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Ford Taurus/Mercury Sable Sedans Pre-2008
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Comments
For example, a lady I ride the train with is looking for a new car. She went to a Ford dealer to look at a mustang coupe. She told the saleswoman that she didn't need a V/8, a 6 or a 4 would be fine. The woman told her in a rather looking down her nose way that Ford has never made a 4 cylinder Mustang. My friend almost laffed in her face because the first new car she had was a 4 cyl Mustang!
When I was looking for my 89 Taurus Wagon I was told by one salesman that the v/6 was optional (not)and when he gave me a price for the car it was about $600 above the LIST PRICE!
Hard to believe sometimes
So how do you like your engine Vulcan owners.
- Rob
I have no complaints. When mine was under warranty I had it checked out for oil consumption. That was at 30k. It still uses the same amount. Estimated at 1/2 quart every 1,500 miles.
I don't find the engine peppy, but it is adequate. I also have a 98 Villager and that engine seems much more responsive.
To be honest I don't think that engine durability is a concern with the Vulcan. I'm more concerned with transmission life. I've had my fluid changed three times since I bought it.
As far as gas mileage; I get between 24 and 28.6 this time of year. I know someone who had both a Duratec and a Vulcan. The Vulcan got about 2 to three miles per gallon more than the Duratec for him. I've gotten as high as 31 on a trip running 70 to 75 and using the A/C.
I bought a 2000 Sable LS today, and it has a cd changer in the console. Can someone please tell me how this works?? I still have 8 tracks (lol), no but really, I only have experience with my cd player at home, and this contraption in the console looks awfully weird to this old (43) guy.
Any help will be appreciated. THanks
Really very easy. Open the console, slide the door open on the CD changer, push the eject button. This will pop the cartridge out of the CD changer (if there is no cartridge then you need to get one as it will not work without it). Load up to 6 CDs into the cartridge as per the picture on the cartridge or instructions in the owner's manual (no not use CDs with paper labels on them that many use when they home "burn" a cd...these may get stuck in the mechanism). Return the cartridge to the changer (be sure to put in in the right way...the writing on the top should face you in the driver's seat) and slide closed the changer cover and the console. Turn on the radio, hit the CD button, select the disc and the track and enjoy.
I owned a 91 Acura Integra for 9 years and I'm a sales rep on the road. I put 286,000 on that car. I know it could have gone further but the shifter bushings wore out. The body started to rust (hard New England winters)and I wore a hole in the fabric of the drivers seat from getting in and out.
He or she must have really kept on top of the repairs and oil changes!!
Thanks for responding to my warranty question, and congrats on all the successful miles on your Taurus. The second-generation Taurii seem like they've come a long way. I grew up with an '89 Taurus, and it was great until it hit 100K, but then, among other things, it started on fire.
Thanks again for your advice.
I have 60,000 miles on mine and its time to replace tires. I think struts and shocks would greatly improve the ride too. I know Ford changed shock damping rates on the 99s but I haven't heard any improvements since.
Any suggestions on strut replacement? I'm just not sure if I should do the whole package; tires, struts, shocks. The ride is not terrible..just old and tired...like me.
Thanks
Second, since you need tires, why not try replacing just those first. You'd be surprised what kind of improvement you'll get with new tires. If you still have the General G4S tires from the factory, you will probably notice a BIG difference if you swap brands, and even if you don't there should be some difference in ride.
You get what you pay for in tires; cheap tires come back to bite you. The trick with more expensive tires (which last longer) is to keep them rotated or else they'll wear out too soon.
I replaced my Generals at 48,000 miles. They had plenty of rubber, but they got hard, and slid easily in heavy rain under more than normal braking power.
I asked my local tire shop (NOT NTB/Sears/Goodyear, etc.) to recommend a decent all season tire, good in rain and snow. They recommended Bridgestone Turanza LS-T tires, which I now have 19,000 miles on. They are great. I have also had good luck with BF Goodrich on other cars (I wanted Control T/A M80 tires, but they were out and recommended the Turanzas instead). They should perform similarly to the Bridgestones, according to my dealer.
The ride improved and so did the handling. They are not all that much quieter than the Generals, though.
In any case, replace the tires and then see if you get any ride improvement. You might not need struts yet.
Check the air pressure in the tires you have now, too, since overinflation will cause a harder ride. The air pressure is listed on the driver's door. It's 33 PSI front and rear for my '98.
Note that the '00 and up cars have bigger (16") tires. They shouldn't be that different, but it could have an effect on the ride. I have been in a few '00-up cars, and the ride was pretty much the same as in my '98.
The 2000 model year suspension was changed to make ride a little less harsh than the previous generation, with little or no sacrifice in handling, in my opinion.
THANKS IN ADVANCE!
Allen
The radios often (probably almost always) were the version with the CD changer controls, without the changer itself. It was an option--you had to pay extra for it in most cases (except maybe if you bought the Mach Audio package--I am not sure on that).
I think it's still that way on the Taurus and Sable. The '03 Sable I recently drove had a cassette player and CD changer controls with no changer. There's also a radio option that has a single CD slot instead of the cassette, and that also can control a changer.
My '98 has changer controls. I added a Ford changer--other than mounting it, it was 'plug and play'--from www.radiosandmore.com. Fired right up as soon as I tested it.
I found lots of items for my kids' 86 Mercury so you should have no problem with your Taurus
All of my cars (for the last 50 years) have been dealer serviced, whether new or used, except for a Hupmobile many years ago, and have found that although more costly it does pay off in the long run. My service interval is right at 3K miles for oil changes, filters and a general lookover by the mechanic.
Driving sensibly helps too!
I note from one posting that the oil consumption for the Vulcan engine is a pint every 1500 miles. Is this normal? Also, the manual advises only regular gasoline. I've used mid-grade (89 octane) for a very long time and am wondering if this higher octane will confuse the computer chip in the ECM?
Any helpful suggestions are most welcome.
It's been my habit, for too many years, to add oil between changes(topping up)as needed by keeping an opened quart in my car's trunk. This habit came about from owning a Jaguar XJ6 which would not tolerate being even a trifle low on any fluids.
Being a mature citizen, the days when cars used a quart or more of oil between 500 and 1000 miles are well remembered. Plumes of blue smoke from the tailpipes of certain makes were common. You were careful to avoid being behind Nash, Studebaker, Willys and Hudson Terraplanes in traffic on hot days.
Again, thanks for the good advice.
The new front- and rear-end, lights, not a big deal. The major upgrade is the new steering wheel and gauges (very similar to the new Ford Freestar) with a digital odometer - finally! It also has 3 button controls for the message board, also the same as Windstar/ Freestar. Then there supposed to be some changes under the hood (more hp, better mileage) which I can not verify by just looking.
Other than that, nothing special.
About one week ago I was involved in a T-bone accident (ironically enough hit by another Ford - an older '88 or so F-150). The impact in my driver's door was horrendous. Glass exploded everywhere. I was to say the least, very impressed with the ability of my Taurus to withstand the heat. Despite being broadsided directly in the driver's door at between 20-30 mph, I sustained only a few minor cuts from glass and no significant injuries. The car, however, was not so lucky and was a total loss.
Thank you Ford, for making such a crashworthy vehicle!!!! I'll definitely be looking at you for my next vehicle.
Glad to hear you came out of it with minor injuries. Too bad your Taurus didn't fare as well, but then again, it did the job it was designed for, especially given you got hit by a pickup.
I think a lot of people overlook this aspect of cars when buying, but it's kind of important!
My next delimma is whether to purchase another Taurus or a 300 M. I liked many features about the Taurus except the resale value was terrible and the driver's seat for me, at least, I found very uncomfortable after lengthy driving.
I would like to have the features of the 300 M but the Ford name. I was hoping to wait until the 500 came out to buy anything, but Mr. F-150 had other ideas ...
I guess now I'm more seriously considering the 300 M with side airbags. It'd be a serious step up pricewise for me, but I don't think my back can take 4 more years of stock Taurus seats.
All kidding aside, anyone that says Ford makes crap doesn't know what they're talking about. I only ever had two problems on that car (24V DOHC - sigh ... what a nice little engine that was
One was a lose cigarette lighter fixed under warranty, the second more annoying problem was the faulty wiper/turn switch that caused the wipers to cycle turning either left or right and the eventual loss of the wiper washer fluid.
But still $120 worth of repairs, one set of $225 tires, and a $100 brake job on a car with $95K miles and 4 years? The foreign quality crowd can stick it. As far as I'm concerned, I'll be buying more American cars in the future.
Note the 300M is a nice car, but is becoming an orphan- I believe Chrysler is replacing it with a 300C rear wheel drive-the Mercedes influence. 300M may depreciate fast as well.
I had a rental low mileage 300M this summer for a weeks vacation and it was a nice car, but I don't think it is all that much better than my Taurus SES with the 24 valve DOHC Duratec, especially when I doubt if you would touch a new 300M for under say $25-$27K?????? That's just a guess on my part as I have never seriously priced one out.
If you really want to save some bucks, find a leftover new 2003 Taurus. With the rebates you can get them well loaded for several thousand south of $20K. Depreciation doesn't mean much to me, especially when I can bank the $5K-$6K I have saved over by not buying a V-6 Camcord. Use that money toward the next one. Money not spent up front does not depreciate!
On the other hand, I don't rack up the miles you do, so depreciation may be more important to you.
Want to move up and stay in the Ford Family? How about a Lincoln LS? Due to the "Domestic is Junk" fervor in the press, a leftover 2003 can be had pretty inexpensively with big rebates as well, especially if you stay with the base V-6 model, which also has an upscale version of that trusty 3 litre Duratec.
When you put 25-30K miles a year on a car you don't really give a crud about depreciation. The Taurus will go down much much quicker since a lot of these are available as rentals and corp. cars. I watched my old '99 Taurus go from an original purchase price of $18.3 K (7/01/2000) to $7.4K (9/18/2003) when I was hit four years and 95K miles later. Still not too bad though, came out $3.2K ahead.
I believe the secret to avoiding depreciation is negotiating a good car deal in the first place ...
The only way to really minimize the worst of the Taurus depreciation is to buy a 1 or 2 year old model. You may be able to pick up a used 2002 Taurus SES for about $11K now. If the dealers are selling them for $11k, you would be lucky to get 9K trade-in value. The value is still spiralling down even after two years, but at a slower pace per year. (If it continued at that depreciation pace much longer, it would have a negative value!)
Even if you buy a brand new 2004 SES with the base Vulcan engine for invoice of $20412 minus the $1000 rebate, that's still $19412 plus the taxes. Expect to lose at least $6K in one year even if you got it for a "invoice minus rebate" deal.
Can you imagine if someone actually paid near the MSRP of $22040 for a bases SES with no options?!
Another comment is this: when shopping, I narrowed it down to two cars, much like it seems vacman1 is doing. I was deciding between a Saturn L200 and a Taurus SES, of the same year and of comparable mileage. When it came down to it, I got the car of lesser quality/options (the Saturn L200) dealer to get down to their "lowest" price, and decided the evening that my boyfriend and I went to the Ford dealer, if we could get them to commit to that "low" price, then I would buy the car, as it's nicer. And that's what happened. Maybe not the most logical/informed approach, but I like having some range of vehicles to choose from, and I was very happy with the end result. Buying a car is really such a game anyway, though unfortunately it's really no fun for the buyer until they have the prize, and it's fun for the dealers, who are secretly laughing in everybody's face anyway, the entire time.
The Asian makes are designed to last X miles with little or no trouble. Yes, they may make it to XXX,XXX miles if they don't rust to pieces in the meantime. If they are so utterly reliable and trouble-free, why do the dealers bother to employ mechanics and require service appointments far in advance?
American cars are designed for our driving styles and conditions. If one thinks that they are superior, simply check some of the other bulletin boards to verify their reputations.
I do think however, you can minimize this hit on a new car if you are smart when you do your shopping. For instance, I recently test drove a 300 M and liked it. Immediately, of course, the salesman wants to make a deal to get me in it because the "rebates might be going down since it was the month's end." I waited, in fact, still haven't bought and now that same dealer is having a huge sale with bigger rebates a few days later.
Now do you think the salesman told me this sale would be coming up? No way! Do you think he knew? You bet your sweet patootie he did. That's one dealer I won't be purchasing from.
I have found that the best way to take the dealers on is to play their own game with them. Patience is the key. Go to 4 or 5 (or more) local dealers and give them the intention you will buy soon (2 wks / 1 month or so). Walk around with them and check out some of the cars you're interested in. Comment very slyly that you think the MSRPs seem high, or that so and so dealer (you don't even need to mention a name) says he can provide model X for a price you set. This does two things: 1) it establishes that you aren't a sucker; 2) it tells you whether the dealer is the kind that will lower the MSRP.
If the dealer wont budge on MSRP - walk right off the lot. This isn't the kind of dealer you want to be doing business with anyway. On the other hand, you may get the result I got recently which was to be offered a very loaded car for an employee price, when I am not an employee of D/C. You'd be surprised what a salesman will do to get you in a car if they are desperate enough.
Once you've agreed on a sale price - or at least you have the price in your mind leave the dealership! Take the salesmans card and negotiate the financing at home over the telephone or by fax! You'll feel less pressure to sign anything in a controlled environment. Remember that as far as you are concerned the sales price and the financing are two seperate issues.
Use Edmunds price calculator to evaluate the financing terms of a deal before signing anything. For example, a $30,700 car ($35K MSRP) with a $2000 rebate sounds like a great deal until you find out they want 4.9% interest for the financing. It's better to take the same car at 0% for 60 months. Know your credit rating before negotiating a finance deal. Some dealers will say you can't get the 0% financing because of a "bad credit" score - which is illegal by the way. And hold out for 0% / 60 months because a lot of dealers will give you that if your credit is 650 or over, and it means a substantially smaller car payment most of the time vs. rebates.
Another optional method I've used with great success is to talk to 4-5 dealers, get the salesmans card and then fax a bid form to all of them highlighting the car model, features you want and financing terms. You dictate all of these and put the names of the other salesman on the fax and then see who bites. Give them one shot to submit their "best price" to you via fax. This is how public works projects are bid and it is a highly successful method that often results in substantial savings to you. Plus, when you enter the dealer to sign papers you already have a form of a written contract, so it's very difficult for them to retract the promises later.
A second major advantage of this method is that if you are a shy person (no worries for me though) you'll have more bargaining power and feel less obligated to give in to the pressure in the sales office. The worst thing one can do is go into a car salesman's office to sign anything!!!!! Make them do it in the open air tables on the show floor because if they think someone else might be watching, it plays on their conscience if the papers are being signed outside the security of their cubes. I know a lot of you think salesman have no conscience, but believe me most all of them do! The ones that don't can usually be ferreted out by trying to negotiate on MSRP.
If you buy new, I think it's a $90 option to get the floor shifter and buckets (unless they moved packages around and you can't get it alone), or the SES comes with it. Used cars may be a bit tougher to find with buckets.
Just keep it a while to avoid the depreciation if you don't intend to keep it until the wheels fall off!
All kidding aside, I put 95K miles on that car in just a few years. I don't know if the seats are only good for wearing those many miles or the comfort had to do with time in the car, etc. I do remember very distinctly getting a very nasty backache after spending 10 hours in the car in one go. Perhaps I would get that with any seat?
At any rate, I don't think another Taurus is in my future at this point. I liked the cost to operate and maintain it, but it depreciated like nuts and overall even the "nice" ones with leather are still a bit plain for me. I'm just approaching that receding hairline / growing gut stage that screams the onset of middle age. It's time to move up to a pricier, more sporty sedan I think!
Still, a loaded Taurus would cost you a lot less, and remember, money you do not spend but keep in your bank account does not depreciate! The extra money you spend on any new entry luxury car, domestic or import, will indeed depreciate quickly.
or when over half the sales of some american cars are to the fleet variety.
From a consumer standpoint, I frankly don't have a gripe with domestic (or foreign manufacturers for that matter) selling to the fleet market. It keeps the factories running and thus allows sale of the same vehicle to the general public at low prices as well. Not everyone has an extra $5K-7K to spend on a new car. I am sure Henry Ford didn't have the best car on the market when he introduced the Model T, but due to revolutionary mass production techniques introduced, it put a car within the price range of most Americans at the time. I applaud Ford for being able to do some of the same today, despite being hobbled by many costs that the foreign nameplates do not have, such as a large pool of retiree pensions to fund and higher than average UAW wages.
And, despite what many may think, Taurus is a very good all around car, especially for the price.
It might be fair to say that by now the Malibu may have better road manners, but then again by how much.
I mean, when you can buy new base taurus for under 14, and a reasonably loaded Taurus with Duratec and stuff for under 18 grand, why would you pop for a Malibu that stickers at over 25k? Sure the Mali is a better car (it should be its like a decade newer), but is it 5-8 grand better? I doubt there's that level of difference.
Ford ought to go on a market assault and also do some suspension and handling work on the Taurus Sable. Put another 20hp under the hood too and keep the price good. Maybe tweak the interior a bit. With some dedicated cost effective improvements, they could make a case to many buyers for going with the larger, known quanity.
So granted maybe the Malibu is on a new chassis but if they sicked the SVT engineers on the Taurus chassis and spent a few more bucks on shocks and tires and suspension bits they could keep the sales going strong and customers happy until the Futura and other sedans come along.
As for Cadillac, their new products appear to be the deal. Except that they still can't make an interior with good plastic.
Even new value leaders like the Suzuki Verona still sell for more than a Taurus.
http://www.freep.com/money/autonews/ford7_20031007.htm
1. From a standing start,hands off (for test purpose only), straight and level or, slightly crowned road, moderate acceleration, the steering wheel immediately moves 1" to left, the car moves slightly but continous to the left, and will soon cross the road center line.
The Ford dealer says this is "normal torque steer".
2. On a level smooth road, steady speed, the engine has a constant, non-pattern hesitation, more obvious at lower speeds (30-50), air cond. off.
First time back, the Ford dealer said it was "normal alternator and compressor surge". With air off ??.
I demonstrated this condition to Ford's Field Engineer and the Ford dealer's mechanic. They both agreed that the " surge", was there, but it was a "normal" characteristic of this engine and no repair or adjustment was available.
I am 70 years old, and when I did my own maintenance, if my car ran this bad, I would immediately do the points ,plugs, condenser, rotor, etc routine. This is normal??? Please comment.
pinky33
I'm wondering if anybody has had some paint peelage problems on their '02. My front bumper and rear passenger door (right by the window) seem to be having some issues. I also have a weird three-finger imprint on my driver side rear door that won't come out with handwashings (the only way I wash the car).
I've been approved by my dealership for a painting, but won't be able to get a loaner vehicle unless I rent one, which, considering it's an '02 with just over 23K, leaves something left to be desired. Any ideas on either the paint or how to get a loaner approved? I already called the 1-800 Ford number, only to be denied and requested a callback from a supervisor-- do these people really call back?
That's not bad.