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High End Luxury Cars

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  • genes555genes555 Posts: 10
    I read in a magazine that said that MB had copied Lexus' flourescent display for the instrument panel. Now that I see it in person, I can see the uncanny resemblance. Shame on you MB.

    Also, anyone notice the Jag has copied the BMW in the front end and MB in the rear taillight design?
    Shame on you JAG.
    Well kudos for JAg for using a MB transmission that's supposed to be marginally better than theirs.
    and BMW using GM transmission in their current BMW 3 series and 5 series cars.

    regarding the resemblance in design between the MB s-class and the LEXUS ls430, i think it is a trend of the industry to have a piece headlights.
    the toyota supra had that since '93.

    regarding the imitation of the cars, i think major german and japanese auto manufacturers copy each other. and then the other european or asian manufacturers copy each other.

    I don't think it's a western vs. eastern culture thing because eastern culture because both cultures have taught each other a thing or two.
  • aimanaiman Posts: 61
    In my humble opinion, major corporations keep close eyes on their competitors moves so that they can outdo or not get outdone by their competitors. A simple example is the GM Onstar which was introduced a few years ago. Similar devices are now available on MB and Lexus (Lexus Mayday). Soon other manufacturers will compete providing this feature to their products. Eventually, they will compete by providing it to many econo cars. While some fans of certain manufacturers dislike this type of competitiveness since they cannot claim somekind of exclusivity of the brand they adore, most other consumers will only benefit from this and get better value out of their cars.

    Happy motoring
  • kappamankappaman Posts: 47
    Ya, the Japanese make the most reliable car, but they do copy style. Copying style has nothing to do with features. Copying features is ok. Japanese dealers have admitted to me that they copy. I don't know if they are that honest with anyone else. You are correct about the less expensive cars benefiting from techno overflow of competition.

    By the way did you see the new protype for the Q45. The pulled a Lexus. It look just like the new S-class Benz.
  • rollierollie Posts: 337
    Regarding post #198:

    kappaman, despite how the car may look in pictures, I can assure you it really doesn't share much style-wise with the new S-class Benz. I saw the 2002 Q45 at the New York auto show and while I haven't decided if I like it or not I can definitely say it doesn't copy the Benz (see the new Lexus LS430 for that). With 340 hp the new Q45 is returning to the roots of the first generation Q45 and away from the Buick-like path of the current Q45 (in my opinion - I'm sure there are those who love the current Q).

    Thanks.

    -rdo
    rdollie@mediaone.net
  • kappamankappaman Posts: 47
    Actually, I like the current Q, but it not up to par with the rest of the lot. I've only seen the picture of both S-class copies. I will have to take your word on the Q, but Lexus has been copying for years. They are all nice car though, and anyone who can afford either one of these cars in fortunate.

    The 340hp will increase sale for Infiniti in believe
  • bbng01bbng01 Posts: 6
    I have a question for you all. I am in the market
    to buy a luxurious reliable sedan. I have narrowed my two options down to either the Q45 or the Jag XJ8. Does anyone have had experiences with either of these cars? I have heard many things about both cars. The Q45 is considered to be a more reliable car then the Jag, though the style of the Jag seems slicker. I have also hear that the Jag requires more maintance then does the Q. So, I would to like know whether it is worth it to put out the extra bucks for the Jag? I have also considered the lexus ls 400 and the BMW 540, but my personal preferences have narrowed it down to the 2 sedan mentioned above. Any input is greatly
    appreciated thanks.
  • kappamankappaman Posts: 47
    I've never owned a Q45, but I've owned the S-class,740il,ES300,SC300, and presently own the Jag XK8 and Vanden Plas. Buy the Jag(98 up). I just test drive a 98 yesterday, I have a 96 Vanden Plas, the 98 is light years better, and the 96 hasn't given me many problem, but you can tell the difference in the cars. The others brands are not really anymore reliable, trust me. They all have their problems that are particular to them. Besides, Jaguar has the best warranty in the business. If you buy pre-owned you can get 6years,100k miles from original sales dates. So, you can actually get a better warranty on a used one(year of two old) than you can on a new one. Truthfully, either choice will be good. They all are GOOD cars...notice I didn't say great. Go with what you really want,no matter what it is. You are the one paying for it. An if you are in warranty, there is really no problem with either choice. The Lexus is probably a Little more reliable than the Jag and BMW and probably on par with the Q. Happy Hunting :)
  • jodys2jodys2 Posts: 9
    bbng01,

    I am a very satisfied owner of a 2000 Jag XJ8L. The car's style, ride and class are head turners. I have about 3500 miles on it now and have loved owning it.
  • ed95ed95 Posts: 1
    I am looking at a 96 XJ12 Vanden Plas, Do you have any experience with the V12? Every time I mention it to people they all tell me to be careful of expensive repairs and reliability problems. Any advice?
  • kappamankappaman Posts: 47
    I would advise against any V12. Basically you have two engines under the hood. A lot of heat, and that not good. V8 is all you really need. I own a 96' Vanden Plas V6 and have driven the 98 XJ8. Buy the 98' XJ8, it is a much better car. Thank me later.
  • q45manq45man Posts: 416
    We are a indepedent Lexus-Infiniti repair facility with 2 location in Atlanta our business is divided 50-50 between the brands (120 per week of each brand). the 90-93 Q45 provides twice the revenue of the same year LS400 models. The 94-96 models are about equal maybe 15% more for the Q per vehicle. The higher repair/failure cost are reflected in the lower resale value of the 90-93Q.
    But these we not really the same cars as to power, handling and overall performance so you have to expect a higher stress rate on the Q. The 94 Q was detuned, soften, and bugs corrected still it out performed most until 96.
    Just some info for those who might be looking at an older model.
  • scongroscongro Posts: 80
    On edmunds.com, they have a long-term XJ6 Vanden Plas that they just wrapped up. You will surely love the maintenence #'s.
  • kappamankappaman Posts: 47
    The long term review as to biased for my taste. I own a 96 Vanden Plas. Though I have a few problems with the car it has been just as reliable as the other luxury cars I've owned.

    First they took a used Vanden Plas. Wrecked the car. Then complained about it. I don't think the review was a good one. How many other used cars that they wrecked are being reviewed.

    There was a good review on the XK8/R though, which I also own. It was pretty accurate from what I have experienced. They cited the good and bad features of the car. Look at JD Powers list.

    For anyone who is debating getting a Jaguar XJ, the 98 and up is really where you what to start. I've driven the 98s and they are better cars that the 95-97. New engine,interior styling, electronics, etc..
  • glensterglenster Posts: 6
    I have enjoyed all of the previous postings here on Edmunds and I must say that many of them are quite humorous. Looks like most of you either love the product or hate it. And the same goes for the people who sell the cars. Well I am here to introduce myself to the boards. I just came over to Mercedes Benz after spending the last 5 years at Lexus of Beverly Hills as their Fleet Manager. I am now the E-Commerce for Beverly Hills Mercedes Benz. I am not allowed to solicit my business here, but I am able to at least offer my opinion and help in "aquiring" a new Mercedes Benz...(hint, hint, hint) So if you are looking to get a new Mercedes and not looking for the high prices or "snotty" attitude that is all to prevelant with my counter parts, I am here to help. The best way to reach me is direct via E-Mail at "bevhillsltd@earthlink.net For those of you who have purchased Lexus in the past, I am well known in the Lexus "chat rooms" as offering exceptional service and value. I offer special discounts only to Edmunds Memebers. At this time I cannot do any better than MSRP on CLK's and S classes...but at least I can get them!
  • mtl3mtl3 Posts: 22
    There's a little excerpt from the user agreement that you are or should be familiar with.

    >>I agree that I will not solicit or promote any products or services within the Town Hall site, and I will not use information supplied within the Town Hall to solicit or promote any products or services via email or any other method.<<

    And should you wonder why car salesmen ethics are often called into question, look in the mirror.
    (hint, hint)
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    That's real funny, you posted in every topic he did, but he isn't trying to "solicit". It seems a salesman is a salesman, no matter what they sell. Oh well.

    M
  • budfox057budfox057 Posts: 2
    i heard that the 2002 7-series bmw will be completely changed. can anyone verify this?
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    I would say so. BMW has a way of doing a last minute face-lift to an existing model usually during the model's last year. The 2001 7-Series is on sale now, so going by past experience the 2002 should be an all-new car.

    M
  • rob114rob114 Posts: 1
    Bud, I suggest that you and your wife drive the cars you're considering. All the analytical model comparisons in the world can't compare to a good ol' fashion test drive.

    btw, is your real name budfox or are you as big a fan of the movie wall street as I am? :>

    - Rob
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    Rob114 is correct. These are all great cars. You owe it to yourself to find a dealer (of each brand) that will let you maybe keep a car for a weekend. It can make all the difference in the world.

    Now on those choices. If you're satisfied with BMWs then get the 740i Sport, the 2001 models are on sale now, plus you can now get the Sport package on the 740iL if you need the room in back. Your dealer is correct, the 2002 will be all-new. BMW is notorious for giving their cars a face-lift for the last model year and they stick behind their cars until the very end. Hence the 2001 7-Series' facelift. Another plus to BMW doing this is that when the 2002 is shown (about next year this time) you might be able to tell from the pictures of the new car whether or not you like it, and the 2001's will still be around for you to get one if you like.

    The A8 is one of my favorite cars, but like the 740i it has aged, although it's not as old as the 7-Series. Quattro and all Aluminum construction make it the "different" one here. I personally am excited about the S8, but your wife may not want this "sports" model. The long-wheelbase A8L is probably the one to go with here.

    I don't like Lexus' cars so I'll just say that the LS430 promises to be a great car if oh-so derivative of a Mercedes. Loaded with features too, like the S-Class.

    Lastly, ahh the S430. Very good, but not enough power for me. Probably enough for you and your wife, but I would (if possible) make the stretch to the S500 if I were buying an S. The S-Class is to me the best looking of the bunch with all the features you'll ever need in a car.

    Take a lot test drives, your favorite will emerge I'll bet on it. Good luck.

    M
  • kappamankappaman Posts: 47
    Listen to merc1. Try them all out. Thats the only way you will know which is best for you. They all have their own charms, good and bad features. I've found that I have enjoyed something unique in each brand that owned(Mercedes,BMW,Lexus and Jaguar). I've also found that they all have maintence problems,some less than other, but it has been pretty even actually. But then again every car has something wrong with it.

    Although I presently on Jaguars, I would recommend the new S-class to someone in the market for highline luxury cars. My reason is that it is the only newly developed one in the pack. You can try it while waiting to see what Jaguar, BMW and Lexus will do next. Actually, the new Lexus LS and SC will be out soon, but if you buy the Benz you buy the original not the copy(Lexus).
  • automophileautomophile Posts: 780
    Since you seem to like performance with your luxury, you might consider the Audi 2.7t or 4.2. Speed (VERY fast), handling, confort, the world renowned Quattro drive, and a gorgeous interior that many feel is the best in the industry. It's worth a look!
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    Monday was a real "car" day in my area. I say this because after I had passed everyone through a stoplight I found myself all alone at the next light, or so I thought. The car that pulled up next to me was none other than a BENTLEY ARNAGE RED LABEL. (He was the old $millionaire$ type, cigar and all) This was the longest red light I had ever been in. Finally the light turned green and naturally the Bentley just kind of wafted away from the light, I proceeded to get into the left hand lane to make a left turn while still looking at the Arnage pass up to the right, and by the time I came to rest in the turning lane a Mercedes CL500 was flying in the opposite direction(!). This was straight out of a commercial. Unbelievable. This was the first time I have ever seen the CL on the street. I was starting to think Mercedes was lying about selling this car, but they are out there. Oh well just thought I'd share that. Then their was the time that a F355 Spider blew past me in Applebee's parking lot, but that is another story.

    M
  • kappamankappaman Posts: 47
    Test drove one at Lokey Mercedes in Clearwater,Fl. They are the only dealership that I've seen that has one to test drive. You have to get there before 5pm though. The manager drive it home every night an on some weekends. I've also seen two on the road and one or two Bentley's and Rolls,new ones.

    I enjoyed seeing a new DB7 coupe on my way to Orlando the best though. Even though it really the same car as my XK8 coupe, it was a rare treat.
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    What did you think of the CL?

    M
  • kappamankappaman Posts: 47
    The CL500 is nice as hell. I most admit the new S-class is growing on me, but it can't touch the CL500. The car is just the right size, the interior is nice(not as strange as the S)or as plain as the old S, and the design is really nice.

    As far as the ride is concerned, the S-class has it beat though. I felt a little shake in the steering column. I notice things like that in cars. My XK8 does the came thing sometimes. It may have something to do with the tires, I don't know.

    Would I trade in my XK8 for it? Yes. Maybe one day, but not yet. I need a little more time in the Jag.
  • budfox057budfox057 Posts: 2
    thank you for writing back w/ so much information. i agree that the test drive is the best way to determine what we want. merc1 i don't understand when you mentioned that bmw is notorious for changing the car in the last model year..please explain. and thank you both for writing..p.s. i'm a stockbroker thus the name budfox..my e mail is: budfox057@aol.com if you would like to say in touch..thanks again!!!
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    Hold off on trading in for the CL coupe, I believe their is a CL cabriolet coming in a few years. I think.

    Budfox057,

    Ok this is how they do it. The 2001 7-Series just went on sale, and it has body-color molding and trim now plus more standard equipment....even though the car has about 16 months to go. The did the same thing in 1995 with the 5-Series. The upgraded it for the 1995 model year and then the 1997 (no 1996 models were made) model came out spring of 1996. I like the way they do it personally, they wring everything they can out of a design before changing it, and the customer almost always benefits from this. Have you driven any one of your choices yet?

    M
  • kappamankappaman Posts: 47
    merc1,
    not going to trade in the XK8 yet. I need a little more time in the Jaguar. The convertible CL500 does sound good, but I like coupes more than convertibles. I can see a CL500 in my future.

    gstutz,
    I had a 95 740il. I think its the best all around luxury car on the market. Hopefully you will not have the electrical problems I had. Looks like you got a good one.
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    I wish I could see into the future that way. I see "only" a C320 in mine, or maybe an M3 or 530i. Don't know yet.

    M
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