I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today!

stickguy · June 2016

I'm sure some of those beasts become sculptures pretty quickly. I would want a driveable engine/exhaust set up, just want to fix the problem areas (turning and stopping!). That won't hurt anything, as long as you don't put in a go cart stiff suspension.

Mr_Shiftright · June 2016

No kidding. Coil overs and thicker sway bars and poly bushings and you're driving around in a cocktail shaker.

fintail · June 2016

Was driving by the Bentley dealer, and a Maybach 57 sitting on the used car section magnetically drew me in to look. 2004, pretty wacky car and it meets my rarity requirements, but at a silly 90K the price would need to be cut by well over half for me to ever consider it. Maintenance is going to be just as bad as a V12 W220.

Also saw a pristine 2nd gen Scirocco 16V, older guy driving it - not many left like that. Nothing else caught my eye, hot here, many old cars original to the area lack AC, so they might not be out.

Mr_Shiftright · June 2016

I think *basic* maintenance for the 10K, 20K, 30K, and 40K services are about $2500 combined, so not too bad. Of course, this does not include any repairs or damage, which I would imagine are extremely brutal. I'd guess brakes and rotors around $3000 (going by an S600/V-12). I think you need a special lift to even service the car, so you know the dealer is going to want to recoup that investment.

I dunno...maybe $250 a month to keep a Maybach on the road with maintenance and normal expendables?

Probably far worse is the catastrophic depreciation.

sda · June 2016

ab348 said:
Took the '68 Cutlass out today for its first extended drive of the year. The annual shakedown cruise is always a bit of a nervous time after it has been laid up for 6 months but as always, everything was fine. The only issue was that about halfway through I realized I had not installed this years registration sticker (which came back in December) nor did I have the registration certificate in the car as both were still on my desk. I was nervously looking for police cars as I made my way back home.

The amazing thing for me, especially now that I have the ATS with its connected-to-the-road manner, is how vague the old car is. It has plenty of power and even though it has drum brakes they work OK for the way I drive it, but the steering and handling is close to theoretical compared to the Cadillac. You turn the wheel to take a curve on the expressway and you wonder if it is actually ever going to respond. Same way when you are in traffic at speed and want to maneuver away from someone in an adjacent lane. You really have to be careful.

As usual, got lots of waves, looks, and nice comments from passersby. Encountered a dark greenish-blue '71 or '72 Chevelle SS, nice-looking car but with an obnoxiously loud exhaust, twice in about a half-hour.

Your Cutlass is a real looker, man that is nice! I like the fact that you have a passenger door mirror, those were not that common in '68.

sda · June 2016

Yesterday I saw a really clean mid-late '40s Pontiac 2 door fastback coupe. It was somewhat of a charcoal gray-blue color and looked to be moving along effortlessly about 50 mph and the driver enjoying every moment.

roadburner · June 2016

ab348 said:
Took the '68 Cutlass out today for its first extended drive of the year. The annual shakedown cruise is always a bit of a nervous time after it has been laid up for 6 months but as always, everything was fine. The only issue was that about halfway through I realized I had not installed this years registration sticker (which came back in December) nor did I have the registration certificate in the car as both were still on my desk. I was nervously looking for police cars as I made my way back home.

The amazing thing for me, especially now that I have the ATS with its connected-to-the-road manner, is how vague the old car is. It has plenty of power and even though it has drum brakes they work OK for the way I drive it, but the steering and handling is close to theoretical compared to the Cadillac. You turn the wheel to take a curve on the expressway and you wonder if it is actually ever going to respond. Same way when you are in traffic at speed and want to maneuver away from someone in an adjacent lane. You really have to be careful.

As usual, got lots of waves, looks, and nice comments from passersby. Encountered a dark greenish-blue '71 or '72 Chevelle SS, nice-looking car but with an obnoxiously loud exhaust, twice in about a half-hour.

Nice! I always wanted a 1969 W31, or a 1970 Rallye 350.

ab348 · June 2016

sda said:

Your Cutlass is a real looker, man that is nice! I like the fact that you have a passenger door mirror, those were not that common in '68.

Picked it up NOS, new in the box, at a local swap meet maybe 15 years ago. It even came with a paper template for drilling the holes in the door. It really is there more for the looks than function, since it is flat glass and not convex like todays are. It is fairly useless for actually seeing anything. That's probably why they were fairly uncommon.

fintail · June 2016

Wow, for some reason, I thought I remembered your car as being kind of a beige gold color. Yours has to really stand out in a crowd. In an area like that where rust is a normal fact of life, I bet it really turns some heads. Sharp.

I wonder when dual mirrors became normal (even if optional, just ordered on most cars), maybe around 1980?

ab348 said:
Took the '68 Cutlass out today for its first extended drive of the year.

fintail · June 2016

I was thinking running costs like a V12 S65, with its specialized brakes and other components. I would be most worried about sensors, engine management electronics, and the beloved airmatic/ABC system.

They depreciated a lot, but have a high floor, just like a Rolls-Royce, where even the most boring malaise Shadow is still worth 10K even if imperfect. I think a reasonably immaculate 04 S600 might be worth 15K today, and when new cost about a third of the Maybach. If they had equal depreciation, that would put the Maybach around 45K, not the 80K they want for it. However, I am pretty sure the real value of the car isn't 80K.

Mr_Shiftright said:
I think *basic* maintenance for the 10K, 20K, 30K, and 40K services are about $2500 combined, so not too bad. Of course, this does not include any repairs or damage, which I would imagine are extremely brutal. I'd guess brakes and rotors around $3000 (going by an S600/V-12). I think you need a special lift to even service the car, so you know the dealer is going to want to recoup that investment.

I dunno...maybe $250 a month to keep a Maybach on the road with maintenance and normal expendables?

Probably far worse is the catastrophic depreciation.

Mr_Shiftright · June 2016

It's a downward spirals for cars like this. The people who can afford them don't want an old used one, and the people who want an old used one can't afford them. So they fall into the hands of wannabees, and punish each successive owner with repairs and headaches, or they get quickly flipped by curbstoners who can't wait to off load them, and thus to another round of abuse by owners ill-equipped to deal with them.

fintail · June 2016

Just gotta find one from a brand-loyal preservationist who maintains the car. They exist, just not common. Every now and then I see an immaculate Silver Spur or similar, and know that it wasn't an easy ride getting it here.

Mr_Shiftright · June 2016

I couldn't even imagine wasting my time on a car like that. It's not even a good, or interesting, or rare, or commendable RR.

fintail · June 2016

Some people do it, as mint cars exist.

I know of a guy who has a very early (1967) Shadow. He bought it from a long term owner who had the suspension and brakes overhauled before he bought it. It has apparently had few faults in his ownership. That's the kind to get,

Mr_Shiftright · June 2016

He's probably lying

Those are pretty awful cars. Or, maybe he doesn't drive it--that should keep it trouble free.

fintail · June 2016

He drives it maybe a little less than I drive the fintail, but he keeps the fluids circulated. I have seen it run and drive, it's a nice old car. I can't imagine working on that hydraulic system though, I think I will stick to an old MB.

Mr_Shiftright · June 2016

Don't go near an old RR, unless you want to pay $6000 for a brake job.

fintail · June 2016

The old Corniche cabrios are kind of appealing in an 80s chic way. But the money would probably be better spent on an AMG SEC.

Mr_Shiftright · June 2016

I like those old Corniches a lot.

fintail · June 2016

10/10 would drive:

Every blue moon or so I will see one on the road. Another car with a very high depreciation floor.

Mr_Shiftright · June 2016

See those hubcaps? $1200.

fintail · June 2016

I think the cars themselves, in clean condition, are still worth 45-50K or so. Probably won't get cheaper, as they have been stable around there for some time.

Mr_Shiftright · June 2016

You mean the Corniche DHCs from the early 80s? Yeah, that's about right. The really super clean ones may stabilize, but anything with needs will continue to decline I think.

fintail · June 2016

Yes, the cabrios. The coupes are older, and although pretty, don't have the convertible attraction (and have always brought a lot less). Most I have seen have been really clean, people take care of these. I don't imagine nice ones ever going below 40K, especially in this speculative age.

Mr_Shiftright · June 2016

I dunno. It's all about supply and demand. Once all the aged buyers for these cars pass on, I'm not sure the young 'uns will take on the expense and hassle of owning one. You can buy some very tasty convertibles for $40,000 that would be far more pleasant to own. Keep in mind, these old RRs are pretty awful cars in terms of reliability, as charming as they might be. So the conundrum is, either look at it and don't drive it, or drive it and pay through the nose for the privilege.

fintail · June 2016

IMO, they were never really meant to be driven. I'd wager well over 99% of all Corniche cabrios ever made have under 100K miles on them, and the model dates back over 45 years. That mileage isn't just because of running costs or reliability, but because the owner didn't need to drive it a long distance. They are ornaments. Relatively few were made, so the demand doesn't have to be huge. I think as long as there is a demographic who remembers what was chic in the 80s, the prices will remain high.

uplanderguy · June 2016

andre, is this you??!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Pontiac-Catalina-convertible-/272265026534?forcerrptr=true&hash=item3f64429be6:g:-z4AAOSwzJ5XVInj&item=272265026534

stickguy · June 2016

you know Andre only buys, but never sells!

ab348 · June 2016

That's a nice car, but I wish it didn't have a black interior, since it is a convertible.

sda · June 2016

uplanderguy said:
andre, is this you??!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Pontiac-Catalina-convertible-/272265026534?forcerrptr=true&hash=item3f64429be6:g:-z4AAOSwzJ5XVInj&item=272265026534

Looks nice and a convertible is great in the Keys. Only thing, no a/c, it gets hot there! I spent the summer of '67 in Big Pine Key. Dad was managing the build of a bridge that went from Big Pine to No Name Key (deer reserve). Seems like yesterday yet was almost 50 years ago, good grief!

imidazol97 · June 2016

uplanderguy said:
andre, is this you??!

Nice down to the wheels even.

Mr_Shiftright · June 2016

fintail said:
IMO, they were never really meant to be driven. I'd wager well over 99% of all Corniche cabrios ever made have under 100K miles on them, and the model dates back over 45 years. That mileage isn't just because of running costs or reliability, but because the owner didn't need to drive it a long distance. They are ornaments. Relatively few were made, so the demand doesn't have to be huge. I think as long as there is a demographic who remembers what was chic in the 80s, the prices will remain high.

I honestly don't think one could make it to 100,000 miles without some catastrophe.

andre1969 · June 2016

ab348 said:
That's a nice car, but I wish it didn't have a black interior, since it is a convertible.

My '67 has a black interior like that one, and yep, it can get pretty hot! Once you're moving, it's not bad, but if the car is just sitting around, such as in a parking lot or at a car show, it gets hot.

imidazol97 · June 2016

I visit lots of car shows and cruise ins through the summer. A
pet peeve is the hoods up and trunks up making it difficult to get good looking pictures. Sunday at a
GM only show at a Hamilton Buick dealer a rain squall went through. The show handlers asked everyone to close their trunks and hoods and come into the building for safety.

Hoods down!!! I waited for the rain squall to quit. Ran out and got good pictures of about half the cars that I had liked with hoods and trunks down. Other cars had left ahead of the rain.

My favorite is this. The color is off--it's a light yellow that has a green tone in it

The perfect GTO

kyfdx · June 2016

Lincoln Mark LT for sale, down the road from me.. hmmmmm

explorerx4 · June 2016

@kyfdx,
Look around a little more to see if you can find a Blackwood.

fintail · June 2016

That's a nice old Caddy convertible.

I wonder what the overhaul schedule is for an old RR hydraulic system - every 40-50K miles or so?

Mr_Shiftright · June 2016

I think it depends on use---the lower the miles, the worse it is on those.

The transmissions are GM I think (in a RR case) so that should be okay. The engine is an outdated V-8 with all kinds of problems.

Best thing to do with one of these is just to sit in it and make vroom-vroom noises. The interiors are lovely to just inhale.

stickguy · June 2016

or, do this to it.

stickguy · June 2016

that is from junkyard empire. Will eliminate the hydraulic issues, if you eliminate the hydraulics entirely.

tjc78 · June 2016

That is what I was thinking. Just stuff some big old American V8 in it. (Chevy 454, or a worked Ford 460 with a C6 tranny).

stickguy · June 2016

a good start. put on a normal suspension and brakes. and figure out a way to put electrics for windows, seats, etc.

Or drop the body/interior on top of an F150 frame!

fintail · June 2016

If you're going to go that far, might as well go all the way:

Quite a lot of this kind of thing out there.

Mr_Shiftright · June 2016

you can blame the British Army. They made armored cars out of them for desert warfare.

fintail · June 2016

Good place to avoid rust.

imidazol97 · June 2016

Saw a Maverick, 1970 or so, rolling on interstate. Perfect condition. Tires normal size but wider tread than usual mounted on deep rims with a 3-prong spinner recessed. Color: Grabber Green. It rode slightly high so I
suspect it has a different suspension and a different engine. Just like the old days.

http://www.maverickcolor.com/chips/70ford.jpg

ab348 · June 2016

Some of those Ford color names are still funny:

Anti-establish Mint
Counter Revolutionary Red
History Onyx
Young Turquoise
Freudian Gilt
Good Clean Fawn
Thanks Vermillion
There She Blue
Home on the Orange
Bring 'em Back Olive
Last Stand Custard
Hulla Blue
Three Putt Green

imidazol97 · June 2016

ab348 said:
Some of those Ford color names are still funny:

Anti-establish Mint
Counter Revolutionary Red
History Onyx
Young Turquoise
Freudian Gilt
Good Clean Fawn
Thanks Vermillion
There She Blue
Home on the Orange
Bring 'em Back Olive
Last Stand Custard
Hulla Blue
Three Putt Green

Sign of the times?

uplanderguy · June 2016

I remember dragging my Dad down to Maverick introduction night, spring of '69.

In hindsight, I think Mavericks were not nearly as nice as the concurrent Novas and Dart/Valiant models.

ab348 · June 2016

uplanderguy said:
I remember dragging my Dad down to Maverick introduction night, spring of '69.

In hindsight, I think Mavericks were not nearly as nice as the concurrent Novas and Dart/Valiant models.

Ha! I did the same thing.

I remember being struck by how cheap the base model interiors looked with the plaid upholstery and little chrome outside. The ones in the showroom with the optional decor groups that had better seats and trim were nicer. But overall I remember being underwhelmed. They sold like crazy though. I suspect because of the low low price and not so much because they were any kind of great car.

I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today!

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