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VW Golf vs Honda Civic



  • I have all the details for the Civic SE hatch in front of me, but as for the others, I can get them within a few days!! (Might have latched myself a job at one of the local dealerships!!)

    The only real differences between the Civic DX and the Civic SE is:

    -Standard CD Player
    -14" Alloy Wheels
    -Body colored rear spoiler, mirrors, handles, side mouldings, licence garnish
    -"Civic Special" Rear badge (replaces the normal DX or CX)

    and it costs about 500 less!

    Up here in Canada, all I've ever been able to find at any dealership is the Civic Hatch CX, DX, and SE, but today I came across a Type R!! Does anyone know about their availablity up here, or even in the states?
  • only1harryonly1harry Posts: 1,137
    They don't export it in the US!! I wish I could buy the Civic Type-R!! It has 185hp and the Integra Type-R suspension, brakes & gearbox!
    It's limited production but will probably be around $5K more than an SE hbk.
    That's the car I was waiting for in '98 & '99 but they never brought it to the US so I got a '99 Integra GSR (170hp). Oh well..
  • quack56kquack56k Posts: 3
    I'm thinking that that one type R that I came across was imported in, cause it wasn't at the dealership for sale!! That's why I'm wondering about it's availablity up here! But ahh....wishfull thinking!
  • shiner2shiner2 Posts: 1
    Howdy Folks,

    This is the first time I've read your group comments and I had a question, or more of a dilemma down here in Texas.

    I've got a 95 Civic CX with 71.5K miles and I'm trying top sell it. Edmunds is giving me a market price of ~ $7500. Is this correct? After looking at other Civic prices (4 door DX,LX,EX)in the classifieds this seems awfully high.

    Another question, I have a dent in the front quarter panel. How much do you usually take off for this? This is the 1st time I've sold a car and I'm not sure what to ask for.

    I wanted to thank you guys for reminding me how fun the Civic is to drive. I just bought a new 99 Isuzu Amigo for $6,500 under MSRP with a convertible soft top(great in central TX). I got the deal of the century but now I am forced to sell my loyal, hard working, great running little Civic CX. I already miss the little guy... I guess I'll give him a spin around the block!
  • isellhondasisellhondas Issaquah WashingtonPosts: 17,881
    Are you gone....? O.K.....

    Shiner, instead of looking at Edmunds pricing, go to your local bank. Ask them which book is used in your part of the world. It's probably NADA but it could be Kelly Blue Book.

    You'll find wholesale and retail pricing. you might ask somewhere in between. Be sure to take the deduct if it's a five speed or has no air cond.

    I can't see your dent, but it might be a 300.00 dent or a 2000.00 dent. Have a body shop give you an estimate so you can show that to a prospective buyer.


    No bank or dealership uses Edmunds pricing. I've found these numbers to be all over the board. Sometimes way too high, other times way too low.

    Use the guide that is used in your neck of the woods.
  • only1harryonly1harry Posts: 1,137
    Having a friend who is a dealer and buys and sells used cars, and having brought people to him to buy used cars (I make a few bucks too..) I have a pretty good idea on what cars should go for. I won't see him till the weekend to check his Kelly blue book but I 'd say retail you could get around $5500 at the most for your Civic without a dent.
    I would list it for $5,550 and don't mention the dent in the ad. Tell them on the phone or when they come over to see it take off $400-500 for the dent. Try to get around 4500-5K and don't go to a dealer. They 'll offer you way below blue book, probably around $3K. My friend buys Civics for $3K and gets $5K for them easily.
    71K mi. is nothing for a Civic. I have 93K mi. on my '97 DX htbk and the engine runs like new considering I 'm hard on the car and often cruise at 80-85mph every day with frequent drag racing at the light.
    Have you considered keeping it as a 2nd car? I thought about selling my '97 Civic DX when I bought my '99 GSR and I actually put it in the local paper for 10 days and then I changed my mind. I got many calls and some people even told me that $6900 was too low and they were afraid something was wrong with it! Gas prices had already started rising last July and since the GSR runs on premium gas I decided to keep the CIvic.
    I know trucks don't get good gas mileage at all and you 'll definitely miss the Civic's.
    If your truck says on the sticker that it gets
    20city - 25hwy, figure 17-22 at best. A lot of my friends have SUVs and jeeps and they don't come close to the advertised gas mileage which is bad to begin with. Just something for you to think about..
  • volksnutvolksnut Posts: 2
    I've decided to keep my civic DX instead of selling it because my wife and I both need high mpg cars where we live and with the current gas price hike. While trying to sell the Honda I got one call for my asking price of $6100. The market is flooded with these cars. In case you didn't read my last comment, I bought a new 00 Golf GLS and I compared them slightly although I'd only had a few miles on it. Now with 2,500 more miles of experience with the Golf, I'd like to compare them again. The Golf kicks the Civics butt in every way. No contest.
  • only1harryonly1harry Posts: 1,137
    Yes, the Golf is the better car (you get what you pay for expression comes to mind) but you can't tell me that a 2750lb car with 115hp can accelerate faster than a 2250lbs car with 106!
    I 've never been beaten by a 4cyl. Golf.
    Just look at the magazine accelaration tests. Golf: 10-10.4s and Civic htbk: 8.7-9.1
    That's one of 2 things a Civic htbk is better at than a Golf GL,GLS. The other is gas mileage.
    Show me a Golf that averages 33-34mpg (like mine).. Other than that, the Golf is better in almost every category. If I could 've gotten a Golf for $12.5K (with A/C) I would. At that price range ($13K) the Civic hatchback is definetely worth it. I 'm sure your GLS cost you around 17K..
    Next year though the Golf will have some real competition from the redesigned Civic which will be much more comparable to the VWs.
  • thebbw1thebbw1 Posts: 3
    Well my days as a speed demon are waning and I'm looking for a little comfort in my life now. I have lived with a Civic hatchback VERY happily for the last nine years, and have just finalized the search for a new vehicle. BUT to me, the Golf was just SO much nicer that any slight cost differances were not relevant. ABS, Disc brakes, heated mirrors, sumptuous details, great sound. Now I am still nervous about leaving the wonderful world of Honda reliability, I'll have to get back to you in a few years.
  • focuszx3rfocuszx3r Posts: 92
    If u can find a Civic hatchback, BUY IT! It is a much better car then a VW, but I was recently in the market for a hatch and I bought a Ford Focus ZX3. Its much better in the style and price dept. then these cars!
  • tomcat630tomcat630 Posts: 854
    Next year (2001) there will not be any Civic H/B for the USA market. So, the Golf will be battling the Focus ZX3.
  • rfruthrfruth Posts: 630
    On the subject of VW vs Honda vs Ford vs GM, when shopping for almost any brand hatch late last year I visited VW dealerships to see and feel a Golf, there were never any on the lot, Focus sedans were in stock but no hatchbacks, lots of Toyota Celica liftbacks for $ 20 + and several Civic hatchbacks in stock ..
    oh yea, SUV = Silly Ungainly Vehicle

    Rob Fruth - Houston, Tx

    1981 Raleigh for commuting, errands & fun ____ __o
    1997 Trek 2300 for real fun ! ____ _ \ | _)
    2000 Civic (dx 5 speed) hatchback (_)/ (_)
  • mnnmnn Posts: 31

    I need some advice on whether to go for the VW or stay with the Honda. I own a 97 Civic LX Sedan (well, I always hit my head when retrieving stuff from a coupe, so..), and am contemplating of trading it in for either the Accord SE (5 sp), or the VW Golf 1.8 T (I heard the Jetta has loads of problems, and it is more expensive). I have test driven the Accord and find it smooth, though lack a bit of sporty feel. I have not had the chance to test drive the Y2K Golf, but I have driven the 97, and that felt great, safe, sturdy, especially in the snow (which is lacking from the Honda). The reason for changing car is that I find my Civic slow, especially when you have the air-con on, and merging onto the highway is not much fun. OK, if my criteria is a more powerful vehicle with a good manual box, high resale value, and low maintenance, which one, (in your opinion) should I be looking at (you won't be held responsible). Plus, I'd probably need a bit of financing, and the VW's rate sucks (bank rate), should I just forget about the Golf altogether?
    I love my Civic, but from the 6th month of ownership on I found myself in need of more horsepower, and I think the Golf would be a nice advancement?!

    When is a good time to buy VW?? I don't seem to recall any "trend" in their promotion like the Honda does. (I live in Canada)
    Anyone out there can help me out?
  • hugozhugoz Posts: 82
    Thanks for the new spin on the "SUV" acronym. If you can think of a synonym for "boring" that also starts with the letters, s,u or v, let us know!

    Concerning hatchbacks, anyone who's unsure about their choices in the $12-13K range ought be looking at the Ford Focus ZX3 hatchback. Don't take my word, though: check out the ZX3 postings -- the people there are absolute fanatics about it!
  • mznmzn Posts: 727
    mnn, I've had two VW Golfs, my current 1996 and a 1987 before it. If you're looking for power, I think the Golf GTI is the way to go. IMHO, the Golf gives a more solid ride. I drove the Civic hatchback in 1996 and stayed with the Golf. Why not test drive them both and see what works for you?

  • only1harryonly1harry Posts: 1,137
    Well if it don't mind a coupe or hatchback the Integra GSR has one of the best manual gearboxes and shifters in the world and should be a bit faster than the Golf 1.8T since it's about 300lbs lighter and has 170hp. although I think the Golf Turbo is also a good choice - don't get the diesel turbo though, it's not fast. The Golf 1.8T should have pretty good power (150hp but lots of torque)
  • judasjudas Posts: 217
    I wouldn't count on the GSR being faster than the 1.8T GTI. I've seen 0-60 times for the 1.8T Beetle anywhere from 7.1 to 7.6, and the GTI is lighter, and more aerodynamic (Although that probably wouldn't matter to 60, might make a little difference in the 1/4). The GSR has about 20 more HP, but its got about 30 less lb/ft.
  • mnnmnn Posts: 31
    Just one quick question: are Golfs made in Germany, or in Mexico like the Jettas and Passats?? And, does it really matter in terms of quality?? (I noticed there are a lot of lemons with Jettas). Also, is it true that if the VIN# starts with a "W" it is German made, whereas those with "3" or "4" are Mexican?
  • judasjudas Posts: 217
    I think that GTI's are still made in Germany, and that Golf's are made in Brazil, but I can't remember where I heard that or even if it's accurate.
  • qwordqword Posts: 20
    If I were you I would look at the 1.8t Golf and the TDI Golf. Believe it or not the TDI Golf out accelerates the 2 liter Golf. Not by much but hey it's a 90hp diesel engine that averages 42-50mpg, pretty impressive if you ask me. However for a couple of thousand more go with the GTI that way you will not have to worry about future turbo problems. I would also take a look at the Integra GSR which is also in that price range I think. Though it lacks considerable in torque it still offers alot of fun up top.
    I was once told that anytime is a good time to buy a VW since VW doesn't offer to many rebates like other car manufacturers.
    Good luck!!!!!
  • phrozenphrozen Posts: 1
    Does anyone know when the next generation of civic hbs are coming out? Or any specs about them?
  • mznmzn Posts: 727
    Sorry, phrozen, only bad news to report. Honda has decided not to continue the Civic hatchback model. Honda is out of the hatchbacks market altogether.

  • rfruthrfruth Posts: 630
    Topic # 271 is Honda Insight Hatchback, is the Insight really available in a hatch version, if so great if not maybe Honda has a 5 door hatch in the works ! SUV = Soccer UV ?

    Rob Fruth - Houston, Tx

    1981 Raleigh for commuting, errands & fun ____ __o
    1997 Trek 2300 for real fun ! ____ _ \ | _)
    2000 Civic hatchback when I have to (_)/ (_)
  • mznmzn Posts: 727
    Yes, you're right! The Insight is a hatchback. As a hybrid car, I tend not to think of it for the typical car buyer. Good point. I don't see any sign of a 5-door yet. We certainly need more of them on the market.

  • Does anyone have an e-mail or P.O. address for Honda? How can we convince Honda that there are some people who would like a 5dr hatch and not a gas guzzling SUV?

    I have been keeping up with a site called and Honda sells 5dr hatches in Europe.
    What can we do to convince Honda to sell these models in the U.S.
  • judasjudas Posts: 217
    You can round up a couple thousand friends that want to buy one. 5 door hatches have never sold well in the US, with the possible exception of the Golf (And even that's up for debate.) The vast majority of 5 door hatches sold here have also been obscenely ugly, witness the Nova 5 door, Prizm 5 door, Saab 5 doors have never been particularly attractive, etc, etc. I've never seen a picture of a Honda 5 door (Do they even produce one?) I guess you're stuck with the PT Cruiser or a Subaru of some sort.
  • only1harryonly1harry Posts: 1,137
    for Japan and Asian markets only. Go to VTEC.NET and look up the news/rumors. Somewhere down the list (in March I believe) there is an article from a Japanese magazine that shows pictures of the '01 Civic 5dr htbk, '01 Integra Type-R and NSX.
    The Civic 5dr looks like the new Forcus HB a little.
    They will also have for the first time a 4dr Civic sedan Type-R with the current Integra
    Type-R engine - 200hp! (Japanese version is always 5hp more than US). I guess they know these cars won't sell well here :( Sure they might sell a couple of thousand but probably not worth their while to export.
  • deevcjdeevcj Posts: 9
    I own a 2k Golf GL, with the 2.0 engine. I can tell you that speed is not its thing, any Neon or Honda out there can take it and I wouldn't even consider running agianst a Focus ZR3. I looked at, drove and researched the heck out of the three since I wanted a hb. If Honda still made an SI hatch, that is what I would of bought. I went with VW for features like ABS, fit and finish and looks. The Focus just screamed small car to me even though it is big on the inside. Something else to consider, only 1000 Golfs are sold per month in America, I have more stangers ask me about my car and have never seen more than a few like it.
  • nasaboynasaboy Posts: 2
    I'm getting rid of an '87 Civic DX Hatchback in a few months. It has 163K on it but the rust monster has basically eaten the car. I thought a few people out there might be interested in the results of my "road test." As far as maintenance goes, I've changed the oil, air filter and coolant religiously; the car does not burn any oil. Do I want another Honda? No. Why. . .
    1. Wiper motor failed at 19K. Replaced under warranty.
    2. Carb floats failed at ~43K. Complete carb rebuild.
    3. Ignition switch failed at ~53K. Car had to be towed.
    4. Radiator replaced at about 120K. This car has gone through 2 thermostats as well. With all that, it still runs much closer to redline than any other car I have ever driven.
    5. Cassette has not worked properly since about '93. Right speaker failed in about '95. This car has the worst radio reception I have ever experienced.
    6. Starter motor replaced at about 135K.
    7. The car has had a vacuum leak as long as I have had it. The idle sounds funny but seems to work OK.
    8. The stick has been very sticky since about '96. I am told the problem is bad bushings. Too cheap to fix.
    9. Seat belts have failed to retract properly since about 1995.
    10. The skin of the right rocker and the structural components no longer touch. Rust in other places too. Left rear wheel no longer perpendicular to road.
    11. After about 50K miles, virtually every brake job involved a cylinder replacement.
    There have GOT to be better vehicles on the road than this piece of trash. Lest anyone think that I have the only Honda problem child, I have a friend with a Civic that REALLY overheated. Although there was never any coolant in the oil or oil in the coolant, the problem was only fixed at 92K with a replacement engine. Back to my car, both CV joints have been replaced, but I consider that quasi-routine.
  • isellhondasisellhondas Issaquah WashingtonPosts: 17,881
    Well, with a couple of exceptions, your list of "problems" are pretty trivial. It's an old car with 163K. Sounds like you REALLY don't like to spend money. Your radio has been broken for seven years and you put up with it....?

    I wonder what you would be complaining about if you had bought a Volkswagen instad of a Honda?
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