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Lincoln Town Car

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Comments

  • navigator3740navigator3740 Member Posts: 279
    I've not had a Town Car do that. My Continentals did it regularly. My Navigator didn't do it for 50,000 miles, then finally needed turning. I'm at a loss to explain it, unless you're in a wet climate. I'm told by my mechanic that driving through water with a hot rotor will exacerbate the problem.
  • dbc123dbc123 Member Posts: 105
    Have you noticed or had any complaints about the much firmer suspension in the standard 03 Grand Marquis? I'm not sure if the Town Car also recieved this "improvement".
    I was ready to buy my 4th Grand Marquis until I rented a new one and immediately was struck by the jittery, harsh ride.
  • audia8qaudia8q Member Posts: 3,138
    No complaints at so far...We sell more Town Cars than GMQ's so I'm getting more feed back on the T/C...and everyone seems to like the ride changes....I think perhaps ANY change would "concern" some of the traditional GMQ buyers but overall its a good move from L/M.

    They eliminated a bit of the traditional "float" in the ride...which yonger buyers find so offensive. hahaha. So they are trying to appease buyers of all ages. Leave a little float but improve the ride and handling overall....

    Ask your dealer if you can take an extended test drive for a few hours....I think after you get familiar with the change you will find it to be improved overall. example...the previous GMQ when going over a pothole would bounce for 1/4 mile. No more. This is a big change for a traditional GMQ buyer and takes a bit of getting use to.

    Good luck
    Rich
  • dbc123dbc123 Member Posts: 105
    I drove the rented 03 GM more than 300 miles so I'm pretty familiar with the changed ride. I've owned several sports sedans over the years and am very familiar with that type of ride. I've done my time in those cars and now want the smooth, isolated ride that only a large body-on-frame car can deliver. The standard suspension needs to be retuned. Ford is listening to the auto magazine writers too much. If GM/CV/TC buyers wanted that sort of ride they would buy a BMW,Audi,Mercedes,etc.
  • navigator3740navigator3740 Member Posts: 279
    I get equally frustrated with Ford for paying so much attention to the C&D staff's opinions. My pet peeve is the steering. Car & Driver hasn't driven a car yet that doesn't have "overboosted" power steering! Well, I'm sorry, but I love easy steering! It's one of the things that drew me to the Navigator. The steering is wonderful! In 2000, they stiffened it up almost to a choke point for me. When I wrote and complained, I was told the "car critics" had rated it poorly in steering feel. Car & Driver doesn't buy cars, but I do. Ford should be listening to us, and the dealers who we complain to.
  • jerrym3jerrym3 Member Posts: 202
    If the regular GM is too stiff for some, what does that say about the Marauder, which is supposed to be even stiffer?
  • dbc123dbc123 Member Posts: 105
    Navigator, I'd wager you and I are only two of many Ford owners who feel that Ford's lack of attention to customer input is largely responsible for it's current mess.
    Ford needs to be true to the original strengths of it's vehicles. The Crown Vics, Grand
    Marquis and Town Cars are true Anerican luxury cars that can be world class in ride, quietness and room. The simple laws of physics dictate that they can NEVER handle like some of the small euro sedans so do NOT try to make them do so. Instead focus on the inherent strengths of this line and refine them until they are best in class. There is still a huge market for this type of car.
  • dbc123dbc123 Member Posts: 105
  • dbc123dbc123 Member Posts: 105
    Navigator's comment on steering weighting is correct. My Grand Marquis, with "firmed up" steering requires considerable effort to hold it against a crosswind or excessive crown in the road. Result is noticeable fatigue after fighting it for a 800 mile day. This is "progress"? I do note that the 03's seem to have more boost and may not suffer this problem. Posts elsewhere, however, suggest that the power steering rack and pinion unit is failing on many cars after about 4K miles...
  • gkarggkarg Member Posts: 230
    I've only seen about 2 on the road since they've been released. I saw a dark gray one last night. The front end is a great improvement. It has a very "LS" look to it. Very sharp!
  • navigator3740navigator3740 Member Posts: 279
    Ford isn't as screwed up as GM. They completely abandoned the RWD sedan market, leaving the entire segment for Taxis & Interceptors to Ford. So that's something, but they do seem to have an urge to "fix" what's not broken on these cars. I have never liked what they did to the Town Car in 98. The suspension is better, handling is great, but the interior looks cheap now, not luxurious, and the A/C is aenemic. I hope Bill Ford gets them back on task and reverses the damage Jacque Nasser did.
  • marsha7marsha7 Member Posts: 3,703
    had an engine with 275 HP, and the new 2003 LS has, I believe, 282 HP, why would Ford put a 239 HP engine in their largest and heaviest car, why not either of the two engines above, or a 300 HP that goes into the Aviator or Navigator???...if the TC is designed to carry numerous people, it needs the HP and Torque to do so...why such a depowered engine in a car competing with Deville's 275 or 300 HP Northstar???...why do we even have to mention this stuff to Ford, they can't be blind to the obvious, as they improved the LS and put HP in the two SUVs, and had the brains to put sufficient power in the Continental...where is the logic in the Town Car???
  • kinleykinley Member Posts: 854
    Don't know the sales figures, but have been made aware that limo companies and livery firms buy a lot of Towncars. Perhaps they influence the Crown Vic engine installation so as to have more miles per gallon. Second reason is most TC's are sold to "the greatest generation" who have matured beyond speed since retiring from their prop driven planes. Perhaps many TC owners don't live near the Rockies or Cascades, but in a flat land where more oomph isn't needed. How much CAFE still has to do with it is still up in the air. I've suggested to Wixom they offer the Mark VIII, 295 hp engine as a $250 "Power Option". No reply as the bean counters rule.
  • corsicachevycorsicachevy Member Posts: 316
    The Town Car could really use an injection of power and torque. The car is not underpowered in its current form but under no circumstances would I call the TC a performance sedan.

    Here is my idea - an aluminum block 5.4V8 Triton SOHC 2-valve per cylinder engine running through a five speed automatic. This motor could easily put out 270-280hp and about 350lb-ft of torque while maintaining very low levels of NVH. This engine transmission combo would provide what the TC is missing all at a lower cost than a DOHC design.
  • kinleykinley Member Posts: 854
    For $400 additional we should be able to buy the 5.4 dohc engine.
  • navigator3740navigator3740 Member Posts: 279
    that the T/C could use more power. But I think it could use a lot of work. Frankly, I haven't liked what was done to the Town Car since the 98 came out. I think they ruined the finest RWD sedan in the world. But, I've been told, they don't built it for me, they build it for Limo conversions and fleet sales to police & cab companies, and it does make a nice Limo. How fast does a Limo need to go? Or a Cab? I think that's probably the cost/benefit scenerio that exists.
  • rea98drea98d Member Posts: 982
    To differentiate it from Mercury. Friends of my grandparents just bought a brand new '02 Grand Marquis, fully loaded, and that car is every bit as nice as any lincoln I've ever ridden in, and probably cost a lot less. More power for the Town Car would definately set it apart from the Grand Marquis and Crown Victoria, just as the Mark VIII had a 290 HP engine compared to the T-Bird and Cougar's 205. Something to actually make the Lincoln worth more than the Mercury. But then again, Mercury already has the 300HP engine in the Marauder, so we're right back there again. My opinion (my opinion plus 50 cents will get you a coke) is that the Marauder needs the Mustang Cobra's supercharged V-8, tuned to pump out an even 400 horsies. Firm up the suspension to make it much better handling. It's supposed to serve as the platform's all-out muscle car, isn't it? Give the Town Car the Marauder's 300 HP engine, to set it apart from Ford & Mercury. Turn Mercury loose with the general public sales with the same 235 HP engine it's got, and leave the Crown Vic to fleet & police buyers as a "stripped down" model. That way, the dealers are happy because none of the cars on the platform get cut, the buyers are happy because there is a car targeted more closly to what they want & need, and the bean counters are happy because it eliminates overlap amongst four nearly identical cars, and you don't have one brand cannibalizing sales from another.
  • navigator3740navigator3740 Member Posts: 279
    I've always thought the Merc should outperform the Ford, not just out look it. No sixes, just V-8s, at least in the big cars. Seems like Lincoln is taking that niche, and I'm not sure where that really leaves Merc. Probably right where it is, nowhere. Wonder if anybody from Ford ever reads these?
  • 0rnery0rnery Member Posts: 23
    Just bought a "1994 Town Car" in excellent condition with 70K on it for $6,600. Not too keen on the color (amethyst), but I couldn't pass it up.

    Only qualm I have is the wind noise that kicks up at about 45MPH and up. There is a moon roof, but the noise seems to be coming from farther forward, where the windshield meets the roof. Anyone else notice this? Is there a service bulletin or work around? I was even kicking around putting an exterior "Moon Visor" on there, but I'm certain it wouldn't look too great! Well, I'd do it if that were the only way to fix it. Any other suggestions?

    TIA,
    Ornery
  • kinleykinley Member Posts: 854
    Wind noise is a fact. Headwinds are the loudest. Tailwinds are the quietest. Cause? The outside mirrors.

    Re:the differential. replace the lubricant with a synthetic. Now. Our factory lube turned to foam prior to the whine costing over 11 hundred to fix. That was at 97,000 miles. After getting a new set of plug wires the car runs on 87 octane again. IMO the price you paid is a very good deal for you. The 94 is an excellent automobile.
  • 0rnery0rnery Member Posts: 23
    Thanks tons for the info, kinley. I'll get that gear fluid replaced immediately!

    I listened closer today to the noise. It may be the 'A' pillars. If that's the case, I can adjust the doors to close tighter on the seal in the upper front corners.

    If it does turn out to be mirrors, I'll scream! I'll rip 'em off! I ain't listening to that racket, no way!

    Just ordered a set of floor mats and hood latch from the dealer. When I get those installed, and this noise taken care of, I'll be 99% happy with the car. It runs like a champ, smooth as silk. I do like it... A LOT!
  • kinleykinley Member Posts: 854
    Change the angle of the windshield so the oncoming air does not smash it so hard by lowering the rear of the car. Turn off the air shocks, switch inside the trunk, and compare the wind noise. There is an adjustment on how your car sets when the air shocks are "on" and just maybe yours are set so the rear end is "up" (more than it should be)causing the angle of the windshield to be less streamlined. The dealer's service tech can make the adjustment if too high.
  • navigator3740navigator3740 Member Posts: 279
    Another potential, but more psychological fix would be to drive an 85-89 Town Car, and compare the wind noise. Your 94 is a veritable mortuary compared to the 89!
  • 0rnery0rnery Member Posts: 23
    It does seem to be the mirrors, kinley. It comes equally from both sides, so it appears to come from the center. The 'A' pillars are well sealed. It does seem to be the mirrors after all!

    Guess what my next question is? Yep, is it possible to upgrade to the newer mirrors? I've read they were made to address this noise problem. Perhaps there's an add-on deflector available... ???
  • kinleykinley Member Posts: 854
    replace the two front doors with either 95,96, or 97 doors that have the repositioned mirrors already. Check out the wrecking yards and they will give you credit for taking in your old doors.
  • 0rnery0rnery Member Posts: 23
    Man, that is a great idea! One that would actually work, too. To be honest though, I was hoping for something a little easier and cheaper. I'll experiment with some type of wind deflector, concentrating on the gap between the window and the inside of the mirror. I've got to get a look at the positioning of the new mirrors to get an idea of what would work...


    Thanks for the help!


    BTW, are you and navigator3740 the only ones that hang out here now? Seems kinda dead! Anyone else a long time Lincoln lover? I just took my "1977 Town Car" on it's last cruise this past week. Bought it in 1982 for $4,800. Babied it quite a bit at first, but it became a daily driver about 7 years ago. Ohio rust got to it after that. I only hope this "94" lasts half as long!

  • kinleykinley Member Posts: 854
    It depends on the subject problem at the time. I'm here because we've driven Towncars since 1980. Our '80 had a 351 engine & it was the best, however, while parked in a lot, another driver suffered a heart attack in his MB, hit several cars and totaled our '80. We took the Insurance $ and bought an '82. That was the car that really developed my patience. We went so far as to install a Crower camshaft only to learn later the computer wouldn't enable it to perform. We went through seven Barimetric Manifold Absolute Pressure Sensors, before the dealer figured out it was the on board computer. After the new computer was installed, it ran like a charm, but not nearly as well as our 94 runs. When the 03's get the factory rebate to where there is 11 grand off of list, we'll spring for an Executive and that could be our last new car. Sorry about the rambling. Good Luck on your "passing wind" problem.
  • 0rnery0rnery Member Posts: 23
    ...passing wind :-D


    I just examined my wife's "1999 G. Marquis". It has the mirrors 6" farther forward and slanted back quite a bit. Not to mention being more rounded and "aerodynamic". If I get something working, that isn't a total eyesore, I'll post some pics.


    Thanks Again!

  • gdblakegdblake Member Posts: 18
    I have a '92 T/C and the engine quit on a trip to Tucson in April. I never had a prob. with this car before. I opened the gas cap and there was a lot of vacuum. After an hr., it started and I got to Alamogordo, NM, and had a garage change the fuel filter (it was ok), and check the pressure of the fuel pump (35 lbs.--30-40 is norm). It stopped again 60 miles from Tucson--vacuum again after releasing cap--started in 30 mins. The L/M dealer there wanted to do a DX and change the pump for $700. I declined--got home to TX and checked my gas cap and the VENT was stuck. I popped it open--lubed the plastic spring loaded disc, and it hasn't happened since. Also thanks to those suggesting changing the differential before 100k. I changed mine at 86 k, and everything was fine, but the oil was black. It cost me $25 at a quick change to have the cover removed, everything cleaned, and 3 qts. of 75-90 fluid.
  • navigator3740navigator3740 Member Posts: 279
    Lincoln fans are many, but they're often driving rather than surfing like us.

    Been driving Lincolns since 1990. Once they're in your blood, it's hard to get them out, I've found. Darn good, reasonably priced American Luxury, IMO. Keep passing that wind, ok!
  • rea98drea98d Member Posts: 982
    The way I deal with wind noise is to put in a Dixie Chicks CD and turn the volume waaaay up;-)
  • navigator3740navigator3740 Member Posts: 279
    Yeah, that works too.
  • remo9344remo9344 Member Posts: 4
    I purchase a used 2001 Lincoln Towncar with 9800 miles on it 2 month ago. I know have 11000 miles on it. My problem is that the ride is no longer smooth and as I go over manhole covers, small pothole, etc the ride is jarring and noisy. I have a 1997 Chev truck which goes over the same places with very little bump. I have friends with a 5 year old Cadillac and a 2 year old Buick Park Avenue. Their rides are as smooth as I would expect the Towncar to be. My dealer say everything on my car is to specification.. Are there any suggestions as to what the problem may be? Shocks, suspension, etc.
    Any help would be appreciated.
  • 0rnery0rnery Member Posts: 23
    Haven't had a chance to experiment with wind noise yet, but I have a possible problem at the moment. Whenever I turn the ignition off, I get 10 beeps of the instrument cluster tone. 10 beeps, waits 2 seconds, then beeps 10 more times. It does this until I exit the vehicle.

    I've got a Helm service manual for 1995 C. Vic & G. Marquis, but not for this 1994 Town Car. It doesn't mention anything about this type of warning. Anybody here know what this might be?

    TIA,
    Ornery
  • 0rnery0rnery Member Posts: 23
    Sheesh. I had one arm of my sunglasses inserted in the front of the moon roof slot. Not sure what switch up there was triggered, but that was the problem!


    Scratch that. My curiosity was killing me, so I went to see what switch was being made. Found these photodetectors" on either side of the front of the roof opening. My glasses were breaking the beam! Now, if I could only figure out what the purpose of these were...


    ...well, I do know the moon roof closes automatically when the car is turned off. It must be there to determine if somebody's body parts are in the way of the closing panel.

  • navigator3740navigator3740 Member Posts: 279
    Sounds like your tires are overinflated to me. My 92 Continental would do this occasionally, but it had the adaptive air shocks, and sometimes it would call for stiffer ride, then correct later. It wasn't often, but I don't think the T/C has that feature. Check the tires.
  • remo9344remo9344 Member Posts: 4
    The tires are 30lbs now, were at 28 and the ride was still rough.
  • 0rnery0rnery Member Posts: 23
    There's some guys in the "Mercury Message Board" squawking about the "firm ride" of the newer Grand Marquis. I can vouch for that. Our 1995 G. Marquis has a much nicer ride than our 1999 model. The '99 has a firmer suspension, which I assume is for better handling. I'm guessing Lincoln may have done the same thing with their newer models.


    You mentioned that "it's no longer smooth". Does that mean it was smooth when you first got it? Really, the only thing that could effect it is the tire preasure, as navigator3740 said, or the shocks. Is it possible somebody replaced the shocks?

  • kinleykinley Member Posts: 854
    "Touring" suspension can be superior in cornering and handling at the expense of a firmer (non floating) ride. You may have been blessed with the package. Some brands of tires do have a softer ride and some tires within the same brand have softer rides. Try Michelin Symmetry tires.
  • navigator3740navigator3740 Member Posts: 279
    If the ride changed, something had to be changed. If it's just firmer than you had hoped, you may have the touring car.

    When I took the Continental tires off my Navigator and put BF Goodrich tires on, the whole truck changed its personality. I was amazed at the difference, and not a good change, BTW. Seems the cars are best with the factory spec tires on them these days.
  • dbc123dbc123 Member Posts: 105
    You may have been blessed with it as posted above or you may have been cursed with it if you prefer a softer ride. Package was only available on Signature Series and is easily identified by the perforated leather seats, unique grill and dual exhausts. The spring and shock rates are both about 30% firmer. It may improve cornering slightly but is that really an issue for most TC owners? Ride is important all the time.
  • avon4meavon4me Member Posts: 1
    Hello all -- I'm buying a 1992 Lincoln Town Car Signature Series from a friend of mine and will be picking it up on Wednesday. Any suggestions on what to do first? LOL -- She said she puts a quart of oil in every month but other than that no problems -- Can't wait -- Nice to meet you all.
    Diana
  • remo9344remo9344 Member Posts: 4
    I do have the Symmetry tires and when I bought the car I seemed to drive on all good smooth roads. It shocked me when I when over some pretty good bumps and cracks in the road. At thst time I absolutely felt a "jarring" ride when I felt the ride would always be smooth or at least as smooth as my chevy truck which it isn't at all times. By the way it is a signature series but only a single exhaust.
    Thank you all for your comments.
  • 0rnery0rnery Member Posts: 23
    I'm a newbie here too, Diana, though I've always owned a Town Car. The first thing you should do is the scheduled maintenance including flushing all the fluids and replacing filters. Replace belt(s) and hoses as needed. Kinley warned me to throw some synthetic gear lube in the differential, which I have yet to do.


    The reason I haven't gotten to it is because I spend too much time detailing it! Just no time to do what should be done, but plenty of time to wash & wax, bleach the whitewalls, apply silicone to the rubber, condition the leather... but God it looks grand!


    The ride is to die for! Sorry yours doesn't suit you remo9344. I know just what you mean. I took my wife's '99 G. Marquis on an errand this morning... ugh. Corners like it's on rails, but that ain't worth much to me. Too stiff! If I had to drive that all the time, I'd drop the tire pressure to 24lbs or something. I'd sacrifice tire life for a better ride any day!

  • kinleykinley Member Posts: 854
    "Auto Week"predicts a style change in 04. Perhaps the bloated look will be diminished. Would adding a Vivid Red plus a tach be expecting too much. 003's seem to be of pale, plain, & boring colors.
  • navigator3740navigator3740 Member Posts: 279
    Maybe there's hope after all. There is a huge list of things wrong with this design, and style is just one of them. The interior was cheapened to the level of an Impala with leather, IMO. The dash is worse than uninspired, and it feels like Sears was the winning contractor on the components in the cabin. I feel the power train and frame elements are better than ever, but it just doesn't feel like a Town Car used to to me. Therefore, I have moved to the Navigator for now, but someday, when my knees are gone, I'm gonna want a car again, and if they don't really fix the Town Car, I'm gonna have to look around. Sad, after 10 years of loyal Lincoln satisfaction & ownership.
  • corsicachevycorsicachevy Member Posts: 316
    The Town Car was just redesigned for the 2003 model year. I can't imagine that Ford will do another re-design so soon.

    Navigator - when you say that the interior was cheapened are you talking about the new 2003 model or the 2002? To me, it would be very difficult to argue that the 2003 interior is cheaper looking than the 2002 interior. If you are talking about the 2003, what aspects of its interior are inferior to the previous generation? Just curious.
  • ehaaseehaase Member Posts: 328
    According to Automotive News, which is generally the most reliable source of information, the Town Car won't be restyled until 2006. It will probably use the same platform until around 2010 - 30 years after it debuted on that platform.
  • navigator3740navigator3740 Member Posts: 279
    I'm talking about the difference between the 97-98 on interiors, ie;

    1) Digital dash deleted in favor of ugly analog dials, with digital computer readouts for fuel computer, etc. An incongruous mix in an unattractive layout.

    2) Sculpted dash panel replaced with straight across flat panel, no character, no fun.

    3) Seat pockets deleted.

    4) Seats lack lateral support, no design, pleating or cushion.

    5) Door panels cheapened - no pocket under armrest in Executive any longer, no pocket in right door on Signature anymore.

    The list can go on. Then, there's the matter of the A/C blower, which starting in 98, does not move nearly enough air, at least for this climate.

    I just feel now, that getting into a Town Car, it no longer reflects a luxury feel inside. The Grand Marquis is much nicer inside IMO. Not saying it is a bad car, just way cheapened inside from the 95-97 models. I think sales kindof bear that out too. The Town Car used to outsell Cadillac DeVille during those mid 90's years. My friend had a 94, a 96, and now has a 2000. He's now looking at Cadillacs. This little freshening up just done did not address the inside, which was the biggest problem IMO.
  • brucelincbrucelinc Member Posts: 815
    I rented a 2003 TC while on a business trip this week. In the past, I have frequently rented TCs but this was my first experience with the new model. I am a pretty loyal "Ford" man and currently own a Lincoln LS among others. My comments are not meant to rile anyone up, but rather express honest opinions.

    Steering: I thought the new TC had a huge improvement in steering feel. The older ones always felt numb and a bit tiring to me - seemed like constant corrections were needed. The new model tracks straight and true.

    Interior: Again, a big improvement, IMO. Much nicer trim and appointments. However, I would like more lateral support in the seats and would welcome an optional bucket seat/console/floor shifter arrangement.

    Ride: This surprised me. While I welcome the stiffer structure, the suspension tuning really seems out of character in this car. The ride is stiffer and noisier than I expected. I am not surprised that a number of buyers coming from older TCs or Grand Marquis' find this set-up unappealing.

    Performance: Another big disappointment. I know the new model has a bit more power. However, it must also be heavier because my rental was the slowest TC I have driven in years. Why on earth they don't use the DOHC engine from the Marauder is a mystery to me. Performance-wise, this car is not competitive with a Taurus, let alone a De Ville or Park Avenue Ultra.

    Overall, I just can't help but wonder what Lincoln engineers were trying to do with this car. If the firmer suspension was aimed at us younger buyers, why not put a competitive engine in the thing? They could make the bucket seats an option, too. If all they care about are the taxi and limo trade, maybe the current version is "good enough." And, finally, will the firmer suspension tuning turn off the traditional TC buyer?

    My hope is that sometime the TC is again viewed as the "flagship" model of the Lincoln line. I personally do not think the 2003 version advances that notion.

    OK, slap me around if you think I deserve it!
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