Audi A6

markcincinnati · August 2002

I think you can still get an extended warraty for money that real people can afford.

There may be a 25K extension of the factory warranty available for a few $$$.$$ -- from Audi.

Then you would have a 75k policy -- as I recall you must have the car be "in warranty" and all service records and intervals current.

And yes I saw several "old" Audis just today and they seem fine -- of course I base this assumption because they were being driven at the time here in 93 degree Cincinnati with their windows up, which I assume means that their AC is even working. Just recall the few posters
who have had 5 figure repair needs OUT OF WARRANTY. Admittedly it has been a minority, but I keep insurance on all the important stuff -- and think that this may be a prudent course of action -- IF it is indeed avail to you.

And I am crossing my fingers!

cdnpinhead · August 2002

there were actually people who bragged about the number of "trouble-free" miles on their vehicle. I had an MGB at the time which I might have put forward, after fixing the issues it had when I bought it.

I follow this board for a couple of reasons, beyond sheer entertainment: 1) Is there anyone who has owned an Audi for long enough to have accumulated six figures of mileage and still thinks it's worth having?, and 2) I was very pleased with my Audi rentals last year in Europe (twice), and am willing to give the brand the benefit of the doubt.

On item (1) I'm still waiting, and suspect that I will be for some time. Regarding item (2), it's clear that these people can build good cars.

Always hopeful. . .

mbnut1 · August 2002

When I feel the need to read about people bragging about how many relatively trouble free miles they have been able to put on their cars I go to the Mercedes Benz club site. Benz diesels have astounding longivity.

max27t · August 2002

Hello Mr. cdnpinhead,

It seems most of the people on this forum discuss 0-4 year old cars. High mileage cars are usually older than that. You may have already checked out the form on Audi World for older A6s (I have not). In case you might be interested, here is a link:

http://forums.audiworld.com/a6100/

Cheers,

m.

hintz · August 2002

Looking at leasing a 2002 audi allroad, went to the dealer here in Naples Fl on saturday, but they were short staffed and unable to help me and told me to call and make an appointment during the week!! This already gave me a bad taste in my mouth! I guess I will drive to Ft Myers to the other audi dealer in town. What are people leasing these vehicles? Sticker is around 47K. This is the first time I've ever looked into leasing. Any help would be greated appreciated!! Thanks in advance.

JBaumgart · August 2002

You might want to post your question on the allroad forum at AudiWorld.com - I do know that in some parts of the country people have been able to negotiate close to invoice on remaining 2002 allroads, but am not sure about leasing. I have a 2001 (didn't lease - paid cash) and except for one unscheduled repair (under warranty at Audi's expense) I am completely happy with it - it's a great car.

uwscarguy · August 2002

I called my dealer over the w/e and inquired about an extended warranty on my '01 2.7T. Basically, the dealer offered me coverage up to 75k miles for $2607. This was a bit more than I was anticipating so I think I will take my chances and go uncovered after warranty expires.

marleybarr · August 2002

I paid $2300 for a 3 year /50,000 mile extended warranty that takes over when the factory warranty expires.

It doesn't cover everything, has a $100.00 per visit deductible on covered items.

Is this extra warranty a waste of money? It is like buying many other forms of insurance. I guess you could ask yourself.... how many repairs does $2300 pay for on the Audi 2.7T? At $88.00/hr. labor + parts markup, it won't take long!

uwscarguy · August 2002

You are absolutely correct and clearly you got a better deal than I did since the warranty offered to me would run concurrent to the existing one UP TO 75k miles. Anyway, the way I see I could simply save that money and use it to pay-off my lease 5-6 months early. That way I'd get a new Audi (with a more sensible lease term for my driving habits) and be driving an "old" out-of-warranty car that many fewer months. Furthermore, since by that time I'd be over my 60k mileage alotment on the car I'd also not be racking up extra miles which I'd have to pay for at the end.
Thanks for your input.

markcincinnati · August 2002

I like the option of "early out" on the lease.

One medium "issue" would easily cost 4 figures to repair.

marleybarr · August 2002

I have been told (off record) by various Audi dealer service writers that the average non-warranty dealer repair runs $400-$500 on many episodes.

Even something relatively minor like changing the xenon headlight runs $300-$400 for the part and atleast $100 labor.

I have also been informed that changing out the 5-speed tiptronic runs almost $9000!! The dealer doesn't see the "tip" die often, but they do see it happen.

I plan to keep my 2.7T for 100,000 miles or more if possible, so I decided to try the extended warranty route.

bjbird2 · August 2002

Hintz, before you buy that allroad, you might read this review....

http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/comparison/articles/71177/article.html

Happy Trails...

JBaumgart · August 2002

In Edmund's ranking system I think they underweighted performance more than most here would. At just 20% of the total score, the allroad's almost perfect 98.4 rating (nearly 20 points ahead of the next best score) couldn't overcome its very low "recommended" and "personal" ratings, which are very subjective and reflect the bias of the testers. Also the criticisms of transmission lag has been addressed in the 2002 model allroad - or you can have the transmission control module updated (or buy the 6 speed manual). I thought it was very unfair and a bit puzzling why they opted to test a 2001 model in the first place when the others were 2002's. Another puzzling question that I had was how did the 3.0 X5 edge out the allroad in the "feature content" rating? On the X5 and is typical for most BMW's it seems that nearly everything is optional and you pay extra for it. There is some good information in the review but I wouldn't base my buying decision on the final "score".

a6cvtowner · August 2002

I have 2002 A6 CVT. I liked this car until recently I drove at night and suddenly lost all my interior lights, power windows, power sits and power locks controls.

I bring my car to dealership ( "Audi of Huntington Valley" in Philadelphia) and 4 days they are trying(?...) to determine what the problem is.

Is somebody had any electrical problems in Audi 2002?

tmanlaw · August 2002

Your problem sounds similar to that experienced by "vertimax" shortly after picking up his new 2002 A6. See post #'s 3018 and 3023. His problem was a short in the vanity mirror. Hope your fix is as easy as his was. Good luck.

kirby2010 · August 2002

Despite my admonition in previous posts about reading the material provided with the car I have to admit that I never read the maintenance stuff. Until now, that is. Frankly, I'm a klutz and changing oil is where my expertise stops. Today, however, I took my car in for the 20,000 mile service. Thankfully I casually asked about rotating the tires. Not covered! In fact only one tire rotation is covered - at 5,000 miles. I was skeptical about the 10,000 mile oil change interval. It's clear now that covered service is driven by the bottom line.

Has anyone done an assessment of the recommended service intervals and determined maintenance items that could/should be done more frequently?

By the way - I remain very pleased with this car (2.7T, 6-speed).

nosho · August 2002

Some 2.7T turbos seem to be hard on the oil (at least mine are) so I change (Jiify Lube at $60 for Mobile One) the oil at half the recommended period. So it's dealer one time and Jiffy the next. If your oil is clear at 5000 then don't change it. But if it's discolored, change it.

Personal opion/observation....

dpedersen1 · August 2002

I just took home a 2.7T with all the toys, Sport, Premium, Convenience, tiptronic, Bose, heated seats. List $47100, did the summer special lease at $547/mon (6.6% tax), $3500 down, $24K residual, 42mon, 10K miles. This is my first ever lease so but I think it is fair deal.

Love the car, it replace my '96 Infinity I35T which my wife now drives (we are dumping her old minivan - so she is thrilled!).

I appreciate all the great insights that this site offers and it is only Links list now so I can check often.

hall42 · August 2002

Hello out there! With no difference in cost, would you choose an A6 CVT or A6 Quattro (in Illinois)? Also, how is the navigation system?

Thanks for the input! (I'll let you all know what I'm up to later, hint: remember the oil leak)

markcincinnati · August 2002

In Illinois IMHO -- 100% certain I would choose quattro.

I have the navigation system and despite it's small screen and no moving map, it has been remarkable, 98+% reliable and very easy to use. I wouldn't leave home without it.

The reliable comment would be true of any system that uses the Bosch Maps -- I cannot comment on others. Audi and Merc use Boshc and the maps are updated annually, which helps, but from time to time the instruction says proceed to the nearest road when I think I am on what should be a recognized road. Doesn't happen often but it has happened a couple of times and hence the 98+% remark.

timcar · August 2002

I'd get the quattro. I know that quattro also used to give you the independent rear suspension which is both smoother riding and better handling than the solid axle. I know that with the '02 redesign, all A4's went to IRS, but I don't think the FWD '02 A6 has it. Add this to the AWD's superior traction, and IMO, handling, and it's a no-brainer. Deanna, I sure hope this means that AoA and/or the dealer is going to do the right thing by you.

hintz · August 2002

What is everyone leasing the A6 for? with premium package and convenience package for 39mo. Was quoted $399.00 per month plus tax. Anyone better deals out there? I also found the CVT engine to be hesitate at times? Thanks!

lar60 · August 2002

The reason for the lease deals is the near 0% money factor being used to calculate the lease. Correct me if I'm wrong, but that's pretty much like 0% financing. If you look at that deal vs. leasing most other cars with 4% - 5% money factors you can get an A6 3.0 for about the same or lower cost of an A4,G35, IS300 etc.. HURRY UP, this is Audi, not dealer sponsored and ends this weekend unless Audi extends it. I just traded my 2001 Audi TT quattro for a beautiful A6 3.0 in Alpaca Beige with Prem pkg, Luxury pkg and convienence pkg for about $38250. Check out pricing on Edmunds and CarsDirect, dealers are dealing on them + the 0%

marleybarr · August 2002

Markcincinnati,

Have you ever brought the 4.2 up to limiter speed, probably about 125 mph? The fastest I have experienced w/2.7T is 107 mph w/ lots left!

Do you believe the limiter is just a "stop" on the pedal wire or is it more sophisticated than that?

markcincinnati · August 2002

I have had my A6 above 110 and it felt fine. I have not hit a limiter in any Audi I have ever had -- I think the fastest I ever drove an Audi was a 1987 5000 CS turbo quattro, to an indicated 120 or so.

I have driven every one of them to at least triple digits -- the problem is I will not do so in anything other than very light traffic, for obvious reasons. Here in Cincinnapolis, it is, sorry to say, pretty hard to feel responsible and safe at speeds above 80 anymore (traffic is thick, that is). So many cars, going way too fast for their capabilities. I am 51 and hope I am only half way done, if you get my drift.

When I am going 80+ and am passed, regularly, by the modern day equivalent of a Pinto, I get scared -- and I'm fearless. And it is strange, this car is almost always driven by a twelve year old wearing a ballcap that is on his head backwards.

Somebody save me.

P.S. the only thing that really bothers me anymore is "passing on the right." I think jail time is the appropriate punishment for such behavior. Yet goin 70 in a 55 will get you in a heck of a lot more trouble with the police.

After driving in Germany and reading the book, "American Autobahn" I am firmly convinced that the single most dangerous (sober) driving "technique" is passing on the right. I can think of NO excuse for this behavior. But, the left lane bandit is a problem -- don't you think?

nosho · August 2002

is part of Engine Control Module computer that monitors speed, RPM, timing and such. The fuel injectors are turned off to limit the speed. Only way around it is to "chip" the engine, which is a modification to the engine control program.

andys120 · August 2002

while driving my '98 A4 Avant after I passed him when he braked in a curve I had no need to slow for(?)

He then flew by me and I decided to let him play cop-bait and hang back while he cleared the path.
I was concentrating so hard that when I looked at the speedo minutes later I was indicating 102. It felt little different from 80--Audi makes truly great high-speed machinery. I backed off a little but I would've had a great excuse--"Officer, I mistook the route marker for the speed limit"(it was Rte 101).

I agree with you Mark about the junk that travels @ high-speeds on our roads. It is truly scary when you are for example, passed on the right by a semi doing 85. There are quite a few posters in here that think it's cool to do triple digits driving minvans, small pickups and the like (see "How fast would you drive if the interestates were deregulated?")

You're right as well about passing on the right (strictly verboten on the Autobahn) but given the number of LLCs there is often no alternative.

markcincinnati · August 2002

I have rarely been passed on the right by a semi, thankfully. But sometimes when the traffic is flowing along at 80 and the passing is being done on the left, someone who wants to go faster will scoot up in the right lane and do some incredibly dumb and potentially dangerous things.

The feeling of safety at high speed that you get in Germany on the autobahn is, I am certain, because of the simple practice of passing only on the left.

Those of us who would like the interstate speed limits increased by say 10 - 20 MPH would only "vote" for such an increase if there would be a crackdown on passing on the right. Huge fines, not for speed, but for improper passing would pave the way for a rise in average speed -- and do so safely.

Hmm, maybe a night in jail for second offense passing on the right -- then we could really crank up the speed on our American Autobahns.

Right now, though -- I feel absolutely unsafe at any speed (with apologies to Ralph Nader) in heavy freeway traffic because you never know "which lane the lunatics are going to be in and pass on." And, no state highway patrol person seems keen on ticketing for passing on the right.

We need lane discipline -- big time.

Now back to Audi discussions, already in progress.

dtwleungnyc · August 2002

Before we can enforce the law in regard to passing on the right. We need to put in penalties for Left Lane Bandits. Once people realize or forced to accept that its not ok to drive 20 mph in the left lane, then it will be logical to enforce the no passing on the right rule.

marleybarr · August 2002

If speed laws were repealed to "reasonable and prudent" like Montana had until a year or so ago, I would be driving 85-90mph in the Audi 2.7t (conditions permitting), and 75-80 mph in my Toy ota camry.

Now I drive 55-60 mph in the left lane behind someone who couldn't even pass the driver's test again!

amarchan · August 2002

The factory head unit (2001 A6 2.7 with Bose system) occasionally "blinked" and would change tracks on a CD, so the dealer replaced the radio today. The first thing I noticed was that the word "Bose" did not come on when the radio was turned on, and the second is the sound quality is horrendous compared to the other unit. Way too much bass, and somewhat distorted sound. Unfortunately the Service Department was closed by the time I realized this, so I have to wait until Tuesday to take this up with them. My question is - are there different head units for the Bose system and the standard system? Physically they look the same, but there apparently is a definite difference in the way they reproduce music. Any ideas?
I took the car in for service today for the brakes. There was a definite shimmy when the brakes were applied at over 70mph. They turned the front discs which were "scratched" and were slightly warped. The problem has diminished but is still present. How have other readers corrected this problem, or is this going to be a recurrent problem?
Thanks for your input.

theremin · August 2002

I'm still deciding between leasing a 2.7T or a Saab 9-5 Aero. One Audi dealer I've talked to is apparently willing to deal pretty heavily on a particular 2.7T on the lot with 17" cross-spoke wheels (even willing to swap them out for 17" chrome wheels from an A4)--the catch for me is the exterior color: crystal blue metallic. This color pretty much turns my stomach. I hardly ever see it on the road--does anyone out there have this color, or even like it? Does it look better in different light? Does it grow on you? What was Audi thinking? I suppose if I get some kind of insane deal I'd have to consider it and maybe chrome wheels (and a little window tinting?) would help it look a little more palatable, but really.....yecchh.

dtwleungnyc · August 2002

When I was shopping for my Avant, my dealer was pushing the Crystal Blue Avant pretty hard. It had all the equipments that I wanted, but the color made me feel uncomfortable, the final word, my wife rejected that color out right. 8)

But since you will be the one that have to look at it everytime before you get into the car. How do YOU like it? I think that's more important.

dtwleungnyc · August 2002

Yes, there are 2 types that I know of. Bose and non-Bose. Most people like the non-Bose head unit more, including myself. I have the Bose head unit in my car because it came with it on the dealer's lot. I believe there's a way to adjust the equilizer settings for the head unit. But you will have to do a search on www.audiworld.com. Good luck.

timcar · August 2002

I think it's fine. Would I chose it? Probably not. If you like it, don't worry about someone else's preferences. If you don't, don't even think about it. You may, or may not, ever be satisfied with it.

timcar · August 2002

I think the head unit for both the Bose and non-Bose is the same. I believe the Bose system has different amps and speakers. I do know that there is a softcode that the dealer must input to differentiate the Bose from non-Bose head unit. Once this is done, you will see the Bose designation when you start it up.

If you have a pre-'02 2.7T or a 4.2, warped rotors are very common. Last time I had access to a TSB on the issue, it said to try turning the rotors first, if not successful, they will be replaced.

rangerwalker · September 2002

I have seen a couple on the road and never like it. I love the look of the silver (although it is common). You're going to have the car a while, so you should get a color you really like. If it turns your stomach now, it's unlikely to get better over time.

dpedersen1 · September 2002

I did about the same process of elimination on my Crystal Blue - wanted something different. Have had (in reverse chrono order) Black, Silver, Black, tan (yech), silver, ...

rayainsw · September 2002

Mark -

I happened to see an article in the Aug. 5 issue of AutoWeek (traditional, paper version - I think it is on-line also) where they drove an Allroad with a selection of modifications that sound like some you are considering. If you have not already seen it, you might be interested.

Just f.y.i.

Cheers,
- Ray
Who is still hoping that someone will market a W8 cat back system . . .

markcincinnati · September 2002

I saw the article too -- it seems the Audiworld crowd gave it mixed reviews -- some are very pro Hoppen Motorsports and some are very pro APR -- the spirit of what I read over on Audiworld is that the article you refer to was "much ado about nothing."

I liked it and still plan some modifications -- I am not totally up to speed on what I need to get the "biggest bang for the buck." A chip? Yes no brainer. 18" wheels and 245 45 x 18 tires? Yes, ditto. New exhaust? Maybe. Bypass valves? Again, maybe. "Y" pipe? Beats me.

I have sent e-mails requesting information -- so far the biggie is the chip -- which I have had experience with -- in a 2000 1.8T that was in my wife's TT (+20% HP and +40% torque).

I've not seen anyone here on edmunds who has chipped his/her 2.7T, but I understand it is pretty common on the S4 which, as you know, has (had) essentially the identical 2.7T under the hood.

The "bypass valves" appear to reduce turbo lag greatly -- which I imagine would be a very good thing once the 2.7T has been "stage one" chipped.

Anyway the chipping and valving etc would be under $1000 -- the exhaust is over $1600 and provides minimal power effect although it does provide some sound, a little HP and some cosmetic changes -- when coupled with a chip the effect is at least an addtional 10HP, but the chip, by itself, adds 58HP -- seems pretty pricey for a small gain especially since I will have at most a 36 month lease.

The wheels and tires, too are over $1500 but the handling improvement is supposed to be quite noticable and positive.

So, I solicit your advice -- chip alone, chip + "valves", chip + valves + exhaust?

Wheels and tires seem like an easy decision. . .so that really is not a question.

If you have any experience with your 2.7T, I would be all ears, as the saying goes.

pgill · September 2002

Question for you: Are you modifying leased Allroads? What do you do at lease turn-in? Don't you have to revert back to stock? If so, what do you do with the aftermarket parts?

JBaumgart · September 2002

Mark, as you know I have an allroad plus my wife drives the A4. While at the dealer recently for routine maintenance I was talking very casually to a very well-informed salesman, and the subject of performance mods and specifically chipping came up. I've had the chipping idea more in the back of my mind than anything, as I find the 2.7T pretty darned strong as is and am leary about possibly voiding the engine/drivetrain warranty on a car that we all know would be very expensive to have repaired on your own. My conversation unfortunately reinforced those fears as this particular salesman told me his dealership's policy on such mods. Basically they frown on it and strongly discourage them and in fact will not even consider taking them in on trade when you go to buy a replacement vehicle - they avoid them like the plague. They know exactly which cars have been modified and according to this guy those who think they can avoid detection (by reinstalling the factory chip, etc) are only fooling themselves. I have no way of knowing if this is true or not, but in my situation here I think I will stay stock at least until the warranty expires - and probably even then I'll have the same concerns if I were to purchase an extended warranty. I wish the dealer here was more "chip friendly" but unfortunately that's not the case - assuming your's is, I must say that I'm jealous as spending $600-$1,000 and getting a measurable boost in performance without warranty concerns would be very attractive indeed!

markcincinnati · September 2002

I have leased virtually all of the Audis I have ever "owned" -- I paid cash for a 1987 500 CS turbo quattro.

I have chipped only 1 of the Audis I leased -- the dealer did it for me. Some dealers are offering chipped and otherwise modified cars as "dealer/performance" options. My dealer will, from time to time, put ground effects, aftermarket wheels, tires, etc. on cars and mark them up -- they go fast.

I have put suspension modifications -- full S8 suspension on an A8 -- the dealer did it for me, I ordered the parts from Joe Hoppen Motorsports. When the parts came in they were in an Audi box and the writing on them was in German. My dealer sells wheels to "dress up" or for performance purposes -- both Porsches and Audis. One of the local VW dealers adds ground effects and "recaro-like" seats, and leather interiors on cars that don't come (to the US) with leather.

I belong -- and have for over 10 years -- to the Audi Car Club (formerly the quattro club of America). Many of the members have put suspension mods, turbo mods, (one guy put a supercharger on his 2.8 A4 -- and his dealer in Huston did the work), plus tire./wheel mods etc.

I have been to the "TT gathering" where almost 100 TT's came together in one spot at the same time from all over -- 3/4 of them were in some way modified -- sound systems, engine mods, ground effects, special paint.

I read, regularly, the Audiworld pages -- lots of mods there.

OK, the point: the club, the dealer, the folks at the Audi driving school in Austria, are well aware of mods. One of the Audi Car Club's members was a "tuner" and he was given a special Mule S6+ car in 1997 -- it was an Audi "200" with a small block V8 engine and a whole bunch of dials and gizmos to adjust the performance of the car while it was being driven. His specialty was the "breathing" of Audi engines -- which he claimed was the cheapest and safest way to increase performance of Audis. I have not tracked down an official Audi exec to speak to the issue of mods. But, then again, there are mods and there are mods.

My 1997 A8 with the S8 suspension and plus 0 tires and "sport air cleaner." I turned the car in, near the end of the lease (4 months to go or so) to the dealer I leased the car from and remember this was the dealer who modded it. The car barely lasted a week on the used car lot.

My first and so far only chipped Audi, a 2000 TT was traded in 7 months after my wife leased it on a 2001 TT with the 225HP engine, ESP, and the "new" suspension system that Audi replaced the original TT suspension system with. Again, the dealer had installed the chip, and the car sold "instantly."

The cars that I have had "aftermarket" wheels on, I traded in, as is. The 1987 5000 CS quattro had a Nak-speaker stereo system and a Blaupunkt aftermarket head unit and amp -- dealer took it in on trade, no questions asked.

Now, I have never put anything that would generally be considered extreme or "tacky" on any of my leased cars. And, yes, IF my new allroad wheels would fit on the next car, I would probably keep them. My track record on wheels is that what will fit on a 2003 allroad, probably will not fit on the upcoming 2005 A6 TT, which could be in my future -- or perhaps an S4 will be in my future -- and probably the wheels won't "translate from one to the next."

The dealer has been helpful across the board. As to the warranty -- there are many discussions over on audiworld -- my impression is that if something you do causes a failure -- you eat it. My fellow club member who supercharged his A4 has a radiator problem which caused overheating -- there was no provable relationship between the supercharger and the radiator -- Audi fixed it.

The exhaust system, both because of its price and minimal effect on performance is something I would have to have some evidence (persuasive) about to seriously consider.

I had not considered chipping to be something that I would "take out" of the car when I traded it in -- nor do I think it should be, even if it could be, hidden from the dealer.

Indeed, as a final point, if you contact Joe Hoppen, he will direct you to the dealers he works with to install his aftermarket parts, if driving to Florida is not something you care to do.

The car clubs seem to be teeming with folks who mod and who rely on Audi dealers for help. Like everything else, it appears that there are mod friendly and non mod friendly dealers.

There are two BMW dealers here in Cincinnati, and one of them, also, appears to be "into" modification of his customers cars.

Now, if I put flame decals on the car and turned it in that way, I assume I would be "dinged" big time. Wheelsand tires, a chip and possibly a valve or two, tinting the back windows (slightly), and keeping everything tasteful and "impossible" to detect unless you know what you're looking for. . .that's my motto.

So the question remains -- anyone on this board had experience chipping his/her A6 2.7T?

Thanks.

marleybarr · September 2002

My selling dealer here in St. Paul,MN. must be one of those "non-chip" type dealers.

The Audi service advisor stated that "any" modification to the engine would void the warranty. I don't believe this dealer does much custom work like markcincinnati mentioned about his local Audi dealer.

marleybarr · September 2002

markcincinnati,

I talked with a service tech at Carousel Audi here in Minneapolis and this guy happens to be a "chip" enthusiast on the side.

Bob is looking for someone who might want to "chip" a 6-speed Allroad. He seems to know all about the issues and technical info concerning Audi and modifying the 2.7T.

Bob could be e-mailed to "service@carouselautomobiles.com" Write for Bob in Audi service.

JBaumgart · September 2002

Even though Bob the service tech may want to do a chip upgrade on the side, he won't be the one to decide on any warranty claims made if some kind of an engine problem should develop. If he had that kind of authority, I might be interested because Carousel is where I take mine in for service (and the dealership to which I referred in the above post).

marleybarr · September 2002

Bob never claimed that he decides warranty issues. In fact, he did state that adding a chip might void certain aspects of the warranty. Audi decides each issue on an individual basis.

He is an individual who works in Audi service who happens to be an Audi enthusiast as a hobby.Bob would be a good source of info about Audi chipping, he put one in his own A4 and seemed to be happy with the results.

markcincinnati · September 2002

The folks on the Audiworld Forum (whom I do not know, of course) and the folks I have been to Germany with (as guests of Audi AG) in 1997, 1998, 1999, 2001 and 2002 are -- apparently -- pro modifications (and also pro keeping warranty coverage).

Based only on this admittedly anecdotal information and personal experience, I would say that Audis -- probably because they are turbo charged (unlike BMW's and most Mercedes) -- attract owners who are pro modifications. Again based only on my own narrow experiences and conversations and readings on the various forums -- most dealers "appear" to encourage or at least condone such behavior.

I am certain official Audi of America policy must be to at least "caution" dealers and owners of the possibilities of denied warranty claims -- especially if a direct, blatant cause and effect relationship can be gleaned. On the other hand, Audi (AG) seems to "celebrate" its owners passion for their cars -- indeed MTM and ABT are huge Audi tuning companies -- they work WITH Audi engineers. And quattro GMBH (?) is now THE high performance "division" -- of der mother company.

Since I don't believe in common sense, I am at a loss of how to describe a "reasonable" (i.e., low risk) blanket definition of how to mod your Audi. I would say common sense modifications are very low warranty risks, if I believed in CS.

The TT that had been modded to 350HP would not fit into that category IMO. In other words, so many things were modded to get from 225HP to 350HP that the warranty is probably at pretty high risk of NOT being honored.

The TT or S4 or 2.7T with a relatively mild "stage 1" chip, however, probably -- I say probably -- will have no more warranty issues than a non chipped version.

At least this has been my personal experience and the experience of many folks I have talked with and read their posts (on the web).

cdnpinhead · September 2002

by the way, that Mark has been able to achieve these on-site visits ("as guests of Audi AG")? Not that I think there's anything wrong with it. I'm just curious. Is it something that happens when you lease your 12th Audi (kind of a Baker's Dozen thing), or what?

Clearly if I'd been wined & dined by the manufacturer of whatever car I owned (or rented), my opinion of it might be swayed.

Or not.

markcincinnati · September 2002

First and foremost, it is important to become a member of the Audi Car Club of America (formerly known as the quattro club of America). Then you must sign up for the annual Audi driving school -- the event includes Munich, Ingolstadt and Seefeld (Austria).

Audi co-sponsors the driving school -- in the form of a subsidy of the cost (of about 50%).

The classes have to be enrolled in at least one year in advance, sometimes up to two years in advance, they are always near the end of January. You are responsible for your round trip airfare. Audi picks up your living, dining and driving costs and hosts you in the executive dining room at Audi AG for lunch with VP level execs. A factory guided tour and visits to the Audi museum, Audi boutique and Audi showcase are included in this three day program. The cost, is a peanut -- for it includes the driving school, three nites in a five star hotel and all your meals (including drinks) at a 5 star restaurant. Cost in US dollars is about $1200-1300 depending on exchange rate. It is a fantastic vacation.

My wife and I have attended and driven in the school 4 times and have taken the plant tour 6 times and have attended and not driven with the club members once.

We have -- one time -- been Audi's guests 100% paid for on a trip to Switzerland to attend the Women's down hill skiing events in St. Moritz. This trip included air fare, spending money and all meals including a black tie affair to thank 50 customers from all over the world for their business over the years. My wife and I have purchased over two dozen Audis -- at least two people seated at our table (also from the US) had owned 50 Audis each. Audi treats its loyal customers very well.

The programs both paid and comp'd have, to my knowlege, no rival in the auto industry. One gentleman who was with his Audi driving wife quipped, "Mercedes just sells me the cars, they certainly don't treat me like this!" Another one said, I have purchased over 30 Fords and they won't even buy me a damn glass of beer."

Audi, and this is ONLY MY OPINION, treats its customers better than any company I have ever dealt with -- and this is including any product or service, not just cars.

The fact that they make among the best cars in the world is just icing on the cake from where I sit.

One trip through the factory (which I made on my own without subsidy the first time) was enough to convice me of the quality of the cars -- and I say this to this day even though I have had my share of problems (mainly with the brake rotors). Nothing even comes close for the price (and that is an important qualifier -- "for the price.")

There is no baker's dozen kind of thing -- I treat them like I want to be treated -- it works (for me, at least).

And although Audi did treat me well, they did not wine and dine me and then I bought 25 cars -- I had had many Audi's for many years before I received such "fringe benefits." I kept on buying their cars, not because they wined and dined me, but because they treated me fairly and had what I considered and still consider the best bargain in the European car market. I owned one BMW a 1988 325ix which was a great car -- but it cost more to maintain it than it did in lease payments. BMW for me was my first car to have $100 oil changes -- and, my last. Audi picks up all the maintenance on my cars, since 1988 -- the same year as my last (and first) BMW. Beauty Money Wealth -- too rich for my blood and not much good on anything other than dry pavement (and remember my 325ix was all wheel drive).

I think BMWs are great and greatly priced -- to repeat, Audi "for the money, nothing even comes close."

Steve you seem so cynical or perhaps incredulous sometimes. I assure you that I am not affiliated with Audi in any way other than being a loyal customer. It might work for you too.

Or not.

Audi A6

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