Subaru Legacy/Outback

rk_goa · August 2001

Out of curiosity, I did a search on "pinging" on google.com - alt.autos.subaru and read the posts. Try it and form your own opinions. Could be wrong, but I got the following impressions: 1) it is not very uncommon 2) may not be easy to fix 3) might not cause engine damage - one poster developed it at 50k and now has 150k miles. I hope my car does not do it - the sound alone would drive me nuts.

drew_ · August 2001

...at 6-7pm Pacific/9-10 pm Eastern. Hope to see you there!

http://www.edmunds.com/chat/subaruchat.html

ateixeira · August 2001

Roger: thanks for looking that up.

You gotta love how resourceful the folks here are.

100k with a ping? Wow.

-juice

paulsgt · August 2001

Jay,
Thanks for the info. I dropped Eric (@ Whitebear) an email asking what he had for LL Beans.

Paul in MN.

erics6 · August 2001

Pings under light load between 2000-2500 rpm. Usually happens when accelerating or when the auto transmission drops back a gear while climbing hills/mountains (revs drop from 3000+ to 2000). Occurs most often in warmer weather. Loud enough to hear with the windows rolled up. Local service advisor's 99 RS does the same thing and says he's had a number of complaints from other Phase II Subaru owners. My wife has heard at least one other Subaru ping just driving around town.

hime · August 2001

I apologize if this has been covered, but couldn't bring myself to read 2500 messages to find out. Has anyone else experienced small brownish spots on the ceiling of their Outback? We have a 2001. Thanks.

stinkynelson · August 2001

Much like Chris' posting #2277, my '02 OB 5-speed requires much concentration by me in order to achieve a smooth acceleration from a stop.

Also, if I accelerate relatively quickly (not drag-racing start, just a quick one) from a stop, the car accelerates slightly, hesitates for a moment, and then starts its normal acceleration.

Anyone else experience this?

johnmei · August 2001

Brownish spots. I would bet it is RUST, perhaps from condensation. Obviously, it shouldn't be and Subaru should install a new ceiling fabric.

johnmei · August 2001

I am planning to buy a 2002 Outback Wagon with the standard no frills "Tried and True" 2.5H4. The standard radio has a cassette player and NOT a CD. Thus, I either will have to purchase a totally new radio/cassette/CD system installed by some outfit like Tweeters (as I am told the radio is not compatible with any other commercial CD unit) or buy Subaru's added option for a single player CD. Is the quality of the unit decent? Also, how is the speaker upgrade? Is the cost worth the supposed sound enhancement?

shirl4 · August 2001

I am enjoying reading what everyone writes. I have had my 2001 OB Ltd.since November and love it. Now, I want to get a Kayak and could use some help. Since I have minimal upper body strength and need to get the kayak on and off by myself, I would be interested in what others have done. Has anyone used the Subaru system? So far, Yakima system seems the best. I would need to mount 2 Roundbars next to the Subaru bars, but then I could also add a pull out bar (that extends about 3 feet beyond the passenger doors) to rest the front of the Kayak on. Then, I could lift the back of the Kayak onto the saddles while the front rests on the pull out bar. Last step is to move the front of the Kayak which is on the pull out bar to the front saddle. I need to add the equipment (about $350 for Yakima)before I will really know if I can handle getting the Kayak up so I want to do the right thing. Any thoughts?
Shirl

originalbitman · August 2001

I have the speaker upgrade with tweeter kit and subwoofer and I think it is more than adequate. To my perhaps less than sophisticated ears it sounds great. I did have the dealer pull and credit me for the 6 disc in-dash CD that was in my car when I bought it. I then replaced the Subaru cassette/receiver with a Blaupunkt Nevada single CD/receiver. It works wonderfully, sounds great and fits like stock. I did the install myself and it took maybe an hour at most. I have posted the install instructions here: http://www.bitman.com/soobinstall/

The instructions for the indash 6 Disc changer explain pretty much everything but if you need more detailed help let me know.

bit - 2001 GT Wagon

lark6 · August 2001

I own a Forester but I use the Yakima roundbars/crosstops system to haul my yak. I don't have a Yakima cradle (e.g. Hully Rollers) but a no-name brand from an outfit on Long Island. I was able to get the crosstops at a great price on eBay (one of the best purchases I've ever made there) and bought the lock cores and crossbars at retail from REI, where I get 10% back as a membership patronage dividend at year's end. I also picked on one of the Yakima airfoils to use when the boat's not loaded becuase they tend to make a ruckus when I drive at highway speeds.

I remove the Subaru factory rack when I put the Yakima system on, and leave the racks off altogether when I know I won't be paddling for a while. Better MPG that way.

Yakima maunfactures the OEM roof attachments for Subaru, BTW.

Hope this helps,
Ed

ssnaakee · August 2001

would you buy another subie? thinking of a legacy.

originalbitman · August 2001

bit - 2001 GT Wagon

rangerron7 · August 2001

roflick · August 2001

We are going with the Outback. All the goodies are too much temptation. I didn't want to get the legacy, although it is a great looking car, and wish I had all the extras. We're getting the 2001 5 speed in white or wintergreen. I hope all the pinging is just an aboration.

I'm waiting on a call from CarsDirect and should hopefully make the deal later this week. Has anyone here dealt with CarsDirect? If so, what was your experience?

Anything's got to be better than dealing with a car salesman. I can't help but want to take a shower after dealing with one of those. The CarsDirect prices seem too good to be true and that's exactly what the sales manager told me. It can't hurt to take a chance.

Thanks for all the great info. Everyone on this board is great.

The next time I talk to you I should be the proud owner of a subie.

rgarbaccio · August 2001

Wife asked me - why would someone sell or trade in their 1 yr. old car. I thought I would pose this question to the 'crew'. She's concerned that it was a problem car, and that's the reason for return, or sale. I think you guys like the new models so much that you just trade 'em in for a Bean.

Which is right? Anyone trade in a perfectly fine 99 or 00 legacy?

ateixeira · August 2001

Off-lease vehicle, maybe? Remember, the 2002s are out now, so a 2000 may already have been out there 24 months, the length of a lease.

Still, nothing replaces a thorough test drive.

I swapped the standard speakers for premium sound ones in my Forester. They may not be exactly the same, but for an idea of what kind of upgrade you'd be paying for, check them out side by side in this photo.

Would I buy another Subie? Definitely. My cousin saw my Forester and was pursuaded to buy an Outback. My dad also bought an Outback. When it's time for the wife to get a new car, I'm praying that the Legacy Blitzen is available. Sweetness!

-juice

paulsgt · August 2001

Hi,
I struck a deal on a Wintergreen (I was torn between white and wintergreen) 2001 LL Bean on Saturday ($500 over invoice w/Subaru Fiancing) I see in "Bitman's" post that he had the dealer remove the 6-disc changer. Is that correct? Has anyone else had the dealer do this? What goes in it's place? I have absoulutely no use for the 6-disc changer and really do need a trailer hitch. I was thinking I could trade the dealer the CD changer for the trailer hitch. I won't be picking up the 'Bean till the 27th. I'll let you all know how it goes.

Thanks!

Paul in MN.

ateixeira · August 2001

I wouldn't bother. It'll help resale, and who knows? It may grow on you.

I used to be happy with tapes, but since I got a Miata with a CD and a CD burner at work, I won't go back.

Plus a hitch isn't that expensive. Check out Pep Boys, if they're in your area. They'll install a hitch for under $200 probably.

-juice

paisan · August 2001

The LL Bean doesn't come any other way but with a 6-disk.

-mike

ateixeira · August 2001

In-dash CD changers are really cool. If nothing else, they'll wow a few friends. Note that even most high-end luxury cars do not offer this convenience.

-juice

paisan · August 2001

My trooper has the 6-disc in-dash std. also.

-mike

originalbitman · August 2001

I haven't looked in an LL Bean so I am not sure about the dash layout. All other Legacys (other than the VDC) have a similar dash and use the same components. The changer is easy to pull and gets replaced with a nice storage shelf with flip up door. For me it was just something I didn't need as its functionality wasn't as convenient as I like plus I had no real use for the cassette portion of the receiver. A simple single CD receiver made more sense and I appreciated the extra storage space in the dash. It holds my CD wallet now.

Anyone with the Subaru cassette receiver (2000+) could use your changer. It is a simple plug-in into the harness. But your dealer should be willing to pull it and give you credit for something like $300-350 (their invoice price) if I remember correctly.

bit - 2001 GT Wagon

nygreg · August 2001

I have the base OB and had the dealer install the single CD. Since I bought the car at the end of April, not a single cd skip. Really like the unit. Base radio has good sound, but some prefer a little more power. People here believe upgraded speakers (al la Juice) make a big difference.

Would I buy another? Can't comment on long term reliability, but, man is this car stable. I love driving it, love the way it looks (Winestone), ergonomics are great and can't wait until it snows.

Greg

jvannorman · August 2001

I noticed that one of the online subaru factory parts dealers has the Subaru alarm that can be added to the 2001 Outback's key-less entry system for around $120. I know I wanted to add an alarm to the car and up until this point figured I would buy an after market brand and install it myself (I figured Crutchfield would be a safe bet and would provide the necessary information and hardware). However, having noticed the factory model, I am thinking maybe it would be easier to install (I'm thinking that it might be easier to tie a factory alarm system into the keyless entry system currently on the car than it would be to tie in an aftermarket system). Has anyone installed the factory alarm and how easy was it? Has anyone installed an aftermarket brand alarm and how easy was it? (I've installed about 7 car stereos in family cars over the years, so I do have some experience in this area, however, I've never installed an alarm.)

evilizard · August 2001

I have the 2001 VDC with the Subaru security system. I was wondering if there was a way to make it automatically lock the doors when the car is started and unlock them when it is turned off.

originalbitman · August 2001

I have the Subaru Security System Upgrade (Alarm). It was dealer installed but I do have the install instructions and it doesn't look too difficult. Basically 3 parts to the install:

1- Security Mudule. It attaches next to the radio/HVAC unit.

2 - Starter Interupt & Horn Relay. Installs under the left side of the dash.

3 - Horn. Underhood install.

1 and 2 require pulling dash panels. I've done it and it just takes a little patience as they are snug fits. The HVAC unit comes out easy. You can see some of what is involved in pulling it by checking out the changer install instructions posted at my site - http://bitman.com/soobinstall/

The Alarm instructions are 8 pages and I will try and post them when I get a few minutes in a day or so.

bit - 2001 GT Wagon

subiowner · August 2001

I have a Omega system on my 96 OB. It has setting switches on the command module (black box under the dash) that lets you enable or disable the door lock feature.

subiowner · August 2001

Bought one 2 weeks ago. still cannot muster the nerve to put a drill on the car!

originalbitman · August 2001

I understand your reluctance. It took me 20 minutes standing there with the drill just to get up the nerve then 10 seconds to shoot the hole. All worked out fine. Just follow the instructions to find the right location. Small drill then big drill and only push hard enough to punch through the metal with the small one. Take your time and it will be fine... or I bet if you go to the dealer they would install it for $20 or so. At my dealer the detail person does those sort of installs and even though he is a great guy I still trust myself with the drill more than him.

bit - 2001 GT Wagon

lanicow · August 2001

I bought a 2001 Legacy GT in Jan this year which I love. Lately I've noticed a pinging sound from the engine. When I switch to a higher octane than what was recommended, the pinging sound goes away.

Any ideas what this could be?
And will Subaru fix this?

thanks in advance! :-)

originalbitman · August 2001

There have been a couple other reports of pinging on this board. Those cars (unlike yours) seem to be unaffected by an octane change. Does it ping only under a load like low gear up a hill? Is it an automatic or manual transmission? What gear are you in and at what RPM when it pings? How many miles on the car?

For more info on pinging check the General Maint and Repair board and scroll up through the messages. There is no search so it will take some hunting but there are a number of posts. Here's a post from Patti the SOA rep: pattim3 "Subaru Crew - General Maintenance & Repair II" Aug 9, 2001 1:58am

bit - 2001 GT Wagon

ateixeira · August 2001

If it's a manual, try to keep the engine at about 2500-4000 rpm, or even higher. Peak torque occurs at 4000 rpm, so that's where it is happiest pulling a load.

-juice

mrdetailer · August 2001

I have a 1991, before they added all of the Nifty features that Outback has. I strongly believe in changing brake, powersteering fluids every 30,000 miles, radiatior coolant yearly, and transmission fluid at least every 15,000 miles. I also use Lubegard where appropriate to dissipate heat.

Maintenence and repairs have only run about $600/year. And I'm agressive about repairs. Am I interested in another one? Yeah. But I do wish they's make one about the size of the Mazda Tribute, I.E. a big brother to the Forrester, with a low speed differential.

lanicow · August 2001

hmm, good questions.

>Does it ping only under a load like low gear up a hill?

nope. it also pings anytime I accelerate; either slowly or quickly. Doesn't seem to matter if I'm going uphill or on a flat.

>Is it an automatic or manual transmission?

automatic

>What gear are you in and at what RPM when it pings?

seems to start pinging at about 30 mph. not sure the RPM. I'll have to pay more attn to what gear it's in and the RPM tonite when I drive home.

>How many miles on the car?

About 10,800 miles

I'll take a looksee at the General Maint and Repair board later on.

ohsubie · August 2001

I installed the car alarm in my 01 Outback after some low life tryed to punch out the drivers side door lock. It was easy with well written instructions. The only thing the instructions leave out, is the need for a real short stubby phillphs screw driver. Follow the instructions to the letter and you should have no problems.
Shifting gears, mine is a Winestone with 13k on it (its 6 months old), I have no engine ping problems and had one trip back to the shop for an O2 senors. Otherwise thing are great!

originalbitman · August 2001

And that's to remove the screws inside the ashtray right? I know just what you mean.

bit

ateixeira · August 2001

Yes, sir! A Forester Plus would be sweet. Give it 3 rows of seats and the H6.

Imagine a car-like, reliable XL7 and you get the picture.

I'm hoping Subaru brings over a Blitzen model, which we'd get for my wife maybe in two years. Then I'd replace my Forester with the Forester Plus.

If I can dream for a minute, how about an SVX coupe and roadster based on the WRX chassis. That roadster could replace my toy, currently a Miata.

-juice

99gs · August 2001

I'm a Bean owner to be and have some questions about the factory cross bars and accessories. What accessories actually fit the factory bars and which ones do you have to buy the round bar kit for? If you get the round bar kit do you have to take out the factory cross bars? If so are the factory bars hard to get out? Also do the side rails stay? I'm thinking kayak and or skis on top maybe cargo carrier. Thanks in advance. Jack

ateixeira · August 2001

I've seen people with both on, FWIW.

You can get clamps that will fit on your standard bars. Maybe someone else will have more specifics.

-juice

goosegog · August 2001

I have the single player and the tweeter kit from Subaru in my 00 OB. Don't have the woofer unit. No problems at all.

The sound isn't bad...I have two decent sound systems at home, one with large bass reflex multi-driver speakers and one with a central bass unit and satellite speakers. I am fairly critical but do not enjoy the overloud bass that is fashionable these days. I prefer a balanced natural sound. I do not play my car stereo super loud as I find it distracts me from driving, so the standard speakers are adequate. Up very loud I will concede they could be better.

From what I've read on this board the in-dash changer unit is unreliable, eating CDs. Perhaps they all are. It is also grossly overpriced as an add-on.

One of my home stereos is a Nakamichi 5 disk changer with only one slot. The mechanics are the same as used in CD servers for networks where it has an enviable reliability record. At work we've had dozens of these things working for years without a single failure. If Nakamichi makes an in-dash changer I'd say go for it. Otherwise...

roflick · August 2001

I pick up ore 2001 White Outback LTD 5 speed tomorrow.

Started with the dealer who ran a locate for me on this car. All he could find was one that was loaded with 6 disc changer, air filtration, auto-dimming mirror, cargo net, etc. This is not what I wanted but he told me it was the only white 5 speed available in southern CA. The price would be $25K + $400 destination + tax and lic.

Needless to say I rejected their offer . I went home and placed an order through CarsDirect for a base OB LTD. I was assured they would find one and they kept their promise. The price....$23,760 (destination included) + tax and lic.

I feel that the dealer found this car and was going to add these options to improve his profit margin.

I started the process on Monday and finalized financing Tuesday. I spent approximately 30 minutes on the phone with the CarsDirect representative and she found the car and secured the loan. All I have to do is go to the dealer and sign the loan docs.

The only pressure I felt was when the CarsDirect rep tried to push their $999 6 yr 72k mile extended warranty. I didn't feel it was necessary after reading all the positive experiences with this car.

Have any of you regreted not buying the extended warranty?

paisan · August 2001

If you buy any warranty, buy the Subaru Gold warranty from SOA. Far better than 3rd party warranties.

-mike

sagresta · August 2001

I don't know if the Subarus sell for more in California, but you should be able to get a 2001 base model 5 speed for under 22K, especially with the $750 dealer incentive kickback. I don't know if that's only with selective dealers though. I bought my 2001 base wagon with auto, cd, air filtration, and cargo net, for 22,400.

It's probably worth the extra cash not to have to deal with the sales people though.

ateixeira · August 2001

Rosendo: first of all, congrats. Nice choice.

Most options are port installed. I doubt a dealer would install them himself because them he'd have to cover the labor. So unless he was making a margin on the options, it would actually be more profitable to sell you a lesser equipped model with options installed at the port (i.e. free labor).

I agree that a factory warranty is better, and the price you were quoted can easily be matched by Subaru.

-juice

99gs · August 2001

Does anyone know of a site to find out the price of the different SOA Warranties. Fitz quotes 25% off, but I would like to know what full retail is without asking a dealer. Not that I don't trust dealers. Jack

ateixeira · August 2001

No idea, but I'd guess around $1200 or so retail for a 5 year B2B. They tend to sell for about a grand or so.

-juice

nygreg · August 2001

Get the best deal you can, be happy, and don't look back. Just enjoy your new Subie. I payed 23.3K 4 months ago for a base with auto, cd, security, rear bar and AWP. Today I can get that 01 for less. Just life. Got the best deal I could at the time. Welcome!

Greg

theob · August 2001

The factory crossbars come out quite easily. Use the Torx driver that should have been in your dash pocket when you got the car. Unscrew each screw about 1" and then lightly tap it with the handle of the driver. The bottom bracket of the crossbar should drop down. You may want to continue until it is completely unscrewed on one side so you can lift off that side of the cross bar and pull it out of the other side.

I believe all of the Subaru-branded accessories will work with the factory bars. If you want to put something like a Yak Steelhead bike rack or wheelforks, you'll need the round bars (which are a set of Yak DoubleCross, 48" bars, and SKS cores)

The rails STAY. I've found the round-bar set harder to install and remove than the factory bars, because you can't open them up enough to pull them off as quickly.
HTH, Theo

Subaru Legacy/Outback

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