Pontiac Grand Prix - 2000-2005

dindak · October 2000

I have driven a 3.1L GP and it's actually not bad at all. I believe it's rated at 175hp which is enough for a mid size sedan. I would pick a 3.1L GP over a 4 cyl Accord any day.

bdstrie · October 2000

I had my GT at 110 when the speed limiter kicked in...I was racing a Sebring who thought he was tough, so I thought I'd stick it to him. We had about 6 miles of straight highway ahead, so I thought I'd see how much concrete I could put between us...I got to 110, and it was like the car slipped out of gear. I could hold speed at 109, but as soon as 110 hit, it was done.

sunfgt · October 2000

Did you win, or was the Sebring's limiter set higher than 110? What was your tach reading?

bdstrie · October 2000

Sunfgt: Not sure what tach reading was...it was kind of a rush...we were in a 55mph zone that's speed trapped regularly, so I wasn't paying much attention to my tach.

I put about a mile and a half between us before I slowed down, and while I'm not sure what the Sebring's speed limiter is set at, he wasn't able to keep up...he was sure trying though.

tsjay · October 2000

I really don't ever plan on going that fast anyway, but somehow I think it would be nice to know that my car would go 125 or 130 if I ever wanted to.

I'll bet that the GT's would go that fast if it weren't for the limiter, huh?

tsjay

kazz · October 2000

A GT at 110 is probably only running @4,000rpm, so yes, it can easily go faster. I believe there is a reprogrammed PCM availabale that pushes the limiter up to around 150. The GTP limiter comes set to (I think, but not sure) 126mph. Once again, a reprogrammed PCM is available to push that way up. It also makes the shifting on "performance shift" mode much more aggressive.

For koolguy: The SE model is now offered only with the 3100 engine. It's a good engine, but not designed for "sports sedan" use. If you want good economy and reliability, the SE is a good way to go. If you wanna go fasta, the GT or GTP is your ticket.

Kazz

96gs · October 2000

I'm surprised they set the limiter so low on the GTP. That is supposed to be the high performance model. Most car enthusiasts are curious as to how fast a car like that would go, and they're probably surprised that even a SVT Contour can go 20mph faster than a GTP. It's all because of the tires. GM cutting corners and putting 60 series wimpy rubber on a 240 horsepower car is disappointing. I know that the GTP also serves partly as a family hauler, and for taking on long road trips and that is where the current tires are nice. They allow for a nice ride with a slight edge on handling (mainly because they're so wide). 225/45 or 50 series tires would GREATLY improve handling and with a higher speed rating, the top end could be bumped up to over 140mph. They should make an option package where this is available. Sort of like the autobahn package for the Intrigue. The GTP already handles pretty good. Just think how much better it would handle with better tires. I'm thinking 225/45ZR-16 BF Goodrich G-Force would be nice. The BF G-Force tires on the SVT Contour stick like glue. Pretty amazing.

toon1 · October 2000

Hey folks...I just got my GT after having to leave a new Monte Carlo that couldn't be repaired. I am enjoying the GT except for one issue; the stereo. I have the CD with equalizer and no matter what I do, it just isn't getting the "richness" I want. Has anyone done anything via factory provided equipment like the Bose speakers or a factory amp. I have asked the dealer and he wasn't sure, said he'd look into it. I really don't want to drop a whole lotta $$. I'm thinking about adding just an amp and see what happens. Any suggestions? Maybe when I get the sound I need, I'll attempt 110mph!!!!

nitro3800 · October 2000

www.grandprix.net/limited/indexjs.html

96gs · October 2000

That's why I think it should be included in some kind of performance package. Not everyone wants to compromise some of the ride for handling, but a lot of folks would I suspect. I'm sure most of us on here would anyway.

carguy62 · October 2000

Does anyone know what the stock speakers are in the GTP? I'm not sure of the configuration but I'm thinking about the ones on the rear shelf. Looking for brand, model no. and any other info (if you know the other speakers as well that would be great). Thanks a lot.

toon1 · October 2000

You should able to see the rear deck speaker info. from underneath when looking through the trunk. I know the GT is Delco, but you might have the Bose package.

carguy62 · October 2000

Thanks but we don't have the vehicle any more. I am trying to duplicate the sound in another. Any one care to take a look for me?

tsjay · October 2000

Does anyone know how the modern horsepower ratings compare in general to the way they rated horsepower in the "good old days"?

They used rate the engine's horsepower without accessories and right at the fly wheel, right? Now they rate them by power delivered to the pulling wheels, right?

Is the old rating something like 50% higher than today's rating for the same engine? In other words, would a car rated at 200 hp today be roughly equivalent to one rated at 300 hp under the old system?

tsjay

96gs · October 2000

In the old days horsepower was given in gross readings instead of net readings. The gross was the maximum power the engine made. Obviously with no accessories or anything, just engine flywheel horsepower on a dyno. I don't think there even was any kind of exhaust hooked up to the engine. Todays horsepower readings (SAE net) is the horsepower the engine makes with all the accessories. The horsepower is still rated at the flywheel however. I believe the stock exhaust is connected to the engine as well. There are some losses in the drive train as noted by different acceleration performance in cars with the same or more horsepower. For example, Chrysler. They obviously loose a lot of power in the transmission or somewhere, as their horsepower ratings always seem a little high. I don't think 200hp net today is 300hp gross. I don't think it's quite that different. It would probably be something more like 240-250.

tsjay · October 2000

In a quarter mile drag race, how would a 2000 Grand Prix GT compare with some of the lesser "muscle cars" of the 60's and 70's? I know the Grand Prix wouldn't outrun most of those old cars, but would it be competitive against some of them? Say a 350 Camaro, for instance? Or a 327 Malibu?

tsjay

graphicguy · October 2000

Don't know the exact acceleration figures, but my GTP "feels" faster than my long (and lamented) departed '67 GTO (400 cube big block, 4 barrel).

A lot of it would be because of the tons of improvements in keeping the GTP on the road at launch. The GTO would launch (if I could control the wheelspin) and be all over the road. Tires are better, suspension is better, steering is better, traction is better on the GTP. If I got the launch down, it would be a good race between the GTP and GTO to 60MPH, though. If you got the GTO up to over 100MPH, it would get scary (compared to today), but the GTO would probably beat a GTP to 100MPH.

All that said, the best 1/4 time I got out of the GTO (at a track) was 14.6, bone stock. Without mods, I doubt the GTP could do that (although I've never run the GTP in the 1/4).

Once underway, the GTO could go 20-30 or 30-50 better than anything I've ever been in (short of a Corvette or a Boxter or many other cars that I haven't yet driven). The big V8s were torque monsters that would really pin you back. Cornering in the GTO was a whole different matter, though. Considering what you can do in today's cars, I would have ended up in the weeds with the GTO if I tried to drive it the way I drive the GTP.

Comparing a 60's camaro or trans am with a small block to a GP GT, I would say the camaro or trans am would take it, easily in the 1/4 or even to 60 MPH.

tsjay · October 2000

Hey, Graphicguy!

So you had a '67 Goat, huh? That was a really great car, I'll bet. My best friend in high school had a '66 silver-gray GTO, that I thought was one of the coolest cars ever. He put deep dish chrome reverse wheels on it with the red pinstriped tires that were popular back then.

The '66 GTO's were my favorite body style, but the '67's were my second favorite, and pretty close in my book to the '66's.

What color was yours? Did you have a four speed or automatic? What other muscle cars did you ever beat with your Goat, and which ones beat you?

I never had a car in high school, but I sure envied those guys with the hot cars.

Man those were the good old days!

tsjay

96gs · October 2000

I see you have a GT with the 200hp 3.8. I ran my Regal at the track (205hp 3.8) and ran a best of 15.7@87mph. Not too bad for a mid sized car.

graphicguy · October 2000

Thanks! Boy do I wish I had that GTO back. I bought it in '79. It only had 42K miles on it and was a 4-speed and had the original "gold" paint job. I bought it from an "older" gentleman (the original owner) who was going to keep it as a "collectable". His wife couldn't drive a 4-speed and he wanted a second car for her. The carpets weren't even dirty when I bought it. It was totally stock and I kept it that way.

It was very solid with the original wood on the dash. It also had a working, stock, hood tach (it was actually in the driver's line of site on the hood instead of in the dash). He took very good care of it.

It got to the point that I couldn't afford the insurance on it at the time (I was a young pup with a less than a sterling driving record at the time) and sold it to a collector about a year after I bought it.

Word had it that it would have run around 14.2-14.3 in the quarter. I never could achieve those figures, though. I'm certain that someone with more track experience than me, could have done it. I actually babied it quite a bit and took very good care of it (except when challenged on the street). I only took it to the track twice and had a total of 6 runs with it.

The '66s had a slightly different grill and could be had with a 389 V8 with 3-two barrel carbs. In '67 they came out with the 400 V8...only 2 or 4 barrel single carbs. Mine was the HO version of the 400. The only one that was faster was the RAM AIR 400.

It truly was a great car.

I've driven some of the 70's version of the GTO and they didn't even come close to that '67.

tsjay · October 2000

The '66's had a different rear end too- they had the louvered tail lights, which I believe the '67's did also, but back end of each rear fender was curved, and the outer ends of the tail lights were shaped to match.

I think the 421 engine was available in the late sixties GTO's, wasn't it?

My buddy had the 389 with a four barrel, and his was an automatic.

I would love to have a brand new '66 GTO, if that were somehow possible.

Later

tsjay

heng · October 2000

Those cars would pin you back in the seat which I don't think a front wheel drive car can do. Friends owned them and I remember riding around in them.

graphicguy · October 2000

tsjay--you could be right about the the different back ends between the '66 and '67 GTO. It's been so many years ago. Mine had the "louvered" tail lights.

I can't comment about the 421. I don't remember it being offered in the '67 (or '66 for that matter...maybe earlier years) I know that the big difference between the '66 and '67 was going from the 389 V8 in '66 to the 400 V8 in '67. I do know that I took my '67 to a couple of GTO shows. The owners of the '66s with the 389 (with "3 dueces" for carburation) always told me that those carbs were a bear to keep adjusted. I never drove a '66, though.

The 4-barrel on the 400 felt like a turbo, all spooled up, when all 4 barrels opened up. I could literally see the gas guage drop when they all opened up.

heng--My favorite Chevy engine was the 396 V8 (in the chevelle SS). Mopar had a big block 440 V8 which was wicked...the 383 in the Road Runners was my favorite, though (never owned one...road in one with a guy at a muscle car show). I also owned a FoMoCo, 69 Torino GT with a 351 Cleveland engine, also a good one.

Of course, this hobby was before marriage and kids.

I often wonder what the big 3 could have done with those V8s if they had done as much development on them as GM has done on the 3.8 V6? Could they pass emmissions with today's fuel injection and computer controls? Could they have upped the MPG? How would they run on unleaded (in 1980 I could only find a couple of gas stations that still offered "leaded gas" for my GTO)?

heng · October 2000

A buddy's brother had a Chevelle SS with a 454. The other brother had a W31 Olds Cutlass. It looked better than the Chevelle.

I remember hearing gas flowing from the passenger's seat of a 430 Buick Wildcat.

A bunch of punks with 5 Trans AM HO 455s all starting up a once and then pulling out Le Mans style.

My family was too poor to own a car.

But now I could afford to buy a modern version of those muscle cars. Think Covette! That has to be the the most powerful re-incarnation of the V-8.

But I'm happy with my GP. You all know how effortlessly it can zip to 80 mph. Well, a '75 Cutlass with a 4 bbl 350 took forever to get up to 80. I remember flooring it from 65 on the LIE (that's Long Island Expressway) way out by Riverhead at 4am (was going fishing). It took forever! At least a mile of road. Plus started getting road rumble. Must have been the early generation radials overheating. The most that car got was 20 mpg (with a tail wind).

toon1 · October 2000

Has anyone had and fixed a rattle in the passenger seat; 2000 GP GT??

graphicguy · October 2000

I've never had a rattle in my 2K GTP.

Take it to the dealer.

tsjay · October 2000

I know there are entire "conferences" devoted to the subject, but there's not much posting going on here, so maybe no one will get too upset if we talk a little bit in "Grand Prix" about the subject.

I have used Turtle Wax "Emerald Series" on my Grand Prix so far, and it seems to do a good job, but is there something better? I'm not going to go to all the trouble of the Zaino stuff or anything like that. I'm just asking what people think is a good one-step wax.

Also, how of often should a car be waxed? I usually try to get a wax job done about two or three times a year.

How about my leather interior? What is good to use to prolong the life of the leather?

Thanks

tsjay

graphicguy · October 2000

I'm a "zaino" believer.

If you want to go the "one step" route, I had a positive expereience with Eagle 1 Wet before Zaino.

I used Lexol products for the leather (I think it was their leather cleaner/conditioner combo).

toon1 · October 2000

I've used Mequier's wax on mine and Mequier's on the interior. I too, try and wax once in the spring and once in the fall. Usually do the leather once a year.

szott · October 2000

Looking for the pros and cons on this car. We're expecting our first child within the next couple weeks and we've realized my 91 2Dr Blazer is not really well suited to the family life. And I refuse to buy a minivan!
Considering buying a Pontiac GP GT Sedan this weekend to serve as the "family" car. It's affordably priced, looks pretty sporty and just seems like a pretty solid vehicle.
Is there something severely wrong with the car that I should be aware of? Is it a diamond in the rough that I'll be lucky to own? Please share your thoughts, experiences, opinions.

graphicguy · October 2000

I've had two GPs (both GTPs). The first one was hit by a guy in an Acura who ran a red light. The guy broadsided me doing about 50 MPH. I walked away from the wreckage. The other guy went for an extended stay in the hospital. My car was totalled, but I didn't have a scratch.

When I got the insurance check, I looked at a lot of different vehicles (including Acura). I ended up getting another GP.

My current GP has over 40K miles. No squeaks, rattles...nothing that has sent me back to my dealer. The only thing I've done is change the oil, rotate the tires and I just put in a new air filter. This car has been cheap from a maintenance point of view.

I have to say that I've owned Hondas, Toyotas and BMWs...all good cars in their own right. Both of my GPs have been sterling cars no matter what measuring stick you use and they compare favorably with all the above brands.

tsjay · October 2000

My 2000 Grand Prix GT four door has been perfect so far, after 17K miles. No adjustments or repairs of any kind. I think this is the first new car I've ever bought that didn't have at least some minor problems that needed to be taken care of under warranty.

I have gotten as high as 31.5 mpg on all-highway driving, driving at the speed limits. I can always count on 28+ mpg on highway driving, even if I "cheat" on the speed limit.

The car has a very nice-sized trunk for a "mid-size" car, and it is very practical, even though it looks so sporty.

I think it would make a fine family car for anyone.

There's some killer rebates and financing available on 2000 left-overs now. I would certainly check these out before buying a 2001 model.

tsjay

yurakm · October 2000

If you are going to buy a new GP GT, it makes sense to test-drive Chevrolet Impala LS.

Basically, Impala Ls is the same car as GP GT, with the same engine, but the body is several inches longer. More rear legroom would make easier to work with the child chair. And the Impala have even higher crush rating.

graphicguy · October 2000

I agree with tsjay's assessments.

The GP GT will handle well...get great gas mileage and have plenty of room for your budding family. They ride well and the 3.8 V6 with the automatic is a lesson in smoothness. Very comfortable! The powertrain will get up and "boogie" when you put your foot in it, too.

The GP GT is very feature rich, too. Lot's of very useful options like HUD, programable door locks, etc.

As said, if you can find a 2000 with the rebates or 0% financing, you can cut a heck of a deal on one.

The only real problems I've heard of were with regards to the '97s. They had a problem with water getting into the headlights. There was a guy who had some transmission problems that posted a few months ago. If memory serves me, he bought it used and it may have been abused, though. I think his problem had more to do with a bad dealer than anything else, however.

The only wish list I would have for the GP would be to have better headlights.

teo · October 2000

I echo Yurakm comments in regards to the Impala LS. If you are considering the Pontiac GP GT sedan, it would be worth it to test drive the Impala LS. The Impala LS's engine and transmission are identical to the GP GT (3800 series II V-6, 200 HP and the 4T65-E 4 speed auto).
However, for family hauling chores the Impala LS is a bit better suited for the job. The car has more rear head and legroom and a bigger trunk (17.0 CuFt). Another point to consider, is that the Impala is the only GM intermediate sedan (W-Body family)that has the best safety score ratings (5 stars front, 4 stars side)and already meets 2003 government safety standards, the Grand Prix, Regal, Intrigue do not. Also the initial sale price is lower on the Impala LS vs the GP GT.

As far as content goes, the Impala LS does not offer the HUD display, but make not mistake...the Impala LS is loaded (Power seats, Trip Computer, dual temp A/C, Monochromatic mirror, power everything, RDS CD/Tape stereo system, steering wheel controls, etc)Alloy wheels and rear deck lid spoiler are also standard.

The Impala is more comfortable and boasts better safety ratings in my book without losing any sporty feeling or looks to it.

Now the GP GT is a great car and it is more sporty and can be obtained for cheap given the incredible finance and rebate incentives offer on it right now. However, overtime, the Impala LS will have a better resale value as is the only GM intermediate that doesn't have ANY special financial or rebate incentives since the car was introduced in mid 1999. the Impala is also the only W-body car that is in the top 10 best sellers in the nation.

You can't go wrong with either car, each one has it pluses and minuses but for family duty, safety and value, the Impala LS gets the vote.

Check it out.

Good luck.

toon1 · October 2000

I recently purchased a 2000 GP GT. So far, so good(besides a rattling passenger seat). I also recently had a 2000 Monte Carlo bought back by GM due to a "cradle/subframe" issue that could not be repaired. I state this as it is my understanding that the Impala sits on the exact same frame with the exact rack and pinion, cradle, subframe, etc. Just something to check out! Take a look at the National Highway Transportation and Safety site and look into "customer complaints". Good luck with whatever you choose!

teo · October 2000

The alleged engine cradle problem. Still check out the car. Do a fair comparison before you decide.

teo · October 2000

For your info, the GP as all other cars of the W-Body family share most of the mechanical underpinnings, so don't think somehow the GP will make you immune to a front end problem.

The Buick Century, Buick Regal, Chevrolet Lumina, Chevrolet Montecarlo, Pontiac Grand Prix and Oldsmobile Intrigue all belong to the W-body platform.

szott · October 2000

Didn't realize the Impala had such high saftey ratings. I'll take a closer look. Still, something about the GP's looks keeps pulling me towards it. Then again, I have to consider safety for the kid. Plenty to think about. Thanks again for the help. I was afraid I'd get negative anti-GM attacks from the likes of bohlen and broncodave. It seems they may have had a bad experience or two with the general. At least broncodave seems to know something about the car. Didn't appear that bohlen has ever even seen one up close! Thanks again.

graphicguy · October 2000

I know the feeling. When I was shopping, the GP was the car I kept coming back to over and over.

I have two teenagers. They fit well in the back seat (they don't fight, so I'll assume they are comfy back there).

Can't comment about the Impala. I've never driven one.

kazz · October 2000

By all means, check the Impala out, too, just so you know you've covered the bases. But the 2001 GP is a 5th-year build on the GP design, while the new Impalas are still (from what I've heard) working out the kinks in the design. I haven't driven an Impala, but find the GP (I have a GTP coupe) to be roomy and strong. I got mine in February this year and have had only minor issues with it.

yurakm · October 2000

GTP (and Buick Regal GS) obviously are stronger, than Impala. Stronger engine/transmission, not body.

But the comparison is with GP, not GTP. Impala LS (and the base Impala with the right options) have the same engine, the same transmission, and mostly the same suspension.

Major pluses for Impala: about 5 inches longer (more space), and have better crush rating. The both is very important with family sedan, with kids.

Minuses: no HUD, lesser radio. Probable minus: the first year design aluminum engine cradle.

The styling - external, internal, dash and instrumentation - is up to the personal tastes and preferences...

tsjay · October 2000

Let us know what you end up with, ok?

tsjay

szott · October 2000

Went out to the dealer the other night. Saw a black GP GT sedan. Briefly went weak in the knees. Regained my composure. Drooled a little. Grabbed the keys from the salesman. Drove it at speed through some nice twisties and sweepers in the area. Parked it. Got out. Tried to conceal the smile stuck on my face. Bought it. I pick it up tomorrow.
I looked at an Impala first at the Chev dealer next door to the Pontiac dealer. I just didn't like the styling. As yurakm states, it's a personal preference thing. One of my account reps has a new impala and it's pretty sweet but I really fell hard for the GP.
I'll plan on giving a running commentary on my experiences with it.

teo · October 2000

Congrats! I think it is very important to get what you really like and what gives the more positive "vibes" about it.

Enjoy that new GP! Can you share pics of your new car with us?

szott · October 2000

I'm taking the company digital camera home today. I'll take some pics and try to get them posted Monday morning.

tsjay · October 2000

Congratulations!!!!!!!

Excellent choice. Be prepared to wash that car about every day, though. You know how black is: nothing sharper when it's clean, but every little bit of dust is going to show.

Give us the details. What option package and extra goodies did you get? Did you get a 2000 or an '01? If you got the 2000, what rebate and/or financing incentives did you get (if you don't mind telling).

Now that you've bought the GP, I can be honest with you without hurting your feelings. The Impala doesn't belong in the same league for looks in my book. Nothing about an Impala is sporty looking. EVERYTHING about a GP is sporty looking. I know, beauty is in the eye of the beholder, and some people probably prefer the looks of the Impala over the GP, BUT I AIN'T ONE OF THEM!

Once again, congrats.

Enjoy that new car.

tsjay

tsjay · October 2000

You didn't post your email address in your profile, so I guess you want your privacy. Don't blame you a bit, but if you will send me a picture of your new car, then I'll have your email address (won't share it with anyone else), and I'll send you a picture of mine.

You can look up my Edmunds profile and get my email address. So far, posting it there hasn't been a problem for me. I've only heard from a couple very nice people who frequent this news group.

tsjay

tsjay · October 2000

If you can stay out of that black Grand Prix long enough, tell us about your first day with her.

Was she cleaned up and ready to go? Did you show her off to friends and family?

tsjay

graphicguy · October 2000

Again, congrats!

A black GP GT does look awfully sweet.

You have found out what we already know...the GP is one of the nicest handling, running, looking bargains on the planet.

I'm sure you'll enjoy it (even if you do have to wash it a lot).

Pontiac Grand Prix - 2000-2005

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