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Comments
The headroom is a little tight. I'm 6'4" and I could use another inch or so of headroom. The nice thing is that there is some spare headroom right where the sunroof is. I usually tilt the seat back a little to give me some more room.
Enjoy your trip. I'm still looking for my first crusing adventure. Should be a blast.
I like reading the Bonneville forum, especially the guys who are modifying their cars. That intense01 dude is killing me. I thing it's safe to say that he has shredded his warrenty! I noticed that he is trying to sell his old parts. I'd like to see what his car can do once he gets it somewhat done.
Have a good one.
- vtech83
Nothing wrong with the previous generation of LeSabres. They're solid reliable cars with a great engine and trans. The styling and interior layout is a little bland for me. Buick really made an improvement with the 2000 models, inside and out. You won't go wrong buying one of these things. Of course, if you do, you'll bring down the median age of LeSabre buyers quite a bit. I'm 42 and even I'm a little young for a LeSabre, according to Buicks marketing department.
Rmnixon:
$17,500 is right about where a Custom would be with 14,000 on it. If they have the color you're looking for, I would get one. Plenty of room in the car for a family of your size. The trunk in the car is huge (18 cubic feet). Your should be able to pack alot of stuff in there. It's such a nice car to drive, too, much better than a minivan. Good luck. Join the club -- get a LeSabre.
- vtech83
You may want to check out the Bonneville SE as well - I bought a 2000 in January with 18K on the clock for $15,995. Most of these cars that are one model year old and have that type of mileage are former rentals. A check with CARFAX will tell you that - as on mine. Watch for cigarette smoke evidence - hard to get rid of.
The thing that swayed me to the Bonneville over the LeSabre is the bucket seat and console with floor shifter as opposed to Buick's bench - just tired of benches right now.
Another you should absolutely consider is the Impala. 2000 was first year and there a few suspension issues impacting some ( if not most ) cars. Check the Impala forum here and page back through - you'll get the gist real quickly! the base model there comes with bench, the LS model has buckets - very much like my Bonneville SE setup. Impala and Bonneville are more aggressively styled than the more conservative looking LeSabre ( another reason I chose Pontiac ).
The 3.8 L V-6 is OUTSTANDING and for long term reliability you won't go wrong with that engine and tranny. The Le Sabre and Boneville as well as Impala LS come equipped that way. The base Impala has a 3.4 L that is also good.
Minivans are so boring! You'll enjoy any of the cars I've mentioned - by the way - all use regular gas - have to watch for that these days.
Go for it - and be sure to rent whatever you decide on first - you will spend $100 to ensure you don't kick yourself afterwards over some oddity you didn't realize on a 15 minute drive ( like my bucket seats that are not as comfortable as they first seemed ).
Good Luck
Ken
Pontiac ups the ante with the Bonneville by offering dual exhaust in the SLE and SSEi models, 17" wheels/tires, stiffer suspension, and a superchared engine in the SSEi. The LeSabre only has a single exhuast outlet and no supercharged option, but then again, the LeSabre has never been a car for driving enthusiasts. The LeSabre has a Gran Touring package available which stiffens up the suspension and adds 16" wheels/tires. It does a surprisingly good job.
The bottom line is that both cars are solid, reliable, and have one of the best engines ever built. You can't go wrong with either car.
Good luck, Mr. RMNixon.
- vtech83
Thanks!!
Just my opinion - best wishes in your decision
Ken
Overall, the LeSabre has a good record of reliability. There are some reports of brake problems in various models, according to Consumer Reports.
I don't think the LeSabre can match the reliability record of the Camry, but as far as American cars go, Buick is usually the best bet. Pontiac cars of similar make should serve you well too, but Pontiac's reliability records I believe are skewed a little in the negative direction simply because people tend to drive those cars a little harder than they would a Buick.
- vtech83
Jim
Question about the touring suspension - do you find that it feels any different than when you first picked it up? The reason I ask is that I seem to remember others in this forum a while back complaining that the ride deteriorates after 10K miles or so. Other comments were that it is too harsh in general whereas the standard set-up is still plenty firm with the 16 inch tires. What are your observations?
BTW - feel free to join us in the Bonneville forum - we would welcome your insights and participation.
Best wishes with your "American Jag"
Ken
I guess you ordered the jacuzzi option on your LeSabre! You've got a hole somewhere, that's the only way water can get in from underneath. Your dealer is going to have to take your carpet up and see where the water is coming in. Good luck.
mrpoetryman:
Glad your car is giving you so many trouble free miles. The GT suspension is great, isn't it? The car still has a great ride, but the handling is there when you need it. Perfect combination.
tpken:
Still glad you're sticking your head in here from time to time.
Mike
---
Thanks for the introduction. Send me an email sometime and we can talk cars and kids. My suspension still feels great, no deterioration at all. Best riding car that I have ever had. Thank's for the invite to the Bonny forum. If I get a chance I'll mosey on in sometime
Mike
----
It certainly is a great combination. How many miles do you have on your's now, Mike ?
Neil
I drove my wife's Neon today and now really appreciate the comfort and quiet of the Le sabre!
I am planning to have a tow hitch installed on the Le sabre so that I can tow a small boat (trailer and boat probably weighs about 600 lbs.).
Does anyone have any advice as to the best type of hitch to use?
Cheers.
Best wishes to all
Ken
If the stereo were a little better and the "bucket seats" had more lateral support, I would just about call this the perfect car.
I just love the combination of ride, power, and handling this thing has. Buick keeps making this car better and better.
Enjoy your car!
Mike
Took my Bonneville in today for an oil change and to get a section of the headliner around the astroroof replaced (little loose when I bought the car; dealer said they'd fix it and I could pick it up the next day, but I couldn't wait! Finally got around to doing it) and they gave me a 2000 LeSabre for a loaner.
Spent the day driving it around and its a fine car indeed. Standard suspension, so a bit more body roll than I'm used to, but nothing excessive. I like the dash setup (far cry from my Bonnie!) and the bucket seats were nice. Definetly a great car, inside and out.
Oh, and also I wanted to echo Ken's invitation for anyone here to check out the Bonnie forum if you want. Maybe we can have a G-Body exchange program here...:)
Ok, I won't waste anymore space here. Take care, everyone and enjoy your fine autos!
Brian
Ken
Thank's for your response. I have the bench seat in mine, and I have no problems with the lateral support I get. I have the back support adjustment set all the way forward to the hardest setting. That might help with your support. Let me know if it does the trick. Happy and Safe Driving !
Neil
andrew47 - the LeSabre stereo, at least the Concert II system I have, sounds OK at best, but then again, I'm very picky about car sounds. The problem I see is that the sound as a whole sounds very thin. The bass response sounds very artificial and there is little or no midtone response. The highs come out well, but then again, the tweeters are mounted in an excellent location at the top of each door panel. Personally, I believe that the system could use a better amplifier and probably a couple of more speakers. The amplifier is located in the head unit and the wiring isn't there to connect an external amplifier easily. From what I've heard, you really don't want to mess around with this setup unless you want to replace everything, and even at that, you might run into some problems. My only adivce is test drive a LeSabre, bring along some CDs and hear for yourself. You might find the quality acceptable, but if I had my way, I would change several components to make the sound cleaner and fuller.
Tracking:
yoksor - My LeSabre had a bit of a tracking problem as well, but it was probably because I hit a rock about as big as a baseball the first week I had the car. Dealer had to replace the wheel and tire and they did align the front end again. No problems since. If you car is having a tracking problem, its either a real problem or you are driving on roads with a bad crown or alot of imperfections. Alot of dealers are blaming alignment problems on roads nowadays. My advice is find another dealer to have the alignment checked. If all else fails, try an independent shop. You might have to pay for the alignment, but if they can document the fact that the alignment was out of wack, you might have a case to take back to your Buick (or other GM dealer) for some reimbursement. Good luck. Remember, you should be able to take your car to any GM dealer, not just a Buick dealer.
Handling:
macarthur2 - Great minds think alike. I did the same thing to my car - I keep mine at 35psi. I feel it gives the car a much more confident feel, especially arounds twists and turns. At some point, I'll replace the 16" set with a 17" set. Just have to find a wheel I like first. Then I'm really going to attack some curves and see what this thing can do.
Reflection:
florence4 - I've got the same problem in mine as well. I've got a Taupe (tan) interior and the reflection is quite noticable. Most cars I've driven have some type of reflection, so this was nothing new. Darker interiors should hide the reflection more, but I think the LeSabre looks better with the lighter interiors. Just my opinion.
Mike
So as I'm admiring my work, I took a quick look at my LeSabre and realized that it might actually fit in the garage now. I measured the garage months ago and came to realize that even if I could get the car inside, there would not be enough room to move around. But now that I was actually looking at the garage, I thought there might be a chance.
So, I grabbed the keys, started up the now gleaming medium red sedan, and slowly pulled into the garage. When I got out of the car, I looked at the rear and I still needed another foot.
No sweat!! Moved the freezer to a difference wall, moved a few trash cans around, pulled the LeSabre up a little more, and ....
.... I now have a garaged car!!
Had to tell this story! I've owner a few darker colored cars and the sun is murder this time of the year. I have a car cover, but why use a car cover when you can use a garage!
Happy Motoring everyone!
Mike
If anywhere close to NJ border you may be interested in our proposed gathering in Rockaway off Rt 80 on Sun Apr 22 anytime after noon. We in the Bonneville forum hope to attract a number of cars to meet and check out great rides.
Any others (lurkers perhaps) in that area are surely welcome. Don't have to live nearby either - I'm coming from Maine!
Best wishes to you folks and your LeSabres
Ken
Sounds like a great idea, but that is a bad time for me. Maybe some other time.
Mike
Ken
I think I am spoiled for life..these things are available only in the top of the line sedans and you get used to them so fast.
Actually, my ideal garage would be two bays wide. really wide, and long enough to hold two cars in each bay. Also, I would love to have a garage that opens on both sides.
Getting the LeSabre in the garage was the icing on the cake. The real purpose was to organize the garage and get stuff off the floor. Even bought a bicycle mounting rack for my daughters bike.
Now my only problem is keeping myself from grabbing the nearest polishing cloth and going over the car everytime I walk into the garage. My neighbor was watching me wash my car the other day and made the following comment:
"You wash and polish that car more than I brush my teeth.
My reply was:
"You need to brush your teeth more often, then."
Later.
Mike
Now go floss that LeSabre!
Ken
-----
Thank you for the invite, but I can not make it on the 22nd. I live in Rockland County, New York. Maybe another time and place we can get together.
vtech83
-------
Hey Mike, you inspired me. Yesterday I cleaned out my garage and discovered that I have 4 extra feet of space that I never had before. Not enough room for a boat, but anyone know where I can get a good,used Harley-Davidson ? Hope all you guys are enjoying your LeSabres. Hey, anybody have any summer road trips planned ? I'm heading to New Hampshire at some point so far, still thinking of more to do. Keep on traveling !
Neil
Ken
Had check engine lights twice with this. Both times while the vehicle was idling in gear. (A parking garage exit that was really slow, and a very slow drive through.)
Anyway, I got the code from the first time which was a code 44, lean mixture or something to that effect.
I am looking for a troubleshooting flow chart. I didn't see it in my Haynes manual for the car. I just returned from my library and Chiltons doesn't have it either.
Does anyone know a good online exhaustive reference for that type of information? Or can someone post the troubleshooting tree for this code. I don't want to just throw parts at it.
But if I need to start pitching, I'm thinking:
1. Vacuum Leak/Intake leak.
2. MAF dirty
3. Low voltages
4. Bad O2 sensor
The light goes out when the vehicle gets moving.
Any thoughts, help etc. The vehicle drives well, but trips this light during extended idling.
TIA
TB
I drive up 91 and then goto Troy, just southeast of Keene. Stay at a Inn there, very nice. Thanks for the camp invite, might take you up on it.
Neil
Too bad there were no LeSabres there to round out the full sized GM offerings.
Ken
My mother has a 2000 Lesabre and has had a stalling problem. The car stalls and is hard to restart. Additionally, the electric door locks do not work when this happens. This really upset her as she couldn't get out the car (until I showed her the manual door lock ; )). Anyway, the car only has 3000 miles on it, new air filter, oil has been changed, etc. Also, no check engine light has stayed on.
Anyone else have a stalling problem and the also the associated "dead" electric door lock problem?
I have a 2000 Intrigue (yes, I'm now an orphan) and recently had a stalling problem that was caused by a crankshaft and oxygen sensor. Any problems like this with the 3.8?
Thanks,
Bryan
I had a feeling right away that I wasn't going to like this article. I was pretty much right.
The article was reprinted by The Times from an article by Jim Mateja of the Chicage Tribune. I felt that Mr. Mateja had a good overall impression of the LeSabre, but I also feel that he missed the boat on a few things.
Here are a few clips from the article:
" ... but the LeSabre is a machine for OFs -- or Old Folks. ... But then there's the styling, phoned in by the same outfit that does most full-size General Motors sedans -- Bland and Boring."
I'll be the first to admit that the LeSabre isn't going to turn heads on the highway, but I don't believe that Mr. Mateja is giving the LeSabre enough marks for styling. Most major automotive publications have given the new LeSabre (2000 and on) very good marks for styling, especially the Jag-type lines and the more aggressive look it has. Compare the new LeSabre to the previous model and the differences are apparent. I would hardly call the styling Bland and Boring.
" ... the $235 Gran Touring suspension that's tuned for a smooth ride with very little sacrifice in handling."
I don't believe that Mr. Mateja conveyed his feeling about the GT suspension properly. He makes it sound like the GT suspension doesn't detract from the normal handling of the car, as opposed to stating properly that it is supposed to firm up the cars handling with little sacrifice in road smoothness. At least he stated that this was one of the options to purchase.
"Forget the $190 optional memory seats/mirrors with power lumbar drivers seat unless you switch drivers daily."
I think most people would agree that memory seats and power lumbar are very desirable accessories. There is more than one use for memory seating, it doesn't have to be for two drivers. I use the Driver 1 setting when I'm alone in the car. With this setting, the seat is all the way back and reclined. I use the Driver 2 setting to move the seat forward a little and to tilt the seats upwards. This gives rear passengers a little more room when I'm playing chauffeur. Also, anyone who has tried to adjust a manual lumbar seat while driving would agree that a power lumbar seat is the only way to go.
I really get the impression that Mr. Mateja got the keys to a LeSabre Limited, drove it around the block once, and then wrote this article. He gave the car good marks for value, options, and reliability. At the same time, he really missed out on the opportunity to emphasize the direction that Buick is taking the car. Too bad that the LeSabre has, and probably will continue to have, a reputation as an "OF" car, especially with shallow reviews like the one from Mr. Mateja. I've been around cars a long time. I can tell the goods when I see them. The LeSabre has got the goods. The new edition of the car, inside and out, is a huge improvement over the previous model. Next time you review a car, Mr. Mateja, please give it a fair shake. The LeSabre deserves better.
Mike
Give me a smooth riding, spacious and fuel efficient full sized American sedan like LeSabre (or my Bonneville) any day. They handle better than ever and are still the best value for the hard earned dollar IMO.
Ken
Fair warning, I am about to shread this guy apart!
Small, imports. Period. He has never liked american cars. Maybe the Viper. I think he said something about the rear window being too small. His job is to critique every car that comes across his driveway, and find faults. He does a great job at it. The only other problem I personally have with him is the fact that sometimes he is dead wrong. I have seen him say something was not available on a car when, in fact, it was standard equipment. I have seen him say this is a great option when, in fact, it isn't available. I am not sure how he kept his job as long as he has or how he became an authority in the automotive industry.
On a lighter side, I look forward to reading his articles when they come out. Gives me a great hearty chuckle. Grats to you both for seeing through his typical bland and boring reviews.
Jeff
ps. I sell more memory seat options to people that have bad knees and backs. I am one of them and I'm 29. Having that exit position is nice..set it up to raise the seat and move it all the way back causes less stress on the joints when leaving. Then, when returning to the car, just hit the position 1 button, viola.
I'm a little concerned about this "Buick won't pay for diagnosis" nonsense. I believe that our cars have a 3-year, 36000 mile bumper-to-bumper warrenty. If the suspensions are making a creaking or groaning sound, there is a problem there.
Let me know how it goes, Karl.
Woodbuick -- any comments about suspension noises or problems that you have heard of ???
Thanks.
Mike
2001 LeSabre Limited
Medium Red Pearl, Taupe Interior
Says it should go off then come back on for 20 to 45 seconds if over a pint is missing. Afraid to go to dealer cause with this car it looks like it'll cost $200 just to make an appointment.
Thanks in advance for any insights you can offer.
Frank.