optimal cooling, and no hot spots. The added benefit of this is that the heater warms up extremely quickly after engine startup.

drew_ · August 2001

Funny, I had the brake switch replaced as well, because of the ESP/BAS light illuminating once. I continued to drive as normal though, and as far as I could tell, ESP was still functional.

drew_ · August 2001

MB's 4-matic system consists of a centre differential with planetary gears (high and low gears for the ML since it has low range as well). The system splits power 48/52 fore and aft for the ML, and 38/62 for the 4-matic cars. The RWD bias is for a more traditional RWD MB feel. The system has 3 open differentials, and traction management is done via brake and throttle electronic traction control. This system is effective in most conditions, as well as light; about the weight of one average size adult male for the 4-matic cars, but over 200 lbs for the ML because of the extra low range gearing.

The Audi Torsen-based Quattro system is also a permanent AWD system that consists of three Torsen differentials. Since Torsens are mechanical gears, they react almost instantaneously to slippage, making them highly effective and responsive. Normal torque split ratio is 50/50 The penalty of this system is that it is heavy, complex, and expensive. Recently, Audi has developed a Haldex clutch based Quattro system. This can be found on the Audi TT, as well as the European-only Audi A3 and VW Golf 4-motion. This system is also effective (but not as good as Torsen)and uses multiplate wet clutches to transfer power fore and aft, but is more of a reactive system, with less than 20% of the power to the rear wheels with no slippage. The benefit of the system is that it is lighter than the Torsen based system, and less expensive. Volvo also uses a Haldex clutch based AWD system.

I would have to say that IMHO, MBz's system has an advantage because it uses a durable planetary gear(s) in the differential and is permanent/proactive to slippage, in addition to being light. Audi's Torsen-based Quattro is also highly effective, but heavy. Since it is also more complex, potential repair costs could be a lot higher.

Drew
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proteus456 · August 2001

I had heard earlier that pricing for the 2002 ML320 was to be released Aug 1. Has this not happened yet? if not, when is the official "launch date"

lemongrass · August 2001

Is it aesthetically pleasing or in bad taste?

drew_ · August 2001

IIRC, that was someone's speculation (regarding the date). No pricing info so far. Once it's out, you can be assured that this is the place to stayed tuned to for info.

drew_ · August 2001

IMHO, it depends on the colour of the vehicle, and whether you have any exterior chrome accessories. I've never found the mixing and matching of chrome and gold to be attractive.

Drew
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cavman2x · August 2001

This AC in my 01 ML320 stinks. It is hot in NJ, 100 today and the AC just can't keep up. We have it on cold-recirc, and fan 4 (loud)and the passenger area is not comfortable. My wife who drives it everday told me it never seems to get comfortable. I don't know wy she waited so long to tell me, but she is right. We got rid of a mini-van and that thing got comfortable in a few minutes. I will test it tomorrow with an infra-red temp. tester, cabin and vents. Will also call dealer tomorrow am. Has anyone had any fixes that were done besides a blown fuse because that is OK. Thanks Gary

dave01 · August 2001

After putting it off for a good while, we're going to buy an SUV very soon. An ML320 is most likely to be it. Despite never having bought a new car, I'm leaning that way now--the depreciation curve is so flat on the MLs.

This is the not-a-minivan replacement for the ol' Volvo wagon, so it MUST have M7/3rd seat. Like M1 and heated seats; don't care about Bose, and pretty flexible on color. Is this a likely combination to find in th '01s, or should I wait for the '02s? While we're ready to go, we can milk the wagon a little while longer. What's base $$ on the '02s? I saw the options somewhere and it wasn't a huge increase. Are people getting '01s at/below invoice?

Can the passenger airbag be disabled when smaller-than-adult folks sit there? Long story, but it's sometimes necessary.

We're in the No. VA/suburban DC area. There's a lot of MLs around, but also buyers who can (more easily?) afford them. Is it worth going well out of town to find a deal, or is it pretty much dependent on the momentary inventory of a particular dealer, wherever they are?

Sorry for all the questions, and thanks for any help! Hope to join the owner's board soon!

drew_ · August 2001

The '01 MLs can be had at about invoice right now, or perhaps even a bit less. The '02 MLs will likely be at MSRP only. The '02's MSRP has not yet been released, but you can expect a $500-$1000 (if not more) increase over the '01's MSRP.

If you want the M7 package, I strongly suggest that you head down to your dealership ASAP since they are not the easiest to find and time is of the essence. Most US-spec MLs come with the Bose option.

No, the front passenger side airbag cannot be disabled unless you have a MB Babysmart child seat; I think a Babysmart booster seat may be available too, but i'm not 100% certain. The '01 ML has dual threshold/dual stage front airbags though, which will only deploy when absolutely necessary, and at reduced power for lower speeds. Anyone under the age of 12 should be in the rear seats.

Hope this helps!

Drew
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mark156 · August 2001

#4126----Lemongrass. Personally, I can't stand the gold package on any car. It never looks right to me. It just doesn't accent the car like chrome can. My .02 worth. Mark

bob259 · August 2001

Lemongrass: I put the gold package on my white/java ML and I think it looks great. The gold really is accented on the black grill. I had saw one in Phoenix and liked it so much ordered the kit while I was there.

However, I agree with what Drew stated, it really depends on the color of the vehicle and your other accents. If I had the stainless push bar/steps it wouldn't have looked right.

I've had numerous compliments on the vehicle, including the dealership.

Off to Phoenix again today then Sacramento, CA for 3 weeks I hate to think of how far behind I'll be on the forum by the time I return.

cassiri · August 2001

Kenyee,

My "wonderful" dealer in Austin, Tx recommended the fuse increase to 40amp. I too think that is a suspect fix. I'm not engineer but I know putting the wrong amp fuse in is a potential fire hazard or at the very least, equip damage. I have not been happy with this dealer at all but they're the only game in town. Just about enough to make me give up on Mercedes.

As for general cooling, we've been at or above 100 for the month of July and August and my a/c seems fine (fuse intact). It does take a while to cool off the cabin after sitting in the sun, but it is a big vehicle with dash only vents. Tinted front windows definitely help too.

rover96 · August 2001

Fuse is design to blow before damage equipment. You dont want too much current flo thru the rated components.
As for A/C, put the air recirulate on (a must for cooling fast), cuz u dont want to bring the outside hot air into the cabin. I leave the dial at 6 ot 7 o'clock position. Hardly ever have to put the fan speed at 2. Hope this will help

rexconde1 · August 2001

I would think that this is a dealer fix too. Make sure you have it in writing that THEY did the work. If something does happen you have it in writing that it was their doing and not yours.

R

lamken · August 2001

I had my front seat vinyl cover replaced under warranty but I have to yell and swear at the local rep to get it done and it is already crack again after 3 month. The material is obviously inferior. I'll probably just leave it cause I don't want them to have my trucks for days to repace it since i'm sure it'll crack again. I'll just buy a seat cover or ignore it.

sequoiasaurus · August 2001

Does anyone know if the SmartKey will be available in the 2002 model?

bfeng · August 2001

Dear cavman,

We have a 1999 ML320, and 2 days ago when it hit 99 in our part of town,
the ML air conditioning had no problems keeping the interior cool. Surely,
the 2nd row seat will be warmer since there are no 2nd row airvents (a real
problem with the kids in the back).
Up front where I sit, AC+Recir with fan on speed #2 was sufficient to maintain
a very cool interior. When getting into the car after it's been parked, we
switch it to speed #3 or #4 for a few minutes. I'm not sure why your
ML AC works so poorly, but you might have your dealer look into it.

John Feng

lemongrass · August 2001

Should I be concerned about MB battery, i.e., fluid level, etc.? I read somewhere about adding distilled water into the battery, how can I tell if my battery needs fluid? Thanks in advance.

f888l888 · August 2001

Long time no post. Seems you are doing great.

After 13 months, I finally got the odo over 8,000 miles on my lx 470 (including a north to south border trip). Well, I plan to go to Canadian Rocky this fall, so that will help rev up miles.

I recall you gave information about oil sucker-such as tempo oil boy. Do you know anything out there that can hold at least 7 quarts? (Since the car is sitting there most of the time, I may want to replace the oil, but not the filter, in the interim)

I am also considering replacing my MB sedan with a two-seater. Sure, SL 2003 looks great, but with a penalty of $85+k. Maybe a nissan Z350, rumored only $30k+, is fine. Comments appreciated. Thanks.

tomhock · August 2001

Regarding posting 4140;... the battery that came in my '98 ML-320 was not a maintenance free battery as I thought it was. When I checked the water level it was down over 20oz, or just to the plate level. I suspect the dealer did not check the battery during the A or B service. You must remove the Hold-Down strap to uncover one of the six cell caps. Add distiled water to cover the plates and bring the level to within about 1/2 inch of the opening. Don't trust your dealer to do this unless you can confirm. Allowing the electrolyte to fall below the plates will lead to early battery failure.

roger23 · August 2001

I have read that the 2002 ML sport package will be redesigned, with more aggressive body cladding and new ultra thin 5 spoke wheels. Does anyone know where I can see a photo? I am really curious, as I have ordered the sport package on my 2002 ML500.

drew_ · August 2001

I haven't seen any mention of a different sport package for '02. The '02 ML55 also looks pretty much the same (the slight bumper redesign is consistent all across the M-class lineup) so I doubt that the Sport Package will be different. Personally, I wouldn't even bother since the main reason to get the Sport package was to get the bumper foglamps. Now that the other MLs will have this, the only reason would be to get the AMG rear bumper and the fender flares.

drew_ · August 2001

Very nice to see a long timer posting again!

Boatus.com sells a 21.5 gallon top sider pump for only $35, so that may be what you want. Definitely more than enough capacity with plenty of room to spare. Here's the link:

http://www.boatus-store.com/mc_online/Browse.asp?showitem=16467

The new SL-class is stunning, but the price is very hard for me to swallow too ;-). Have you considered the new MB C230K coupe? The high level of MB overal safety, a good amount of power, sporty handling, great room for for 4, and even available with a 6 speed manual tranny,but yet a base price of only about $25K! Have you also considered the CLK-class and SLK-class?

f888l888 · August 2001

Drew

Thanks for the topside information. I will get one soon.

I was thinking about a pure 2 seater car. So, I was not really giving thought about 2+2 coupe. Since I have already owned a people as well as cargo hauler, I'd like to get a toy car. And I intend this will be my last purchase of car for this life. I was looking at Audi TT which looks like a toy, but it offered no manuauto ( I know some people prefer stick) or at least auto. The Z 350 looks promising in paper, looks like a toy but comes with decent engine with auto. The SL is most technology sophisticated, a roadster and a coupe in one, active body, etc., etc. Anyway, the decision will not be made until sometime in early 2003.(This time I will have the final say about the matter.) Regards,

biker5 · August 2001

i think the correct capacity of the regular topsider is only 2 1/2 gl. not 21.5 gl or thats what you mean...I went to the site and it say 21.5 that gonna be a big can.

blackjava · August 2001

Well, sorry to say that I sold my ML320 to a used car outfit yesterday. Although I was very impressed with the vehicle overall and with the service department, it left me stranded 4 times with continued fuel pump problems. In my state, the Lemon Law still would not apply so that was not worth pursuing. However, on a good note I thought I'd let you all know that the resale value was pretty good.

After 20 months of ownership, the price I received from a dealer(!) was $9140 less than I originally paid for it, which works out to $457 per month. Not bad for a luxury SUV. I had advertised in the paper (less than a week) hoping to sell it myself but the offer from the dealer seemed good enough to avoid the trouble. BTW, mine was in outstanding condition.

As it worked out, on a potential trade-in the dealers were offering me $3k less. So I ended up selling it outright to another dealer and then making a separate transaction on a new vehicle with a different dealer.

I'd still recommend an ML320 to somebody interested in buying a new SUV, or maybe the new Acura.

This message board is great ... so long!

spamaway007@aol.com

drew_ · August 2001

ML320 Base Model Price: $36,300.
ML500 Base Model Price: $44,950.
ML55 Base Model Price: $65,900.

Although the above is unconfirmed, you can expect the '02 models to sell at, or very close to MSRP.

wmquan · August 2001

Nice, and impressive ... $500 increase in base of an ML320 isn't much at all considering the addition of base items like side curtains, front/rear fully automatic climate control, tilt reversing mirror, etc. A lot of folks would pay $500 just to get the side curtains, so there really isn't an increase in my book. Competition doesn't hurt, either.

I'd assume that the 2002's will command MSRP for a while, but after a few or several months there'd be some discounting, though there's only about a $3k spread between invoice and MSRP. 2001 prices seemed to drop fairly quickly though some of that was the anticipation of the 2002.

michml320 · August 2001

Drew,
Do you have a reliable source for your info? Thanks for that. Still no word on delivery! Waiting is the hardest part!

sequoiasaurus · August 2001

Thanks Drew! Do you believe your source is reliable? I hope so.

Last I saw 8/13/01 was the target release date but as we all know that may get pushed back due to high volumes of 01's left.

jbuhac · August 2001

Hi, I haven't been following the forum for the past year, so sorry if this is a well covered topic. My 2000 ML430 with 34k miles failed to start in a NYC garage on the Friday. Had to rent a car to get home, 150 miles away, and will have to take the train back of Tuesday to pick it up. The roadside assistance guy suggested it is probably a fuel pump and there are a lot of problems with these. Seems to me a sad state of affairs in a $48K vehicle. Any ideas, and any tips on reimbursement for all my expenses from MB. Are they supposed to bring the vehicle back to me? Should I get a Land Cruiser next time ?

drew_ · August 2001

Even the E-class can have fuel pump issues, and that vehicle is even more expensive than the ML. Part of the reason is our high sulphur levels in our gasoline, courtesy of the petroleum companies.

Earlier built '00 MLs did have one of the older fuel pumps that could have problems. You may be interested in this message. Your ML probably could've been started if you had given the tank or the pump area a couple of whacks.
drew_ Aug 4, 2001 2:43pm

Your warranty does cover trip interruption for both alternative transportation, and hotel accomodations. I believe what you do is give your receipts to the service manager at your dealership and they'll be refunded back to you (though not immediately).

drew_ · August 2001

Sorry, I have no idea if the source is reliable or not. It's a 50/50 chance at this point. I'm just passing along info :-). If I do get confirmation, I'll let everyone know as always.

Stay tuned...

Mercedes-Benz M-class (ML320, ML350, ML500 and ML55) 2005 and earlier

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