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Ford Taurus/Mercury Sable Sedans Pre-2008

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Comments

  • badgerfanbadgerfan Member Posts: 1,565
    If you are buying a new Taurus these days, you cannot get the 3.8 engine anyway, as it was replaced by the Duratec as the optional engine in Taurus/Sable when the '96 redesign came out. So no worry about headgaskets. I would bet any 3.8 engines they are putting in Windstar these days probably have a redesign to fix the headgasket problem anyway.
  • riswamiriswami Member Posts: 192
    I know that the 3.8 was discontinued in the Taurus (replaced by Duratec) in 96 and on models.

    My point is they continue to put the 3.8 in the Windstar and the Mustang. So don't bet on the Vulcan going away. I also wouldn't bet that the 3.8 head gasket problem has been addressed.

    As far as putting a four in the Taurus; maybe a reasonable stratergy if energy gets tight and the fours make a 20% or so improvement in fuel economy over the current v-6s.Also gas would have to increase by 50 cents to a buck a gallon fior most folks to consider a four. Right now fuel economy is not an issue with most new car buyers. Why should it be when gas is as cheap as it has ever been!
  • upsetter1upsetter1 Member Posts: 205
    500 is smaller because it is based on Volvo S80 platform. Though originally I heard that it is going to be a big car - between Tarus and Vic. May be they were meaning the interior space - the same tricks as with Focus - higher seating positions and etc.

    Taurus originally was thought to be based on Volvo, but after 500 arrival they decided to move to less expensive platform like Mazda6. Not bad to me, it should more sporty car, though I would rather go for Mercury Sable based on Mazda6. It ought to be of higher quality and more sporty than Ford. They also may shoose to keep Taurus as Lumina or Malibu Classic - just for fleets and rental. Why not Mondeo, probably it is more expensive platform than Mazda6.
  • danielj6danielj6 Member Posts: 285
    The leather seats in my Sable are really really cold in this New York winter. I wish I had heated seats because my old butt suffers in this weather.

    Well, yesterday I paid a visit to dealer service because the hood release handle malfunctioned in my S.W. They fixed it and replaced windshield wipers which were brittle. I should've bought an extended warranty. Mine expires in April 03. With an hourly rate of $85 + parts, the dealer is going to take me to the cleaners. After April I'm afraid my car will begin experiencing mechanical problems.
  • badgerfanbadgerfan Member Posts: 1,565
    I have often thought leather seats were overrated. Cold in winter, hot in summer, and when they age tend to get wrinkled and messy looking. Cloth seats suit me fine and are less expensive.

    I usually try to avoid dealers for service except for recalls due to their generally high prices. Fortunately, so far, little need to go anywhere for service with my '00. One insignificant recall, and two tire rotations is all it has been in for any service. I change oil, oil filter and air filter myself. With buying oil and filters on sale, I spend about $8-9 max per oil change also.
  • venus537venus537 Member Posts: 1,443
    "But to get their V-6 versions, they will tend to push you up to at about $23K or more (negotiated price, not list)"

    $23K just happens to be the list price (not negotiated) for the accord lx v6.
  • badgerfanbadgerfan Member Posts: 1,565
    OK, Edmunds lists MSRP with shipping for Accord LX sedan with shipping of $23460, with invoice of $21,159. Are there any incentives for Accord? If not, and given it is a new model, I doubt you could get it under invoice, right? Please go find one, bargain hard, and report back what you can buy it for.

    Meanwhile, many other Taurus and Sable owners have the proof they can get a well equipped one with DOHC for $18K. I have the proof sitting in my garage. Taurus SES, DOHC V-6. That you will notice is $3k less than I will bet you can buy your Accord LX sedan.

    Since you are obviously not going to change your mind, and the happy Taurus/Sable owners posting here are unlikely to either, I think it is fruitless for me to respond to your posts anymore. I will leave it up to someone else if they want to carry on.
  • riswamiriswami Member Posts: 192
    indeed. He drives a Jetta. Talk about over paying for a set of wheels. I owned one for 10 years. Like the car, had good luck with it, but parts are ridiculously priced.The Jetta was an 88; had a 93 Escort Wagon that held its integrity much better than the VW. But VWs are back in vogue, go figure.

    Taurus/Sable are good value. There is a large segment of the population that think they are inferior. Ford did that to themselves.
  • ehaaseehaase Member Posts: 328
    I have read that Ford has fixed the head gaskets on the 3.8L, but now the 3.8L has problems with the intake manifold that can harm or ruin the engine in the 60,000 to 90,000 range. I have read that all of GM's OHV engines, including the 3.8L, also have intake manifold problems that can destroy the engine in the same range.
  • regfootballregfootball Member Posts: 2,166
    kinda hilarious, if Ford can sell a DOHC Taurus for 17-18K, how is it all the GM lovers can whine so much about the 3800 engine saving them so much money on their car? I can't think of a single GM car with a 3800 engine that you can buy cheaper than the Taurus Duratec. Kinda kills that whole argument for GM fans right there.
  • pluto5pluto5 Member Posts: 618
    You can buy an Impala LS for 17K or even less using all available rebates, GM Card earnings and dealer discount. Max GM card earnings on the blue/gold card are still $3,500. You would probably have to do a factory order, though.
  • crusin14108crusin14108 Member Posts: 3
    I purchased a 2002 SES in Nov. of 2002. I really like the the car except for the ventilation system ,it doesn't seem to have a good air flow in any of the selector settings. Side windows fog and especially the rear side windows. Had dealer check out and they say it has normal flow. It's really annoying having to have the fan on high to keep windows clear. I have owned fords since 1973 and have never had this problem. Ford also needs to put in heaters for front seat, especially with leather seats. I live in Western New York an these leather seat are cold.
  • atcersatcers Member Posts: 26
    Venus537 isn't worth the effort. While he isn't uncivilized in his conversation he is somewhat of a "troll". He owns a VW yet finds the need to post quotes from this board with his own questions. Then when someone responds he doesn't answer. Search how many posts he makes on the VW boards versus here!
  • danielj6danielj6 Member Posts: 285
    Leather seats are not only cold in winter and hot in summer but also, in my opinion, unnecessary. Mine are also of a light color and they get dirty. However when I purchased my S.W. the dealer didn't
    have any other with cloth seats. I frankly didn't even know at that time whether or not I could get a Sable/Taurus well equipped without leather seats.

    As for dealer's service, I used to hate it and, in fact, I had my previous vehicles serviced at a private shop. Well, since I began taking my Merc. to the dealer, service has been considerably cheaper than at he private shop.

    If I were to trade at this point in time, I'd go for either another Sable or a Taurus.
  • regfootballregfootball Member Posts: 2,166
    leather warms quickly in winter and holds your body heat....gets all toasty on the rump.

    leather cleans easier. yes, you do clean your seats don't you? when you kid or dog yacks on the seat you wipe it up. With cloth, gotta shampoo it and hope the odor doesn't stay in it.
  • regfootballregfootball Member Posts: 2,166
    an Impala for 17k will only have the 3400 and you'll need to use your GM card with a lot of bucks on it to get a 3800 version for that price. Lots of folks don't have a GM card.
  • cds12cds12 Member Posts: 139
    Why in the hell would anybody in their right mind buy a new Ford Taurus?

    This is a seriuos question. Make your case Taurus owners.
  • ezaircon4jcezaircon4jc Member Posts: 793
    Because they are a great value and every bit as good as a Honda or Toyota. I've had 4 Sables, sister to the Taurus.
    1986- 50K miles, no problems, Vulcan. GREAT mpg.
    1988- 125K miles, no problems, 3.8L. Very good mpg.
    1991- 175K miles, no problems, 3.8L. Very good mpg
    1996- 115K miles, no problems, Duratec. Best mpg was just over 25

    The '88 & '91 had the 3.8L engine and I did not have the head gasket problem. The '91 & '96 needed a water pump and A/C clutch around 100K. The '91 needed PS hoses around 150K. They all needed tires, struts and the normal wear-out items. We still have the '96 and it runs as well as the day we brought it home almost 7 years ago. Were I not in the financial position I am in, we would have a 2000 Sable in the garage instead of the Lincoln LS that lives there now.
  • iusecadiusecad Member Posts: 287
    too bad no one in here is on trial.
  • edmund2460edmund2460 Member Posts: 293
    I'm not Ford bashing (actually I'd still buy one if the price is right). But on my 93 Sable GS 3.8L(purchased used with 20K from dealer) I had the following unscheduled maint. Windshield replaced,repair to pwr steering (don't remember what the fix was) to correct a problem with lockup of the steering but it was expensive and two recalls during warranty. Between 36K and 100K I had - radiator replaced,pwr steering hose ($300 job),engine mounts,A/C compressor,head gasket, transmission. Not to mention starter and water pump (which I consider normal) Curiously my 89 Taurus wagon had the same problems except for the gasket. In addition it needed a new rack around 100K. ( I think my Sable is leading up to a rack replacement too, because its making the same noises)The trans was skipping at 110 when I traded the Taurus.. To me it means that very little was done to address supplier quality between those years (89->93)for both cars to have exhibited the same list of problems.
    On the positive side the 3.8L is a smooth engine and is still running strong at 114K and does not burn oil. I have always maintained my cars religiously. Also the pwr windows and locks have had no problems on both cars.
    I think Ford should make quality their sole focus instead of trying to boost sales with new concept cars.
    I also think that they don't (or didn't in the past) care to retain customers because their first reaction to a widespread problem (like the head gasket) is to deny it, to keep costs down. Jac Nasser may have had something to do with that philosophy...
  • edmund2460edmund2460 Member Posts: 293
    I need to replace tires on my 93 Sable. Have any of you Taurus/Sable owners had any experience with Bridgestone Turanzas? I'm primarily looking for ride/quiet and thought there may be a cheaper alternative to Michelin X-1's.
  • pluto5pluto5 Member Posts: 618
    We shopped the Taurus but decided on the Imp LS as a better value. Actually, you can get the LS with the 3.8 for $17K if you have enough GM card earnings and do a factory order. With the new, unlimited earnings GM card you only get up to $1750 rebate but it should still help you get an LS for a little over 18 K with the 3.8.
  • regfootballregfootball Member Posts: 2,166
    PLUTO NOT EVERYONE HAS A GM CARD!!!!!!!!!!

    "Actually, you can get the LS with the 3.8 for $17K if you have enough GM card earnings and do a factory order."

    Without the GM card, you still can't match the Taurus pricing on a Duratec vs. 3800 comparison.

    Plus, the Taurus is better looking, inside and out. Sable too.
  • regfootballregfootball Member Posts: 2,166
    Well, I basically bought my SHO because it was a SHO...(a 99) and I previously owned an 89. I bought the Taurus because GM sedans bite and I couldn't yet afford an import or luxury marque which I would prefer.

    I rented a 2000 Taurus once and thought it a nice car as well....I admit, its mediocre in comparison to some of the most recent additions to the sedan market. However, its probably the best value out there for a car that has some tech in the powertrain and doesn't have the overall cheapness of some of the GM products.

    I think Ford could improve the current Taurus with some tweaking however. But tell me what other car can you drive and not get scorned at like you would with a Grand Prix, and have an up to date powertrain, solid ride and handling, interior with decent plastic, good space, and reliable overall? Taurus....the Duratecs are extremely solid and reliable.

    Rode with my brother in law yesterday in his 97 SHO. 134 thousand miles on it now and NO PROBLEMS. Sounds and rides as tight as my 99 with 50 thousand on it. He thinks it will go to 250k no problem. Still looks new. He may put struts in it soon though.

    Another friend I have had a 96 and 97 as company cars and both were very solid in 170,000 combined miles.

    Factor in the good prices new and used, and a Taurus is a real solid buy. The car is not class leading, but is a better purchase decision than lots of other alternatives, either from a cost, or reliability, or looks standpoint.
  • danielj6danielj6 Member Posts: 285
    Taurus is a safe, powerful, comfortable car. It comes better equipped than the Japanese. It generally carries lower insurance premiums that the "hot" Camry and Accord, Taurus' parts are cheaper than the veritable Japanese brands. Ford gives nice incentives in either cash or 0% financing. Overall, is a better value than Accord and Camry, and is easier to buy. I don't care very much about depreciation.
  • ehennessehenness Member Posts: 92
    To reply to a couple of older posts:

    I think it was Pluto5--I'm agreeing with you on the GM 3.8. It's ancient in terms of original engineering and when it began life. It's been constantly updated, and the fact that an engine designed in 1961 or so is still viable (and very much so) just proves the soundness of the design. It's very much like the 737 (nice analogy, BTW). That design is about as old, and yet it's still competitive versus the newer designs from Airbus because Boeing has kept improving it (I think they're up to the 737-700 and 737-800 now).

    Also, I think you made the point that you prefer the 3.8 to the Vulcan, having driven both. I'm sure that's true (it's been a while since I drove a GM 3.8); just don't forget that the GM 3.4 is more of a direct competitor to the Vulcan in the size range we're talking (say Impala vs Taurus). The Duratech makes a better comparison to the 3.8.

    Moving on to a more on-topic reply :-)

    I've had Bridgestone Turanza RS-Ts on my '98 Taurus for 5000 miles now. I love them. The local tire shop (not Firestone) recommended them, based on my desire for decent snow and rain traction, a decent ride and handling, and good treadlife. They said I could go with Michelins, but they were $20 more per tire, and he didn't think it was worth it.

    The store has a 30-day ride guarantee (full credit for other tires if you don't like them), and they have not replaced any yet. I can see why. They have great traction in snow and rain, and they handle well (much better than the General G4S tires the car came with). They are rated for 80,000 miles, as well.

    I think Bridgestone themselves have a 30 day ride guarantee as well (look at their website to check) and so maybe you want to try them that way. I love mine, and I see no reason (nor did the tire guy) why I'd need to spend more on the Michelins.

    BTW, for those who may be leery because they're Bridgestones and that means they're related to Firestones, the Turanza LS-Ts (probably all Turanzas) are made in Japan. They are not a rebadged Firestone tire, nor are they made in one of the plants that made the Explorer Firestones...
  • ohio7ohio7 Member Posts: 67
    I have to agree with bagerfan, also - why do you get on this board and try to convince OBVIOUS Taurus and Sable lovers that a Jetta (snicker) or anything else is better for us. You should be on the VW board where you can knock Tausus/Sable to your hearts content.

    venus537 - you ARE the weakest link - GOODBYE!!
  • badgerfanbadgerfan Member Posts: 1,565
    Guess what Venus537 posted in the Honda Accord discussion, post 8297:

    "my local dealer doesn't have any lx v6 models. i guess they're using all the v6s for the ex models."

    Could it be that Honda is listing an LX V6 in their product lineup but not actually building any of them? Sounds like a type of bait and switch to me-get the buyer who wants a V-6 Accord in the door, then switch him up to a higher priced version because the LX V-6 they make so few of.
  • ezaircon4jcezaircon4jc Member Posts: 793
    Actually they are up to the 900. Mostly the different series' designations are lenght, engines and avionics. SWA bought a bunch of 300 series', which had the most advanced avionics, but didn't certify their crews or planes to take advantage of the systems. They have since rectified that situation. The bad part of the electronic "upgrades" is, as one pilot told me, they are becoming really good secretaries and not so good pilots (relying too much on the automation).

    Now to stay on subject. Due to my overtightening of the pan bolts I have to get a new pan gasket on my Duratec. $500, YIKES! I guess I need an in/lb torgue wrench!
  • venus537venus537 Member Posts: 1,443
    a little touchy and defensive. you misstated the price of the accord lx v6 and i was simply correcting you. i didn't mean to slam on you. many posters have said that they're getting their accords near invoice (i do hope this is true). so you're correct, that's around a $3K difference. not the $5-6K if the negotiated price of the accord lx v6 was $23K.

    true, accord lx v6 models are more rare than the ex v6 models. but i will not be baited to something i don't want.
  • badgerfanbadgerfan Member Posts: 1,565
    I am just tired of having to defend a position which I feel is very valid: Taurus is a family size car with good reliability and solid build quality, decent acceleration with a reasonably "sophisticated" 200 HP DOHC V-6, good handling, and is still reasonably priced. Yes maybe it is not "best in class" but it is close enough to be a good choice, especially when you are paying thousands less for it. You can argue about how many thousands less it is , but I think it is a definite fact you will not find a new V-6 Accord or Camry nearly as inexpensive and widely available as a Duratec equipped Taurus/Sable.

    Venus, from your last post, are you now saying you would have to pay about list price of $23K for an Accord LX V-6? If so, then we are back up to about a $5K difference. If you believe you can get it at about invoice, then we are into the $3-4K difference.

    In any case, can we agree that Taurus is a good value, even though it may not be best in class? Test drive a new Duratec equipped Taurus or Sable yourself and even you may grudgingly agree.
  • regfootballregfootball Member Posts: 2,166
    amen badgerfan.

    I'll add that a Taurus is a lot more defendable than say, a Century or something of that ilk.

    Yeah the Taurus will not win a C/D comparo, yet the overall package is underated by a lot of folks IMHO.
  • venus537venus537 Member Posts: 1,443
    i agree that the taurus is a good value and with your points in the first paragraph. look at this way, no need for you to defend your position for i'm the one willing to pay the thousands more and it's me who's doing the defending.

    you're probably right about the switch and bait with the accord lx v6. the local dealer has 24 ex v6 accords and only 2 lx v6 accords coming in. i don't know if one could get an accord lx v6 at invoice but it's probably less likely than getting the more expensive ex v6 accord at invoice. i just love those marketing people.
  • edmund2460edmund2460 Member Posts: 293
    Thanks for the info. I like my local Firestone dealer and have bought quite a few tires from him, but they were mostly for cars not driven on trips and for which ride was not important. I think I will try the Turanzas. One last question are they quiet? I have found that the other Firestone/Bridgestones I have had were all noisy.
  • phatbunsphatbuns Member Posts: 20
    I had Pirelli P400s on my Sable for years, good wet and dry handling tire. Currently have Dunlop SP sport A2 on my Taurus, very good also. Be really fussy about tires - cheap tires defeat averything else in your car, like cheap speakers on a good stereo.
    Great info on tires at Tire Rack, you can redo the search based on preference for handling, smoothride/ quiet, etc. When you open the link you may have to refresh (F5) to view the page:

    http://www.tirerack.com/tires/SelectTireSize.jsp?autoMake=Ford&am- p;am- p;am- p;autoModel=Taurus&autoYear=1993
  • ehennessehenness Member Posts: 92
    I've never had the Turanza LS-Ts on any other car (they're new for 2002), so the only comparison point I have is with the factory-issued General G4S tires the Taurus came with. The Turanzas are slightly quieter than the Generals; I don't find them objectionably loud. The ride is better, the handling is much tighter, and the traction is much better (especially since the Generals got hard and began sliding on slightly hard braking even though there was plenty of tread and the air pressure was correct).

    If you go to a local dealer (and a Firestone/Bridgestone one at that) they should be aware of the 30-day ride guarantee. It might be a pain to go back again, but you'd at least get to try them for yourself and get the whole price back as credit for something else if you dislike them.
  • bcohenbcohen Member Posts: 58
    My wife went on her own and picked out some "cheap" tires at Discount Tires...the Dominators for her Taurus. But, I'll tell you, they are actually really good tires so far for wet, dry, and snow. We'll see how long they last, but so far I would highly recommend them. Good value.
  • jpelderjpelder Member Posts: 235
    I must be one of the last people on earth to drive a taurus, but this week I finally got one for a rental (I usually end up with a GM or Toyota).

    Overall, I think the car is good in about every area. It was very solid, good fit and finish, reasonable power at all speeds. After a week, I felt like I had a toyota as it was quite competent, but not impressive, in most areas.

    Downsides: Seats were firm but not supportive. Very bland styling even though they were base equipment. CD stereo had inferior sound compared to base Delco systems. Ride was too firm and a bit loud, but some people prefer to call it "sporty" so I guess that is subjective. Engine was a bit weak on the Torque side, but not bad. The engine computer had a bit of trouble regulating the choke when starting, but the temp. in Maine was -15F that morning so I suspect other cars had problems too. The car (idling) was on the verge of stalling for the first minute. Didn't notice a recirculation button for climate control.

    Upsides: Tight handling, radio controls were numerous, but logical. I like how they eliminate the double duty buttons found on some radios...an Improvement over past Ford systems. Good gas mileage. Solid build...the doors have a vault-like feel, very nice.

    Overall, my driving experience was much like driving a toyota, bland but very competetant. However, it feels much more solid, and I would buy a Taurus over a Toyota/Honda in a heartbeat.
  • badgerfanbadgerfan Member Posts: 1,565
    Being a rental Taurus, it likely had the base engine Vulcan V-6. The Duratec V-6 is definitely a big step up for not a lot of money. I prefer firm seats and firm but not punishing ride, and have not noted the seats to be unsupportive. You may have gotten the base manual drivers seat in your rental as well, with less adjustability than the power seat in my SES.

    Again, as I have stated before, Taurus is not "best in class", but when you look at what you will pay for it, it is a good choice. Almost all the bells and whistles for actual buy price of about $18-$19K. I would have to think long and hard to spend another $3-$6K to get the "perceived" better features/performance of V-6 versions of the CamCordAltiPassats.

    Of course, if you lease or trade often, then maybe your decision process is different due to the effects of less depreciation of some of the foreign badged competitors. If you buy outright and keep your car a long time like me, then depreciation means nothing.
  • sculldog33sculldog33 Member Posts: 19
    R&T did a comparo of the Accord, Mazda 6, Altima, Camry and Passat, all with V6's and heavily loaded. Ford not included due to lack of available test car. Several interesting things struck me from this article.
    1.) Prices on the competition are scary. VW=30,400, Camry=31,484, Altima=28,687, Accord=26,260 and Mazda=24,400. Not included in the comparison is the Maxima, while also hits the high 20s / low 30s. These are MSRP but even the shrewdest negotiator isn't likely to come close to the 18-19K you'd pay for a loaded T/S with an MSRP of around 24K.

    2.) Based on numbers alone, which I realize don't always tell everything about a car, the T/S holds it's own against almost any measurement - speed, handling, interior room, etc. In fact, on the space categories, it wins more often than not. Yes it's an older design that needs to be updated to stay competitive, but price is it's big trump card.

    3.) All isn't rosy for the T/S. For example, Ford shouldn't have gone cheap with the rear drums. Braking is clearly a weak point for the T/S and rear drums on a 3500lb car can't be helping. Ditto for the de-contented dual exhaust which would probably add some more hp and torque. 200hp barely cuts it these days with the new V6 family sedan standard about 220-240hp. Heated seats should also be an option on the T/S given all the higher end models that ship with leather standard and given that most of the competitors offer it. Same for the traction control/power passenger seat/side airbags option which lists for roughly $400 but which I couldn't find on any of the cars in my area back in 2000 at least. Given the fairly insignificant impact on the bottom line, these should be standard. (this is Ford's bread and butter family sedan so why wouldn't most families want better traction and safety for maybe $3 more a month on the payment.)

    4.) However, the T/S's win in the engine category in terms of fuel - all the other cars require premium 91. Incremental fuel costs over the life of the car would add up.

    5.) Finally, imagine if Ford worked on the T/S even a little. Presumably Ford makes money on these, even if the margin is low. Selling 400,000 of these must have a positive impact on the bottom line. Could boost the engine a bit (easy since the Duratec lives in Lincolns/Jags with more power), up the content a bit (brakes, exhaust, better quality leather, heated seats, traction control, power antenna, fancier hinges in the trunk to free up more space, toss a subwoofer in the trunk to boost the MACH audio option, audio controls on the steering wheel, maybe zenon type headlights/driving lights as an option, etc.), then make 17" alloys with 215 size tires an option. Instead of the current 18-19K out-the-door price, do this for say 21-23K, then market this thing properly and sales would likely take off even more. Many of these changes could also be offered only on the top-end models, so folks looking for a 16K GS would still be covered. Problem is that for the Sables at least, it would be hard to justify the price on a V6 Lincoln LS when the two could be parked side-by-side in the showroom.

    Bottomline is these are solid cars for a great price but with just a little more work, they'd be unbeatable.
  • regfootballregfootball Member Posts: 2,166
    agree on a lot of those points, but so many shoppers nowadays see the Taurus as so familiar looking they just bypass it anyways.

    Owning a 99 SHO I see the benefits of things like 4 wheel discs. When I rented a 2000 one time and drove through hilly country it freaked me out because the disc/drum brake setup was so scary in comparison!

    Ford would have to do a reskin to recreate interest in the car again for a lot of people, as they still see the silhouette being too familiar to the 96-99....i think this is what hurts it the most in the market, still too roundish for many in a time when creases are envogue. Too bad the Mondeo is not here.

    I think as far as Taurus Sable goes, make the 200hp duratec the standard motor and make an option for an uprated Duratec (with vvt). Just pluck the engine from the Mazda6 or Lincoln LS. Make it about 230hp.

    Redo the styling as much as possible without having to redo the structure of the car....i.e. reskin on the cheap to get rid of more of the oval look.

    Either redo the dash and door panels again or upgrade the materials and controls on it now. Make more comfort options, like htd seats and give us nicer leather. And how bout a DECENT sound system, something that rivals an aftermarket system maybe instead of continually offering these cheeseball factory systems. An mp3 player input maybe?

    Then, to add interest, let SVT take a shot at using the vvt duratec and tune it to about 240-270 hp and get a Getrag manual tranny and make a Taurus SVT. Try to keep the price of the SVT Taurus reasonable (i.e. not over 30k). The orginal SHO always generated a lot of interest in the Ford line and I think Ford needs to offer a performance Taurus again. If they can make a limited number of Focus with special manual transmissions every year, I see no reason to not do it with the Taurus. Even if SVT sold 5-10000 of them it would restore part of a special image to the Ford Taurus.

    Of course in my fantasy world, they take v8 Taurus duratec based motor and pump it up to 300+ hp and offer it in an AWD version. The v8 SHO motor is based on the v6 Contour motor (v6 + 2 cylinders). If they took the Duratec 3.0 vvt motor and made a v8 out of it and performance tuned it through SVT, they would have a 4.0 litre v8 with vvt, and then they could microfinish the intakes, etc. and get about 325hp+ out of it.

    I think most would just be happy with a performance v6 though. I sure would.
  • upsetter1upsetter1 Member Posts: 205
    Some weak points on Sable:

    Rear drums. Though I have no probelm with it, I kepp a distance usually, sometimes it may be scary, because the car accelerates really fast and you don't notice it until you suddenly have to stop ASAP.

    Seats are comfortable - more comfortable than in Camry. Actually Camry is the closets car to T/S in the market. But in both Camry and Sable I have a problem to find good driving position even though they both have power seats. Also I think that in both steering wheels are too far away (or pedals are too close). BTW I see no advantage in adjustible pedals, unless you are asian, so they should drop that feature to save money.

    AT. Doesn't work properly like in other cars, like in Camry e.g.

    Engine noise may be too harsh atlow rmps, but actually I like it. Driving Camry is more like driving an electric car. You don't feel engine and car. Everything is too smooth.

    I like how constelation of buttons are shining in the dark of the night, though to use them may be a challenge on the freeway.

    C-pillars on Sable are too thick. I have a problem with visibility. Car also could look better with thinner C-pillars in Jaguar style.

    Generally ovaloid style is getting a little long in the tooth. They should restyle it more in Lincoln or Jaguar style back in 2000.
  • ehaaseehaase Member Posts: 328
    Although it would have been more cost effective (just as GM is upgrading instead of replacing its W body), Ford isn't going to upgrade the Taurus in any way, with the 500 and Freestyle coming out in less than two years.
  • venus537venus537 Member Posts: 1,443
    my understanding is that the mazda 6 runs on regular unleaded gas and the accord can run on regular unleaded gas (the 240 hp is based upon regular unleaded gas and jumps to 250 hp if you want to use the premium stuff).

    one other thing ford should address with the taurus would be an improved automatic transmission.
  • upsetter1upsetter1 Member Posts: 205
    Mazda6 uses Duratec with modified head - VVT and VLI. Duratec was designed for regular gas.
  • bcohenbcohen Member Posts: 58
    One of the car mags (I think C&D) had a small spy shot of the revised Taurus for 2004. They've gotten rid of any hint of ovals now.
  • atcersatcers Member Posts: 26
    Premium gas has a higher octane rating! Higher octane gas does not produce more Hp even in a Honda Accord V6!!!! Octane ratings are a measure of inflammable liquid content for fuels. Higher octane fuels burn more slowly than lower octane. It does not give an engine more power or increase it's performance. It may however help eliminate pre-detonation (pinging). Octane requirements are based on engine compression.
  • badgerfanbadgerfan Member Posts: 1,565
    Your statement is not entirely accurate with some of today's electronically controlled engines.

    Some manufacturers will rate their engines at a certain HP based on use of high octane fuel, but will allow use of regular grade. Then, if the owner uses lower octane fuel, the engine is equipped with knock sensors and automatically adjusts the timing which slightly reduces preformance, to keep the engine from knocking (premature detonation) when using the lower octane fuel.

    The difference in performance on these engines is usually pretty negligible whether you use standard grade or high octane fuels.

    If the mfr recommends only use of high octane fuel, they probably designed it with compression ratios high enough that you may indeed see much poorer performance along with some objectionable knocking if you try to use regular grade gas.

    Duratec is designed for use of regular gas, and for this engine, use of premium is a waste of money.
  • upsetter1upsetter1 Member Posts: 205
    If you want to see the facelifted Taurus check out the lastest issue of Road and Track.
  • regfootballregfootball Member Posts: 2,166
    it doesn't look too much different unfortunately.
This discussion has been closed.