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Just passing along info Houdini. It wasn't necessarily meant for you. If you have no interest then I would suggest that you ignore it. :P
which one below is the true performance enthusiast and which one is the poseur?
A) The person who is in denial that a DSG can outshift him with a manual tranny?
The person who picks DSG in order to get the best performance possible?
I guess the answer is obvious, dont you think?
I'm waiting to see the reports of the owners of the new MDX in about 6 months. Right now, it's still a bit early as I wait out the euphoria stage.
I will skip the one Isuzu and the Jeep Wrangler Unlimited Sahara which was rated by CR recently at a dismal "17." I don't believe I have ever seen a vehicle rated that poorly.
The person who picks DSG in order to get the best performance possible?
I don't think thats really it. Even Porsche admits that the Tiptronic 911 Turbo is faster than the MT version. That doesn't mean that those who choose to buy the MT are "in denial".
Consider hydraulic vs. fly-by-wire flight controls. Keeping a P-38 in the air was 100% pilot skill. Modern jet fighters are flown by computers, with the stick serving as a pointing device. How many pilots of today's fighters could pull a P-38 out of a spin or stall?
Driving with a MT is like that. Yes SMGs and even some manumatics can shift faster, but there's satisfaction in you rather than the computers doing the work.
2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460
Corvettes weren't created to be mated to an automatic transmission.
To defend sloth or laziness, you better be Johnnie Cochran, reincarnated. I'm no Marcia Clark!
DrFill
BMW AG 3L DOHC I-6 (Z4 3.0si)
BMW AG 3L turbocharged DOHC I-6 (335i)
DaimlerChrysler AG 3L DOHC V-6 turbodiesel (Mercedes-Benz E320 Bluetec/Jeep Grand Cherokee CRD)
DaimlerChrysler AG Hemi 5.7L OHV V-8 (Chrysler 300C)
Ford Motor Co. Duratec 35 3.5L DOHC V-6 (Ford Edge/Lincoln MKX)
Ford Motor Co. 4.6L SOHC V-8 (Mustang GT/Mustang Shelby GT)
Mazda Motor Corp. 2.3L DISI turbocharged DOHC I-4 (Mazdaspeed3)
Nissan Motor Co. Ltd. 3.5L DOHC V-6 (Infiniti G35)
Toyota Motor Corp. 3.5L DOHC V-6 (Lexus IS 350)
This list is a bunch of %&$#!
NEITHER of the Ford engines should be thur! The 3.5 because since THE LAST GENERATION Altima had similar power, and the Nissan and Toyota 3.5 easily overpower it. The 4.6 because it's just less efficient, and only as powerful as the 3.5 in the Nissan and Toyota! Plus it's crude in comparison.
This list should be kept to naturally-aspirated only. Not even the Prius' engine should make it.
Here's my list:
G35 3.5 (306HP, MT or AT)
Dodge HEMI SRT-8 (Many vehicles, 425HP, 6.1L)
Vette Z06 (7.0L 505HP, lightweight, 0-60 in 3.3)
BMW 3.0 (255HP)
Lexus LS460 (380HP from 4.6L, matching 5.5L)
Mercedes BlueTec Diesel
Ferrari 4.3 (483HP, 5-valves per cylinder)
Honda S2000 (240HP out of 2.2L)
2007 Toyota Tundra (381HP, 400+ lbs.ft from 5.7L)
Mazda RX-8 Rotory (1.3L, 238HP)
DrFill
Mazda's 2.3L turbo is more sophisticated than the rotary, and just a better engine overall. The rotary has very anemic torque (worse than the S2000 I think) and it guzzles oil like its going out of style.
You and I briefly chatted about this improvement much earlier in the year, and it has finally happened.
link title
TagMan
G35 3.5 (306HP, MT or AT)
Dodge HEMI SRT-8 (Many vehicles, 425HP, 6.1L)
Vette Z06 (7.0L 505HP, lightweight, 0-60 in 3.3)
BMW 3.0 (255HP)
Lexus LS460 (380HP from 4.6L, matching 5.5L)
Mercedes BlueTec Diesel
Ferrari 4.3 (483HP, 5-valves per cylinder)
Honda S2000 (240HP out of 2.2L)
2007 Toyota Tundra (381HP, 400+ lbs.ft from 5.7L)
Mazda RX-8 Rotory (1.3L, 238HP)
No biturbo BMW engine on your list?
This is the introduction of the very first straight six with twin turbos . This engine produces the level of responsiveness that has never been witnessed in any other turbo. Unlike other turbos this 3.0L biturbo runs as smooth as a regular BMW i6. The biturbo generates V8 power with the fuel efficiency of a BMW i6. And last but not least due to its two turbochargers this engine does not have the time lag that other turbos have. In fact based on my own personal experience time/turbo lag is practically non-existent.
Quite a phenemonal engine IMO. Especially when your consider the true performance specs of this engine. It has been proven by several reviewers to be far more superior than indicated by BMW official figures. Which makes this engine more superior than both the Infiniti and Lexus 3.5L engines on the Ward's List.
BMW could have built an engine with more displacement and higher fuel consumption but instead it chose build a sophistacated fuel efficient lighter engine that can generate oodles of power.
Impressive indeed!
My initial point was that calling someone a poseur because he is impressed with the way a DSG shifts does not at all make him a poseur.
No DrFill in this case your argument does not resemble Marcia Clark's. Your Top 10 List is another matter altogether
Oh and by the way I found out why there are no HELC engines on Ward's List. To qualify a car with a listed engine cannot have a price above $52K.
Uh, whose first I6 turbo? BMW's? If you mean world's first, I'm sure the Supra TT will have something to say about that. The old 2.8L Skyline GT-R engine was also a twin turbo straight six.
This could've very well beent the car sitting in my garage instead of the S8(maybe, maybe not).
Finally, an Automatic. Maseratti should know that we pesky Yankees love our big cars to be extra-smooth, and introducing the DuoSelect as the only tranny choice only added to the problems.
The ZF is probably the best 6-speed on the market right now. They couldn't have made a better choice.
OK let me clarify.
The first TT straight-six with high precision fuel injection and an all-aluminium crankcase. Is there any engine that fits that description?
Not that I know of. Both the Toyota 2JZ-GTE and Nissan RB26DETT engines were iron block\aluminum head SOHC, without any kind of VVT system or exotic fuel injection.
I still think the BMW 3.0L is arguably one of the best engines of any make.
Dewey, I agree the TT engine is deserving, and while not on the Doc's list currently, it might earn its way there over more time.
One thing for sure, you are mighty impressed with the engine! It's a winner, alright.
TagMan
That explains a LOT.
TagMan
I did, however, see a dark grey A8L the other day. It really caught my eye. It's handsome in all colors- but I think grey is very cool, if not the best. Of course, she doesn't like grey. Oh, well...
I guess green will have to do. It's no British Racing Green (we were looking at the XJ before), but I don't think that we'll be at much of a loss, because the A8 is undoubtedly a better car than the XJ8. You have to really want the retro looks.
Everyone, thanks for the advice. I'll put it to good use.
'06 Audi A3 2.0T DSG • '05 Audi S4 Cabriolet • '04 Lexus RX330
I hear you can hit a lot of home runs when you're on "The Clear" or The Cream". :surprise:
Give me a boost, and I can slam on anybody!
You'd be "Posterized"!
DrFill
Infiniti 3.5L 306hp
BMW 3.0TT 300hp
Audi 2.0T 200-240hp (in other markets)
Mercedes-Benz Blutec (E320)
Audi 4.2L 420hp (RS4)
Lexus 3.5L 306hp
Porsche 3.6L 480hp (911 Turbo)
Nissan 3.5L 270hp
Subaru 2.5T 250hp
Chrysler 5.7L 425hp (SRT8)
IMO.
'06 Audi A3 2.0T • '05 Audi S4 Cabriolet • '04 Lexus RX330
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Here it is, my friend:
link title
TagMan
Secondly just because they commercials are on all the time and get peoples attention doesn't mean they aren't lame because they are. Go the News and Views thread and look under the commercials board, Lexus is mentioned every year around this time as the most annoying holiday commercials going.
You really have to drink the Lexus kool aid to think that those awful commercials are moving the product and not the special deals.
Everyone will sell a jillion cars this month, not just Lexus. Yes MB/BMW would need help, or hire a new advertising firm to come up commercials so droll.
M
Deliciously complicates my choice: twin-turbos? diesels? 4.8 L X5 to please the boss? (Anything but an MDX!)
Whichever BMW I decide on, I do believe I will go with the color in the photo. Very nice. I have had silver cars for too long.
It's starting to affect my hair color.
Yeah. I dread December TV watching with the inevitable "December to Remember" Lexus commercials. Hopefully my next TV will have a filter which I can program to recognize such annoyances (like a spam filter) and spare me my displeasure.
I really don't like them either. Ordinary Lexus commercials are generally very good and very memorable ("dimpled panels" "robot fingers" "retractable roof building") even the new "wine glasses" one is ok, not great since it advertises probably the least useful part of the new car, but its still much better than these goofy sales event commercials.
The one area where I think traditional Lexus commercials fail is when they talk about the IS and GS. They still don't know quite how to sell performance yet. Even the "something wicked" way back in '98 was better than what I've seen for the new GS.
Do you think Lexus has been doing those commercials for 6 years because they weren't working?
Not only have they boosted sales in December, but they've even built a cottage industry for those Mega Bows that are put on the cars.
If I have time, I'll find the article that shows how the commercials success have not only raised the Art-of-the-Sale iduring the holidays, but influenced how other HELMs do business during the holidays. :surprise:
Stay tuned!
Everyone will sell a jillion cars this month, not just Lexus.
Comparing everyone's sales numbers to Lexus' is, at best, a reach. I expect better from you, Merc. When it comes to sales, there's Lexus, then everyone else.
DrFill
DrFill
Problem for Lexus is they've set the bar too high. They can only be compared to themselves.
Nothing will compare to the original LS commercials, or the 1992 SC commercial, and the MacBeth-themed GS commercials were excellent. The current GS commercials have followed the car into mediocrity.
The current campaign commercials are cute (Too cute?), but are very effective and successful. In effect, they are a lot like the Lexus vehicles themselves.
If some people want to talk about dread, let's talk about when the Germans dredge up a commercial. That's why I keep fresh batteries in my remote.
DrFill
As the Guinness brothers would say, "Brilliant!!!" :P
Oops there is one car missing? Where is the Lexus LS460?
Oh well at least they did not forget the MB S Class and Aston Martin V8 Vantage
2007 Automobile Magazine All-Stars
2007 BMW 3-Series
2007 Chrysler 300C
2007 Honda Ridgeline
2007 Mercedes-Benz S-Class
2007 Mazda3
2007 Lotus Elise
Aston Martin V8 Vantage
2007 Infiniti G35
2007 Porsche Cayman
2007 Chevrolet Corvette Z06
Why?
Is it because German ads focus more on the exciting features of their cars . Is it because their ads do not focus enough on Moments, robots, mega-bows and wine glasses?
Yesterday a 335i. The day before that a Lexus GS. Today a non-silver 535i and maybe tomorrow a turbodiesel.
Decisions, decisions, decisions?
I know the feeling. I have a roving eye for almost every tailpipe that passes by me. Except unlike you I intend to wait another six to seven years until I buy a new car
Sometime the chase is better than the catch.
2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460
Just so happens my major in college (didn't mean to shock ya' ) was in advertising of all things.
Those Lexus ads work for sure, so you are darned right about it. You'll get no argument from me on that.
But successful ads can still be disliked ads. Why? Because its more about retention and motivation. Plenty of folks are retaining the info in those Lexus ads, and are sufficiently motivated by them to actually make the purchases. From that standpoint, those ads are highly successful.
You are right, sir.
And I can't wait for January to stop seeing them.
TagMan
Life is about exciting moments, not exciting features. Which is the main point behind Lexus' successful commercials.
Tag
Wow! That post was so good, I can drop the subject right now! :surprise: Great job, Tag!
Hopefully, as a post-grad, you will be teaching Rebuttals 101 at the Learning Annex.
I can't wait to stop seeing those commercials either.
As it will mean I was able to slide through another year happy and healthy :P
And have witnessed one more year of Lexus dominance.
DrFill
They aren't all bad. VW's short lived "Fast" campaign was really stupid, but I have to admit that I laughed when I first saw the "Un-pimp mein auto" ads. I'm not the type that normally laughs at commercials. The new Rabbit commercials are just average.
Mercedes has done some really stellar commercials like "Falling in love again", and also some really lousy ones, like the most recent C and E class ads. I've never seen a C-class driver attempt a "burn out" in real life. (Is a C230 even capable of that?)
Same for BMW. Their ad for X-drive with the angels floating under each wheel was brilliant (Audi, hello, anybody home?), but the "independent company of ideas" ads reminded me of a fluff piece for somebody like UBS or GE. Yawn.
Audi's and Acura's are both really awful, in one ear and out the other.
Wow! That post was so good, I can drop the subject right now! Great job, Tag!
Well, that's just the way it really is... I have nothing to do with it.
one more year of Lexus dominance.
One thing here, though, Doc.
I suppose you are referring to "sales numbers".
When you look at the consumer marketplace, there are MANY products that are the number one sellers, as you and I both know, that aren't worth the time of day.
That "dominance" you speak of means nothing.
The number one selling food in a category may actually be bad for your health! Is it better?
The number one-selling deodorant just may be leaving a lot of stink unattended to. Is it better?
Bill Gates' Windows OS is the number one seller over the Apple OS. Is it more stable, less virus-prone, and does it operate better? NO, but it sure "dominates".
See ya later.
TagMan
Time to get a 3 year subscription. :P
I'm pretty lucky about the timing of my 545i lease expiration.
There are so many fantastic choices either out there now or coming soon, that I will only lease for 2 years or shorter (if they allow it). I want to experience as many of these great vehicles as I can.
I have never seen a car spot that is anywhere near as entertaining as the beer spots consistently are.