Volvo S80

s80willie · October 2003

Thought Id try posting this on the general area to see if there is any guidance out there?

I've got a 2000 Venetian Red T-6 that I just love. I just passed 48,000 miles. I just took it on a 500 mile trip and somewhere I got the front drivers-side headlight lens cracked. The headlight assembly looks to be intact.

When I searched the inter net for replacement parts. I found a lens only replacement at www.importspecialistsofamerica.com. They are offering the lens only at ~$126. When I talked to my dealer's parts guy he was unaware of a replacement lens only. When I gave him the part number from the web site (8662865) he looked it up and indicated it was not for the US market, but he further said it looked like he could order it and couldn't see why it couldn't be used. I decided to order the lens only from Import Specialists.

My question for you savy S-80 owners is have any of you replaced the lens only on these headlight assemblies and is it something that a reasonably handy person should be able to do? To bracket my answer, I can tell you that I've replaced the rear tail light assembly on my wife's 850 and previously on my old 740 TD. The supplier has told me they include the new retainer clips and gasket with the lens. I'm looking to see if anyone has any step by step directions for removing and installing a new lens and relatively how difficult it might be. It looks like the headlight assembly on the 2000 is held by two bolts on the top of assembly. Any hints or things to look out for. Or does anyone know where one could get the headlamp replacement procedure? Of I subscribed to the Volvo on-line manual service is this sort of thing covered in the manual?

Thanks.

volvomax · October 2003

The 2.9 is being phased out in favor of the S80 2.5T.
Currently there are no incentives on the T6.

n0v8or · October 2003

Another owner posted these instructions on the Volvospy S80 forum in 2001. I saved them for future reference. So far, I have not broken any headlights, but it seems to happen often (this is the 11th time I've posted this for someone).
==============================================
The front bumper has to be partially removed on one side to replace a headlight assembly or glass.

Start by removing the upper clips that retain the glass to the headlamp shell.
Next, drill off the 4 plastic-headed rivets inside the wheel well (have new rivets and a rivet gun handy for re-installation).
Remove the headlight wiper arm, the black plastic cover just below the headlight (just pull off carefully after heating with a hair dryer to prevent the brittle plastic from cracking), and the side marker lamp (which is attached to the black cover).
Remove the turn signal lamp assembly (push down on the release tab from the top next to the headlight, then slide forward.
Remove the 2 plug covers in the lower front area of the bumper, and remove the bumper retaining bolts. The bumper will now slide forward enough to remove the remaining clips that retain the glass to the shell.
===========================================

I would be leery of using a Euro-spec glass, as it may not match the other side. Discount mail order dealers, like Borton Volvo, sell the correct lens for about $125, according to others who have replaced it themselves.

volvomax · October 2003

You can get a clear plastic stick on shield from IPD that will absorb rock hits very nicely.
Beats repalcing len covers.

s80willie · October 2003

Thanks n0v8or for the replacement procedure. I'm not sure I understand why all the steps are needed, but I'll go home tonite and try and eyeball with the procedure and make sure it all makes sense. Sounds more like an 850, but I'll check it out. Thanks!

n0v8or · October 2003

Yeah . . the instructions are a bit cryptic.
I have "eyeballed" all the steps and they seem to make sense. The "black cover" is a finish molding that runs along the top-front edge of the bumper, starting just to the side of the grille and continuing around to just past the yellow side marker light (which is mounted to it).
I used a long screwdriver to depress the turn lamp assembly release tab.

squintsf16 · October 2003

I have a 1999 s80 t-6, and also have the same transmission problems that you describe. Mine has been at the dealer for a month, and they have yet to fix it. The transmission is just one of about 25 problems wrong with the car! I have owned the car for about 6 months and it has 66k miles on it. Of those 6 months the car has been at the dealer 2 of them, and is still at the dealer as I write this. Eitan I will let you know if I find out anything. I wish I had never even seen this car, what a piece of junk!

eitan56 · October 2003

Brian: Thanks for the empathy. I'm pretty sure the problem with my trans is a bad sensor or the need for the proper updated software that operates trans. It's an elusive problem. I have had the car at the dealer 3x, the last two they did not get the condition. The 'shudder' comes & goes. It seemed to be more consistant (the shudder, that is) in the warm weather. My personal mechanic's 'SWAG' is a bad ambient temp sensor, if such an animal exists.

I feel your frustration. Let me know what you find out.

Question to anyone in northern NJ; Any service experience with Paul's Volvo in Hawthorne, NJ? I can't bear to keep going back to the dealer where I bought the car. Whoever said finding a good Vovlo tech is the key to happy ownership knew whate he/she was takling about.

s80willie · October 2003

thanks, n0v8or. The only part that I've got questions about is the removal of the 4 plastic rivets in the wheel well. It doesn't seem to be connected to anything involved in the removal. I also hope the lens doesn't have a clip on the inside edge. It looks like there are two bolts on top that secure the headlamp assembly. However when I tried to loosen them and possibly remove the assembly to work on it the assembly is still held in by something I can't find. I presume the procedure you gave is for replacing the lens without taking the headlamp out. I would think it's easier than this, which probably means there is a step that I'm just not visualizing properly. If you have any other words of wisdom I'd appreciate it.

n0v8or · October 2003

The rivets fasten the fender liner to the bumper assembly, preventing you from sliding the bumper forward.

One owner was able to watch the technician replace his headlamp (the entire assembly; he was told the glass could not be purchased as a separate piece). They completely removed the bumper to gain access to all of the shell fasteners.

My understanding is there are retention clips only along the top and bottom, and it is possible to replace the glass, but not the entire unit, by just sliding the bumper forward enough to access the lower clips.

davant · October 2003

One more time with feeling...

Volvo's current semi-secret $5K dealer incentive on the S-80 2.9 expires 31 Oct. Dealer feedback is they don't expect any major changes as sales appear flat at best. Anyone heard what programs/incentives are in store and when they'll be released? Real close to buying an '04 S-80 2.9 at $32.8K w/premium (leather & sunroof) & 17's, MSRP of $40.7. Fingers crossed the $5K stays or goes up. Any chance there'll be dealer incentives for the 2.5T AWD version or T-6 perhaps?

Request feedback before I buy one and the headlights crack, then I can't get the bumper off, and then the transmission woes (whooa-Nellie).

Also, anyone heard about possibly phasing out the 2.9 engine? In lieu of what? I hope there's an alternative to the turbo 5-banger and top-notch dual turbo T-6 as although the 2.5T may be stronger than the 2.9 due to the blower, (208HP, 236 ft lbs/torque versus 194HP & 207 ft lbs for the 2.9 6-cyl), it's certainly not as smooth as either six. All are great engines but the 2.5 felt like chitty-chitty bang-bang in comparison. You have to check the tach to see if the 6 cyl is even running.

FYI on headlight protection. 3M makes clear sticky material (like sheets of heavy grade clear tape) that is used to protect aircraft antennas, works great. Still looking for a web source and will post it. 3M, post-it, get it?

volvomax · October 2003

Not going away.
The 2.9 is being phased out in favor of the 2.5T variant. Hence the incentive.
Given the declining sales there will be incentives on all versions eventually, but it won't get any better for the 2.9 than it is now.
ipd carries the 3m headlight sheets, www.ipdusa.com

davant · October 2003

Got word Volvo fixed a previous oversight by offering $5K off the T-6 as well. I hope this continues or increases when the Nov programs are announced. They're not making this an easy decision for me...2.9 or a few grand more for a T-6, hmmm. Thanks Volvomax for your posts and guidance.

squintsf16 · November 2003

Eitan,

I should get my s-80 back today, and it seems as if a vacuum leak may have been causing many of the problems including the one with the transmission. Supposedly the technician has put over 300 miles on my car after he changed the molded plastic hose that is attached to he throttle body, and the transmission has not had anymore mishaps since this hose was replaced. I saw the hose and it looked like the bottom of it had literally melted. Today will be six weeks that volvo has been working on the car and supposedly they have fixed everything. I am going to get the car back tomorrow and will be trading it in this weekend. Let someone else have the crazy thing. Good luck with yours!

Brian

jrosasmc · November 2003

What does everyone think of the new 2.5T AWD? I think that model will be a blessing to S80 sales, and I also believe that it's probably the best Volvo to come out of Gothenburg since the original 850.

Volvomax, do you think the 2.5T, even with AWD, will place a dent in XC70 or 90 sales?

volvomax · November 2003

I like the S80 AWD, it is easily the best handling and feeling of the S80's.

But, it won't change any of the sales figures for the XC90 or the XC70. In fact, in the Southwest, the South and the West Coast it won't sell in any numbers at all. In the Northern markets I expect it to do quite well. AWD is only a small part of the decision to buy the XC90 and the XC70, there are a whole host of other reasons.

cmnott · November 2003

The 2.5T AWD seemed to get a decent review from Car and Driver and has good power too...0-60 in 7.7? I think.

It the T6 going to be AWD as well? It sure needs it.

jrosasmc · November 2003

Is the 2.5T even out for sale yet in the U.S.?

lancerfixer · November 2003

I'm guessing part of the reason they went with the turbo 5 in the first place is for space limitation...you've already got a transversely mounted straight six under the hood in the 2.9 and T6; there probably wouldn't be any extra room for the AWD running gear. If that's the case, I'd say a T6 AWD is out of the question.

davant · November 2003

It might be that S-60 2.5T AWD configuration fits nicely in the S-80 and trumps the base 2.9 powerplant, killing two birds with one stone. Three if you count swaying prospective S-60 buyers into the S-80 with more powerplant choices. The $5K dealer incentives on the S-80 2.9 and T-6, but not the 2.5T AWD, clearly point which directions Volvo is headed.

Will probably settle for the 2.9 here or jump to the T-6 if I can swing it, partly because of the $5K. Either feels like the best bargain vs. the 2.5T.

rocco62 · November 2003

I am trying to buy an S 80 w/ AWD. However the $5K incentive is only being offerred on the S80s w/o AWD. Will the S80 w/ DSTC do as well in the rain and snow as the S80 AWD??
Here is what I have been quoted:
S80AWD Includes Premium Package,Metallic Paint, Child Booster Seat
             Market Price: 40,995
              Invoice Price: 38,595
               Selling Price: 38,895 which is less than 1% over invoice
S80 with Dynamic Stability Traction Control includes Continuously
Controlled Chassis
Includes Premium Package, Climate Package,Bi-Xenon Headlamps
                            17”Alloy Wheels

                        Market Price: 43,515.00
                        Invoice Price: 40, 765.00
                        Selling Price : 35,399 includes $5000 cash back
What is the lowest I could get a dealewr down on a S80 w/ AWD?

rollie · November 2003

DSTC is far superior to AWD for snow and rain.

DSTC prevents you from running off the road by correcting out of control movements. AWD is useful only in getting you moving from rest if you have differential traction (i.e., better traction under at least one wheel than the others) If you have glare ice under all wheels it won't matter if you have FWD, RWD, AWD, DSTC, etc. because you won't be going anywhere. If you have some traction under at least a wheel AWD can help get you moving. If you hit a patch of ice while underway and start to slide DSTC will correct the slide but AWD won't help a bit.

With a FWD layout I wouldn't be concerned about initial traction for moving from rest. If you can't get going with FWD you might want to reconsider driving. If I had to choose again between AWD and DSTC there's no contest - DSTC wins (of course cars with both like XC90, Audi Quattros with yaw control, etc. are better still.)

Good luck.

-rollie
rdollie@att.net

kiiwii · November 2003

Here is my view....

2.9
Pro:
1.) from personal experience, this is a reliable engine. My 960 (almost the same engine as S80 2.9) is pushing 120k. No engine problem.
2.) 5K incentive.

Con:
1.) not as powerful as 2.5T
2.) doesn't have as many standard features as 2.5T
3.) difficult to find one with DSTC here in the south.

2.5T
Pro:
1.) AWD
2.) more power than 2.9

Con:
1.) higher insurance rate, cuz it has a turbo
2.) turbos tend to "lose" power when getting old, and they may be more expensive to maintain.
3.) I may be wrong on this.... I read that Volvo uses Mitsubishi turbos.

I never had a car with turbos. I know the insurance will be higher, but how much higher??

n0v8or · November 2003

One more con for the AWD:
The tires must be matched. Damage one and you have to replace all four. This has been an unpleasant surprise to many of the XC and V70-AWD owners.

houstons80 · November 2003

I just bought a used 99 s80 2.9 with 46K on it with optional 17's. I changed out the tires the other day and had a hell of a time doing it. Nobody had these tires. I finally broke down and called a TIRE Distributer and asked him what he had and who he conducted business with. He had some Federal SS595 225/50Zr17's that he could get me in an hour and a half! He directed me to a small auto accessories shop about 2 blocks down from and sent the tires over to them for installation. I paid $111 each with the total being $493 out the door taxes included. These are some awesome tires Z rated and very aggressive looking (Almost to much so). 300 Tread wear with AA and A ratings. I think Consumer Reports had the Falken's rated the best in that size and value, but I could not find them. Here is their web site www.federaltire.com. I am a Volvo S80 tire expert as of last week! Ask away.

Planet Houston out...

houstons80 · November 2003

Hello all,
Volvo newbie here in Houston, TX. Does anyone have any experience with any of the Dealers in the Houston Area? I currently have mine in the shop for a once over since I just bought it. It has been acting crazy of course right after I bought it. Warning lights going off, AM radio working like crap, Transmission shudder when shifting gears during hard acceleration. All the usual S80 issues. I have 48K on the car, but the time on the warranty ran out in June. So I am basically stuck stuck with a bill. The service writer told me to get an extended warranty and bring it back to get fixed. Does anyone have any experience (GOOD) with the warranty companies. They all seem "seedy" what about ease of use when you take it to the shop etc. ANy input would be appreciated. Take care. Planet Houston ....

tmart · November 2003

Kinda surprised you had trouble getting some 17 inchers. Have never had a problem getting them for my C70 at Discount Tire. Only experience I've had with dealers is with DeMontrond on North I-45. Can't complain about their service department. You can buy extended warrantys from the dealer. Mine expires next month. Am planning to go thru my credit union. Their price is about $500 less than Volvo's.

kiiwii · November 2003

You may want to try Volvo of Houston. It's close to I-10 and beltway 8. I think it's the largest Volvo dealer in town, and the service is okay. I have tried other Volvo dealers in Houston, and I was pretty disappointed.

davant · November 2003

DTSC...hmmm, maybe. Down South and East we have poor drainage and oyster shell roads. If you're not familiar, it's especially treacherous after a light rain. Anyone think DTSC is that much better than the standard S-80 STC?

The AWD vs. S-80 prices posted above sound good. The 5-cyl felt choppy to me at idle in the S-60, can't imagine it got better in an S-80. Your thoughts on this impending deal are appreciated:

'04 S-80 2.9, Prem, 17" wheels, mudflaps on all 4, metallic paint, MSRP 40,670 (thereabouts), will sell for $7350 off down to $32,800. Sounds like a great deal to me, your thoughts?

I would like to add the -801 stereo, reverse sensors, and maybe DTSC. The $7350 discount still stands no which I choose from this particular dealer, others hem & haw. The dealer offering this isn't real local which isn't a major problem if the price is right. Anyone have pos/neg experiences buying from another dealer and getting serviced locally?

Also, the pearl white sounds interesting. Can't find a vehicle picture (not a fob or sample) anywhere. Anyone able to post or e-mail me a photo?

Good luck in Houston.

edkunkel · November 2003

It is kind of a shame that S80 prices seem so soft. When you can get more than 7000 dollars off on a car it must mean the demand is very, very low.

It almost seems like its the death knell of the car.

Perhaps Volvo needs to do more than just refresh the car after 5 years.

XC 90 prices are high only because they all fell of the boat into the North Sea. There is some demand for the S60Rs I guess.

Oh, I had a bad knocking noise, like valve tap or a sewing machine. I read somewhere that it was the O-rings in the oil pump. Sure enough that was it. So my 99 S80 lives on, quiet as new.

I had a Cross Country XC70 loaner and it had the 2.5 all wheel drive.

I kind of liked it. The AWD gives the sensation of sure footedness. My wife took it on a long trip. She had some complaints about swaying and vertigo from her passengers, but perhaps this station wagon AWD is more raised up than the S80, it must be. It looks so anyway.

volvomax · November 2003

The S80 is a hell of a deal right now.
Sadly, the car continues to suffer from its launch reputation.
The S80 was a very ambitious project for Volvo, one that they lacked the resources to bring off.
Volvo is at least 2 yrs away from a new S80 and I don't think anyone wants them to rush it this time.
The new AWD is a very nice car, much more stable than the fwd variants.
I would give anything to have an awd T6 though.

BTW, the ship sinking had nothing to do with the XC90's popularity. Only 900 or so XC90's went down with the ship.
The myriad of awards and recognition plus the overall good design and thoughfulness of the Swedes is what keeps that car hot.
Hopefully the new S80 will benefit from the XC90's success.

mnuss · November 2003

My husband is trying to buy an S80 T6 in Ice White with no options (no climate package, etc.) We live in Jacksonville, FL. We have been quoted $40,387.00 (which includes the destination charge), $366.00 for dealer service charge, tax of 2,495.18 (6 percent plus $50.00), and 177.00 for tag and title, for a total of $43,425.18. Does this sound like a good deal? I've seen other posts (like rocco62's) which talk about a $5000 cash back but I can't find anything about this elsewhere. Has this incentive expired? My dealer says the $40,387 price he quoted me includes this, but rocco62's price quote is even lower. Where are you guys, that you can get this $5K rebate? Any help would be appreciated.

larryp3 · November 2003

I did not think you could get a T6 with no climate package in the USA. Are you sure??

mnuss · November 2003

To respond larryp3: The dealer told me there was no climate package. This is not a T6 Premier, just a T6. The climate package includes heated seats, rain sensor, etc. I just looked at the car a few minutes ago but I didn't notice any of those things.

brt1 · November 2003

Does anyone know how to adjust the aim of the lo beams on an s-80?

n0v8or · November 2003

See www.carsdirect.com for curent pricing. I have found them to be a reliable source and always get thir price or lower.

There is a factory-to-dealer price incentive of $7000 in my area (Northeast). It does not pass directly to the customer like a rebate, so you have to negotiate to get it.

davant · November 2003

You have to look hard at other sites I can't mention here but there is $5K on both the 2.9 and T-6 , not the 2.5T AWD, through Dec, no telling if it will be extended. Volvo secretly added the T-6 to the $5K plan in late Oct. As stated above, you'll have to pull teeth to get it. I can't see anywhere that there's $7K, could be dealer discount included with Volvo's incentive.

The price mnus is getting in #1373 is high IMHO. Here's what one dealer put in writing on a T-6 trumping that deal heavily: '04 S-80 T-6 ($44,525), White Pearl ($600), Climate Package ($650), Bi-X headlights ($500), 4-C chassis ($995). Destination ($685) is included for a total MSRP of $47,995, discounted $7350 ($5K of it from Volvo) for a before tax total of $40,644! Tax here in NW FL is about the same as Jacksonville.

As you can see, this has $2,745 worth of options and is only $257 more than your current deal. If you can figure out how to e-mail me I'd be glad to fax it to you along with other similar ones. Even with such a deal the wifey is shying away from the T-6, just too much oomph, I'm just about shedding tears. We have similar offers from the same dealer with the same discount as I rambled about earlier. I would like to find a car like the one you're looking at in one of the neutral metallics.

kiiwii · November 2003

I would aim the final price (before TTL) to be the MSRP minus $7000 to $7500. The dealer mark up from invoice for S80 is around $2000-2500. Since there is a $5000 incentive, the true cost of the S80 is MSRP minus $5000 minus $2000-2500. If you aim for $7k off MSRP, the dealer should still have $500-$700 of profit. ...this is just my very rough calculation.

davant · November 2003

Well put Kiiwii. I successfully bargained for $7,200 off of MSRP on a T-6 now including getting the car elsewhere which is a good deal according to a pricing service that also publishes a magazine but shall remain nameless.

I believe in fair dealer profit but consumer info/research warehouses, namely this site, are a great help in saving at least a few hundred bucks. Dealers don't have to disclose there's a $5K incentive. I imagine some non-web researching customers are gloating they haggled down 2-3 thou after viewing the invoice price and because they're uninformed allow the dealer to pocket all or most of the 5 grand. In slang Latin terms left up to your interpretation, "Carshopus Saveabundle Dealerrectum" ;o]

Keep posting the bargains, I will too.

rickeyinva · November 2003

I'm in the process of buying an S80 2.9, and my dealer is offering a $1000 discount for AARP members in addition to the $5000 Volvo discount.
Haven't been able to find out whether that's local, or Volvo/Ford wide. Nothing on AARP's web site about it either.

The dealer is also offering a $200 dealer loyalty discount (we've bought there before). The non-negotiated price (they don't negotiate) is $2000 off MSRP. Add it up, and that's $8200 off a $40,825 MSRP car! The same discounts apply to the T6 if I could justify it.

My wife's company (quite large) has an employee discount with Ford (including Volvo), and that program's price is about $125 above what the dealer has offered; however, under that program you don't have to pay for processing and document prep fees (about $275)...so that's even a bit better deal.

skapetan · November 2003

Does anyone know if you'll get the $5000 discount in conjunction with Ford's X-Plan pricing?

My company offers a discount through Ford on Volvo's, but I don't know if I can get a better deal right now simply by going in and negotiating myself.

Thanks.

kiiwii · November 2003

T6? Excellent Choice!! This is my very first choice. This is a tank with rocket!! Have fun.

kiiwii · November 2003

I was looking at the X-plan for S80 that was offer by Ford to us. It's only about $2000 off MSRP. I don't know if the pricing was published before the $5k incentive.

I had a chance to deal with a Jaguar dealer with the X-plan (something similar, but I believe Jaguar has a different name for the plan). The salesman wasn't too happy when I mentioned that I would purchase the car with X-plan. I called and left him a message days after the test drive. He didn't even bother to call back. Not sure why... maybe they won't get that much profit from X-plan? ... just something interesting experience I had

tcormier · November 2003

hello all! just now looking into the S80 "value play". Here in New England can't find confirmnation of $5k dealer incentive. Based upon FLA looks like $5-$7k off msrp even for AWD is target pricing?

tpc

rickeyinva · November 2003

The rebates, including the $5000, do apply under the X-plan. The X-plan price is 2% above invoice for Volvo (varies for other Ford products), and it's very close to the dealers price anyhow. The big difference was not having to pay the almost $300 in document preparation charges. Our salesman also didn't seem to like us using X-plan, but the sales manager, on the other hand, didn't seem to care.

To Tcormier: the $5000 rebate isn't valid for the AWD, only the 2.9, 2.5 Turbo, and Premier. For the AWD, I would expect only $2000-2500 off MSRP.

davant · November 2003

T-corm,
You won't find the $5K incentive anywhere but on websites like this one. Dealers will probably tell you the scoop if pressed but they aren't obligated to share that money with you. If you notice, it doesn't apply to the AWD S-80 2.5T. This was no mistake. I think Volvo is leading us toward that S-60 powerplant because maybe next year the 2.9 will go away and the T-6 will be AWD if they can figure out how to do it. This is purely my speculation but would give Volvo two 4WD powerplant choices in its top-notch sedan.

rick-va,
Ba-Bam grandpa! Nice job, makes me look silly with a $7350 discount, I wish I was older. The T-6 is just so much fun to drive, if it's in your budget with all those stacked discounts, I highly recommend it, you won't be sorry, insurance isn't but a few bucks a month more over the 2.9. What colors are you considering? I finally got White Pearl photos thanks to one great dealer. Even a basic T-6 was a stretch and with my list of options, just too much money as the 2.9 is plenty zippy (OK, I'm rationalizing away my pain). Our local dealer has exactly what her first choice is and my second; Gold 2.9, Premium Package, 17 inch rims and variable speed assist steering (better this year with a ZF unit), Warm & Climate (dealer claims the IR reflective windshield is great), On-Call Plus, MSRP $42,660, discounted well to $35,300 ($7350 off, 2.75% above CRWP), we're going for it! I feel comfy as it looks like Ford is only giving their best pals what we non-X-plan eligibles can do on our own, I did that well on my Ford Expie Eddie B here too.

Next issue, I know extended warranties are well regulated but anyone care to share what they paid or what I will should pay for a 7 year, 100K mile, $50 deductible VOLVO plan? Thanks for everyone's help and feedback.

kiiwii · November 2003

How do you get a 2.9 with speed sensitive power steering? I thought you have to opt for T6 to get it.

davant · November 2003

Kiiwii,

If you get the factory installed Stentor 17 inch rims you get the ZF variable assist rack & pinion steering too on the 2.9. It is standard on the T-6. If I remember right, it's on the window sticker listed like "(includes speed sensitive steering). Not sure if that's true with the optional rims on the 2.5T version.

tcormier · November 2003

anyone, (thanks davant)

have u driven each of these? could a T-6 with traction control negotiate a steep, snowy, hill from essentially a standtill as well as the new AWD in your opinion?

kiiwii · November 2003

Davant, how do you like the 17 inch wheel? I'm sure the handling is better than 16" size. How's the ride quality? 17" wheel has a pretty aggressive tirewall ratio -> 50.

Yes, you are correct. You get speed sensitive power steering with the 17". That's a nice surprise

Volvo S80

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