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Uncledavid: thanks for your feedback about navigation screen. It's helpful to know every detail about a car before venturing to buy it, especially for 35 grand!
As for ride quality, I guess it's a matter of reaching the sweet point between comfort and handling, and your willingness to compromise one for the other.
Wjat about any Honda/Acura loyalty discounts?
1violinist - that's the tact I may take i.e. asking for accessories instead.
Alternatively, since I need a car now, I may buy a clunker to drive through the end of the year when hopefully some deals will come out. All of the other car makers are offering deals on the 2004's already!
It's not enough that we're getting raped for not budging on the MSRP, they have the nerve to try and keep an additional grand? WOW. Add up the difference in Invoice and MSRP, and the holdback, that's too much of a profit. I don't care how competitively priced this vehicle is and all the standard options it comes with, if I really want it, what I should just bow my head down and walk into the dealership like that? Wait, why don't they just put hand-cuffs on me and duct tape on my mouth, and just show me where to sign... you get my drift.
I know that each and every dealer is trying to rake it in b/c of all the loss of $$$ on the transmission failures, but c'mon people. There has got to be some bargaining room....I don't see people wrapped around my local Acura dealership jumping off a roof to get a car. Sure there might be a waiting list, but if a dealership only gets 5 or so cars in a batch every few months, that's another issue.
We'll see what happens. Wheel locks, splash guards, trunk mat...that's kissing my a!#. Those kind of small things don't mean the same as $$$ off the final price I'd pay for a car. Again, we'll see what happens. Laters.
"They [Asian automakers] started offering some cash on '04s before they even hit the ground, especially for those that haven't changed the design much," said Joe Cashen, director of CarsDirect. "In years I've been doing this, I've never seen them offering this much cash this soon. Normally the offers came after the cars had been on [dealer] lots for several months."
Honda Motor Co. remains the one major Asian automaker not offering any cash-back deals.
There are few slight differences in equipment between these two cars, but the primary difference is in the overall driving experience. I drove both this past weekend. The Lexus is very smooth, quiet and more luxurious. With the upgraded 3.3L engine in the ES, it has very ample acceleration at all speeds, but the overall road handling isn't near that of the TL. The upgraded ES330 engine really draws these two models very close together...making it a tougher choice than ever...so you just have to take your pick.
My wife will probably decide for me (smile).
The ES is more plush and luxurious feeling and has a more comfy ride, the TL is more sporty. Lexus dealers usually have better service (better loaner cars, etc.)
You can't really go "wrong" with either one. It's generally a buyer's market these days. Just five years ago, you'd have had to pay $45k for cars with the features, safety, and power of these $33k cars.
I'm a little unclear as to your point... are you praising Honda for not having to resort to extreme incentives to remain competitive saleswise, or criticizing them for not offering cash-back incentives?
The black and parchment is such a nice combination. It tough to keep black cars clean though. Do you folks think the green or red exteriors would be any easier to keep clean? Would they hide the swirls any better than a black car would? On a scale of 1-10, 10 being black and 1 being silver on a scale of exterior maintenance, where do you think the various colors lie?
By the way, the sales guy recommended a website that sells after market wood stick on pieces to give more of a luxurious look. Apparently the after market wood is actually real wood. I see that they don't have 2004 TL applications available yet. I realize the car afficionados are familiar with these websites so this is for the other folks who come here. I'd be happy to provide the link if anyone wants it.
The new BMW 5-series looking similar to Pontiac? The Gran Prix? Umm...I dunno...maybe...especially if you squint. Not really that far-fetched. Pontiac has toned down their styling "excitement".
http://www.ferrari.com/ferrari/images/360_modena/210x130/detail_i- nterior.jpg
Go to lexus.com and build an ES330 as close as possible to a base TL, and it comes out to about $35,100 (base $32,300 plus premium package $2,800 (cd changer, hid, vsc, heated seats, wood and leather steering wheel)). Street price of this car is $33,000. Street price of the TL is $33,000.
Some people like a tighter ride (TL), some people like a more plush, smoother ride (ES330). It's a matter of personal preference. Neither is necessarily "better" than the other.
The TL is definitely faster than the ES, probably about a second faster 0 to 60.
Not including accessories, the most you could pay for a 2004 TL in Canada is $44,000. That's a $9,000 difference! These figures are MSLP and you can probably get some kind of a deal with the Lexus...but still!
http://www.lexus.ca/lexus/experience/en/home/vehicles/configurato- r/BA30GP2004/configurator.jsp?model=BA30GP&year=2004
In a year, the new IS330 and GS will be out, the new Passat will be around, and the RL will be the Acura flavor of the month. Then, you'll see discounting and the TL will be the better deal.
Hey, which place is that in NY? Maybe I'll visit them instead of this place in NJ that won't budge.
Thanks.
I would not buy it because of the DVD Audio, but it is a plus on my list of plus and minuses between the TL and the G35.
According to my dealer, the delivery split is (60/20/20). That is, if only 5000 units arrive in Canada, 3000 will be Base, 1000 will be Navi and 1000 Dynamic. For me, only 1000 6MTs for all of Canada worries me. I'm ordering mine this month!
I don't have a Bluetooth phone because I have no use for it. If I had a car that was Bluetooth enabled, you can be sure that my next phone would have it.
Acura is helping advance these new technologies. Once other manufacturers get on board, they will really start to take off. I forget you made the statement, "why would anyone need a computer in their home?", but today, having a home computer is as common as having a toaster. DVD-A and Bluetooth are tomorrow's home computer.
I don't know too much about the 18" rims/tire package that you can order with the 2004 TL......just wanted to know a few things. (please don't be annoyed because i've owned only sport utes so far and this is my first sedan so i'm still new to some concepts)
Neways 1st question if i were to get the 04 with 18" would i still get a nice ride or would the ride quality be really stiff. (i want a sporty looking & performing car but if the ride is too stiff that wouldn't be too good)
2nd question ... on the 18" how long do the tires on there last ?
3rd question.... i'm sure that tires for the 18" cost more to change but what's the average price for a 18" tire for the TL?
4th question ..... so i guess what i'm asking is it overall a good idea to order the new TL with the option rim package. (i like the look i just wanted to know if i was sacraficing too much ride quality and if the cost of tires and how often u had to change them would get too costly)
5th question .... are the 18" rims by 8" or 8.5"?
P.S. i live in Sunny So. Cal so if that makes a difference let me know.....thanx ahead of time guys i appreciate it.
George.
I've narrowed my decision down to Navi in White/Parchment or maybe Blue/Camel as a distant second choice. I'm betting (or hoping) that due to the rather hefty $premium for the Navi, it would not be in great demand.
I am also on a waiting list for the new Motorola V600 (bluetooth) phone. Once both of these new toys are in my life, I don't know what I'll research at work all day! Maybe I'll go for a drive!
Can't do that - unless it is still there next time I am nearby - and I have a camera - and I am nearly out of film - and I have it developed soon, etc. But I did note that it had DST plates - rather than regular dealer plates - or MFR plates.
Believe it or don't.
Ir was there twice when I was at the dealership - about a week and a half apart.
- Ray
Just trying to help here . . .
The TL is built in North America and their is solid production capability. It isn't the same situation that you have with the TSX (with small numbers being imported). Acura dealers are not going to "run out" of their bread-and-butter sedan.
If you choose not to buy now, and you wait six months until the prices come down, you'll still be able to get what you want.
BTW, I bought my TSX within the first month, and got a relatively lousy deal on it. The TSX is still selling for close to MSRP where I live.
Plus, I don't think DVD-A will catch on in the car as fast as people say it will. Remember, in a car, DVD-A sound is not good for the rear passengers. Also, CD's are cheaper.
Bluetooth is being crowded out by other standards for wireless broadband. While it's certainly possible that bluetooth will be "the" standard for use of the cell phone in a car, it's hard to say that it will be the future at this point.
In the end, it's a matter of personal choice and how much you get out of these features, and if you're willing to get the items necessary to enjoy these features.
As the sidewalls get smaller, they get stiffer. The result is better handling, and also a stiffer ride, since there is now less "cushion". There is no way to have both. Also, the tires with thinner sidewalls are usually more expensive and wear out faster.
If you REALLY need the handling, or are that hung up on the looks, get the 18s, but be aware that it will cost you in ride and extra tire costs for as long as you own the car.