Dodge Intrepid

mdey · May 2003

I noticed with my 01 ES 3.2L that changing the oil and filter and refillling with 5 qts. of oil that the oil reads 1/2 qt. low on the stick immediately after the service. It will stay that way in my car for the next 3k miles. I once added 8 oz. to the refill and that brought it to the top of the stick. I only did that once and it burned down to the middle of the stick fairly quickly and stayed there from that point on. Just an observation that may be helpful to some of you to explain any oil consumption you may be experiencing.

andre1969 · May 2003

isn't just going into the filter, is it?

mdey · May 2003

I tried to have the fuel filter replaced on my 01. The dealer tells me the car doesn't have one and relies on the sock at the bottom of the fuel pump assembly in the tank. Say it ain't so.

My '01 ES with 3.2L is at 45,000. I am shopping to have the transmission serviced. The dealer where I bought it only does the pan drop to replace the screen. They then refill the transmission. They don't turn the torque converter.

I spoke with another dealer and they don't turn the torque converter either but they will do a power flush for $190. I have done the flush on other cars if the fluid smells burnt, but otherwise just turning the converter gets most of the old fluid out.

Does anyone have any thoughts about why two Dodge dealers (one is a Five Start) won't turn the torque converter? Is is inaccessible in this car? If we are just talking dropping the pan and refilling then I can do that in my driveway for the price of the filter kit and 5-7 qts. of ATF+4.

mdey · May 2003

Actually when I change the oil I fill the filter about 2/3 full before I install it. That eliminates most of the oil pressure lag you hear (knock knock knock) when you start the engine immediately after an oil change.

No, I just think the accuracy of the dip stick varies from car to car. Mine is probably a bit short. By overfilling it I put the oil in contact with the crank shaft and it foamed it up a bit. The foam burned off and the oil level settled to its normal level.

Foam = sludge. Very bad.

andre1969 · May 2003

All I know about 'em is that my mechanic says they're "lifetime", whatever that means. I don't trust it though. I kinda miss the good ol' days when they had the little cannister mounted in the fuel line just in front of the carburetor. At least those things you could change yourself when they went bad, for only a few bucks. I guess if it's in the gas tank, they have to actually drop the tank to get to it?

As for the tranny service, what does "turning the torque convertor" mean? I had my '00 serviced at 30K and 60K by my mechanic. I didn't ask what all it involved though.

I kinda wondered about dropping the tranny pan myself and just doing a drain and fill. I know back in the day, when they did a tranny service, they'd go up in there and adjust the bands and stuff, but nowadays I think they use solenoids, and there's nothing to adjust.

I knew a guy who worked at Jiffy Lube for awhile. He said all they'd do is loosen the pan without taking it off, and let the old fluid drain out, and then put new fluid in! So much for the filter and the gasket, I guess. Wonder how many cars have failed as a result of being "serviced" by quickie places like that?

ottowrkr · May 2003

The LH cars do have a fuel filter other than the pick-up screen . It is inside the tank and is part of the fuel pressure regulator and it can be replaced .

mdey · May 2003

Torque converters usually have a drain point but you have to turn it so that it points down. The converter holds a couple quarts of fluid and I have read that the fluid tends to stay put and not circulate into the rest of the transmission well. Leaving old fluid inside the converter can ruin the in it over time.

By draining the converter you can usually get about 80% of the fluid out of the transmission. Most transmissions hold about 10 quarts of fluid. Dropping the pan usually only removes about 4-6 quarts. As you can see, that is not an effective service even with replacing the screen.

I know ATF+4 is supposed to be a "lifetime fluid" but lifetime to me is the life of the car, not 100,000 miles then spend $2,000 to rebuild.

I will continue to do a little homework and let everybody know if I come up with a decent solution. Otherwise I guess I will spring for the power flush method.

By the way, I think the filter in the tank idea is an exceptionally bad idea.

mike372 · May 2003

in my '89 Tbird the shop dropped the pan and drained the converter. There was a small drain plug which they removed to let the fluid drain out of the converter. This was almost as good as flushing the system with a machine which was over $100.00. The only significant amount of fluid left was in the cooler lines. But with 149,000 miles, the trans is shifting properly and the fluid looks good. The trsns in my Firebird has 185,000 miles and still is OK and all I ever did was drop the pan and change the filter a few times.

ottowrkr · May 2003

last time I checked the LH converter does not have a drain plug

mike372 · May 2003

Is that true for both the 2.7L and also the 3.5 L engines?

ottowrkr · May 2003

pretty sure . I will look when we go back to work Tuesday

tomandjen · May 2003

I have a 2001 R/T Motorsports Edition in excellant condition with only 10000 miles...can anyone tell me how much to expect to get from this vehicle if I should sell? From what I can tell resale is not very high unless I can find an enthusiast with some money in their pocket. Thanks for any info...

J

smithed · May 2003

Ottowrke,

Are the 2.7 and 3.5 going to be used in the new cars? I understand that the transmissions will be MB designed units, correct?

I hope that the supplier of the electric window motors is doing a better job than who supplied the first motors for my Intrepid, all of which were replaced within 18 months of delivery.

For awhile there it was change the oil, change a window motor.

ES

andre1969 · May 2003

yea, I'd like to know what they're going to be, too. I've heard several different stories, that include the 2.7, 3.5, 4.7, and Hemi.

As for window motors, I'm just curious...are they very hard to replace nowadays? I'm guessing that smithed got his done under warranty. My 'Trep now has about 79,000 miles on it now, and while I do have an extended warranty, it has a $200 deductible.

Last fall, I replaced two power window motors on a '79 New Yorker. I'd guess that it took about an hour per window, and that included taking the old ones out of my '89 Gran Fury donor car, and doing some splicing in the wires to make them fit (same motors, but the plugs are different)

Have power window motors changed much in the past 20 years or so? Also, the ones I dealt with were bolted in. Do they still use bolts, or do they rivet 'em in nowadays?

I've been lucky so far with my windows, but I'm sure the day will come, eventually!

emale · May 2003

andre,

from what i've read, the 3.5l and hemi are definitely gonna be in the LX cars, and definitely not the 4.7l. still not sure about 2.7l. also, from what i've read, the W5A580 mercedes 5 speed automatic will be the sole automatic.

andre1969 · May 2003

the trend these days seems like it's for bigger and bigger engines. The 2.7 was very competitive when it first came out in '98, but since then, it seems everyone's put on more displacement and added power.

The LX looks like it's going to be at least a few hundred lb heavier than the LH as well, so it might be too much for the 2.7, unless they can find a way to get more power out of it.

Wasn't there an experimental 2.7 that they got 275 hp out of?

Jason5 · May 2003

The latest, and previous, articles I've read suggest simply the 3.5 and the 5.7 hemi.. That does tend to leave a rather significant gap in engine offerings--depending on your vantage point.
If, as materials have suggested, the 300C and Dodge variant are in the high 3000 to low 4000 pound range--I'd wager that the 3.5 would be as low a displacement as you'd want. Clearly the 2.7 would be overmatched for a vehicle at that weight.
I recently drove an AWD Chrylser Pacifica and it was "modestly powered". A very impressive automobile in terms of ride, handling and accomodations---but modest in power with the 250HP 3.5. While I believe that the 300C and Dodge variant will be impressive automobiles, the creeping weight, the creeping price point (apparently), the switch to RWD, the space utilization and the styling give me a moment of pause--will they be MY type of impressive automobile. Don't misunderstand my enthusiasm for a proper 5 speed automatic and a powerful engine...but......I suppose I'll reserve judgement for the final product.

Jason5 · May 2003

Yes....there was a concept car with a 225HP or higher version of the 2.7 (dual exhaust) and one closer to 300 that was either supercharged or twin-turbocharged.. That rating would make sense as it equals the roughly 275HP from Audi's own twin turbo, intercooled 2.7 liter V-6..
I've always been a fan of the 2.7--but think it's just incapable of making the torque necessary to move a "full-size" car with any verve..

emale · May 2003

jason & andre,

i agree. i would think the 2.7l would be overwhelmed in the LX cars. although that said the 5 speed automatic would probably help keep the engine in its powerband better.

as for the LX cars themselves, i'm really not sure about the styling, etc. i'll have to wait and see myself. i must say i don't like the small side windows. what happened to open and airy??

jason, per your pacifica comments, i really wish chrysler had a 5 speed automatic for that vehicle. i think it's sorely needed. it probably wouldn't hurt to have shoved the 4.7l or hemi in there either! but as we all know, the current front drive automatics are not able to handle that much torque. i understand some improvements are coming relatively soon for the fwd powertrains. talk of a hemi 6, etc over at allpar.com.

andre1969 · May 2003

the LX cars should still be pretty roomy inside, even with the switch back to RWD. I also have an '89 Gran Fury, which is RWD and actually a touch shorter in the wheelbase (112.7" versus 113"). Despite being a dinosuar in design, dating back to the 1976 Aspen/Volare, it actually has a bit *more* legroom in it than the 'Trep!

I also have a '79 New Yorker, which at 118.5" in wheelbase is close to what the LX cars are going to be. Its basic structure dates back roughly to the old intermediates of '71. It's a long sucker though, at something like 221.5". I think the LX cars are only going to be around 200". It doesn't have anymore legroom than the 'Trep (at least measured at the gas pedal) but the firewall and wheels are much further back, so there's less intrusion into the passenger area than with the LH cars (or the Gran Fury M-body).

The LX cars are also going to be fairly tall, although they still have a low-slung look to them. I've heard somewhere around 59-60 inches. In contrast, I think the 'Trep and Gran Fury are around 56" tall, and my NY'er is only 54.5" tall. With a taller body, they don't have to space the seats quite as far apart to get good legroom.

I wonder how much trunk space they're going to have?

emale · May 2003

andre,

i always thought the intrepid lacked front seat legroom...especially on the passenger side. would have been nice if they'd allowed for more seat travel.

i suspect the lx cars will be nearly as roomy as the lh...and may actually "feel" more roomy because of the more upright windshield and taller roof...

mike372 · May 2003

turns on at times even when the air conditioning is supposedly off. In other words when I just have the fan on to get some fresh air the compressor clutch will sometimes engage depending on how the temperature knob is adjusted. This never occured in any of my other cars and just wondering if it is normal. Andre...does this happen with your 2.7L engine?

andre1969 · May 2003

Emale, I noticed that, too, the first time I rode as a passenger in my Intrepid. The main problem is that the footwell on the passenger side is about even with the dead pedal on the driver's side. The area where the gas and brake pedals are is actually cut out, and recessed in back. Seems like the passenger side of cars up there has been getting a bum rap for ages, though. When GM and Chrysler (and probably Ford, too) downsized their cars in the late 70's, the floorpan on that side was a few inches shallower, to accommodate the catalytic converter. It's not too noticeable in a big car like a full-sized GM, or my '79 NYer, but is a bit more noticeable in my '89 Gran Fury, and especially GM's downsized '78-88 RWD intermediates.

I think the Impala and Taurus are a little better, legroom-wise, on the passenger side, than the Intrepid. A power passenger seat, where you could raise the front and lower the back, would help a bit, too.

Mike372, I've noticed something in my 'Trep that cycles on and off on occasion, but I think it's actually the electric fan. When I used to deliver pizzas, I'd notice it sometimes, when I'd leave the car running in the customer's driveway (I didn't deliver in a bad neighborhood). Sometimes, when the customer took too long to come to the door, I'd hear a clicking noise behind me, and the headlights would flicker. The engine would rev up for about 30 seconds, and then go back down to normal. It would do that whether I had the a/c on or not.

Sometimes I'd notice it when driving, too. Especially when stopped, like at a traffic light. The headlights would dim for just a split second, and the engine would rev a bit. I think that's all it is though, is the electric fan cycling on and off.

smithed · May 2003

I do have a power passenger seat in the "Trep and there seems to be adequate leg room. I am 6'2" and love to have the wife drive while I snooze with that seat back down. Like a lazy boy recliner.

ES '99

emale · May 2003

mike372,

i believe the a/c comp will cycle on/off in all climate positions "except" vent, floor and maybe floor/vent.

mike372 · May 2003

I think there is plenty of legroom. I have a power driver's seat too. Its also very comfortable with the seat back down for snoozing. I figure when I run out of money and lose the house I might try sleeping in my front seat! Maybe I will call it an Intrepid RV.

ottowrkr · May 2003

from what I have been told they will use the 2.7, 3.5 and 5.7 Hemi. Only the Hemi gets the MB trans , the other 2 engines will get a Chrysler RWD trans .
The AC compessor will cycle on and off , even in the winter . Also the cooling fans do cycle at times .

andre1969 · May 2003

is the Chrysler RWD tranny still going to be a 5-speed unit, or a 4-speed? Who makes the 5-speed unit they're currently putting in some of the Mopar trucks?

Jason5 · May 2003

Morning group... Nice discussion brewing again. Although the Intrepid has passenger room where it counts--it is a bit lacking in front seat legroom--though completely adequate. I suspect it's not something you'd notice unless you tall, long of leg, or comparing it to another car. After a bit of a search, my buddy picked up a new 2003 Altima. Although it lacks the room of my Intrepid, I notice that I can "stretch" my legs in his passenger seat better than in my own.
Clearly the 104.5 cubic feet aren't "in the air" but around the body despite a bit less legroom.

njdevilsrn · May 2003

Hello all, in the last week or two, I've noticed a windy sound, almost like it's rattling something plastic, coming from the middle or passenger front end of our 2002 Intrepid. I haven't gotten the chance to be in the passenger's seat to hear exactly where it's coming from, but it's definitely to the driver's right. It gets louder with increased speed.

Also, was reading the owner's manual and it recommended the timing belt be adjusted at 15000 miles. Any idea on the cost for this service?

andre1969 · May 2003

One thing I noticed a long time ago (don't ask me how this came to me tho!) I found out that if you use the following formula: (front legroom x front headroom x front shoulder room)/1728 + (rear legroom x rear headroom x rear shoulder room)/1728, you get a number very close to what the EPA and the like rate the interior volumes of different cars.

Unfortunately, this doesn't take into account several things like wheel well intrusion, tranny/driveshaft/ehxhaust system humps, curvature of the side windows, etc. They also might take measurements in an area that another driver might sit, like if the seat gets moved.

For instance, in rear headroom, the 'Trep is rated at 37.5", while the Century is rated at 37.4" and the Taurus is rated at 38.1. But then I can fit fine in the back of my 'Trep, with room to spare. I actually have to slouch in the back seat of a Century, despite supposedly only .1" less headroom. And the sides of the Taurus curve in so far that, despite supposedly having .6" more headroom, my head *still* hits the ceiling!

In front legroom, the Century supposedly has a bit more, 42.4" versus 42.2" for the 'Trep (and Taurus), but the Century actually feels tighter to me.

I did test drive an Altima about a year ago. The seats go further back than they do in the 'Trep, which is good for front seat occupants, but it cuts into the rear seat, which is still pretty good.

smithed · May 2003

The rear seats in the 'Trep seem to sit pretty low, so there is plenty of head room for this (relatively) big guy. I once had to sit in the right rear for 700 miles with my left leg propped up on the center console with a splinted and newly fractured fibula. pretty comfortable despite the pain. Watch out for those trees while you are riding an inner tube down a snow covered hill!!

ES

smithed · May 2003

I hear an intermittent whistling noise, vaccuum line like, from the drivers side dash that seems to occur with acceleration or decceleration, and then stops. Any ideas?

ES

smithed · May 2003

njdevils, that is likely to be a door or window seal. There have been several posts about the door seals. Might want to search for those.

Off Topic--great hockey game last night. I thought the Devils were going to do it. Should be a barn-burner in Ottowa Friday night.

ES

mike372 · May 2003

I can understand why the cooling fans would cycle on and off but cant understand why the A/C compressor would cycle on even in cold weather. If the A/C compressor clutch is engaged doesn't this mean that cold air is being produced by the A/C system? Thats how I thought it worked in my other cars.

emale · May 2003

andre,

the automatic tranny used in the trucks is a chrysler designed and built unit called the 5-45rfe. it is a five speed. however, despite what ottowrkr said, i have a hard time believing chrysler will install two different rwd trannies in the LX cars. dc is planning to build over 400,000 mercedes trannies at its indiana plant. where are they all gonna go?? i know some will be slated for the next grand cherokee, but that is still a couple years or so away. guess we'll just have to wait and see!

andre1969 · May 2003

thanks for the info on the 5-speed Mopar tranny. Being a Mopar fan for as long as I've been, I'm kinda proud to hear it's actually a Mopar unit and not a Benz tranny!

Does the Mopar 5-speed tranny have anything in common with the older 4-speed truck tranny? None of those have anything in common with the old 3-speed Torqueflites, do they?

emale · May 2003

the new RFE series tranny is fully electronic and has some similarity with the electronic front drive units...but is much stronger and of course a rwd layout. from what i've heard, it has been a very good tranny for chrysler since its inception in the late 90s.

actually the RE series trannies (46re, 47re, etc) are related to the good old torqueflite legend. however, when chrysler added overdrive and made some other changes, the durability was lost somewhere. the RE series trannies are on their way out. the were hooked up to the old 318, 360 and v10 as well as the cummins. pretty soon only the cummins will be attached to this old tech tranny.

andre1969 · May 2003

I wonder if the new 5-speed (that's the RFE, right?) would bolt up to a 318, 360, etc? I've heard of some people swapping in the 4-speed tranny to their older cars, so they could have the benefit of overdrive. I believe you have to modify the floopan to make it fit, though.

emale · May 2003

i really don't know how difficult it would be to hook up the newer 5-45rfe to the old 318 and 360 engines.

apasionato · May 2003

Hi, everyone!

I need some help: I have been wanting to buy an Intrepid for two years now after seeing/driving one. I love how they look and how they drive.

However, after doing research online I am reading many complaints about the Intrepid, many model years....are these complaints mainly of the models up to 2000, and, has the car, especially the 2002, gained better quality and reliability? I am aware of the problems with the 2.7 engine and I now will only buy a model with the 3.5 engine.

I am wondering if the postings I am reading is mainly because the ones who are having problems with their Intrepids are more likely to make posts? Or, are the Intrepids mainly lemon cars, mechanically? Are the complaints I am reading just a small % of the overall experiences with these cars?

Are there any out there who have owned a 2002 Dodge Intrepid ES (or SE) for awhile and have had very few problems with them?

Do you love your 2002 Dodge Intrepid ES?

I'd really appreciate your help.

Thank you!

Aimee

ottowrkr · May 2003

emale- i hope you are right about the trans . But from what I have been told all 2.7 and 3.5 cars will use a corporate trans only the 5.7 will get the MB design (U.S built) trans.

mike372- the a/c will cycle to allow the oil in the system to circulate and keep all the parts like seals lubricated

emale · May 2003

otto,

i guess we'll see...but it seems to me that it'd be more expensive to have two different rwd trannies in the same car, in spite of which engines are put in the cars.

btw, what tranny did the airflight concept car have in it? it had the 3.5l engine. that may indicate what tranny they plan to use for the production LX cars that have the v6 engines...

Jason5 · May 2003

Good morning... I hope you're enjoying the holiday weekend. Based on your profile and questions--I'm not certain what you're seeking. If your goal is to buy the single MOST reliable used car---then you'd probably want to buy a previous generation Camry or Accord. If, however, other factors consider into your purchase, then I would certainly recommend an Intrepid.
I suggest you check your sources for the "problems" you've heard about the 2.7 in particular and the Intrepid in general. The VAST majority of us--with ownership experience and without some other agenda--have found them to be well-designed, competent, reliable vehicles that have the added benefit of low maintenance costs. My car is a 2000 ES and my only expenses to date (at 61,000 miles) aside from normal maintenance were tires and brakes. Happy hunting...!

andre1969 · May 2003

is that Chrysler got most of the kinks out of the automatic tranny around 1996 or '97, although they've made running improvements to it year after year, since then. So basically, the newer the Intrepid, the better the tranny should be.

The 2.7 is a decent engine, although it does have to work harder than a 3.2 or 3.5 to move a 3400-3500 lb car around. It's fine if you take care of it, but with being smaller and more complex (DOHC versus SOHC), it's not going to be as tolerant of neglect and abuse.

One minor advantage of the 2.7, over the 3.2/3.5, is that the 2.7 uses timing chains, where the larger engines use belts. The interval nowadays on the belts is something like 105K miles though, so don't let that be the determining factor!

I have an '00 base model (they call it SE nowadays) with the 2.7. I'm pushing 80,000 miles, and no engine/tranny problems yet!

mike372 · May 2003

I appreciate your concerns regarding the Intrepid and the 2.7L engine. I recently purchased a new
2002 SE w/ the 2.7L engine. The only problem so far has been a bad ABS controller which was replaced under warranty. Admittedly, it has only 2600 miles but no other problems. Its hard to say whether the 2.7L engine is inferior, but if I had to do it over again, I too would have selected an ES or probably an SXT with the 3.5L engine. The 2.7L engine has OK power but the car could certainly use a little more H.P. and torque. Maybe you should consider a Honda Accord with a V-6. Its probably going to cost more as the incentives are less (I'm not exactly sure what they are) but its an awesome car with high reliability. Chryslers reliability is still questionable.

andre1969 · May 2003

Well, I dropped my Intrepid off last nite to have the recall done. It's a fairly minor thing; they just have to replace two bolts in the seat. The current ones could break, causing the backrest to suddenly recline fully.

The recall notice says it should take about 1/2 hour to do, but the dealer still wanted to keep the thing for a day. They told me it takes 2 1/2 hours to do. I said something in shock, like "you mean it takes that long to change two bolts?!" The tech replied that they have to actually remove the seat from the car.

Still, what's that? Maybe 5 minutes, with the right tools? I guess they just write the hours a little high, so they can bill Chrysler for it?

emale · May 2003

andre,

warranty/recall stuff doesn't quite work that way. before the recall even was sent out...dc would have already notified dealers how much time they have to do the recall and how much money they'll get. and if the dealership goes over that alotted time...it comes out of their pocket!

ottowrkr · May 2003

andre1969, crazy eh. It takes us 48 secongs to put that seat in ,but takes all day to change the bolts . HHMMMM.

Also if any of you Trep owners are in the Brampton, Ontario , Canada area this Sunday June 1st, there is a Dodge/Chrysler/Jeep/Mopar car show that is held at the plant . It is open to all years of vehicles as long as the are DaimlerChrysler built.

mike372 · May 2003

you dont understand. It takes 1 hour to find the replacement bolts, another hour for break, and one half hour to remove and replace the bolts. By the way, anyone need mint condition parts for a 91 Celica GTS Liftback. My mom hit a curb while trying to avoid a deer and really did a job on the undercarriage of the car. The insurance company totaled it out. They want $250 to buy it back which I think is illegal. I am going to try to get it back for less but may have to pay the $250. But there's no way it going to the junkyard so they can make a few thousand off the parts. I dont care if I have to store them in my basement and never sell them. It was a real nice car, one of the best remaining 91 GTS's on the road, easily. Any ideas on the best way to market these parts? I dont think they changed the body design for the nest four years.

Dodge Intrepid

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