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Older Acura TLs

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Comments

  • carguy58carguy58 Posts: 2,303
    I wouldn't panic yet about the 04 TL spy shots. I'll wait till the real photo's come out. In my opinion Honda panicked with the new Accord when they saw the 02 Altima come out and decided to be different with 03 Accord styling because of the Altima. I hope the same thing doesn't happen with the 04 TL. Honda may panic because of the G35 styling. I hope not though.
  • Um, not to be sarcastic but the TL tranny is fine. They only had a problem in a few of the TL series transmissions..........see, the difference is that when acura has a problem with a car, it's a big deal because honda/acura problems very infrequent........the TL will last years more than the mustang. Heck, look at the number of say 1992 mustangs on the road now and the condition they're in.......then look at all the say 1992 acura legends on the road........night and day!
  • You know when someone digs deep enough to find a problem in the look of the trunk lip, that they simply couldn't find a darn thing wrong with the car. The Acura TL is by far the best mid-market luxury sedan out there......it wins on price, quality, performance, luxury, safety, and style......give me a break!
  • tls02tls02 Posts: 20
    Joseph, I'm not the guy who is complaining about the trannys. I LOVE my 2002 TL S! I went to buy a TL in March 01, left a deposit on a TL, went back the next day, test drove an S and switched my deposit for the S. (I had to wait a month for my color scheme, Black/Black.) This car is the best car that I have ever had, (and I have been buying cars since the late 60's). Having said all that, I cannot wait for the 04 TL. If it is anywhere as good as I believe it will be, I'm going to Trade my 02 for a 04. (My wife has already agreed. Once you get to my age, take your pleasures as you can!) I think that I have seen your Posts at ACURA-TSX.COM. If not, go to that Forum. Lots of good info there. Thanks!
  • ruskiruski Posts: 1,566
    I see a lot of junky looking Legends on the road.

    And the TL tranny problem IS a big deal because it is mode widespread than you allow yourself to believe, and Honda does not have any other fix but to replace the broken tranny with a new [refurbished] one.
  • s852s852 Posts: 1,051
    Price is yet to be announced, so it remains to be seen if the price is going to be that great.
    There aren't even any firm facts on what the standard features and performance will be.
    Some have said it will move upmarket so the base TL price will not be close to a TSX with navi.
    Hopefully the interior will be greatly improved with real wood and no shared interior trim and switchgear with the Accord the way the current TL has with the old Accord. Also, it's time to replace the super-weak Bose stereo system with something that actually has impressive sound quality.
  • msgreenmsgreen Posts: 67
    various sources suggest that the 04 TL will have 280 hp or more. I have driven other FWD cars with notable HP and have noticed substantial "torque steer" under hard acceleration. Acura is not immune from physics. Assuming that the TL will once again be FWD, has anyone heard what they plan to do to mitigate the effects of more HP re "torque steer"? Could be very noticeable if they also add a manual transmission.....
  • TLS.....I agree with you on the Type S.....as I've said, I have an '03 with only 450 miles on it and I smile each time I get in it......it is by far the best car I've ever had......and to think, in 10 years, I'll look back and say, it was a great car, but look what's out now......that's what I said about my '96 TL. If you're wife is on your side with the '04.....you must get it...but I'm sure you know as I do, new cars are money pits.........I should have just driven my '96 TL into the ground, but the new TL Type S's are just too nice!!
  • I have also read about the 280 hp going into the next TL.....but who knows. We likely know more than the dealerships as Honda never says anything till the cars are on the way. But, I would imagine the car will have more than 280 hp and the interior will be very futuristic.......by the way, the interior in the 2003 TL Type S is nothing short of perfection. I think the new body style in the '04 will take some getting used to. It would be nice to see it have TRUE dual exhaust rather than the h pipe you see in almost all the foreign V6's these days. Joe
  • s852s852 Posts: 1,051
    The 2003 TL interior is well short of perfection. Have you never seen a Passat GLX or a new Lexus ES300's interior?
    The current TL's interior is only mildly upgraded from the old Accord and has some obvious pieces that are exactly the same as a 2002 Accord's.
    The fake wood and fake carbon fiber interior trim are laughably unrealistic and cheap-looking.
  • ruskiruski Posts: 1,566
    I liked it until I sat in my co-worker's 2002 Accord Coupe. It is almost the same!!!
  • ruskiruski Posts: 1,566
    well 280HP is a big number but knowing Honda, their engine will probably have relatively low torque. So torque steer should not be a problem.

    But who knows - look at the Nissan Altima and Maxima, I am hearing complaints about ridiculous torque steer in those cars.

    On the same hand it is not impossible to make torque steer negligible despite high HP and torque numbers. Example - Pontiac Grand Prix GTP. '98-2003 models have 240HP and 280 torque. 2004 has 260HP and 280 torque. And almost no torque steer! I just had a 2004 GTP for an extended test drive and could not provoke any torque steer, and I really tried.
  • schollscholl Posts: 13
    My guess is that the 2004 TL will have less than 280 hp - I don't think it needs to win the HP war to compete.

    I agree that the interior needs improvement - I'd rather pay more for the car with real wood trim than that idiotic fake stuff that's in the current model- sorry folks! I've owned two accords - but if I don't feel like I'm driving a luxury car - then what's the point. I'd also like to see the headroom increased - Acura surely must have listened to the numerous complaints about that issue

    While most of these forum comments are subjective impressions - and that's cool, that's what it's all about - I think some posters have become such "fans" of a car that they spin everything to the positive and live in denial about certain issues.
  • carguy58carguy58 Posts: 2,303
    I have heard about that but I don't think that will happen with Honda. Nissan has always focused on big horsepower numbers while Honda usually focuses on giving you the "whole package" in a car.
  • varmintvarmint Posts: 6,326
    Which of Honda's V6 engines is missing torque? Their small 4 cylinder engines may lack grunt, but the V6 designs have all been fine.

    For the most part, torque steer depends on the layout of the engine and use of unequal half-shafts. The actual power is a secondary factor, and power delivery (when and how the torque hit in the rev band) is also important.

    I think the interior of the 2003 TL is nice, but nothing special. For comparison, I recently test drive a 30K Buick RDV. The center stack in that thing used a design very similar to my '86 Cavalier! I do prefer the look of the TSX.

    Fake wood isn't a problem for me as long as it looks good. Some does and some doesn't. Real wood ends up looking fake by the time they bury it in a plastic coating to protect it from the elements.
  • carguy58carguy58 Posts: 2,303
    Was the 95-98 TL interior that much better than the 99-03 TL interior? I remember in 1998 the 98 TL was priced at 33K and the 99 TL was priced at 29K when it came out. Could have been some cost cutting in there to lower the buying price of the 99 TL. My thinking was Acura was slipping while Lexus was streaking back in 1998. They had to do something and lower the TL's price to sway buyers away from the Lexus ES 300. Lets see a base 99 Es 300 went for 33K while a 99 TL went for 29K. Nice strartegy by Honda. I would no way buy a Lexus because I don't care for their styling mostly with a few exceptions but Lexus was just on a hot streak in 1998.
  • carguy58carguy58 Posts: 2,303
    In July 0f 2001 I looked at an 01 Accord Coupe and a 01 CL(Base model.) I bought the CL because I thought the interior was a little bit better and the exterior styling of the CL appealed more to me. It seemed like the interior was layed out a little bit better in the Acura than in the Honda.
  • well, as I've said, I have a 96 TL and a 2003 TL Type S and I don't see the similarities in the interiors......remember the cars are basically the same size, and if you check the specs, the older TLs 96-98 have more room inside, however, when inside my '03.....it seems much more roomier. I agree, headroom in both models is an issue. Someone mentioned comparing the interior of the TL to that of the new Lexus ES 300.......I've seen the lexus on TV, yep, it looks nice, but have you seen how they completely ruined the design of that car?! Acura, hands down the winner there, and much less $....more power, and it does look different than it's sister, the Accord......the ES 300 does not look any different than it's sister the Camry, oh wait, yep, the lights are different..haha!
  • On another note.....one of the main reasons the TL became cheaper in 99 was because the assembly took place in the US. The 96-98 models were assembled in Japan. Also, the no options, other than the nav, help reduce production costs. RE: wood trim, yep, I'd rather have it real wood, I went for the diamond white pearl TL Type S as it came in beige leather and the much better wood color than the black leather TLs offer. One of the reasons, I believe, the TL is not real wood is because they only put that in the flagship the RL to help differentiate the car. The RL for 2005 will likely be the nicest luxury car on the road for around $50,000........much nicer than the Lexus LS 400 or 430, whatever that over-priced toyota is!
  • carguy58carguy58 Posts: 2,303
    The RL is going to have battle the 05 BMW 5 Series, 05 Cadillac Seville STS, Lexus LS430 and whatever Mercedes offers in that price range. Its going to be exciting though because Cadillac, Acura, and BMW will put their $50,000 offerings at basically the same time! Even though I like Acura alot I think BMW has everybody covered in this class.
  • msgreenmsgreen Posts: 67
    not sure that you are on the right board, but as someone who has anguished a bit over the the RL, my sense is that they have a HUGE mountain to climb when the "new" RL finally hits the streets (whenever that is). I think Honda has blown it big time with so little info on this car. The existing RL, while a nice car, is NOT selling vs. the competition. If Honda wants to compete with a V6 only, then the rest of the car: interior, styling, features, etc, had better be bullet-proof. It has been incomprehensible to me that Honda did not put the VTEC V6 and a five speed auto transmission in this car two years ago. GAWD! if they were going to let it go this long without serious make over, why didn't they at least take existing Honda offerings off the shelf to improve what they were trying to sell??? I wanted to buy an RL several years ago and kept waiting for the "02" which was supposed to be such a big change. Obviously did not happen, so I gave up and bought a BMW. Great car, but I remain pissed at Honda for not giving me a chance to make some other decision. They have strung out their RL potential buyers far beyond reason....
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    I suspect the RL replacement was one of the few cars Honda actually had to muddle over as far as it's market position and specification. I'm sure they probably pondered whether doing another RL at all considering the current car's performance on the market compared to the E-Class, 5-Series, GS and A6. Honda's corporate culture won't let them justify the money, or lavish engineering needed to compete with cars like the E-Class or LS430. They're having to shake this small, 4-cylinder mentality to compete in other areas, so hopefully they'll see that there is some money to be made at the 40-60K level. Discouraging is that they've basically said that a V8 and RWD is out of the question. The current RL was a rare misstep for a usually right-on-the-money Honda. They were oh so wrong in even trying to say a V6 fwd car could compete with a a bunch of rwd V8 cars. I have never seen a company in which on of their cheaper cars (TL-S) shows up their flagship car so bad. This next TL and maybe RL are the last chance for Acura to get me interested in their cars again. Talk about one disappointment after another, thats all Acura has been, to me. It all started when the "Legend" left. Will all the time that has passed by since the current RL (1996) was introduced I expect something spectacular for 2005, dare I say a "segment buster".

    M
  • carguy58carguy58 Posts: 2,303
    The Legend was one of the best looking cars of the 90's no doubt but that was like 1995 when it left. Its time to move on from that time. I think Acura just got caught by Lexus when the Legend left. Acura is doing good now but Acura better hope the 04TL does not dissapoint since its moving into the 30K+ price range. Honda did dissapoint me with the new Accord. They had a chance to blow everybody away with the new Accord. The styling is so vanilla I don't know what happened there.
  • varmintvarmint Posts: 6,326
    My thoughts on the RL. And I think Merc1 is probably correct in saying that Honda may have considered scrapping the RL. Honda has had more profitable projects to work on in recent years.

    Based on the reception of the 2004 TL concept and the similarities we are seeing with the spy photos, I expect the new TL will enjoy success similar to the '99-03 model. I don't know that it will bust the segment wide-open, however it should keep its place as a respected offering. The shift upwards in price may not make people happy, but that move is necessary to separate Acura products from Hondas.

    On the Accord, I think they nailed it. The styling up front combines current trends (swept back head lights and the rakish character line along the profile) with new designs like the convex/concave treatment over the fenders, the crease-less hood, and tiny grill. I think most folks are distracted by the problems in the back and fail to notice just how unique the front and profile look. On the functional end, the new model is cleaner, more powerful, more comfortable, more fuel efficient, and it offers more options. There are things to quibble about. I won't argue there. I just think the vehicle as a whole is just as strong as the out-going models.
  • carguy58carguy58 Posts: 2,303
    Your right the back end does bother me. The side looks fine. I think the Accord Sedan the average age buyer is going up to much. The last time I looked the average age buyer for the Accord Sedan was 55. That has too be lowered down a little bit. Honda nailed the Accord styling to a tee in 1996 and in 1998. The 01 refresh was a step backwards and you know how I feel about the new one. 96-97 was the best looking Accord in my opinion most definately. The thing that dissapoints me the most is Honda released the TSX under the Acura emblem and it looks better than the Accord Sedan. Honda wants to charge 5-7K more than a 20,000 dollar Accord LX 4 cylinder auto model. That's just an awkward decision to do that.
  • 2003tls2003tls Posts: 100
    The styling of the Accord Sedan is why I bought a TL. The rear end looks like a Saturn and the front is just odd. The 2004 Accord is such a better car in terms of everything else. Why did they screw up the styling? Luckily, it looks like the 2004 TL is following the styling cues of the TSX. If it looked like a bigger Accord - yikes!
  • automophileautomophile Posts: 780
    for the new TL. My wife just brought home a new TSX, and if the new TL is the same but a little bigger, I am completely sold. The TSX is the best car she saw in 6 months of looking that could offer performance, luxury and reliability in a compact size. She was lusting after the BMW 325, but it is no longer interesting after driving the TSX with it's $10,000 cheaper price tag. She had 2 Integras in the past, the first, an '87, went 130K miles without a single repair. The new ones should hopefully be the same or better.

    The TL spy pictures are interesting - but the cars are obviously a bit disguised. In addition, these could be "older" prototype bodies that they are using for mechanical testing. It will be interesting to see what the final car really looks like My current lease is up in December - just in time for a new TL! I'll keep checking here for more information from you well informed people!
  • ash213ash213 Posts: 40
    I think 2004 TL is going to be a bit smaller than the current model, as it is going to be based on new Accord. I am trying to decide between 2003 v/s 2004 TL. Pricing of 2003 is hard to resist. Any thoughts.
  • bodble2bodble2 Posts: 4,519
    We're inside of 3 months of intro date of the '04. I would definitely wait.

    BTW, someone posted earlier that he was told there would be 7 versions of the new TL. I wonder if we'd be so lucky that there would be an AWD wagon?!
  • s852s852 Posts: 1,051
    The current TL is also based on an Accord and the new Accord is not smaller.
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