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Comments
Since writing the note, a friend who has an A4 with this interior but in a 2000 or 2001 says, some cleaning but no stains from leather -- so they might have "fixed" the staining problem.
I forgot to mention that the driver's side seat belt also caused a diagonal mark on the seat back near my left shoulder which became a shadow after the 4th or so month.
I forgot also to mention that I had purchased for an earlier Audi that I had had a set of custom made sheepskin covers. They were fantastic, comfortable -- but they did hide the leather.
And, expensive as they were, they had to go with the car (an Audi coupe quattro) when I traded the car in. So as much as I liked them, I have never repeated this route. I have looked at NON-custom sheepskin covers and they look tacky and frizz off on wool suits -- the custom ones had no bad habits.
I do believe that, as usual, I perhaps got the "beta test" vanilla seats -- now with timcar's words, I may consider them again -- funny I never see them "in stock" tho.
I have not owned a "vanilla" interior. I find them attractive. However, both owners and my salesman have advised against it, unless you observe a very strict maintenance protocol. I have owned, like Mark, the melange. It wore well. We currently have two black leather interiors; needless to say, they are easy to care for.
I find the melange in my '99 easy to care for if I remember to do it. I use Meguiar's Medallion which is what my detailer recommends.
For those of you who may still be "on the fence" - I am also completely satisifed with the car. I've found myself comparison shopping (again) on the highway - looking at the BMWs, Volvos, etc., that I looked at before I bought this car. No question I made the right decision.
In any case, my point was in support of timcar's speculation (?) that the leather surface had changed beyond the '99 model year (perhaps the grain changed which would account for his experience --i.e., maybe the leather in subsequent years was less porous.)
My melange leather has very tiny pores and when I had it professionally cleaned, it returned to "showroom" quality -- and my wife's TT has finer leather still -- it is "almost like shoe leather" it is so smooth.
Anyone have their 2002 2.7T's or 4.2's or 3.0's yet? Any CVT transmissions? My dealer is still sitting with a few 2001's -- and a whole row of allroads and even a couple of A4's and S4's -- and as we have noted it seems that the 2002's are being held in port until the '01's are gone.
And, I noticed that for the first time in months (years I think) Audi's sales were down (in September -- obviously due to the Terrorist attacks).
I have owned only A6's; however, I have driven A4's. More to the point, my wife's new A6 Avant 3.0 is a transformed car, in light of the new engine. I can only surmise that the impact of the new V6, on the lighter A4, would be even more dramatic.
In fairness to the 2.7T: I have written previously that it has the aura of a small V8; It is simply one of the nicest engines I have either experienced or owned.
The MSRP was $45,175 and the cap cost was $39,000. The money factor was .00175 or 4.2% APR (much worse than Volvo's 1.5% APR but comparable to BMW's 4.5% and much better than Lexus' 6.2% APR). The driveaway costs were about $2,000. Total monthly lease incl. taxes is just under $500.
Other key factors for me were the no cost service plan for the first 50K miles and that I was willing to look at cars with up to 1000 miles.
Hope this helps. I pick it up today and can't wait to drive it.
The deal on the 2.7t seems adequate. However, you did not mention the Audi loyalty program. Was that offered to you? If applicable, it would have paid for the first month's lease, up to $800, and reduced some up front costs.
Enjoy your A6.
I have test driven the A6. Very nice for the relatively short test drive. The dealership is offering most of the A6 2.7T's on the lot for practically invoice.
For about the same amount of money, I could get an A4 3.0. I plan to test drive it soon. Right now I must say that I like the looks of the new A4.
Some previous comments that I have read regarding reliability issues with the A6 have me concerned. Have there been any significant problems with the 2001 models? Where the reliability issues primarily with pre 2001 models? Is it common for automatic transmissions to go out soon after 50,000 miles?
I know that the A4 is new and may present with its own set of new model year problems, especially with the new engine.
Any and all feedback is most appreciated.
" - Phone Transmitter Kit; 1J0051438AH
- Speaker Kit (Bose); 000051437E
- Speaker Harness (Bose); 8D00514433
- Console Base For Phone; 4B1051601A1EJ
- Bumper Antenna; 000051506D
There's no part number assigned yet for the glass mount antenna."
There are several discussion threads that may prove helpful on this subject, check out the URL below and search for "Nokia Phone" -- or just Phone.
http://www.audiworld.com/search/index.html
The problem is the dealer is $1000 more than I think is a great deal. Because of this, I'm thinking I should buy a 2002 A6 4.2 (color?)/Melange/sport/etc. and try to get 3 to 4% over invoice 3% is my magic number on a new purchase of the current model.
The fact that the 2001 A6 4.2 is a year old and sitting on the lot since June tells me that the dealer "could" sell the car at $500 over and free up some capital to increase his 2002 stock.
Any comments?
Dre
Sight unseen,other than swatches,I will become the proud owner of a 2002 4.2 Crystal Blue metallic/Platinum in hopefully 3 weeks.I was lucky in that the car is on this side of the pond and was available to the dealer.
Oddly,in the beginning I was ready to get a 2.7T,but after recent events,I thought what the heck,you only live once.Besides when you consider standard equipment and content the price differential is not that great.
I've seen the Crystal Blue in the showroom on a 3.0 model, very subtle color. Looks more silvery blue on the showroom floor. It should hide dirt well. Did you inquire at all about the A8's? I'm wondering how close they'd be in price since the A6's appear to be selling well and the A8's are not.
First impressions:
http://forums.audiworld.com/a6/msgs/90399.phtml
First Pics:
http://forums.audiworld.com/a6/msgs/90658.phtml
Thanks, Markcincinnati for hooking me up with Ralph!
First impressions:
http://forums.audiworld.com/a6/msgs/90399.phtml
First Pics:
http://forums.audiworld.com/a6/msgs/90658.phtml
Thanks, Markcincinnati for hooking me up with Ralph!
In fact my wallpaper is a (supposedly) 2003 A6 that I got of the www somewhere.
I read your post with interest, not that I don't believe you, but where did you get your 2004 info?
Thanks.
Thanks for the comments. The problem is I'm in an either/or situation. Either Audi financing 2.9% or Invoice'ish price. Dealers must be getting incentives to move the remaining 2001 stock. I'm guessing that is why the dealers are selling for invoice if you have "other" financing. The numbers are not in favor of the low invoice price compared to Audi of America 2.9% financing.
FYI:This is in regards to a Buy.
Price-wise since this is a non-lease deal I'm at mid 51's out the door including luxury tax, PPX package and TTL.
Hope your decision is as easy as mine was.
Has Conti contact 2 tyres (and BOY, are they noisy!). Getting the AVS dBs on Wednesday.
jk
I love the dual pipes on the 2002s! Must be the infant in me...
He said that "they" have had problems with that combo but wasn't specific. He also said that it was so rare that he would need a deposit so that he wouldn't get stuck with an un-sellable car if I backed out.
Needless to say, I shopped elsewhere although I could see his point. I had no luck finding that combo and settled happily for brilliant black w/ melange. I'm interested in hearing these stories though.
As for Consumer Reports, my transmission flows seamlessly but I don't drive Mercedes daily so maybe I'm just not refined enough to notice the writer's "issue"...
Just a thought.
In the off chance that you did not see this article, here is a link describing a buy-out of a lease below residual value.
http://www.edmunds.com/news/column/carmudgeon/47476/article.html
Isn't this what you call getting upside-down on a lease? I know you lease through Audi rather than a bank, but I found it interesting. It almost seems like cheating if you lease with the intent of sticking it to the bank - not that there aren't a few who deserve payback. How does AFS move all of those returned cars?
Greg
Please report if you had one or both.
Thanks
Dre
As regards criticisms of Audi's: this message board is chock full of significant and substantive commentary on specific problems. You need only read Mark's brake saga or my comments on incessant warning chimes to conclude that we are not evading reality.
Cars, for the enthusiast, are an emotional and subjective choice and experience. On the other hand, when one makes a practical selection, based upon necessity, objectivity rules. My firm leases a fair number of autos. Several years ago the decision to lease Chevy Lumina's was made. The cap cost for each vehicle was less than $18,000. They have proven to be safe, economical and reliable vehicles. However, they evoke the passion of a grapefruit. Conversely, they make our accountant tingle with pleasure. This is not a criticism of the Chevy; it may be of the accountant.
An Audi will not supply the sense of sobriety of a car intended to be an "appliance". Nor will it bore you. It is sort of like choosing a spouse: do you want thrilling interludes, interspersed with moments of frustration; or do you wish a steady, predictable routine, and the absence of controversy. Of course this analogy is suspect: the vehicle separation usually comes after 36 to 48 months.
If you have any specific questions on what frustrates or cheers Audi owners, you have but to ask. I have found the members of this message board to be both tolerant and candid. And nuts about their cars.
Cap. cost $45,200 (sticker $52,200)
Payments: $548.49 plus MA tax $27.40, total $575.91
39 months
10,000 miles per year
Due at inception: lux tax $288, 1st payment, no cap cost red.
residual at end of lease $28,188
I also added cd changer for $299.00
Dealer was Ira Audi, Danvers, MA
I hope this helps.
One or many may dismiss Consumer Reports -- others may totally buy the Consumer Reports write ups and use them as a reason to or not to buy. Generally I find Consumer Reports reviews of cars have little to do with the "joy" of driving -- no matter what the make or model.
I have been forthcoming in my experiences with over 24 Audis -- virtually none of them has been perfect. All of them have been rewarding and exciting to drive. One or two of them has been a pain in the butt (my 1978 Audi 5000 and my 1979 Audi Silver Fox -- which I believe was called a GTI -- were both fraught with problems, too numerous to go into here). The dealer and the company (AoA) have always always always made things "right!"
The cars are a pleasure to drive. They are mechanical -- they have problems.
At this moment, I have not found anything that even comes close to them and I will continue to lease/own and drive them.
My wife is on her second TT and says "I can never drive another car."
The cars from Audi are not appliances -- I read a review of cars written by Jay Leno once, wherein he said that Lexus and Acura and Infinity are fine cars, but they are so perfect they are bland! That expresses my feelings to a T.
Term (months) 39
Residual (% of MSRP) 0.54
Residual Value 28188
Money Factor 0.00153
APR (for info only) 0.03672
Monthly Lease Charge 112.28
Monthly Depreciation 436.21
Base Monthly Payment 548.49
Sales Tax 27.42
Total Monthly Payment 575.91
Due at inception
1st payment 575.91
Down Pmt 0
Security Deposit 0
Title, Tags, Misc. 288
Tax on Down Pmt 0
Total 863.91
These numbers are very good. If memory serves me correctly, Audi was advertising 2.9% on a lease in August. The delta between the 2 money factors for total payments is only $991.38 using the same capital cost. It looks like you got a very good deal. I'm assuming MA tax is 5%.
Thanks
Dre
I couldn't turn it down at this price.
(I love the car, btw)
I have a '98 A4 with the 2.8, 5-speed, and Quattro. It is one helluva fun car and a blast to drive. If it's not too deep, it goes in the snow better than my wife's Suburban.
I was excited about the new A4, and after reading here and elsewhere I had decided that the new 3.0 with the six-speed was the car for me. I was ready to order sight unseen.
I went to the dealer yesterday to get my oil changed and they had one A4 - a 3.0 with tip and 3.6 miles on it. I initially liked the looks of the front end, but the rest of the car looked chunky and angular - not the smooth flowing look I am accustomed to. I saw an '02 A6 next to it and really appreciated the nice lines, even the rear end which I used to hate. On the inside of the A4, it is also more angular, and the instrument cluster is much less appealing (too much digital mess, no oil temp gauge, and no analog clock). You can't raise the parking brake without bumping up the center console. The audio and heating/ac systems looked much improved however, and I like some of the new features. It is obvious that the Germans will never cater to our "Big Gulps" though, and after having spent some time driving in Europe I know why.
The test drive - the 3.0 is really powerful and they have tuned the engine and the exhaust so that you really know it's there. Still not enough low end torgue though. I thought the handling was kind of squirrely, but the salesman called back later in the day to say the car had not been prepped and the blocks were still in the suspension. No wonder it didn't feel right. The tiptronic was actually a lot more fun that I expected, especially because it had the steering wheel mounted shift buttons.
I then drove the A6 with the 3.0 and the tip. I know it has to be heavier, but it didn't seem much slower. I really liked the extra room after having driven an A4 for four years, and the interior is gorgeous. It also obviously costs more money.
Questions:
1. Have any of you die-hard manual tranny loyalists bought a tip and been satisfied?
2. Would you spend more money on an A6 now when they are going to change it next year and likely add some new technology?
3. The A4 was silver, showing all of the body panel lines and angles. Have any of you seen a dark color, and does that "wash away" a lot of that?
4. Is the A6 just too refined compared to the A4?
5. I'm concerned about the comments regarding the 6-speed tranny in the A4 (Post #2090). Has anyone else driven one?
I think all of the Audis are great, but I wasn't as impressed with the new A4 from the appearance and interior standpoint. If I could justify the extra money, maybe the 2.7T in an A6 with the sport suspension is the answer.
Any input would be appreciated. Just when I thought I had made up my mind, more choices. All good ones though.
I love my V8 and virtually everything about my A6 -- my wife had 2 A4 2.8 quattros both with stick. I had an S6 with a 5 spd manual -- man I miss that car.
But, the V8 and the 2.7T engines seem to do just fine with the tip -- I confess to not having driven a new A6, but I have driven a new A4 (with stick) and I like it -- makes me long for the S4 coming soon.
So, having said this, I would NOT feel that I had something "less" with a tip than with a manual. I just happen to like the manual better -- but obviously not enough better to make me not get an A6 with that wonderful V8 (and based on your comments the 3.0 V6 is pretty spanky too).
That's my $.02 worth.
A standard seat with the sport suspension would have been my preference. While the car is fun and competent even with the standard suspension, it's a little floaty at higher speeds with stock 16" wheels and stock all-season tires. Word is that just more aggressive tires make a difference, larger wheels, more so. There's also plenty of modifications that can be done to the non-sport suspension. But if the sport seats are comfortable for you, no reason not to get the sport package.
Rumor has had it that the A6 standard suspension was replaced for '02 with the sport suspension from earlier years, and the new sport suspension is even firmer. I have no idea if this is factual.
Word is the current A6 will be replaced in two years, not one. If you like it, don't mind a little larger car, and find it more comfortable, why not?
As to the age old "manual" question: The tiptronic is quite nice; it is a fun substitute for the auto modes (normal and sport for 2002); however, as a former BMW and Alfa driver, there is no substitute for a four, five or whatever speed, if it is in your blood. That having been said, given the type of driving I do these days (rush hour mixed with aggressive driver commandos), I find the auto a pleasant companion. I must be getting old. On the other hand, Sterling Moss always believed that one is foolish to drive a manual, on the street, when an automatic is available. Of course, none of us had his track time (or skill).
The A4 is not as attractive, in 2002, as its previous incarnation. I have no idea why Audi so drastically modified the styling. It is clearly A6 derivative and uninspiring Further, since you have owned an A4, you do not require commentary on interior space, or lack thereof.
In essence, I suggest that if you genuinely desire a manual, get it. If you like the idea of an automatic, with tiptronic, you will not be disappointed. Finally, the 3.0 is a serious performer, worthy of taking its place with two other stellar engines, the 2.7T and the 4.2.
And, I do believe there is a place for measurable qualities, etc.
But driving is subjective -- Audi has never been very good in its marketing campaigns in my opinion, but their Joy campaign seems to hit the mark. Consumer Reports doesn't speak much to the heart but a lot to the head.
I would not totally disregard Consumer Reports data, but I would hardly ever imagine myself able to buy or not buy a car based on their "data."
Sure, I want a reliable car -- and if the reliability factor gets too low, well I would probably not buy a car because of it -- but a totally reliable car that gave no "driving pleasure" would not be my cup of Tea!
Morphie you are right about the 3.0. I was hesitant to heap praise on it after having only driven it for a few miles with a transmission I am unfamiliar with. But it is a dramatic improvement over the 2.8. I have been mostly satisified with the 2.8 in my A4, but the A6 was never a consideration with that engine. But the 3.0 really is impressive. I wish they offered the A6 with a 3.0 and six-speed, as they do in the A4.
I need to spend a little more time with the tip. I live in the mountains and the nearest stoplight is over 50 miles away. Lots and lots of twisties and no traffic. In other words, the ideal environment for a manual. I rarely feel the need to be relieved by an automatic unless I am in a city, and as infrequent as that occurs it really doesn't rate much consideration.
I'm also glad that someone feels the same way I do about the styling of the new A4. The A6 looked really nice next to it.
Tim you're right about the new model being an '04 (sorry, I should have read more prior posts). That pretty much negates my concerns about driving an outdated model in only one year. I usually trade every three anwyay, but wasn't ready to give up the A4 last year. Yes, you can get the 2.7 with a six speed, and I just need to sit in the sport seats to see how they fit.
Mark - I'm sure you miss the S6. I have had notions of putting aside all of this deliberation and getting a good deal on an '01 S4. I would have so much fun I don't think I would care if it is last years style or smaller. BTW, was the A4 that you drove a 3.0 with a six-speed or the 1.8? What do you think of the exterior, and what color was it?
What I really need to do is spend a little more time driving these cars. The problem is the nearest dealer is almost two hours away. Oh well, that's the price you pay for living in the sticks.